RE: Not a sucker

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MagiksSlave -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 12:53:52 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave I disagree, why are my hard limits any less valid than someone elses just because mine are routed in past abuse? Someone here said it and they were right, a hard limit is a hard limit period end of story. Look, there are multiple ways I can approach this: A) I can point out that if you propose to be a slave, you don't have any hard limits. B) I can refer to the fact that you're calling it a hard limit to avoid dealing with it. C) I can simply point out that every sub makes a judgment call on any dominant she interacts with. Dominants will do the same and those who value themselves most highly will be the most demanding. Such men do not have any expectation that you can hide away an aspect of your sexuality and expect that to stand. quote: This is part of an issue I have been working on getting over my entire adult life but sometimes you have to see that some things are too painful emotionaly to simply solve. That doesnt mean you dont continue to work on them and it also doesnt mean that even if you continue to work on them that you will succeed in fixing it all. I understand that. You're not the first woman I've encountered who's dealt with such things. I'm not saying that a Dominant who interacts with you can't approach the subject with respect for what you've endured and an understanding of your emotions around the issue. What I'm saying is that I wouldn't accept an unwillingness to work on it. You responded by saying you want to be valued for who you are and I'm pointing out that everything factors into that valuation, including your willingness to deal with such issues. A sub who demonstrates a willingness to do so will be more highly valued than one who doesn't. First off, I am not a slave, I know the name says otherwise and I am sorry for the confusion (I was at one point a slave to one man and only one man. I am no longer a slave and if you had bothered to read my profile at all you would have known that.) Even if I was a slave I would still be entitled to hard limits, being a slave doesn't mean you have none or aren't entitled to any. Second, I am dealing with it as I have said several times but while I am dealing with it and not OVER it, it remains a hard limit, end of story.

sirsholly -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 1:21:11 PM)
quote: I'm not saying that a Dominant who interacts with you can't approach the subject with respect for what you've endured and an understanding of your emotions around the issue. What I'm saying is that I wouldn't accept an unwillingness to work on it. The lady never stated an unwillingness to work on it. Emotional scars are slow to heal. In fact i think she is demonstrating her strength and resolve by honoring her own emotional timetable and refusing to submit to some thoughtless asshat who feels she is only working on the issue if she is on her knees. quote: A sub who demonstrates a willingness to do so will be more highly valued than one who doesn't. On the flipside...a dominant who respects the pace and method a victim of abuse deals with her issues, as opposed to dictating how he feels it should be, will be more highly valued than one who doesn't.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 1:47:34 PM)
First off, I wanted to commend you for making this thread and for having the guts to stick with it, despite some of the unaware posts that have been made. That took an incredible amount of courage, personal fortitude, and self knowledge. In my mind, anyone who doesn't want you b/c of this particular limit, could never, ever deserve you.

Lucylastic -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 1:58:23 PM)
Chatte said it better than I could have...Kudos Magik, and welcome back .your limits are yours and should not be violated or pushed until YOU are ready to change that position/limit.. It might never happen, but do NOT do it for anyone else but yourself. working thru a limit even when you want to takes time, caring and commiunication. Take care and I hope you find someone who treats you properly in every respect.

MagiksSlave -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 2:08:43 PM)
Thanks ChatteParfaitt and Lucylastic, this has not been an easy issue for me and I often feel angry that it is an issue because it is a mark that was left on me without my consent and I don't want it there. A lot of men dont get that, they dont get that this wasnt a choice for me and I am just as put out, if not more, by the fact that it is there.

Awareness -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 3:38:41 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave First off, I am not a slave, I know the name says otherwise and I am sorry for the confusion (I was at one point a slave to one man and only one man. I am no longer a slave and if you had bothered to read my profile at all you would have known that.) Even if I was a slave I would still be entitled to hard limits, being a slave doesn't mean you have none or aren't entitled to any. I disagree. Attitudes such as this derive from people who are playing at slavery, not serious individuals contemplating a TPE arrangement. quote: Second, I am dealing with it as I have said several times but while I am dealing with it and not OVER it, it remains a hard limit, end of story. Let me get this straight. You asked a question; I answered; you disagreed; I clarified. And you're still bitching about the answer you got. Next time, try Ask A Mistress. They'll give you all the cheerleading ' you go girl ' posts you seem to want. Don't ask a Dom a fucking question and then complain because the answer isn't pleasing to you. I note the usual idiots are missing the point. Issues writ large.

