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RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 9:41:09 AM

SpanishMatMaster

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quote:

ORIGINAL: pleasantorture
I don't think that our belief system is meant to be an advertising campaign to attract more partakers.

Interesting enough, this is exactly what most belief systems are meant to be. Exactly this. Belief systems which do not succeed on this (and the concurrency is high) disappear, and only those which succeed, survive and reproduce to the next generations, sometimes which small changes which themselves, only survive if they are positive to achieve exactly that - attract more partakers. And so it works, until now.
I stop reading here: I just lack the time and I do not wish to get involved in another different discussion. If you want to play the game, you are welcome, but that's about it. Nonetheless, welcome in the forums and have a nice day.

< Message edited by SpanishMatMaster -- 11/27/2011 9:45:16 AM >

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Humanist (therefore Atheist), intelligent, cultivated and very humble :)
If I don't answer you, maybe I "hid" you: PM me if you want.
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, pause and reflect.” (Mark Twain)

(in reply to pleasantorture)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 9:41:56 AM

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The only one playing a game is you.

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Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to SpanishMatMaster)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 10:28:42 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

GotSteel
By the way, tweakabelle, does Santa Claus exist?

Can I get back to you on that after I check my Christmas presents please?

Thanks, I got a kick out of that but it also makes a good point.

When I ask about Santa we all (except for Kirata) understand that I'm not asking whether there are any overweight bearded truck drivers in Alaska or a metaphorical spirit of christmas or some guy in Boston who has legally changed his name.

Why does that suddenly change when we're talking about God? Why do people think it's reasonable to swap out the being widely believed by it's adherents to answer prayers and effect their lives that the atheist is actually talking about with some hypothetical, undefined, untestable deity/deities?

To determine if God, the god that people are overwhelmingly actually praying to exists we do the same thing that every kid does and which you immediately think to do, check for presents.

< Message edited by GotSteel -- 11/27/2011 10:37:34 AM >

(in reply to tweakabelle)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 10:33:31 AM

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I dont believe in the red suit guy, I do believe in the spirit.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to GotSteel)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 11:03:46 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
I dont believe in the red suit guy, I do believe in the spirit.

When I say that there is no Santa Claus are you, is anyone, confused about which one of those two things I'm talking about?

(in reply to tazzygirl)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 11:54:16 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63
Regardless of how one interprets the statement, I would wonder why would one make such a statement to begin with.

Have you heard of the Asch conformity experiments?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63
Well, I try to separate the interconnecting ideas related to the concept and just break it down to the bare bones of what the question is asking. Did such a person ever exist as a regular human being without magical powers? Was the legend based on an actual historical figure? That's what I would look at first when considering the question. We can look at the legend of Santa Claus in art and literature and trace back its origins. That would at least tell us what does exist and how our modern legends of Santa Claus came about, and that would probably give us more information than simply saying "Santa Claus doesn't exist."

I view it somewhat the same regarding questions about the possibility of god's existence. I view "god" as a concept which can be interpreted in any number of ways. Some might view "god" as merely the sum total of all physical laws in the universe, without necessarily anthropomorphizing it as some kind of actual "being." So, it would really depend on how one defines "god" and "existence" in general. In my opinion, it would be up the one claiming that god doesn't exist to define one's own terms, since it can be (mis)interpreted in any number of ways based on differing interpretations of "god."

It would also be necessary to show the logical progression of thought which takes one to the conclusion that "god doesn't exist." If it's based on questionable aspects of the Bible, then that may not be enough. For example, if someone said, "It's not possible for Moses to have parted the Red Sea, therefore God doesn't exist," I wouldn't accept that as a logical conclusion.

When someone says that God doesn't exist are you under the impression that they are talking about the sum total of all physical laws in the universe and not some kind of actual "being"?

(in reply to Zonie63)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 11:59:37 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The only one playing a game is you.

Are you sure SpanishHat sees it as a game? he thinks he hz teh big winnage sewn up, true enough, but a game implies somebody else stands a chance of winning, and that ain't his style, is it?

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(in reply to tazzygirl)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 11:59:49 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl
I dont believe in the red suit guy, I do believe in the spirit.

When I say that there is no Santa Claus are you, is anyone, confused about which one of those two things I'm talking about?

Nope not at all... as long as you are speaking to adults. If you speak to a child, then you get into the grey area.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to GotSteel)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 12:01:01 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

The only one playing a game is you.

Are you sure SpanishHat sees it as a game? he thinks he hz teh big winnage sewn up, true enough, but a game implies somebody else stands a chance of winning, and that ain't his style, is it?

Depends. I have seen children playing a game where one will insist they are the winner because its their house/their ball/their game....

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 12:02:15 PM

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Which is pretty much SpanishHat's approach in this very thread, true enough...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to tazzygirl)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 12:52:06 PM

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I think it's time to introduce certain people to the Dunning-Kruger effect.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 11/27/2011 1:38:18 PM >

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 1:54:57 PM

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Is somebody still sore because he hasn't been ignored?

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 2:03:55 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Is somebody still sore because he hasn't been ignored?

Not at all. I think the Dunning-Kruger effect couldn't be more relevant.

Besides, I recently achieved "hidden" status.

K.

(in reply to Moonhead)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 2:18:25 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpanishMatMaster
If you have to take in account all possible scenarios, from the most weird and ridiculous to the most serious... all possible scenarios... then you can't. But you can try, really. I read.

I don't think that I can make that standard either, but by all means if that's your standard let's see LevelOf("2+2=4") = LevelOf("there is no God") please remember to list all possible scenarios.

(in reply to SpanishMatMaster)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 2:57:56 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

Besides, I recently achieved "hidden" status.

I beat you to it.

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Du blutest für mein Seelenheil
Ein kleiner Schnitt und du wirst geil
Egal, erlaubt ist, was gefällt

Ich tu' dir weh.
Tut mir nicht Leid!
Das tut dir gut.
Hör wie es schreit!

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 3:12:44 PM

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I beat you all to it.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Ishtarr)

RE: The Illusion of Superiority - 11/27/2011 3:14:13 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Is somebody still sore because he hasn't been ignored?

Not at all. I think the Dunning-Kruger effect couldn't be more relevant.

Besides, I recently achieved "hidden" status.

K.

Mea culpa, old boy. Congratulations!

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 5:59:11 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SpanishMatMaster

"grandiose"? Fuck you.
I have shown...

I can show...

I have shown...

I have shown...

And I can prove that God does not exist
Fuck you.

Well that sums things up nicely.

K.

(in reply to SpanishMatMaster)

RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 9:04:56 PM

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Hey guys, I haven't been put on hide! Am I missing out on spmething special?

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RE: Agnosticism - 11/27/2011 9:14:04 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Hey guys, I haven't been put on hide! Am I missing out on spmething special?

Yep. But don't worry, I suspect your chances may go up after you reply to this.

K.

(in reply to tweakabelle)

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