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Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 1:13:29 PM   
Najakcharmer


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Crossposted in part over from a  femdom board I found recently, female-led-relationships.com.

How many folks here believe in female supremacy - in other words, you think that everyone else in the BDSM community is doing it wrong and would actually be happier in a heterosexual femdom relationship? 

For myself, I am proud to be a member of the leather/BDSM community.  This is my tribe, this is my extended family.  My brothers and sisters in leather include men and women of all genders, sexual orientations and D/s orientations. 

I have a lot of love and respect in my heart for the wonderful human beings I have met in my years in the leather community.  Gay leather daddies, lesbian bois, beautiful and brave transgendered folk whose personal vision of themselves was strong enough to sustain them on a very difficult road to walk.  Loving male dominants, powerful female dominants, intelligent and feisty female submissives defending their lifestyle choice in a society that condemns it, strong and savvy male submissives with wit and wisdom and a fine sense of humor. 

These are my brothers and sisters in leather, all of them.  Disrespect any of them and you disrespect me.   I am a female dominant, but my orientation is not the single right one for everybody.  Different people need to walk different paths in life, and I offer my respect and support to them as they freely offer it to me. 

We don't need to waste our time and energy arguing who should be doing what and with which and to whom.  We have far more important things to focus on as a greater BDSM/leather community.  If we don't stick together, the outside world is quite ready to stick it to all of us individually.  

I don't care who holds the whip in your relationship. That isn't my business, it's your choice.   I only care that we all need to stand together to defend our rights to use those whips on our consenting adult partners and to make our own lifestyle choices. We all benefit when we can share good information about safety and technique as a community.   I can't say what is right for you in a D/s relationship.  I can only say what is right for me.  I feel secure enough in my lifestyle choice and my sexual orientation that I can appreciate and respect people who are different from me. 

I can learn good things from other D/s couples without the need to tell them that they're doing it all wrong because their gender mix and match isn't the same as mine.  I don't care one bit who is giving the advanced bondage demo, whether it's a male-male couple, a female-female couple, a femdom couple or a male dominant couple.  You can learn some amazingly good stuff about safety and technique from a skilled expert even if they are not the same orientation as you.  If you cut yourself off from 75% of those opportunities, I think you lose something very valuable.

I have been around the community long enough to have seen how other M/s and D/s lifestyles work, the good and the bad.  I rejoice in the diversity of the greater BDSM/leather community, and I am happy to exchange ideas and information and support with gay leathermen and lesbians, male dominants and their submissives.  And some of my friends are bi poly genderbent switches who bottom to transgenders on alternate Tuesdays.  I think that's great and I'll be right there at the play party cheering them on.  It's not about who you beat or dominate or who you're beaten or dominated by, it's about who you are as a human being and as a member of the BDSM community. 

And that is why I cannot support or condone female supremacy.  I don't feel the need to justify the fact that I am dominant and my partner is submissive by trying to convince myself that this is some kind of universal truth for everybody.  Years of living in the real-world BDSM community tells me that it *isn't* a universal truth, and that other people are wired differently from me and need different things to be happy and fulfilled.  A gay leatherman top is not a good candidate for being happy in a femdom relationship.  Do you really think he should try anyway?  Do any of you female supremacists want to to try to explain to Guy Baldwin why he should change his orientation to femdom because he's been doing it wrong all his life?  If there are any volunteers, I'll be selling tickets to watch the comedy show.

I see people on both sides of the fence, female supremacists and chest-thumping Domly-Doms, who quote "scientific facts", examples from the animal kingdom, statistics, religious citations, etc (sometimes even the same ones viewed through a different cultural filter) to "prove" that their sex is the one that is "naturally" supposed to be dominant.  I suppose if you are fundamentally insecure in your role, you might feel the need to convince yourself that your sexual orientation is really a mandate from God or is the scientific natural order or whatnot.  But the BDSM community is always going to be bigger than your sexual orientation, whichever one it happens to be, and so is the spectrum of human needs and nature. 

I'm okay with that.  In fact I think it's great.  I don't fully understand people who are not okay with that, but I'm waiting to hear your point of view.

< Message edited by Najakcharmer -- 5/16/2006 1:32:06 PM >
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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 3:11:42 PM   
thetammyjo


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I have no personal face-to-face time for anyone who supermacy because of something they had not part in deciding -- race, sex, eye color, ethnicity, nation of origin etc.

I have even less personal face-to-face time for anyone claiming their way or philosophy is THE ONE TRUE WAY.

