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RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:32:38 AM

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Couldn't get that GMA video to load, unfortunately. Thanks for the link, though.

I'm actually surprised the rudeness would be that blatant (as far as folks snickering behind their hands and whatnot). The only time I've encountered out and out eye-rolling and the like recently is when I (foolishly) decided to go on a plane ride, LoL. Won't be doing that again any time soon!

Even online most people seem to be (relatively) polite, most of the time. For instance, when I message a girl on here, Facebook or wherever, usually she either doesn't reply, replies politely but very quickly makes it a point to rebuff me in some fashion (such as by saying she has a boyfriend, or such like that), makes up some excuse for why she's not interested for some reason other than my appearance, or, worst case scenario, simply blocks me without replying (those are the ones that tend to sting the most). You do get the rude ones every once in a while, though. Just yesterday I had a girl tell me that she wouldn't be seen in public with "someone like me"... LoL.

Nice.

(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:34:22 AM

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Yes, it is the way it is, right or wrong. I've lived it and still do to a certain degree. Right, wrong, judgemental, whatever you choose to call it. It's a reality. Remember the big todo about two seats for obese people on airplanes? There were alot of strong opinions about that.

(in reply to AquaticSub)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:37:17 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Atropos19

annie:

This may be a little off topic, but I'm interested in this documentary you mentioned. Exactly how was this woman treated differently? And how traditionally attractive was she "in real life"?

It's funny... I have a female friend who's a bit on the heavy side (and married to a skinny guy, go figure), and she says that when she goes into stores like Abercrombie, the Gap, etc. to buy clothes for friends and relatives, she gets dirty looks from the skinny 17 yr old blondes behind the counter, like "What are YOU doing thinking you can shop here?" I've always thought it was all in her head (i.e., projecting her insecurities onto other people), but in the past couple years I've started to wonder...

No I've seen similar. I've even seen the same scenarios presented on Oprah and 20/20 once upon a time. A long time ago. The ones I've seen haven't even only addressed heavy people but also women and black people in other clips. Simply showing that racism and discrimination still thrives quite well in our society.

It's probably not merely your friend's perception. Although I will say that I am on the heavy side albeit not to an extreme and I've not experienced that type of discrimination. But I do have a friend who I've been with who is far heavier and sensed the same type of stuff your friend did. Given it doesn't occur for me on my own I knew it was directed at her. Which both infuriated me and made me sad.

(in reply to Atropos19)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:41:33 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: anniezz338

Yes, it is the way it is, right or wrong. I've lived it and still do to a certain degree. Right, wrong, judgemental, whatever you choose to call it. It's a reality. Remember the big todo about two seats for obese people on airplanes? There were alot of strong opinions about that.

Segregation also used to be the way things were.

If you're comfortable with the current status, than by all means enjoy it. I shall continue to loathe it and not accept it.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:47:15 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: anniezz338

Yes, it is the way it is, right or wrong. I've lived it and still do to a certain degree. Right, wrong, judgemental, whatever you choose to call it. It's a reality. Remember the big todo about two seats for obese people on airplanes? There were alot of strong opinions about that.

Some folks are comfortable in their lemming-ness and strive to be the most accepted of the group.

And then there are the rest of us who like to look beyond the small confines of the box society wants to place us in.

ETA...Hmmm, I wonder if granny had a quote for that concept.

< Message edited by BonesFromAsh -- 11/30/2010 9:48:38 AM >

(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 9:59:09 AM

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Watched the ABC News clip (with the girls taunting the woman). A few things struck me:

In the article, they ask the question of whether the "stats" would change (i.e., would more people intervene?) if the ones doing the taunting were boys. But they don't actually tell us whether more or less people intervened under the changed scenario.

Also, there's the question of whether it would make any difference if the person being taunted was male or female.

Ultimately, I think what this "experiment" failed to take into account was... would people be likely to intervene in other circumstances? Or is there just a general "don't get involved" mentality? I tend to think the results would be similar in a lot of different scenarios where one person was being picked on or harassed by others.

In particular, some acquaintances of mine (all men) once started mercilessly picking on a guy in a wheelchair while they were all waiting in line for a ride at Kings Island (a local amusement park). What no one else in line knew, of course, was that the guys (including the one in the chair) were all there together and the whole thing was a joke.

