Collarchat.com

Join Our Community
Collarchat.com

Home  Login  Search 

RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law...


View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
 
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 4:14:31 AM   
pahunkboy


Posts: 33061
Joined: 2/26/2006
From: Central Pennsylvania
Status: offline
each day hundreds of people have their heads beheaded- over dissing the quran.

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 4:22:29 AM   
StrangerThan


Posts: 1515
Joined: 4/25/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And whenever the crazy religious fundamentalists try to impose their religious law on everyone else, I get concerned.

quote:


In Mississippi last week, the state Supreme Court rejected a lawsuit to stop a ballot measure (Amendment 26) defining a person as the moment of fertilization. The implications of the ballot measure are that abortion, contraception, in vitro fertilization, and stem cell research could be rendered illegal if the initiative passes. Mississippi’s highest court ruled 7-2 against stopping the initiative and said it did not have the power to review ballot initiatives before the vote takes place. However, in refusing to stop the ballot measure, the court revealed that it will uphold the proposed constitutional amendment when it passes. There is little doubt the ballot initiative will pass because Mississippi has the largest percentage (82%) of Christians in the country. Not surprising is that of 9 justices, 7 profess Christianity as their religion on the MSS official website.


http://www.politicususa.com/en/personhood-democracy



Told ya Mississippi was next.

But fuck, I didn't stick it under a sensationalized topic.


_____________________________


--'Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to reform' - Mark Twain

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 4:22:45 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
Well, seriously, what else would one behead?

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 6:26:17 AM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

He is using the word "Sharia" to point out the hypocrisy of fundies screaming and fretting about the threat of Koran-based law and how that would be counter to everything America stands for while at the same time trying to impose their own Bible-based law.

Is there any basis in the Bible for the notion that "personhood" begins at conception?

K.



My guess is Jeremiah 1:5 :

"Before I formed you in the womb I knew you, before you were born I set you apart; I appointed you as a prophet to the nations." (NIV)

Psalm 139:13 :

"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb." (NIV)

Psalm 139:16 :

"your eyes saw my unformed body." (NIV)

Luke 1:35

"The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God." (NIV)

~ Mary was not knocked up yet, so the Spook is calling the embryo holy.

Here is a link to the Warnock Inquiry Report for you: http://www.scribd.com/doc/48298002/Warnock-Report-of-the-Committee-of-Inquiry-into-Human-Fertilisation-and-Embryology-1984

I really do not have the energy to find the Catholic report.

Frankly one of the issues that no one talks about regarding all of this is how do we as a people/culture/society change when changes in technology and medical knowledge come about. For a long, long time, the only way to control reproduction and fertility was to control the entire woman. That is no longer true. So, how should our body of laws and our views of them change? Also, with this change, how should we view and judge those who lived before us?

As far as 'God' goes. IIRC, he was not so much into abortion as really digging on the infanticide. Abortion seems a lot cleaner and neater in comparison.

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 8:33:49 AM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

(3) The word "person" includes individuals, children, firms, associations, joint adventures, partnerships, estates, trusts, business trusts, syndicates, fiduciaries, corporations, and all other groups or combinations. NOTE HOWEVER, THE DEFINITIONS STATUTE DOES NOT LIST “MAN” OR “WOMAN” – THEREFORE THEY ARE EXCLUDED FROM ALL THE LEGISLATIVE STATUTES!!!

Gee, I could have sworn that men and women were "individuals."

K.




Every "legal entity" is a "person". The person belongs to the one that created it. The person is a transmitting utility, designated to perform a special duty or fulfill a specific purpose, unattached from it's creator/owner.  <- of course the only one in the world that is respected in law is the king.


quote:


"The law of nature, all men are born free, every one comes into the world with a right to his own person, which includes the liberty of moving and using it at his own will.

