RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority?

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 7:01:32 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

Nods. If you find love in today's fractured world you are indeed lucky. To diminish it's worth or to say it is not needed, or worry about loss of authority is just wrong on many levels, to me.

I used to do this, because I didn't believe in it. I had lost faith in the words. I didn't want a man to tell me he loved me because I didn't trust him enough to actually believe him. "Show me, don't tell me" was my response to it.

Trusting in my owners words is so much better for me. Knowing he means what he says is more fulfilling than I can even try to express here.

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Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to sexyred1)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 7:53:18 AM

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I'm of the opinion that many who post in CM, whilst they may try to give a broad answer do so based on what is right or wrong for them and thus for each it is the one true way rather than a universal one.

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Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

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(in reply to NuevaVida)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 8:29:05 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

I'm of the opinion that many who post in CM, whilst they may try to give a broad answer do so based on what is right or wrong for them and thus for each it is the one true way rather than a universal one.

Hi IronBear,

I would tend to agree. However, when one person states her amusement at how others are doing it and tells us that putting conditions on the relationship is wrong - when ALL relationships have conditions - it was worth commenting on. And if it was only one specific condition, then I am curious why.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 9:52:23 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida
I would tend to agree. However, when one person states her amusement at how others are doing it and tells us that putting conditions on the relationship is wrong - when ALL relationships have conditions - it was worth commenting on. And if it was only one specific condition, then I am curious why.

Yeah, but is it really worth having the debate? Yes, the one-true-way crowd will always be here and always be vocal. So what? I pretty much get it that there are some "slaves' here on collarme that feel I'm not masterly enough. Those same slaves, to me, look like a joke. That's no real surprise. That's just an artifact of coming out of such wildly differing doors that there's really not even any room for discussion. This goes back to the multiple definitions of "dominance" and "submission" that float around in BDSM land. Some people get it that there are multiple valid viewpoints and other people do not.

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~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to NuevaVida)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 10:46:29 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527
Yeah, but is it really worth having the debate?

Nah, not really. And I don't personally care how others view me, either. I was just curious about the hypocritical part of the message.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 11:13:35 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

I'm of the opinion that many who post in CM, whilst they may try to give a broad answer do so based on what is right or wrong for them and thus for each it is the one true way rather than a universal one.

But isn't that true for Us all.. We ALL have a OTW... Ours and it is only applicable to Our Household. Discussions are mainly sharing viewpoints based on those positions.

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This above all: to thine own self be true,
And it must follow, as the night the day,
Thou canst not then be false to any man.

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(in reply to IronBear)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 3:53:16 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse
But isn't that true for Us all.. We ALL have a OTW... Ours and it is only applicable to Our Household.

Sure that's correct.... if we assume that everyone is so parochial that the only viewpoint that they can hold in their head is their own.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to RavenMuse)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 5:13:47 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

quote:

ORIGINAL: RavenMuse
But isn't that true for Us all.. We ALL have a OTW... Ours and it is only applicable to Our Household.
Sure that's correct.... if we assume that everyone is so parochial that the only viewpoint that they can hold in their head is their own.

I'd actually take this a step further and say there may be ways that work even better for us, that we haven't considered. I mean, are you absolutely certain there is only ONE way for you to do things? Or is your mind open to different ideas? I don't think of my owner as having "one true way" for us. I think of him as having "his" way for us, but that may change if he finds an even better way.

This is why I love conversations that are so open in nature, in which various approaches are discussed - openly. I find open minds to be enormously attractive.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 5:40:54 PM

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Actually i KNOW someone didn't imply i am amused at how others do it because that is something i have NEVER said. And if you want to start putting words in my mouth i suggest you know my thoughts before you do. Its BS comments like that that lead to misconceptions. However, these TYPES of discussions i do find amusing. And to answer a question being posed -- Yes my way is the ONLY way. If you have a problem with that then do it your way. It utterly flabbergasts me how people are sooo afraid to admit that THEIR WAY IS THE WAY. I mean come on folks be logical instead of emotional. If your way wasn't THE way for you, you wouldn't be doing it. So when someone comments on THEIR WAY is THE way, logically an intelligent person should be able to say okay cool. Instead of always with the "true" concept being utilized. It utterly amazes me that on a board with so many intelligent people that many responses start out with "ohh you are saying there is one true way." Yeah actually i am. I am not wishy washy, i don't need approval or to be politically correct and try and make everyone feel okay in their chosen way. My way is THE way. Again, if you don't like MY way, do it your own way. Its really that simple.

