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RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 2:41:36 PM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
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quote:

one of those freedoms being the right to actually be a ......well a socialist if I were so disposed


You are entirely correct.

One of the many paradoxes for which the warrior fights is that of any civilian to be as wrong as he wants to be.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 7:20:47 PM   
FatDomDaddy


Posts: 3183
Joined: 1/31/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u
Feel free to correct me if I have this wrong....but I was allways taught that our Uniformed serviceman and woman fought and died for our freedoms(I know it's a quaint little idea...but there you go)...one of those freedoms being the right to actually be a ......well a socialist if I were so disposed.
Now did I get that wrong?


Nope.... you are not wrong at all....

But one wonders why Socialists feel the need to lie that they are in fact socialists.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 102
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 7:47:03 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		Maybe you should ask someone you think is a socialist... maybe your definition and a socialists definition, do not align,.
I could think you are the sweetest man in the world, but that would only be my opinion.not a fact.


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(in reply to FatDomDaddy)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 8:28:09 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: EbonyWood

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

quote:

I'm however being extremely blunt about an apparent issue. That dispite everything people have learned or been taught, people are ignoring it in favor of being caught up in the proganda and bullshit. Amazing how educated people are taking the bait and falling pray to bullshit. Seriously though, does make me wonder if this shit is still being taught in school though.


THIS
Excllent post, and sadly they are becoming more and more  irrelevant, the more they spout easily debunkable dogma.
Socialist my arse.
Marxist, not even close
however I would love to play in some jello with the man.Obama not the elf



The means of production are actually being concentrated into fewer and fewer hands and there is no collective anything.
 
That nobody has a clue about actual, as opposed to propagandized, socialism is a legacy of the communism scare era, where everything not American was bad and left unexamined for a generation or more.
 
Heads on pikes. I want fucking heads on pikes.
 
 


This is absolutely true, there was a time in this country when academics couldn't even teach Marxist theory in colleges in this country...

_____________________________

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Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 8:29:14 PM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Sooo...VA Hospitals. Discuss.


Discuss what? Non sequiturs? Poor analogies?


VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 105
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 8:29:20 PM   
Marini


Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Youre a moron if youre unaware that mnot was being facetious.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4
Ron, I'm starting to question if they even teach this shit in school anymore. Why are people so damn in the dark and clueless?




I'm totally aware that he was thank you. :-)

I'm however being extremely blunt about an apparent issue. That dispite everything people have learned or been taught, people are ignoring it in favor of being caught up in the proganda and bullshit. Amazing how educated people are taking the bait and falling pray to bullshit. Seriously though, does make me wonder if this shit is still being taught in school though.


Many people only believe what they read in a book, what someone "tells" them, what they hear on the news, what they see on t.v., or what they read online.

I have a few random idiots around here, that challenge anything that I say, in which I can't provide "research" or "evidence".

People want and need to be able to believe in authority figures, and most people really do "believe everything the MAN tells them", even though they say they don't trust the man.

I have never come close to trusting "the man", and I never will.

Being able to take information from a variety of sources, analyze it and synthesize it, and formulate your own "deductions", theories, or conclusions, about how the world REALLY operates, is hard for many, especially when its easier to believe what you are told.
"Free/Independent" thinking and thinkers, are rare indeed.

It must be true, cause I heard it on t.v., I read it online and I was able to google it.
lol,
Most people are not able to think out of the box, so they remain clueless and in the box.

Look at the history of civilization, and the historical government take overs, invasions, events/ atrocities, etc. that have been able to be carried out, and people just sat by, allowed it and watched it happen.

Everything that is going on right now, is because we still sit around and just watch .

Nothing of real value is going to change, until people get to the breaking point, and get tired of just watching what happens to them.
By the time, we get to the "breaking point" it is usually too late to get the real changes that were needed, but at least "something" will be done and a few issues will be addressed.

Great post!

< Message edited by Marini -- 8/11/2010 9:06:13 PM >

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Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to Whiplashsmile4)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 9:18:54 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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Its a part of the compensation package veterens receive in exchange for their service, which is not exactly socialism.


quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....