MistressDarkArt -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 4:16:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave First off, I am not a slave, I know the name says otherwise and I am sorry for the confusion (I was at one point a slave to one man and only one man. I am no longer a slave and if you had bothered to read my profile at all you would have known that.) Even if I was a slave I would still be entitled to hard limits, being a slave doesn't mean you have none or aren't entitled to any. I disagree. Attitudes such as this derive from people who are playing at slavery, not serious individuals contemplating a TPE arrangement. quote: Second, I am dealing with it as I have said several times but while I am dealing with it and not OVER it, it remains a hard limit, end of story. Let me get this straight. You asked a question; I answered; you disagreed; I clarified. And you're still bitching about the answer you got. Next time, try Ask A Mistress. They'll give you all the cheerleading ' you go girl ' posts you seem to want. Don't ask a Dom a fucking question and then complain because the answer isn't pleasing to you. I note the usual idiots are missing the point. Issues writ large. [8\|] Aaaaaaaaaaaaand once again Awareness takes first prize for demonstrating how NOT to make friends and influence people.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 4:56:24 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ChatteParfaitt First off, I wanted to commend you for making this thread and for having the guts to stick with it, despite some of the unaware posts that have been made. That took an incredible amount of courage, personal fortitude, and self knowledge. In my mind, anyone who doesn't want you b/c of this particular limit, could never, ever deserve you. Would you say the same about a male sub that had a hard limit that was one of your favorite things? I mean never ever ever deserve a good sub is a bit extreme for someone that basically says. "We won't work out. Good luck and Godspeed"

zephyroftheNorth -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 5:29:29 PM)
You know what MS, you don't owe unaware or anyone else an explanation. On topic I honestly believe there are men out there who will understand. In fact I would say that understanding and being willing to support you as you work through it will tell you you've found a good man. welcome back, by the way. [:)] Zeph

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 7:02:55 PM)
Please do not misunderstand me, Hilly. Everyone wants what they want. I want what I want, and that's a priority for me. So I get what you are saying, of course. A person who looks at the whole individual can make some decisions. For me personally, individual sex acts are not among what I need to live, however, relationships with strong, courageous, up front individuals willing to own up to their shit and obviously working on it? Yeah, I need that. It's rare, but I need it none the less.

Kalista07 -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 7:59:00 PM)
It amazes me that so many people are up in arms about magikslave's inability to give a blow job... I wonder if these same people would be as adamant about men who refuse to perform oral an a woman. Kali

MistressDarkArt -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 8:06:23 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Buzzzz Sweetie, I am not changing a thing , everything is very well, with me. [8\|] So sayeth your left...or is it your right...ass cheek? [sm=moon.gif] Gawds, you and your buddy UnAwareness are reasons 946 and 947 I am not a submissive.

MagiksSlave -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 8:55:01 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Awareness quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave First off, I am not a slave, I know the name says otherwise and I am sorry for the confusion (I was at one point a slave to one man and only one man. I am no longer a slave and if you had bothered to read my profile at all you would have known that.) Even if I was a slave I would still be entitled to hard limits, being a slave doesn't mean you have none or aren't entitled to any. I disagree. Attitudes such as this derive from people who are playing at slavery, not serious individuals contemplating a TPE arrangement. quote: Second, I am dealing with it as I have said several times but while I am dealing with it and not OVER it, it remains a hard limit, end of story. Let me get this straight. You asked a question; I answered; you disagreed; I clarified. And you're still bitching about the answer you got. Next time, try Ask A Mistress. They'll give you all the cheerleading ' you go girl ' posts you seem to want. Don't ask a Dom a fucking question and then complain because the answer isn't pleasing to you. I note the usual idiots are missing the point. Issues writ large. No my problem come in with the fact that your OPINION is that your OPNINION is that of the entire Dom community and there for a fact and not an OPINION. I would take no issue if you answered for yourself and only yourself and werent trying to make me feel like less of a person for this.