Again i am posting in this reply based on comments i saw because really, lol the responses you posted to my post weren't all that important to me but i was hoping some of you would stop and think about your way being YOUR way and your way being THE way. There are too many people worried about what other people think about what they do. But whomever asked me if M/s can be both who you are and what you do -- my answer is no. Actions don't make someone a Master or a slave, being does. As for my motto -- no actually it doesn't put conditions on anyone -- because i never said anything about a Man choosing to do things differently would be a deal breaker. Hell i am a slave, i can demand anything i want lol whether or not he would comply is not up to me. If his mastery holds me as his slave, he can and will do pretty much whatever he wants even if he decides to tell me he loves me. See, while i do have my motto, the concept of slave that i am resides solely on the Master. That's what most of you don't get who are asking me that question. grins, i can demand anything i want, whether or not i get it is at HIS determination -- not mine. However, i have seen way too many people say if they don't have his love or it appears he doesn't say he loves them, that is a deal breaker for many. But what i did find amusing is MOST people can't articulate a concept of what love means. They break it down into concepts that existed in my relationship without the word love bandied about. So that's what i am i guess confused about. Why such focus on something most people can't articulate but uses more arbitrary words to describe same. That is what i find confusing -- so many people it seems set this whole concept up to fail because in the end they are using so many arbitrary words to describe an arbitrary concept, when you can simply eliminate the catch all concept many call love and focus on defining those arbitrary concepts you are using in the catchall of love.

I don't need to hear a guy tell me he loves me, for if i don't know it and he has to say it for it to be real, to me -- something is very wrong.

To me, when you feel threatened because someone claims a way is the way, and you aren't capable of saying yeah okay because its true for those people it is the way. It tells me there is way to many insecurities in your way that you feel another not agreeing with your way is somehow a concept that shouldn't exist.

I've always thought people who use the phrase "one true way" as a sneer are silly. Why? Because it implies that they themselves do not recognize their OWN way as THE way. And if they don't see their way as THE way, then perhaps there are issues they need to address. There is nothing wrong with OWNING your way because in the end, if you can't define and own your way -- then whose way is your way?

What's the song -- you've got to stand for something or you'll fall for anything. You've got to be your own man, not a puppet on a string.

You've got to own your way. Otherwise, how can you be sure someone else owning their way is the wrong way for you? Don't let fear of disapproval from someone else come in the form of their owning their own way.

angel

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What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
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(in reply to NuevaVida)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 6:13:24 PM

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Wow you wrote this big ol' long post but never answered the question about conditions.

I will answer to my comment about being amused. Your post said:

quote:

I am amused at many responses in this thread who read what i posted. Why? Because many of you seem to think that the ownership relationship i speak about was somehow void of something you think you have. That love for you brings about a concept that my relationship with my Master didn't have. My favorite is the implication that his saying he loves you and the love makes it a stronger bond etc.

I suppose it was worded vaguely enough to be open to misinterpretation, but no matter. Don't make it so deep, though - I'm not "wanting to put words in your mouth" lol.

As I said before, I prefer to have a way that works for us, and not limit to just "one" way. We'll adapt and evolve as we move through life. We're just fluid like that.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 6:35:12 PM

WolfyMontgomery

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I think the thing that you're not totally getting is that most of us "OWN" our ways. The way I live is the way for me, and anyone who doesn't want to live that way probably wouldn't be a good Master for me. But I don't say that their way is wrong, like how you tend to imply in your postings, I just look at what they say as just another way TO live the lifestyle, even if it's not *my* way.

But that doesn't mean that I'm not polite about it and calling it "The One True Way", because it's not *THE* one true way for everybody - just the way for ME. Because of this, I don't disapprove of what others do, I don't knock them for what they do, I just know that I'm not compatible with them for said relationship.

But the reason why people got annoyed at your words is because you're wording things as if that's the one true way for EVERYONE. We aren't politically correct, we're just polite and not saying that everyone else is doing it wrong - even if it isn't right for us.