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(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 9:42:45 PM   
Owner59


Posts: 17033
Joined: 3/14/2006
From: Dirty Jersey
Status: offline 		It`s government run health care and among the best.


Back on topic......


There is no doubt that it`s the conservative movement picking this years slate of candidates,not the national establishment.


Steel is dancing as fast as he can but is just watching like everyone else.


Soon,within weeks,the primary season will be over and real race starts.


What the GOP will have to run with will be far righties like Sharron Angle who is so far off the scale,even an unpopular guy like Reid will win.

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President Obama

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 108
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 9:55:48 PM   
thornhappy


Posts: 8596
Joined: 12/16/2006
Status: offline 		The NHS in Britain is paid by taxes.  A compensation package, if you will.

Like Social Security.  Medicaid.  SSI.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Its a part of the compensation package veterens receive in exchange for their service, which is not exactly socialism.

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....


(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 10:48:38 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thornhappy

The NHS in Britain is paid by taxes.  A compensation package, if you will.

Like Social Security.  Medicaid.  SSI.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
Its a part of the compensation package veterens receive in exchange for their service, which is not exactly socialism.

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....





LMAO. If you think taxes are compensation, then you must think up is down and left is right.

(in reply to thornhappy)
Profile   Post #: 110
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 11:20:27 PM   
slvemike4u


Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline 		I do believe Thorn was referring to the Health Srvice as the compensation....not the taxes.You're taking that reading of the post leads me to believe you feel up is down and left is right.

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Profile   Post #: 111
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/11/2010 11:55:07 PM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

I do believe Thorn was referring to the Health Srvice as the compensation....not the taxes.You're taking that reading of the post leads me to believe you feel up is down and left is right.


Sockpuppet was in such a hurry to spew hate, he didn't read the post.
 
Sums up the mentality, or lack of it.

(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 112
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 5:09:37 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Sooo...VA Hospitals. Discuss.


Discuss what? Non sequiturs? Poor analogies?


VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....

Really? Given that only people who've served in the armed forces get treated there, they seem more reminescent of the sort of pseudo feudal libertarianism Robert Heinlein proposed in Starship Troopers.

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(in reply to juliaoceania)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 5:12:54 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Sooo...VA Hospitals. Discuss.


Discuss what? Non sequiturs? Poor analogies?


VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....


If that is true, then I definitely don't want socialist healthcare.


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Profile   Post #: 114
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 7:11:14 AM   
Whiplashsmile4


Posts: 2305
Joined: 12/2/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi
quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....

If that is true, then I definitely don't want socialist healthcare.

I can honestly say that some VA hospitals are Awesome and other one's suck ass. It all depends upon the administration of the hospital in question. I have a family member who is under the VA Hospital care system.

Sincerely, the VA hospital care system is way better compared to most private Nursing Homes or Adult Care facilities. I can share with you tons of horror stories of fucked up shit about None Socialised care facilities. It's some serious mind blowing bullshit that purely pisses me off and I think people need to wake the hell up. A lot of shit or problems are centered around Policies and staffing.

Socialized Medicine can co-exist with None Socialized Medical. First and foremost, the problems again are centered around Administration and Policy. There are some really screwed up things in that department that fail people miserable. The VA system really is not fruad prone like other social systems are. Hell what to write about next?

There are people that are taking advantage of socialized systems in bad ways, in terms of fraud. This needs to be addressed. People that actually need the help at times are not getting it.

In regards to the new Obama plan, first and foremost. I'm going to use myself for an example. When I was working for a company I had health insurance. Not a big deal. When I quit and went independent. I was paying out around $560/month for it. Again, no big deal. My medical bills don't amount to much in a years time. Probally around $200-$600 at the most on average. I dropped health insurance and been paying for it out of pocket as needed. Which is pretty damn fair. Why should I pay for way more?

To be honest, I would not have an issue with paying more.. if this extra money was going into some health care fund. Seriously, I was more in favor of the Savings Account type of fund thing to invest in my health care coverage.