I find attempts to use science or history is usually made by those with training in neither. Claims of some deity making said claim seems based on personal interpretation or submissive to some cultlike authority. I wonder why they want this "evidence" because it seems so silly to me. It makes me think they need the evidence and to convince people of their beliefs because their beliefs are rather weak and they are therefore threatened by other beliefs.

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 3:30:06 PM   
Slipstreme


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There are far too many exceptions to any supremacy rule that I can't believe any supremacist out there. After all, if their word was law, there would be no exceptions to their rule.

"Scientific fact" is often beriddled with alternatives and miscounts. After all, science claims that reproduction is the only reason animals copulate. The numerous counts of gay animal copulations is proof enough against this. On the same coin, a supremacist, male or female will always find the female or male Dominant that they can't argue with and won't argue with because they can't stand to face the facts. Their law isn't law.

I believe everyone should have the right to do with their life what they see fit to do with their life. And no supremacist could possibly convince me otherwise.


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 3:36:52 PM   
DiannaVesta


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My views on this have been expressed here on this site. At least in my world its not all about that. Its personal and what I'm into. It brings me peace, joy and hot ass orgasms. Najak I agree with you on many levels. To each his or her own & we should all be fighting for the freedom of choice. Fem Supremacy is a choice. Don't let the words fool you.

Do you remember a discussion many years ago about buzz words? This is no different.


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 4:06:15 PM   
crouchingtigress


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to me it is all "Sexy Fiction"....probally similar to the thread on "Buzz Words", but I never read that one...basically the idea is that words like Fem Supremacy, slave, owner, whore, are sexy as fuck...wonderful words with individual subjective meanings.
 
But anytime I get into a conversation with an extremist no matter what the topic religion, racism, D/s I walk away....life is way to short.
 
How ever I love all your posts and will read them on any topic I am really smitten with you and you writings...and that part about your leather family makes my heart melt...I wish I was closer to my leather family....makes me home sick actually.

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 4:14:21 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


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quote:

How many folks here believe in female supremacy - in other words, you think that everyone else in the BDSM community is doing it wrong and would actually be happier in a heterosexual femdom relationship?
I don't believe most female supremacists within BDSM community believe that women are superior, and everyone else is phucked in the head, lol.  

I believe in fem supremacy or female lead relationships, but not in the same way that everyone sees the bad word "supremacy."    I'm certainly not better than anyone because I was born with a vagina, nor do I think everyone else is doing it wrong.   I consider my way a kink, where I admit to wanting to be understood as the dominant, the one in control, especially if he (my consentual subject) has a deeper love and respect for women than the general population, and enjoys deferring to one. 
I have the common decency to look for someone who agrees with that, and I call my partner a sub/slave given the imbalance our relationship would have.

quote:

For myself, I am proud to be a member of the leather/BDSM community.  This is my tribe, this is my extended family.  My brothers and sisters in leather include men and women of all genders, sexual orientations and D/s orientations
I am as well proud to be a member of such a diverse community I can feel I belong with my twisted relationship/sexuality approach.
To be honest, in a lifestyle that has little issue with calling subjects lords, slaves, properties, pets, masters, toilets, bitches, etc,  I hardly understand folks who take issue with female supremacy as a kink choice.    
<<<-------Looks around for Jasmyn to explain this much better than I have though.   M

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 4:19:49 PM   
DiannaVesta


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig

quote:

How many folks here believe in female supremacy - in other words, you think that everyone else in the BDSM community is doing it wrong and would actually be happier in a heterosexual femdom relationship?
I don't believe most female supremacists within BDSM community believe that women are superior, and everyone else is phucked in the head, lol.  

I believe in fem supremacy or female lead relationships, but not in the same way that everyone sees the bad word "supremacy."    I'm certainly not better than anyone because I was born with a vagina, nor do I think everyone else is doing it wrong.   I consider my way a kink, where I admit to wanting to be understood as the dominant, the one in control, especially if he (my consentual subject) has a deeper love and respect for women than the general population, and enjoys deferring to one. 
I have the common decency to look for someone who agrees with that, and I call my partner a sub/slave given the imbalance our relationship would have.

quote:

For myself, I am proud to be a member of the leather/BDSM community.  This is my tribe, this is my extended family.  My brothers and sisters in leather include men and women of all genders, sexual orientations and D/s orientations
I am as well proud to be a member of such a diverse community I can feel I belong with my twisted relationship/sexuality approach.
To be honest, in a lifestyle that has little issue with calling subjects lords, slaves, properties, pets, masters, toilets, bitches, etc,  I hardly understand folks who take issue with female supremacy as a kink choice.    
<<<-------Looks around for Jasmyn to explain this much better than I have though.   M



Actually I think you explained it very well. Where is Jasmyn anyhow? I haven't seen her around.