As for my being a slave - it's true, I probably wouldn't be one if Master didn't love me. Honestly, I don't see myself being a slave in most relationships, it's the fact that he's inspired me to want to be his property that I have given myself to him in that way. If I wasn't his slave, I wouldn't even call myself a slave - the most I would be without him is a submissive with the potential to BECOME a slave to the person that I could trust that implicitly - and for that level of trust to be there yes, I would have to love them and in order for me to love them that deeply I would have to be loved by them. I unconsciously submit to pretty much everyone I meet (it really pisses Master off, he's working on making me stop), but I am not owned by everyone I meet, and yeah, it takes a lot for me to want to be owned.

And I'd say he maintains that authority pretty darn well. Once I gave myself to him, I'm his, I don't have any authority anymore because I gave it all to him, and he's not about to let me have it back any time soon.

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~Eleven

-A Wolf of a Different Color

Fear me and my Gleaming Metal Chompers of DOOM!
..........that means my braces. >_>

(in reply to barelynangel)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 6:49:24 PM

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chuckles, Wolfy for me it IS the one way for everyone. IF its not, then do it YOUR way. I don't HAVE to agree with what you do, what you define etc and if you get upset because you fail to see something as a opinion, that's my issue how?

I don't and won't agree with what a lot of people call slavery or being a slave. What's more i don't have too, but what else is simple -- if you don't agree with MY way, then do it YOUR way.

You don't get that when i post, i post about MY WAY, that's it -- it really is that simple. I could honestly care less about your way other than as a course of discussion. If you need my approval of your way, you won't get it. Why? Because how can i approve something i don't understand? What's more while its a curiosity for me, its not something i think about beyond the casual online discussion or offline discussion now and again.

You are taking posts here way to seriously if you are upset because my way IS the way. If you don't like MY way, please feel free to do it YOUR way, but don't fool yourself -- in the end we all have our ways and for each of us our way is THE one "true" way. To say otherwise, you are fooling yourself.

Ahh okay you aren't being politically correct, you are being polite. Well so am i, i am being polite giving people the benefit of the doubt that they are intelligent enough to recognize that if someone speaks of their way as the way, the connotation of THEIR way is understood. I don't see a need to put disclaimers on every one of my posts to me that is IMPOLITE because it indicates people are too stupid toi recognize my way is the way -- for me. I guess in the end, it all depends on what you consider polite. Your way of being polite is implying people are stupid and are incapable of recognizing someone's post is THEIR way, my way of being politie is giving people the intelligence understanding that they know when a person posts an opinion, its is about THEIR way and a disclaimer isn't needed. To me this board is full of way to many intelligent people to have to insult their intelligence with a disclaimer even if its integrated into the post. May as well just put it in their signature line implying people aren't intelligent enough to recognize it without it being said ALL of the damn time.

And you will find, i could care less if people get annoyed with what i post.

angel

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What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
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(in reply to WolfyMontgomery)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 7:06:15 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida
This is why I love conversations that are so open in nature, in which various approaches are discussed - openly. I find open minds to be enormously attractive.

Open-mindedness is indeed a wonderful characteristic. It is unfortunate that it is not more common than it is. It is also unfortunate that sometimes the more you see a person post the uglier of character they show themselves to be.

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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/25/2010 7:21:04 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofMists

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida
This is why I love conversations that are so open in nature, in which various approaches are discussed - openly. I find open minds to be enormously attractive.

Open-mindedness is indeed a wonderful characteristic. It is unfortunate that it is not more common than it is. It is also unfortunate that sometimes the more you see a person post the uglier of character they show themselves to be.

It's not as common as we might wish. But there's hope, ya know. I used to be extremely close minded and I changed my thinking.

As for characters, yes, sometimes you can just sit and watch it worsen, but those are the choices people make. I can choose not to let them penetrate, so to speak.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 4:20:08 PM

WolfyMontgomery

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Huh, didn't realize I was upset. I thought I was just pointing out my observations to people's opinions and figuring out how exactly they thought and why they think it should apply to everyone - which there are plenty of people who DO think it should apply to everyone and think less of people who it doesn't apply to. Logically - when you look at most of the people who say that their way is the "One True Way for ALL", they have the mindset that anyone who doesn't think that way is less than, stupid, ill taught, misinformed, idiotic, the list could go on and can get much more insulting. So logically a person who most often sees that phrasing in people who think highly of themselves and less of others who don't agree, they assume that anyone else who uses that phrasing means the same thing - even if they're just assuming that any intelligent people should know the difference. Most intelligent people do, but most intelligent people also notice the fact that it tends to be the ones with their heads stuck up their asses who look down on all others who use that way of putting things.

