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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 4:49:07 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas
. . . . because I am letting the authorities deal with this.


I think therein lies the problem, Arturas. The 'authorities' don't have the automatic trust of large numbers of the people in this case. People aren't assuming, as they might in other circumstances, that these authorities have been honest and competent with this issue. The authorities - in that neck of the US woods particularly - haven't been reliably unbiased and disinterested in relatively recent history when it comes to issues where race might be a factor, particularly, and people are questioning their reliability again now.

These agents of the State - the police, the lawyers, the officials involved - are the servants of the people. If they look as though those servants are screwing up, the people have to pull them back into line. That's what's happening here. On the one hand it could turn into a nasty witch-hunt, true, but on the other, it's democracy in action. Ugly, but the sometimes unavoidable result when the people's servants don't do the job properly that they're paid by the people to do.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 5:04:28 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		Well I can rest easier in the knowledge that Arturas is "letting the authorities deal with this."
Of course there are more than a few of us feel that this is just what hasn't happened,absent all of the outcry the authorities seemed quite prepared to sit back and do nothing.
Now if there are some that object to folks suggesting that this young man was shot for having the nerve to commit "walking while being black" who should they be upset with.....the folks making such claims or the authorities who seemed willing to chalk it up to "just one of those things "?

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 5:40:54 PM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

No. I did not. Probably because I am letting the authorities deal with this. Still, that does not seem to justify your post that "retired judges" are interfering because it is an election year so can you elaborate on this? Do you think retired judges are interferring with the Special Investigator also?


You are confused. I suspect you have conflated the contexts of two different posts.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 6:15:46 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u
this young man


As a matter of interest, at what age is a person considered to have reached majority in that part of America? I do believe it's over the age of seventeen.

If I'm right, here's another fact in this whole case, worth chewing over, to see how it tastes:

Zimmerman is a self-confessed child-killer. Furthermore, he is a child-killer who's not yet explained to any judge why he killed a child.

Nup. It *really* just doesn't sit right, does it?




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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 6:18:50 PM   
slvemike4u


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Status: offline 		I'm confused Peon...is there some question whether or not he was ,in fact,a "young man"...as a 53 year old man I would have an issue thinking of him as anything else.


Sadly,he will never get any chance to be anything else

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 6:27:44 PM   
kalikshama


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Status: offline 		I think Peon's point is that he was a child, not a (young) man.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 6:33:23 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u

I'm confused Peon...is there some question whether or not he was ,in fact,a "young man"...as a 53 year old man I would have an issue thinking of him as anything else.


Sadly,he will never get any chance to be anything else


I'm saying that, at best, he made it to 'young man'. But, really, by law, he was a boy - a child. Albeit a tall one who was just beginning to learn how to look and act 'cool' - and making a pig's ear of it, as all boys do at that age. I'm damned certain I did, anyway.

< Message edited by PeonForHer -- 3/30/2012 6:34:02 PM >

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 6:49:45 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kalikshama

I think Peon's point is that he was a child, not a (young) man.

Childhood is generally considered to refer to the period between infancy and puberty.

K.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/30/2012 7:19:09 PM   
TheHeretic


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas
I cannot think of a good one except to fuel more MSNBC pundit judgements.




Arturas, the answer to free speech used badly, which we certainly have with this case, is more speech. That video contains actual facts, which are sorely lacking. I'd say sequester the Grand Jury now, and let it all out.

My feeling in this case is that Zimmerman initiated and escalated an incident that left a teenager dead, and never needed to happen. I don't care what color the teen was, Zimmerman needs to be held to account.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/31/2012 7:12:33 PM   
LookieNoNookie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arturas

MSNBC reports today that the Mayor forced the police department to release the 911 and video tapes of Zimmerman's entry into the jail for questioning. OMG,what is going on here, police suppression of the facts?

Nope. It's normal for such information to be unreleased until the case is completed. The Mayor is bowing to politcial pressure and no other reason and is doing so against the wishes of the Prosecuter and those doing this investigation. There are good reasons for not releasing this information and few good ones. I cannot think of a good one except to fuel more MSNBC pundit judgements.



And....MSNBC chopped the audio to make it sound as they chose.

You can find it on google.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/31/2012 8:07:49 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LookieNoNookie

And....MSNBC chopped the audio to make it sound as they chose.

Yeah really... wasn't that cute?
    In the NBC segment, Zimmerman says: “This guy looks like he’s up to no good. He looks black.”

    The full version, though, unfolds like this:

    Zimmerman: “This guy looks like he’s up to no good, or he’s on drugs or something. It’s raining and he’s just walking around, looking about.”

    911 operator: “Okay. And this guy, is he white black or Hispanic?”

    Zimmerman: “He looks black.”

    ~The Hollywood Reporter
But hey, they just want to see justice done.

K.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/31/2012 8:39:09 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline 		What's the material difference? I don't see the articulation of evidence of any crime, do you?

And without evidence of any crime, why would Zimmerman concern himself with Trayvon Martin going about his lawful business in a place where he has every legal right to be?

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 3/31/2012 8:40:24 PM >

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/31/2012 9:52:12 PM   
Kirata


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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

What's the material difference?

The (one would think) stunningly obvious material difference lies in the false impression created by the chopped version.

It's clear from the full version that Zimmerman's suspicions were aroused by Trayvon's behavior, not his skin color.

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 3/31/2012 9:58:03 PM >

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 3/31/2012 10:22:47 PM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

What's the material difference?


Seriously?

This is not reporting--it's fiction "based on actual events."

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 4:34:19 AM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata


quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

What's the material difference?

The (one would think) stunningly obvious material difference lies in the false impression created by the chopped version.

It's clear from the full version that Zimmerman's suspicions were aroused by Trayvon's behavior, not his skin color.

K.




What crimes does his behaviour provide the necessary elements of ?

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 4/1/2012 4:35:30 AM >

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 4:36:26 AM   
farglebargle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

What's the material difference?


Seriously?

This is not reporting--it's fiction "based on actual events."


If you think ANYONE is doing 'reporting' these day's, you got other problems.

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It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 7:35:54 AM   
cloudboy


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quote:

My feeling in this case is that Zimmerman initiated and escalated an incident that left a teenager dead, and never needed to happen. I don't care what color the teen was, Zimmerman needs to be held to account.


Why didn't the Police feel that way at the scene of the shooting?

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 7:39:39 AM   
Hillwilliam


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cloudboy

quote:

My feeling in this case is that Zimmerman initiated and escalated an incident that left a teenager dead, and never needed to happen. I don't care what color the teen was, Zimmerman needs to be held to account.


Why didn't the Police feel that way at the scene of the shooting?

Apparently the investigating officer did want to file charges and arrest Zimmerman but he was overruled by the DA who I would assume didn't visit the site or talk to witnesses. Interesting eh?

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 7:40:01 AM   
Musicmystery


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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

What's the material difference?


Seriously?

This is not reporting--it's fiction "based on actual events."


If you think ANYONE is doing 'reporting' these day's, you got other problems.

I'm not the one parading around the headlines here, am I.

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RE: MSNBC reports Mayor makes Police Dept show police t... - 4/1/2012 9:43:20 AM   
farglebargle


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Status: offline 		No one is cutting off your eyelids making you read...

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It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

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