Anyways, with Obama's plan... I myself and a number of people we are going to go from paying around $200-600 year to say spending like $5,000-6,000 a year for insurance. I can imagine also some people being forced to enroll in low income socialized medicine programs, which means people will have to subject themselves to some of the crazy policies of these programs.

Obama's plan either forces people into "the System" or forces them to Engage in Commerce with Corperate Insurance Companies.

Seriously, I would not have an issue with paying the Extra $5,000 a year, if that money was going to end up going towards my health care when I'm old and need assisted living and health care in my later years. Basically, I would be investing in my future health care needs. I seriously don't see this shit happening with Obama's plan.

This plan in my opinion is just going to place more of an economic crunch on healthy people with healthy families. Fuck All, I'd rather have my income tax increased by 18% with money going into a socialized system compared to this madness. At least I'd be getting something back out of it at a later date should I become seriously ill.

Insurance Policies are not investments! Insurance Policies are not Investments. Like I said, I'd rather pay into some plan that's an investment in my future health care needs. I'd rather be taxed and the money go into a Government program or a Program that serves as an investment plan for Medical needs.

I'd rather see the Goverment get my money compared to a private company, at least the Government can use the money to maintain things in our society. Roads, Schools, Health Care, whatever the hell else. Seriously, what the fuck are the insurance companies gonna do with my money? What Radiculas Salaries and Bonuses are these people gonna get? Insurance Companies don't have my best interest in mind. Do you honestly think or believe they have yours?

I'm getting off my soap box now...

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Profile   Post #: 115
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 7:14:41 AM   
Whiplashsmile4


Posts: 2305
Joined: 12/2/2008
Status: offline 		Obama ain't so socialist, if he were, he'd not piss me off so much.

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Profile   Post #: 116
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 7:20:27 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Whiplashsmile4

Obama ain't so socialist, if he were, he'd not piss me off so much.

He's not a Republican, so he must be a socialist.
Great, innit? And they let people that stupid vote in elections, too...

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Profile   Post #: 117
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 8/12/2010 7:21:44 AM   
EbonyWood


Posts: 2044
Joined: 7/8/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania


quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Sooo...VA Hospitals. Discuss.


Discuss what? Non sequiturs? Poor analogies?


VA hospitals are an example of socialist healthcare....


If that is true, then I definitely don't want socialist healthcare.



You do if you've got no legs and no money.

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 118
RE: GOP Rep. "I Refused To Call Obama 'A Socialist... - 12/21/2010 3:33:28 PM   
DTrashy


Posts: 4
Joined: 11/29/2010
Status: offline 		I would say that I am really a progressive that disdains socialism and entitlements. However, I really get tired of coservative pundits capitalizing on conservative agenda. I am in favor of totally revamping social security to only retiring people when they are no longer viable in the work place but increasing the benefits based on how old the person finally is when they finally have to retire. I am in favor of a single payer education system which determines who gets paid to go another semester by how well they perform in school. I am in favor of a multi-tiered healthcare regulation that determines health care fees based on healthy lifestyle indicators. I happen to agree with a lot of what is in ObamaCare but I think it could have done better. Nobody seems to understand that we have a free health care system by just going to the emergency room and then not paying the bill. I am disgusted by people who smoke, drink and eat crap and demand free health care.

I am rather disgusted that Republicans exchanged lower tax deductions for the wealthy in return for 13 more months of unemployment. I suppose that the wealthy would suddenly decide to invest and hire more people since they will be paying less on their profits so that the 13 additional months of unemployment won't be needed, LOL. How about a tax structure that would clearly rewards the wealthy for investing in this country and hiring more U.S. citizens. Having said that the economy is best explained by supply and demand. So as long as people overseas are willing to work for less than people in the United States then jobs are going to go overseas. The government regulation that we have has been determined by lobbyists rather than by the people. I wonder how much these conservative talk show hosts are subsidized by lobbyists.

(in reply to EbonyWood)
Profile   Post #: 119
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