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 4:23:43 PM   
LadyMorgynn


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Hmmm.  My thoughts on this are kind of convoluted.  Try to bear with me.  I believe in female supremacy in that I am female, and I am Dominant, supreme to the male.  Does that mean I believe all females are supreme?  No.  I am naturally Dominant... not because I am female, but because I am ME.  Therefore, I feel I can hang with the FemDomme crowds because I am a female AND naturally Dominant.  At least to the point where some may start espousing a "natural order" at which point we part ways. 

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 4:29:22 PM   
fastlane


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Blktalltoofilling....." believe in fem supremacy or female lead relationships, but not in the same way that everyone sees the bad word "supremacy."    I'm certainly not better than anyone because I was born with a vagina, nor do I think everyone else is doing it wrong.   I consider my way a kink, where I admit to wanting to be understood as the dominant, the one in control, especially if he (my consentual subject) has a deeper love and respect for women than the general population, and enjoys deferring to one. 
I have the common decency to look for someone who agrees with that, and I call my partner a sub/slave given the imbalance our relationship would have."

It all comes down to two things, understanding and awareness. If you don't understand, you can never be aware, but can jump to conclusions that could not only call your supremecy into question, but your motives as well?
Just my .02


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 5:03:13 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


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quote:

Actually I think you explained it very well. Where is Jasmyn anyhow? I haven't seen her around.
Thank you.
I haven't seen Jasmyn on in a few days, hope she comes out of hiding soon.    M

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 5:36:24 PM   
Najakcharmer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig
To be honest, in a lifestyle that has little issue with calling subjects lords, slaves, properties, pets, masters, toilets, bitches, etc,  I hardly understand folks who take issue with female supremacy as a kink choice.    


I have no issue with two (or more) people being in a relationship and those people deciding that the female in the relationship is supreme.  That's a form of female supremacy I support and appreciate, because it leads (as GDV so wisely says) to peace, joy and hot ass orgasms for everybody. 

What I have issue with is when somebody tries to tell somebody else in the lifestyle that they're doing it wrong and they should change their sexual and kink orientation because only (insert gender, race or religion here) can possibly be dominant.   Eg, "You can't possibly be happy as a gay leatherman or a male dominant or a female submissive, that's just wrong, you have to submit to women and lead a femdom lifestyle because it is the Natural Order and the Right Way To Live."   

Meh.  That's just silly, and that's the part that I object to. 

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 6:11:17 PM   
LadyMorgynn


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I'm with you 100%.  And I don't like hearing it from the Female Supremacists any more than I like hearing it in reverse from the Gorean Dominant males.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Najakcharmer
What I have issue with is when somebody tries to tell somebody else in the lifestyle that they're doing it wrong and they should change their sexual and kink orientation because only (insert gender, race or religion here) can possibly be dominant.   Eg, "You can't possibly be happy as a gay leatherman or a male dominant or a female submissive, that's just wrong, you have to submit to women and lead a femdom lifestyle because it is the Natural Order and the Right Way To Live."   

Meh.  That's just silly, and that's the part that I object to. 



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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 6:19:55 PM   
michaelGA2


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i'm a firm believer in Female Supremacy. 

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 6:34:32 PM   
DiannaVesta


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quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelGA2

i'm a firm believer in Female Supremacy. 


lol- how can you keep such a straight face and say that???


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 7:50:10 PM   
Slipstreme


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quote:

What I have issue with is when somebody tries to tell somebody else in the lifestyle that they're doing it wrong and they should change their sexual and kink orientation because only (insert gender, race or religion here) can possibly be dominant.   Eg, "You can't possibly be happy as a gay leatherman or a male dominant or a female submissive, that's just wrong, you have to submit to women and lead a femdom lifestyle because it is the Natural Order and the Right Way To Live."   


Exactly how I view supremacy in any form. Once it goes outside whatever relationship to trying to control the way other people live, then I have a problem with it.

The way I see supremacy most often touted as, is this "everyone has to abide by this because it is right and the only thing that is right."

