quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Seriously......I don't see this stuff as gender hateful. I see it as very dry humour, almost a way of saying I survived and am going to be okay, and for all that fucktards did to me, I DON'T hate you all. I just think an awful lot of you are really fucked up. Which is totally true. A lot of us, men and women, are really fucked up.

The problem is, most of us seem to require the truth to be all candy coated and P.C.

Fuck P.C.. I am sick of P.C..

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

Seriously......I don't see this stuff as gender hateful. I see it as very dry humour, almost a way of saying I survived and am going to be okay, and for all that fucktards did to me, I DON'T hate you all. I just think an awful lot of you are really fucked up. Which is totally true. A lot of us, men and women, are really fucked up.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

holy fuck! a lot more replies than i expected. ok, then, a mass reply to save time and bandwidth.

kana***
yeah, i guess we can seem that way to you guys. of course you're wrong about us, but what the fuck eh?

latigresse***
thanks. i agree with you on the numbers. i originally put in 1 in 100, but decided to change it, to be a little more generous. i guess i'm mellowing as i approach the big 3-0, eh?

fadedshadow***
i can't really argue with that overall. but i will add that in my experience the bulk of the non-trash are found at the lower end of the economic scale and on the fringes of society.

lillybopeep***
i wasn't assuming that my conclusions were unique, or that i was revealing any great deep truths. i posted it to explain why i hold the views i do. i don't think i am overly bitter, i'm just fucking realistic. i've been divested of my romanticism when it comes to men. and babe, i was a streetwalker, believe me i know just how evil and dangerous women can be. try being the new slut on the corner and you'll see just how sisterly the ladies of the night aren't.
i'm sure your pedo guy messed your head up pretty good, they really do that to you. i had one guy who had me dress up in his daughter's clothes and then walk in stanley park after dark so he could jump out of the bushes, grab me, beat me and "rape" me while calling me by her name and i called him daddy. that whole scene fucked me over for a week or two. i never did him a second time, that's for fucking sure.

aynne88***
first, all those wonderful men you know, how many of them can you honestly say you are 100% positive that they have never hired a prostitute, or taken advantage of a hungry homeless girl? and how the fuck do you know what they did when they were with her. see that's my point, for you they are wonderful and caring, but when they come out to play on my side of the tracks, they drop the facade and be themselves, because to their minds we don't matter, we're just whores. and who they are without their masks is very different from who they are with them on. fucking jeckyll and hyde comes to mind for most of them.
men don't go to whores when they are broken hearted, and usually don't go to bars first. the vast majority of my clients were stone cold sober. so we are comparing different subsets of men here. and what they told me about the women in their lives is very different from what they tell you, very very different.
the whole fucking point of posting this shit was to show how i wasn't a man-hater, that i disliked and distrusted men for valid reasons. but that seems to have zipped right over your head. oh well, can't get through to everybody.

jstanothersub***
you're remark about being treated the way you let people treat you, well come on. for fuck's sake, letting people treat you however the fuck they want to is pretty much central to a prostitute's role, doncha think?

tj444***
yes a lot of the fuckers are out cheating, but not all of them. a whole lot of single men frequent hookers, a whole fuck of a lot of them. mostly losers in one form or another who can't or won't get laid any other way.

arpig***
you agree because you're not really a man. you're a lesbian at heart. viva el frente extensivo lesbianismo!

otterswim***
their marital status by definition doesn't enter into it if you are fucking them for money, or for food, or a place to sleep out of the snow.
the concentration? yeah, a valid point. my experiences are with a certain sector of the male population, but its pretty fucking representative. and its a large sample. you do the math: 2 years, roughly 200 nights a year, 2 - 4 men a night. we're talking between 800 and 1600 of them. that's a fuck of a lot of men. and that doesn't include the rest of the time when i wasn't officially hooking, when i was just being exploited whenever i was down and out.

linnaeaborealis***
thanks. its good to have somebody else from the "trade" confirm my findings.

arpig (again)***
well, since you're technically not a guy, ok, you can. but you have to shave first, and i mean fucking all of you, not just your face. goddamn werewolf.

silvermark***
if what you say is true, and i have no particular reason to doubt you, then you would be one of those 1/50 i mentioned. good on ya, i envy any woman lucky enough to be with you.