No one said anything.

(in reply to BonesFromAsh)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:10:16 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Atropos19

Watched the ABC News clip (with the girls taunting the woman). A few things struck me:

In the article, they ask the question of whether the "stats" would change (i.e., would more people intervene?) if the ones doing the taunting were boys. But they don't actually tell us whether more or less people intervened under the changed scenario.

Also, there's the question of whether it would make any difference if the person being taunted was male or female.

Ultimately, I think what this "experiment" failed to take into account was... would people be likely to intervene in other circumstances? Or is there just a general "don't get involved" mentality? I tend to think the results would be similar in a lot of different scenarios where one person was being picked on or harassed by others.

I've noticed this in many of the "experiments" that are done in regards to this subject. I, personally, feel a woman is used as the test subject more often than a man perhaps because society is more judgemental of fat women comparred to fat men. It would be interesting to see the "What Would You Do" video (one of the links I offered) done with a fat guy food shopping with is son.

quote:

In particular, some acquaintances of mine (all men) once started mercilessly picking on a guy in a wheelchair while they were all waiting in line for a ride at Kings Island (a local amusement park). What no one else in line knew, of course, was that the guys (including the one in the chair) were all there together and the whole thing was a joke.

No one said anything.

I've done similar things with friends of mine just to see how people would react. I wish I was surprised by society more often than not.

BTW...haven't been to King's Island in years...good memories indeed!

ETA....I use the word "fat" because I find "overweight" to be misleading...over whoose weight? BTW, I'm a fat chick myself but I like to spell it phat just because it has one extra letter...like me, one extra more.

< Message edited by BonesFromAsh -- 11/30/2010 10:14:13 AM >

(in reply to Atropos19)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:17:37 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: anniezz338
SpaceSpank, sadly, just like society dictates us everywhere else, first impressions do count. And it's been statistically proven. I watched a documentary where a girl was made up to be 60-80lbs heavier and went looking for a job, shopping, dining out, etc. Then she went as herself. I was surprised how noticeably different she was treated.

And it's not just women. One the study I saw, women were given a profile sheet for a man and asked to rate his attractiveness. When he was blue collar he scored a 4. When he was in the 250K annually white collar category, he was an 8. It isn't just surface impressions. The cold hard truth is that both men and women select for things other than the good, pure, "who they are as a person" things that we all like to talk about. The other cold hard truth is that they ought to... this is not people being shallow... it's people being human and behaving as humans really do, not as we wish they would in our sterilized (and wildly inaccurate) conception of humans.

All of this may be wildly unfair to men who don't have status in their community and/or women who are not hotties... but life was never meant to be fair.

_____________________________

~Jeff

I didn't so much "enslave" Carol as I did "enlove" her. - Me
I want a joyous, loving, respectful relationship where the male is in charge and deserves to be. - DavanKael

(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:18:08 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: anniezz338
I just need some awesome Dom to cure me of my evil drive-thru ways :P

But why does Mr Awesome want a sub who isn't already as awesome as he is? So because you're a sub you're allowed to be lazy and not focused on being the best you can be? Why does he have to waste his time trying to force you to do the right thing instead of finding someone who is committed to being at her best so she matches him?

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:24:02 AM

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There is a difference between selecting someone based on what you are attracted to and making baseless assumptions from a picture and a profile that may or may not even have a weight listed.

_____________________________

Without my dominance you cannot submit. Without your submission I cannot dominate. You are my equal in this, though our roles are different.-Val

It was ok for him to beat me but then he tried to cuddle me! - Me

Member:Clan of the Scarlet O'Hair

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:28:48 AM

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I've seen it first hand as well, Atropos.

I had a friend of mine when I was much younger that was 400+ pounds. A sweetheart of a guy..him and his wife.

We were riding a bus one afternoon..I got on before he did and went to the back..He was a few places behind me when boarding. I found a seat that had only one place so he had to look for another which was two seats in front of me.

When he approached the seat he wanted the other guy sitting in it said " Next seat Big Boy"..My friend being highly medicated for bi-polar and a number of other things was about as docile as a fly so he started to move to the next seat. It made me sick to my stomach so I said something about it in my usually so very nice way. I tapped the guy on the shoulder forcibly and told him to move his ass.