[It, the legal entity is an "IT" not a man or woman.  So if your IT is the legal entity yet they throw your body in prison if the "it" stood trial and not you?  Hey its "their" distinction not mine! LOL]

This is what is called personal liberty, and is given him by the Author of nature, because necessary for his own sustenance." --Thomas Jefferson: Legal Argument, 1770. FE 1:376

See what they did here?  LOL


In law, PERSONALITY means capacity of having, acquiring and exercising rights, using the term in its widest sense.  A legal person is an entity having interest which the law recognizes and secures, or, as it is commonly put, a subject of rights.  The type is the individual human being, as a natural person, and in modern law every human being, as a natural person has also a legal personality.   Juristic personality begins when the legal requirements for recognition of a group of associates as a legal person have been fulfilled, and the law in consequence clothes the association with the capacity of exercising a legal control over or influence upon the acts of othersNatural personality, the legal personality of the individual human being, begins upon birth and survival of birth.


This is all color of law.  In other words abstract bullshit for the most part.  Capacity determines rank essentially of your legal person.



Now title 18 defines those who presumably "chose" to be under the control and subject to the united states corporate "person".

quote:

TITLE 1 > CHAPTER 1 > § 8 § 8. “Person”, “human being”, “child”, and “individual” as including born-alive infant  (a) In determining the meaning of any Act of Congress, or of any ruling, regulation, or interpretation of the various administrative bureaus and agencies of the United States, the words “person”, “human being”, “child”, and “individual”, shall include every infant member of the species homo sapiens who is born alive at any stage of development.   (b) As used in this section, the term “born alive”, with respect to a member of the species homo sapiens, means the complete expulsion or extraction from his or her mother of that member, at any stage of development, who after such expulsionor extraction breathes or has a beating heart, pulsation of the umbilical cord, or definite movement of voluntary muscles, regardless of whether the umbilical cord has been cut, and regardless of whether the expulsion or extraction occurs as a result of natural or induced labor, cesarean section, or induced abortion.   (c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to affirm, deny, expand, or contract any legal status or legal right applicable to any member of the species homo sapiens at any point prior to being “born alive” as defined in this section.     http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/html/uscode01/usc_sec_01_00000008----000-.html 


Of course it goes without saying they have no legitimate authority to claim or define anyone as a person.

Legitimate authority comes by contract.

the word individual in "lego land" is used to differentiate between body corporate and body singular.

The rights spoke of in the DOI are largely disposed of when you enter into contract under tha constitution which of course the "state" claims they have have the right to force you to do, see the abrahamson case.

.







oh and "Chief" has the same rank as KING, such as the commander "in-chief", chief's and kins are "recognized" sovereigns.

Neither of whom are personally suable, you can only sue one of their corporation trusts.


birthers you reading this?








Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 9/15/2011 9:05:35 AM >


_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 9:12:44 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
That is fucking typically retarded asswipe.

No factuality whatsoever.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Real0ne)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 11:56:37 AM   
Fightdirecto


Posts: 1101
Joined: 8/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig
He is using the word "Sharia" to point out the hypocrisy of fundies screaming and fretting about the threat of Koran-based law and how that would be counter to everything America stands for while at the same time trying to impose their own Bible-based law.

Is there any basis in the Bible for the notion that "personhood" begins at conception?
K.

One of the many things I learned growing up a PK (Preacher's Kid) is that many Christians, many non-Christians, and many anti-Christians are Biblically illiterate (but then, many Christians and anti-Moslems are illiterate when it comes to the Koran and many Christians and most anti-Semites are illiterate when it comes to the Thalmud).

Most people, sadly, deep down inside want someone else to do their thinking and their research for them. People in my Dad's congregation would often ask him, "What does the Bible say about //fill in the blank//?" and my Dad would say, "As a Christian you should be reading your Bible. Look it up. " And some would get offended that he won't give them the answer and do the research work for them.

Or they would say something like "The Lord helps those who help themselves. It's in the Bible", and Dad would say "No, it's not in the Bible - it's a line from a hymn written by John Wesley." And some would respond, "But I heard Pat Robertson say it on the The 700 Club and he said it was a teaching of Jesus Christ" - because it was easier for them to believe what a TV preacher said than for them to take the time to look it up in their own Bible.