ChatteParfaitt -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 9:11:16 PM)
Personal strength, honesty, integrity, fortitude trumps everything else. It always has and it always will. All the rhetoric in the world will not change that.

Awareness -> RE: Not a sucker (9/14/2011 10:41:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MagiksSlave No my problem come in with the fact that your OPINION is that your OPNINION is that of the entire Dom community and there for a fact and not an OPINION. I would take no issue if you answered for yourself and only yourself and werent trying to make me feel like less of a person for this. What the fuck are you babbling about? My response made it clear I was speaking for myself. Which part of: "This phrase is always a huge red flag for me.", "such women are completely unacceptable to me", "I wouldn't bother with...", "I expect your best. ", "What I'm saying is that I wouldn't accept an unwillingness to work on it." made it seem like I was speaking for every Dom? My commentary is laced with self-reference. There are certain things I hold to be universals. That is my reality and I will always speak as though that reality is true and inviolable. That's an inherent side effect of strong self-belief. One of these is that fundamentally when two people hook up there's a value proposition underlying it all. Women don't hook up with men based upon "future value", they hook up with them based upon present value and men do likewise. You're asking if this affects your value to a potential Dom and yes - it does. In the same way in which many things do. On both sides. I'm not engaging in anything to try and make you feel "less of a person" and either you're being incredibly disingenuous or you're more fragile than I anticipated. If the latter, then it's important to understand that what you may be feeling as a result of my posts is an inadvertent side effect of the discussion, not the result of any agenda on my part. Sure, I'm capable of digging the boot in, but I'm not going to do that to a slightly fragile sub who's endured some unspeakable things in her past. That would be a savage indictment of my own character and frankly, I have no need or desire to indulge in such darkness.

MagiksSlave -> RE: Not a sucker (9/15/2011 12:36:33 AM)
I think I lost the plot...

crazyml -> RE: Not a sucker (9/15/2011 1:59:04 AM)
Which people are up in arms? I must be misreading the thread abominably, because I've read it back again, and can't find a single person who is "up in arms" about it.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Not a sucker (9/15/2011 10:59:01 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Kalista07 It amazes me that so many people are up in arms about magikslave's inability to give a blow job... I wonder if these same people would be as adamant about men who refuse to perform oral an a woman. Kali If it's a Domme who REALLY likes oral, she should tell him "Good luck and Godspeed I hope you find someone but it won't be Me".

Hillwilliam -> RE: Not a sucker (9/15/2011 11:00:08 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ChatteParfaitt Please do not misunderstand me, Hilly. Everyone wants what they want. I want what I want, and that's a priority for me. So I get what you are saying, of course. A person who looks at the whole individual can make some decisions. For me personally, individual sex acts are not among what I need to live, however, relationships with strong, courageous, up front individuals willing to own up to their shit and obviously working on it? Yeah, I need that. It's rare, but I need it none the less. I was just noticing some 'circling of the wagons' by the fairer sex in the last coupla pages here LOL.

LafayetteLady -> RE: Not a sucker (9/15/2011 12:29:40 PM)
I read the beginning couple pages and this last page of this thread, so sorry if I missed something important. So often around here everyone talks about how D/s ans M/s isn't about sex. Blow jobs are a sexual activity, no one is going to intelligently dispute that. Those saying your issue with them makes a huge difference in your "value" as a sub are not so subtly saying that their D/s and M/s relationships ARE about sex. I have issues with breath play. I'm sure some here are claustrophobic. No one would ever say those things devalue a sub or that I was going to have to learn to deal with having my mouth and nose covered or the claustrophobic needed to "work through" their issue and be locked in a box. So for those guys who claim to be dominants or masters who say no "true" sub/slave can "refuse" to give blow jobs, in my opinion, you guys aren't "true" masters or dominants, just guys who get off ordering women to engage in sex the way you want. Magick, I'm truly sorry for what you suffered. Regardless of the reason for you abstaining from the activity, your "value" as a sub is not diminished by it. The right dom for you will see your "value" based on the person you are, NOT whether or not you can suck a tennis ball through a garden hose.

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