If I have to look like an asshole because I chose to stand up for someone I deemed less fortunate in a situation I can live with that because the alternative is feeling like one by my own standards and that won't do at all for me. I usually always say something..It has of course gotten me into trouble but I can live with that as well.

I've seen it many more times and I'll usually wait for a second to see if the person will defend themselves..If the "attacking" party doesn't hush then I'll step in. I don't care if I know ya or not.

In the situation you've brought up..Who knows..maybe people picked up on the fact that you guys were putting on an act.

All in all..I think you're right though..Not a lot of people will say something these days because they are afraid of what might happen. I've been afraid in a number of those situations as well but something inside says you gotta do something...My conscious!

I hate that guy sometimes

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
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(in reply to Atropos19)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:29:19 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527
this may be wildly unfair to men who don't have status in their community and/or women who are not hotties...

Why? Each of us is allowed to make or own choices. We all bear the responsibility to make ourselves reasonably attractive to potential partners. And the 5'9", 350 lb guy in his fifties demanding that life serve him up a 25 year old pornstar with a seven figure income - hey, that's his choice, but it limits his pool of prospective partners and means that his search will take a long time.

_____________________________

"You women....

The small-breasted ones want larger breasts. The large-breasted ones want smaller ones. The straight-haired ones curl their hair, and the curly-haired ones straighten theirs...

Quit fretting. We men love you."

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:37:26 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
But why does Mr Awesome want a sub who isn't already as awesome as he is? So because you're a sub you're allowed to be lazy and not focused on being the best you can be? Why does he have to waste his time trying to force you to do the right thing instead of finding someone who is committed to being at her best so she matches him?

Thank you, Des. I've seen this attitude quite a bit, and I have come to believe it's held by women who have no understanding of how common being submissive really is. The attitude is basically, "I have all these things wrong with me, but I am a sub/slave, so if you are a strong enough dominant you can fix me and we'll be happy forever after." As if being willing to sub is some sort of golden treasure (or gift) that outshines everything else. Well, frankly, every woman I have ever been serious about, vanilla or otherwise, submitted to me in certain ways. It's not that hard to find women who have their shit together who enjoy a man who is strong. In fact, my single female friends most often complain to me that men tend to be too afraid to take charge when dating, or are assholes. A non-asshole dominant man is a rare find, even in vanilla.

Going the other way, men eventually meet that skinny gym chick who is batshit crazy, and the fat girl who is supernice and great in bed. I don't think it takes long for most guys to figure out that they'd rather have a food-loving nympho than a neurotic biatch. Thing is, the OP of this thread has no experience other than reading forum posts. It is physically impossible for you to change her mind, about anything, because it is literally all in her head.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to DesFIP)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:40:20 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

When he was blue collar he scored a 4. When he was in the 250K annually white collar category, he was an 8. It isn't just surface impressions. The cold hard truth is that both men and women select for things other than the good, pure, "who they are as a person" things that we all like to talk about. The other cold hard truth is that they ought to... this is not people being shallow... it's people being human and behaving as humans really do, not as we wish they would in our sterilized (and wildly inaccurate) conception of humans.

This thread wasn't started based on preference. That's the difference. It's one thing to say I want a man who makes lots of money versus a man who makes little because I want to live comfortably. Or to say I want a white collar man because he leaves the house dressed far nicer and that's what I find hot and appealing. Or to say I prefer skinnier men to heavier men because that's what I find attractive. It's entirely another to say well he's fat so he's not disciplined and that's why I'm not interested. Either call it for what it is which is "I don't care for fat men" or at least concede to making assumptions about a whole group of people unfairly. The former is merely an opinion and we ought to determine what is right for us in spite of fairness but the latter is an attack on an entire group of people...wrongly I might add so of course it's going to garner strong responses and paint oneself in a negative light.

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:41:54 AM

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anniezz338

A few thoughts to offer and not all of then directed at you.

My story on becoming overweight happened like this:
I once was once of those people who as a youth could eat anything and not gain an ounce.
I never excercised aside from the mandatory gym class.

I graduated in 1980 thin.
In college, it was pretty much the same.