However, I would think simply by being the Dominant one of your Household, you would therefore be the "supremacist" of the House. For some of us, it is over males and females and not simply one gender. This is what the supremacists who have posted here seem to be saying. They are dominant over males, but have no problem with people who aren't living by their model, which I congratulate them on. IE: you could sit with a maledom and discuss things without it boiling down to a battle of the sexes if I'm getting this right. However, you know and hopefully he would to, that if he wanted to be with you, he would realize the orientation wouldn't work, drop the notion, and not try to get you to submit.

(Note, I use the pronoun "you" as a generalization)

We had a female supremacist here at one time who was relatively annoying because she kept trying to push her agenda on to other people, including maledoms and femsubs, even lesbian femsubs.

At least the Goreans have their own forum. However I have met a couple Goreans that have the same views of above. In thier house they are supreme, but don't have any problems with femdoms and malesubs outside their family and even encourage your endeavors. (Ex: Ironbear He is a cool and accepting guy.)

< Message edited by Slipstreme -- 5/16/2006 8:01:40 PM >


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 8:28:03 PM   
MistressLorelei


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I believe that all of us have a right to  believe what we want to... My way is certainly the best way for Me.    I don't view all men inferior, and certainly not all women superior (I am not blind).  I think of it more as women being natural leaders in their families since forever, and not being recognized.  That these same women themselves do not recognize their power, their abiilities often because they have never been recognized by others in their lives, and have bought into the 'women are inferior' way of thinking that has so long been accepted as 'law'.  If my grandmother had her way.... there would be no female-led relationships... though she led hers, she just doesn't realize that she did.  For some, their roles in life would have existed as a' non-powerful' female, but  many are unhappy settling for a secondary existence and have no choice in the matter.  Society has forever found it okay to think of women as second class citizens and for women to accept it.  (There are limited exceptions and yes, society's opinion is slowly changing).

Personally, due to compassion, being typically more empathic, less aggressive, more nurturing, there are few circumstances where I would choose a woman to represent me over a male.  I want an empathic doctor, a non-aggressive driver, a nurturing caretaker, etc.  There are exceptions. YES!!  But these are My views.  Am I a man-hater?  Heck no. I am here hoping to find a wonderful male to own forever.

I find it hypocritical for many in the Bdsm lifestyle who are 'fighting' for the rights of Bdsm lifestyle, to shun those involved in female supremacy... especially since no one can really define what it means exactly as it has different meanings to different people who practice/believe in it. I rarely see it shoved down anyone's throats on the forums... It's a belief system for most... and I believe we all have those.

< Message edited by MistressLorelei -- 5/16/2006 8:32:35 PM >

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 8:31:41 PM   
Najakcharmer


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It's a lot like religion.  I wanna worship my gods my way in my house, and it's fine if you worship your gods your way in your house.  But if you come knocking on my door telling me that my gods are false and evil and everybody has to worship your gods in just such and such a way, I'm going to think you are a really annoying asshole and kick you out of my house for your lack of respect.


< Message edited by Najakcharmer -- 5/16/2006 8:32:32 PM >

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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 8:40:47 PM   
Najakcharmer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: MistressLorelei
I find it hypocritical for many in the Bdsm lifestyle who are 'fighting' for the rights of Bdsm lifestyle, to shun those involved in female supremacy... especially since no one can really define what it means exactly as it has different meanings to different people who practice/believe in it. I rarely see it shoved down anyone's throats on the forums... It's a belief system for most... and I believe we all have those.


I don't shun or disrespect anybody who doesn't shun or disrespect my family and friends.  My family and friends include gay men, lesbian women, male dominants, female submissives, transgendered people, etc, of all D/s orientations and lifestyles.  Anyone who says to the rest of my leather family, "You're doing it wrong; your lifestyle is invalid because it isn't femdom" is going to have a problem with me.

Not all female supremacists (or Goreans and male dominants for that matter) are the type that actively disrespect others whose lifestyles are different, but some are.  Those are the ones I have issues with. 



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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 9:15:38 PM   
TeeGO


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The idea of Female supremacy drives me wild on a personal level, it really does. But no way do I believe that female's are inherently superior to males. I believe society is going to really excel in the coming years as females are finally being recognized as equal partners on planet earth. The idea of holding down half of the people is crippling. Scratch that. Maybe it is true that half the people do need to be tied down, but that would be submissive, male and female.


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RE: Female supremacy? - 5/16/2006 9:19:06 PM   
TeeGO


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quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelGA2

i'm a firm believer in Female Supremacy. 


That is of course as long as the female does everything you tell her to do.

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