I once encountered an atheist who declaimed, "The Bible says such-and-such, and that's stupid". When I asked her where in the Bible it could be found, she said, "Sam Harris said the Bible says it in his book, The End of Faith. As for me, I have never read the Bible and never plan to. Why should I bother reading fiction, since Sam Harris already did the research?"

< Message edited by Fightdirecto -- 9/15/2011 11:59:02 AM >


_____________________________

"I swore never to be silent whenever and wherever human beings endure suffering and humiliation. We must always take sides. Neutrality helps the oppressor, never the victim. Silence encourages the tormentor, never the tormented.””
- Ellie Wiesel

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 1:00:29 PM   
Real0ne


Posts: 21189
Joined: 10/25/2004
Status: offline
I promise I wont do that again!  honest!

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 1:04:22 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Well, seriously, what else would one behead?


Ask Rule.



_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 1:11:39 PM   
MileHighM


Posts: 400
Joined: 10/8/2009
Status: offline
That could be said for //Fill in Blank// ideolgy as well. How many tea partiers have read the constitution, Smith, Burke, federalist papers, etc etc. How many progressives have read the constitution, Marx, Rousseau, Zinn etc etc. People often argue recycled garbage fed to them by media sources.

What's just as bad is how many people argue thier position without knowing the other guys... How many cons have read Marx, How many libs have Hayek?

Most people are lazy hacks, they want to know what to believe not why to believe.

I think it is best to evolve ones ideas over time, try not to be married to a ideological identity.

(in reply to Fightdirecto)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 1:16:13 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MileHighM
How many cons have read Marx

Nobody who's claiming teh Kenyan is a Marxist, for a start...

(I confess I haven't read Hayek meself, but I have gone through Rand, Friedman, Mitford, MacDonald and a bit of Schicklegruber...)

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to MileHighM)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:07:09 PM   
MileHighM


Posts: 400
Joined: 10/8/2009
Status: offline
I wasn't... What are you getting at?

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:18:32 PM   
calamitysandra


Posts: 1682
Joined: 3/17/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

each day hundreds of people have their heads beheaded- over dissing the quran.



I know I am showing an frightening amount of naivety just by asking, but anyway:
Any chance that you could provide some sources for your assertion? 


_____________________________

"Whenever people are laughing, they are generally not killing one another"
Alan Alda


(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:24:12 PM   
Aylee


Posts: 24103
Joined: 10/14/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MileHighM

try not to be married to a ideological identity.


But we LOVE each other! If you keep standing in our way like this, we will just elope!

_____________________________

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam

I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

(in reply to MileHighM)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:27:57 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MileHighM

I wasn't... What are you getting at?

Just a response to your "the right ain't read that, the left ain't read this", comment. Not a criticism, I just thought I'd better be honest and admit that I hadn't read the other name you dropped.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to MileHighM)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:31:19 PM   
MileHighM


Posts: 400
Joined: 10/8/2009
Status: offline
I was talking about your kenyan comment... Was implying he was a marxist?

(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 2:37:40 PM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
I'm not (he strikes me as a right leaning centrist American and/or a high tory British just like the chimp) and I wasn't implying that you were, but there's plenty on here who insist that he is too a Marxist and has a sinister leftist agenda to turn America into the late USSR. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to MileHighM)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia... - 9/15/2011 5:41:10 PM   
Masta808


Posts: 591
Joined: 1/6/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pahunkboy

each day hundreds of people have their heads beheaded- over dissing the quran.



Its because NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition!

(in reply to pahunkboy)
Profile   Post #: 58
Page:   <<   < prev  1 2 [3]
All Forums >> [Community Discussions] >> Dungeon of Political and Religious Discussion >> RE: "Personhood" movement is Christian-Sharia Law... Page: <<   < prev  1 2 [3]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts




Collarchat.com © 2024
Terms of Service Privacy Policy Spam Policy

0.086