In 1985 i had a severe knee injury that imobilized me for more than 6 months.
I was bored to tears and in boredom I ate.
I ate for the lonelies, I ate for boredom. When breakfast was done I wondered what was for lunch and that was at 10am. So i'd rustle up a little something.
After lunch I wondered about what i would have for a snack before dinner.

And because I wasn't moving at all, unlike my previous and longtime 'eat everything and never gain an ounce' I gained this time.

I lost my fast metabolism.

And it took me a long time to see the change...and so my eating habits didn't change.

I did go back to work at a fairly active job.

I still gained.

I lost and gained a few times and in 2004 I lost weight due to an undiagnosed medical condition (type II diabetes).
My weight stopped at 214lbs and had been stable until last year.

Last year I began losing it, very consistenly.
I have lost 50lbs so far.
It is easier than it probably could be to to a medication I am taking for migraines.
That doesnt make it without effort.
It doesn't make it easy.
It just makes it easier.

quote:

ORIGINAL: anniezz338

I'm single and I'll own up that my first impression would not be positive meeting someone grossly overweight. Yes, it's shitty. I know first hand because it has been done to me. Should I automatically assume that he's that heavy for a good reason? No. Does it make me a bad person? No.

Point blank, when wannabe's and wankers are brought up, I think of some overweight men I have chatted to online. They can't get a date anywhere else so they present themselves as Masters/Doms. I may have little experience, it's true, but it comes out in their behavior when you start talking to them. I've been looking into this stuff for about a year now. I can start ticking off the names of who I would consider true Masters/Doms in CM....and I bet I would get alot of agreements. I can tell at least a general difference. And there is alot of them (no not all overweight).....lol.

I do not like talking badly about people....but that's the truth.

And when I was losing my weight, I was dealing with anxiety, stress, slow metabolism, perimenapause (don't even get me started on that...lol) and a torn muscle in my back, all considered legitimate medical issues. I still deal with them. They are on the excuse list.

So why do you have the double standard?

Annie,
Assuming that someone would be a wannabe or a fake based on their weight is faulty theory.
I have met some very nice very real guys here many of them were at least a little overweight.

My Master is in that category.
He appreciate efforts I make to alter baked goods for there to be less fat, sugar, and increase the healthfulness quotient.
He appreciates creativity.

How are you determining who is a fake?

Sometimes a fake is only someone you are incompatable with.

I met decent people within my first year of being here. They may not have been long term match material, but some of them are friendship worthy and I am glad I met them.

And then there is the joy in my Master finding me here and the discoveries that brings.

_____________________________

The original home of the caffeinated psychotic hair pixies.
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(in reply to anniezz338)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:45:57 AM

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OK

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RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 10:51:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

All in all..I think you're right though..Not a lot of people will say something these days because they are afraid of what might happen. I've been afraid in a number of those situations as well but something inside says you gotta do something...My conscious!

I hate that guy sometimes

I hate that guy as well sometimes and he sometimes gets me into trouble. I can't help it. But truth be told I'm awfully glad that guy is there. It's what makes me feel human...that I do care.

(in reply to Icarys)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 11:11:18 AM

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Come on, annie, you can do better than that. :P

(in reply to subkatslut)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 11:18:03 AM

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quote:

The cold hard truth is that both men and women select for things other than the good, pure, "who they are as a person" things that we all like to talk about. The other cold hard truth is that they ought to... this is not people being shallow... it's people being human and behaving as humans really do, not as we wish they would in our sterilized (and wildly inaccurate) conception of humans.

These may be hard and fast rules but there are wide variations on just how much is needed.

I had at least one female that I dated for some time that I didn't find physically attrative until I got to know her mind and I can't say why it happened that way but I found her beautiful in a world of other ways. After a few months of talking to her I began to see that my limited idea of what beauty was would hinder a possibly great relationship if I let it. I began to place focus on the many other things I liked about her instead of the one or two things I didn't like and it worked.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to leadership527)

RE: Weight and Master/Dom control - 11/30/2010 11:19:35 AM

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quote:

It's what makes me feel human...that I do care.

Exactly.

_____________________________

submission - the feeling of patient, submissive humbleness - the state of being submissive or compliant; meekness.

Alaska Bound-The Official Countdown Has Started!
http://tinyurl.com/872mcu3
http://alturl.com/mog7m

(in reply to subkatslut)

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