otterswim (again)***
i didn't mention cheating or rape in my op even once. tj brought up cheating, and you are the first to bring up rape. i was really fucking open and honest about my feelings in the op, i didn't sugarcoat or dress anything up. i'm sure there is a whole fuck of a lot in there for you to debate or object to without making shit up.

rapierfugue***
your opinions do not surprise me in the least. but please keep in mind, we are mere mortals, so you shouldn't really judge us by the same standards you use for yourself and your fellow olympians.

thanks all for reading, and for the messages of support that i didn't reply to. and for the silliness as well. there is always room for some serious silliness in life.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

Btw: I was raped by my HS boyfriend (and worse) and a male sig. tried to kill me in '96 and nearly succeeded. However, despite that I do not have an issue with men. I just have an issue with men who would do harm to me.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LinnaeaBorealis

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

Btw: I was raped by my HS boyfriend (and worse) and a male sig. tried to kill me in '96 and nearly succeeded. However, despite that I do not have an issue with men. I just have an issue with men who would do harm to me.

I only want to address this one paragraph. Your sample size is much much smaller. There were only 2 who did bad stuff to you & interestingly, they were both males you knew & had a relationship with. This is very different from living the way Hannah has lived & the way that I lived, where the abnormal becomes normal, if you will. The majority of those we encountered in our travels did bad shit, not just a couple of them. That's a very different thing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

holy fuck! a lot more replies than i expected. ok, then, a mass reply to save time and bandwidth.

kana***
yeah, i guess we can seem that way to you guys. of course you're wrong about us, but what the fuck eh?

latigresse***
thanks. i agree with you on the numbers. i originally put in 1 in 100, but decided to change it, to be a little more generous. i guess i'm mellowing as i approach the big 3-0, eh?

fadedshadow***
i can't really argue with that overall. but i will add that in my experience the bulk of the non-trash are found at the lower end of the economic scale and on the fringes of society.

lillybopeep***
i wasn't assuming that my conclusions were unique, or that i was revealing any great deep truths. i posted it to explain why i hold the views i do. i don't think i am overly bitter, i'm just fucking realistic. i've been divested of my romanticism when it comes to men. and babe, i was a streetwalker, believe me i know just how evil and dangerous women can be. try being the new slut on the corner and you'll see just how sisterly the ladies of the night aren't.
i'm sure your pedo guy messed your head up pretty good, they really do that to you. i had one guy who had me dress up in his daughter's clothes and then walk in stanley park after dark so he could jump out of the bushes, grab me, beat me and "rape" me while calling me by her name and i called him daddy. that whole scene fucked me over for a week or two. i never did him a second time, that's for fucking sure.

aynne88***
first, all those wonderful men you know, how many of them can you honestly say you are 100% positive that they have never hired a prostitute, or taken advantage of a hungry homeless girl? and how the fuck do you know what they did when they were with her. see that's my point, for you they are wonderful and caring, but when they come out to play on my side of the tracks, they drop the facade and be themselves, because to their minds we don't matter, we're just whores. and who they are without their masks is very different from who they are with them on. fucking jeckyll and hyde comes to mind for most of them.
men don't go to whores when they are broken hearted, and usually don't go to bars first. the vast majority of my clients were stone cold sober. so we are comparing different subsets of men here. and what they told me about the women in their lives is very different from what they tell you, very very different.
the whole fucking point of posting this shit was to show how i wasn't a man-hater, that i disliked and distrusted men for valid reasons. but that seems to have zipped right over your head. oh well, can't get through to everybody.

jstanothersub***
you're remark about being treated the way you let people treat you, well come on. for fuck's sake, letting people treat you however the fuck they want to is pretty much central to a prostitute's role, doncha think?

tj444***
yes a lot of the fuckers are out cheating, but not all of them. a whole lot of single men frequent hookers, a whole fuck of a lot of them. mostly losers in one form or another who can't or won't get laid any other way.

arpig***
you agree because you're not really a man. you're a lesbian at heart. viva el frente extensivo lesbianismo!

otterswim***
their marital status by definition doesn't enter into it if you are fucking them for money, or for food, or a place to sleep out of the snow.
the concentration? yeah, a valid point. my experiences are with a certain sector of the male population, but its pretty fucking representative. and its a large sample. you do the math: 2 years, roughly 200 nights a year, 2 - 4 men a night. we're talking between 800 and 1600 of them. that's a fuck of a lot of men. and that doesn't include the rest of the time when i wasn't officially hooking, when i was just being exploited whenever i was down and out.