The thing that irks most 'intelligent' people about the whole "one true way" thing isn't the fact that it's said - as you said everyone has their own "one true way" - it's the fact that most of the time person saying it is an ass about it. I completely own my own concept (it is mine, I live it, I wouldn't want to live any other way, too bad for those who do I won't change for them, it is my "one true way" and if they can't live up to it then they aren't for me), but I am not above seeing that there are more ways for people who are NOT me. To NOT see that speaks of elitism to me, and most elitists tend to act like they have their heads stuffed way too far up their nicely polished asses.

Honestly from my perspective it seems that you're not even interested in discussing the different "ways" beyond your wanting to say that you don't understand them and they don't matter. And in that course of discussion, when you see something you don't agree with, or when someone replies to your comment - is it a call to defend your beliefs or is it a call to discuss those beliefs? For me, it's a call to discuss them, find where the other person is coming from and learn new things - whether those things will eventually apply or not to my own dynamic (9/10 it doesn't) it never hurts to at least have those windows to different aspects so that if someone comes to you for advice or when you need advice yourself you can look back on those discussions and look at all the different pieces of information and have them all to draw from.

My "way of being polite" is basically to keep my head out of my ass and have an open mind to learn about other concepts, whether I agree with them or not. A person can always *understand* another concept, even if they don't agree with it and wouldn't want it as a part of their life.

I tend to not get annoyed with people unless they directly insult me, which you haven't - so I have no reason to be annoyed, or upset, or whatever you want to call it. I thought we were just discussing things, after all.

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Fear me and my Gleaming Metal Chompers of DOOM!
..........that means my braces. >_>

(in reply to barelynangel)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 5:03:51 PM

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Wolfy, first of all, you have no clue what my MOTIVE in discussing is or what i learn or don't learn from the discussions. Are you seriously trying to tell me that ANYTHING said on these boards you are going to go out and CHANGE your way of doing things in your relationship? Somehow i doubt it. These are DISCUSSION boards, all i do here is intake and offer information (one thing you will find is i could care less what people do with the information i offer -- if they choose to discuss it fine, if they choose to ignore it fine, if they choose to laugh at it or find it amusing fine) and in all the years i have been a part of discussion boards, i have to say, i have never taken what is said in the discussions and changed my way of doing things when i have experience in it.

I find it interesting with all my questions on this thread you don't FIND me interested in DISCUSSING. Really, what do you consider correct discussion technique? But i think you are confusing discussing with accepting. I tend to get my experience from living, not discussing.   If you see what most of the experienced posters state when someone ask them for opinions they say GO OUT AND EXPERIENCE it. They don't say learn through ad nauseum discussion of 3209392302192310298479238429463289 different opinions being cast about. Hell, why someone would want that type of pain is beyond me lol. Sifting through opinons is not the way to obtain what is correct for you.

You seem to think that just because i don't accept other people's definitions somehow its some great thing. Its really not. Damn Wolfy i am one person out of 103920132918342104 people lol. While it seems you really want me to be some important person in the general scope of things -- i am really not.   What you call elitism is simply acknowledgment that i know nothing i say here will remotely change anyone's lives, the elitism you speak of is my knowing that people are capable of making their own choices so my discussion comments are absolute becuase it is how it is for me.

grins, i will also say, i never said ONE TRUE way. That was another poster. I simply responded to someone saying that's what i was saying.

Wolfy, you are more than welcome to keep your options open, however, to judge someone who chooses not too is pretty much saying that YOUR way MUST be everyone elses way. You and i seem to have different reasons for participating in discussions. Yet you are telling me that i am wrong because i choose NOT to do it your way. Wow, sounds familiar yes.

Same with those speaking of open-mindedness -- i know for a fact both people aren't absolutely open-minded about all subjects, maybe on this one particular subject they have CHOSEN to be, but they both are now saying how THEIR WAY is how everyone should do it, and one has even resorted to insults because someone chooses NOT to do it their way.