linnaeaborealis***
thanks. its good to have somebody else from the "trade" confirm my findings.

arpig (again)***
well, since you're technically not a guy, ok, you can. but you have to shave first, and i mean fucking all of you, not just your face. goddamn werewolf.

silvermark***
if what you say is true, and i have no particular reason to doubt you, then you would be one of those 1/50 i mentioned. good on ya, i envy any woman lucky enough to be with you.

otterswim (again)***
i didn't mention cheating or rape in my op even once. tj brought up cheating, and you are the first to bring up rape. i was really fucking open and honest about my feelings in the op, i didn't sugarcoat or dress anything up. i'm sure there is a whole fuck of a lot in there for you to debate or object to without making shit up.

rapierfugue***
your opinions do not surprise me in the least. but please keep in mind, we are mere mortals, so you shouldn't really judge us by the same standards you use for yourself and your fellow olympians.

thanks all for reading, and for the messages of support that i didn't reply to. and for the silliness as well. there is always room for some serious silliness in life.

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I've often said there is a very good reason I have three dogs, one cat and two horses.

I do see a lot of humour in the fact that Hannah posts a lot like a female version of a certain male poster, that hasn't been around here much anymore, that used to get accused of hating women. He uses lots of cuss words and comes across all mean and nasty. I used to wonder if I was the only one that saw a lot of tongue in cheek humour in his posts. The ones he made when he wasn't under moderation.

Seriously......I don't see this stuff as gender hateful. I see it as very dry humour, almost a way of saying I survived and am going to be okay, and for all that fucktards did to me, I DON'T hate you all. I just think an awful lot of you are really fucked up. Which is totally true. A lot of us, men and women, are really fucked up.

The problem is, most of us seem to require the truth to be all candy coated and P.C.

Fuck P.C.. I am sick of P.C..

quote:

Wether or not you consider yourself a lesbian or bisexual or whatever, the fact remains, you are a man hater, simply because you lump us all into the same category. Really, sexism is no different from racism in my mind. Its still a mass judgement of a group of people, simply based on coincidences of birth.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

quote:

ORIGINAL: LinnaeaBorealis

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

Btw: I was raped by my HS boyfriend (and worse) and a male sig. tried to kill me in '96 and nearly succeeded. However, despite that I do not have an issue with men. I just have an issue with men who would do harm to me.

I only want to address this one paragraph. Your sample size is much much smaller. There were only 2 who did bad stuff to you & interestingly, they were both males you knew & had a relationship with. This is very different from living the way Hannah has lived & the way that I lived, where the abnormal becomes normal, if you will. The majority of those we encountered in our travels did bad shit, not just a couple of them. That's a very different thing.

I have met my fair share and had interaction with bad and exploitive men, Linea, and I understand that in comparison my sampling size is small... my point was in the first part, the men she encountered were by nature not happy and well adjusted.
The men who were likewise destructive to me were not happy and well adjusted.

There is also an element of personal responsibility in this for my situation at least.
After my HS boyfriend raped me, I stayed with him. I stayed. I had reasons to stay then and for a long time I blamed myself for that choice but I was doing the very best that I could. Not only did no have any meaning, but my staying allowed for other escalations.

In the second situation, I did not leave when there were big red flags. I am responsible for staying. I was there with red flags for 2 years before he tried to kill me.
My bad choice.

edit to add: I am not responsible for the fact that he tried to kill me, but what is true is had I left after the first red flag, or the second or any point between first red flag and the night he tried to kill me, I never would have been in that particular position to be hurt.

quote:

Hannah, it didn't zip over my head and you didn't need to be snatty either. No shit men that go to whores treat them differently as a matter of fucking fact John and I have used the services of a very hot escort on more than one occasion, but it was fun, and hot and sexy and umm she made a ton of money, did some partying with us, and left with a fat tip. Whenever she is in town she calls and we hang out.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Icarys

quote:

First of all, if she is so obviously a man-hater, then why don't you consider LaT, Greedy, tj, Arpig, and Linnaea to be man haters? They all agree with Hanners.

I kind of do to a degree, Heather.

quote:

ORIGINAL: HeatherMcLeather
Hanners started this thread at my urging, because I wanted you all to understand her better. I'm somewhat regretting doing so now, I am thinking, maybe it wasn't the best idea after all.[/color]