And no, Wolfy, my mind doesn't wrap itself around the "L" concept. Its not something i understand at all. So again YOU are once again doing what you accuse me of doing, saying it should be YOUR way -- i.e., everyone understands. I don't and won't accept something  i don't understand. And i think its pretty elitist of you to say everyone "understands"another concept. So you are WRONG to believe everything can be understood by people.

grins, do you really want to continue playing this game? Edited due to length.

angel

< Message edited by barelynangel -- 10/26/2010 5:07:54 PM >

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(in reply to WolfyMontgomery)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 6:02:59 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

Same with those speaking of open-mindedness -- i know for a fact both people aren't absolutely open-minded about all subjects, maybe on this one particular subject they have CHOSEN to be, but they both are now saying how THEIR WAY is how everyone should do it, and one has even resorted to insults because someone chooses NOT to do it their way.

Um, what? Since I'm one of the people who spoke about open-mindedness...what exactly am I not open-minded about?

And please quote me where I have said my way is how everyone should do it.

I'm still kinda wondering why you have chosen not to answer my earlier question about conditions, too.

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RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 6:14:56 PM

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There are many benefits to one true ways. Traditions are fun; I love Catholic Mass, though I'm athiest. And therein lies the drawback to one true way. Because I tend to really piss off any priests that come talk to me, even though I'm just being honest about my conclusions.

How to have the benefits without the drawbacks, I wonder?

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(in reply to NuevaVida)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 7:04:02 PM

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NuevaVida, are you saying that every post you have made on this message board has been within the definition of being open-minded? Umm, we've both been on this site for a while and the answer to that question we BOTH know is not yes.

I think open-mindedness has allowed too many people to become wishywashy in what they believe and it shows in our world. And i don't believe being open-minded is a concept that benefits everyone. As i said, you've GOT to stand for something. The only thing being open-minded in this thread would bring me is falsely accepting a concept i don't understand -- the "L" concept. And from what i am seeing there is 2103219043291473921382198.32 definitions of the concept of the love being applied to relationships - and this is the HARDEST thing for me to understand --, along with 832901920132910432214983294832.30 concepts of what is slavery or slave, and then again 292928777444.92 concepts of authority.

So to me, being openminded in this thread would simply give me a headache of massive proportions -- yeah i mean a REAL headache -- for one simple fact, i am an ultra analyzer. Its not healthy for me. Now perhaps YOU have learned something being the open-minded person you are. But if you don't, its not that big of deal as how i do things but more so WHY is really no concern or consequence to you.

And finally - i answered your last sentence before. This is the last time i will respond to your question. I can't help you are missing it in my response because you are in more need to see negative in my post.

angel

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What lies behind us and what lies before us are tiny matters compared to what lies within us.
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(in reply to DMFParadox)

RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain aut... - 10/26/2010 7:18:01 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: barelynangel

NuevaVida, are you saying that every post you have made on this message board has been within the definition of being open-minded? Umm, we've both been on this site for a while and the answer to that question we BOTH know is not yes.

My open-mindedness has evolved quite a bit since I've been on these boards. I am not, nor did I say, I am open-minded in "all subjects". I am generally open-minded. You're the one who said "all subjects."

quote:

So to me, being openminded in this thread would simply give me a headache of massive proportions -- yeah i mean a REAL headache -- for one simple fact, i am an ultra analyzer. Its not healthy for me. Now perhaps YOU have learned something being the open-minded person you are. But if you don't, its not that big of deal as how i do things but more so WHY is really no concern or consequence to you.

That's a shame that you'd get such a headache from being open-minded. I'm a big analyzer myself. In fact, I am a analyst as a profession. It requires me to keep an open mind, so that I am not so narrow I miss something crucial.

As for "Why" being no concern to me...that's odd you would say that, since you ask so many why questions. I would think you would like "why" exchanges.

quote:

And finally - i answered your last sentence before.

Yes, actually, I did miss it. I'll go look for it, since I was actually pretty interested.

quote:

This is the last time i will respond to your question. I can't help you are missing it in my response because you are in more need to see negative in my post.

I'm not looking for or needing to see positive OR negative in your post. I am responding to what your posts represent to me - trust me, there is no need. If I see negative, it's not because of some "need" to see it - it's because negative is coming through to me. Really, angel, I am not invested in you. I just wanted to know how you'd answer certain things.

And you showed me.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to barelynangel)

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All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Ask a Master >> RE: Being in love with a slave - can a man maintain authority?

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