RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling?

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RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:11:49 AM

Posts: 17033
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From: Dirty Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

quote:

ORIGINAL: Owner59
Ummmm...because he shot and killed someone......the trial, is where guilt is proven.....that`s what a trial is for.

So IF he did nothing wrong,George has little to worry about.....

If he did do something wrong....George has lots to worry about.....

That`s why "Team Zimmerman" is going Team-OJ on us.

Owner, I think you should stand trial, here in NJ, for driving a legally registered car that is fully insured and fully operable, within the speed limit while not under the influence of any mind-altering substances.

There's no evidence to suggest that your in violation of any law that's on the books but I want you to stand trial, anyway.

Really?

Peace and comfort,

Michael

Well....if there was a dead body in the corner......say your son maybe or brother......that might change the context a bit.....yes?

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to DaddySatyr)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:12:14 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SoftBonds

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

Actually, Softbonds, there are numerous folks saying he shouldn't go before a judge.
On the other end of the spectrum, there are those who are claiming Murder 1 and he should go to the chair. I'm thinking more negligent homocide because it was his damn stupidity that created a situation where someone died. This is a felony and he will have to surrender his carry permit.
This will be a relief to other gun owners like yours truly that one less dumbass has firearms.

Somebody died, so someone should be investigated. If he did nothing wrong, he should look forward to his day in court to be exonerated, as should his supporters. The only reason to try to avoid a trial is if he is guilty...
A police officer shoots an armed felon while said felon is shooting at the officer, the officer is investigated (generally an open and shut case, but still). I don't see why a neighborhood watch guy should get any more favorable treatment than any cities finest.

yeh thats what the police do to see if they have a winnable case before they press charges and NOTHING should EVER be in front of a judge but a JURY, that should be mandatory in every state even for a traffic ticket.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

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(in reply to SoftBonds)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:14:23 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

"Any time you go to trial, you're putting your fate in the hands of twelve people who weren't smart enough to figure out how to get out of jury duty" ... Alphonse Capone

Peace and comfort,

Michael

no kidding!

and the judge will convince them that he [the judge] has authority to tell them what to and not to consider and that they cannot judge the law. all horsehit of course.

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to DaddySatyr)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:16:55 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hillwilliam

That's interesting that you just arrived here and you're familiar with what happened 2 weeks ago.

All I would like to ask is which banned personage are you a sock for?

You got that too huh.

It's luckydawg.

I got that from his whiney posts about the mods.

(in reply to Hillwilliam)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:17:23 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoftBonds

If he did nothing wrong, he should look forward to his day in court to be exonerated ...

If he did nothing wrong, why should he have to go before a jury (Not a judge, usually)?

I am not sure he did anything that isn't within Florida law. I'm also not sure that he didn't do anything wrong. The people who get to decide that (initially) are the Sandford PD and the Prosecutor's office.

Peace and comfort,

Michael

thats correct, to determine if they can even make something stick, then arraignment can be before a judge then the trial before a jury.

Anytime ANYTHING gets to a court it should be adjudicated by a fully empowered jury.

but if he did nothing wrong it should be dropped.

< Message edited by Real0ne -- 4/7/2012 10:18:04 AM >

_____________________________

"We the Borg" of the us imperialists....resistance is futile

Democracy; The 'People' voted on 'which' amendment?

Yesterdays tinfoil is today's reality!

"No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while the legislature is in session

(in reply to DaddySatyr)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:22:26 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

quote:

ORIGINAL: SoftBonds

If he did nothing wrong, he should look forward to his day in court to be exonerated ...

If he did nothing wrong, why should he have to go before a jury (Not a judge, usually)?

I am not sure he did anything that isn't within Florida law. I'm also not sure that he didn't do anything wrong. The people who get to decide that (initially) are the Sandford PD and the Prosecutor's office.

Peace and comfort,

Michael

Surely because thats where points of law are decided. In a courtroom.

Dont forget those who decided if anything untoward had taken place on the bridge during Katrina, have just been jailed for trying to cover it up. This includes the very cop who was sent to investigate the shootings.

(in reply to DaddySatyr)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 10:48:57 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr

Owner, I think you should stand trial, here in NJ, for driving a legally registered car that is fully insured and fully operable, within the speed limit while not under the influence of any mind-altering substances.

There's no evidence to suggest that your in violation of any law that's on the books but I want you to stand trial, anyway.

See, there's a material difference here which your defective reasoning hasn't picked up on.

In FLORIDA LAW, to charge Manslaughter, ONLY TWO ELEMENTS MUST BE PROVEN.

1) Trayvon Martin is dead

2) George Zimmerman, through act or negligence killed Trayvon Martin.

That's it. We have evidence PROVING a violation of Florida's Manslaughter law.

Whereas, your defective reasoning made you embarrass yourself with an inapplicable hypothetical example, where NO ELEMENT OF ANY CRIME HAS BEEN PROVEN.

And of course, the facts above which I've shown make Zimmerman chargeable for manslaughter are uncontested.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to DaddySatyr)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 11:47:56 AM

VideoAdminGamma

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Fast Reply

The discussion may seem disjointed in some places because of posts that were removed by someone that should never have been posting. I am not going to ruin the rest of the conversation because of one person causing problems.

Please message me if there are any further issues.

Thank you for being a part of CollarMe,
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RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 11:50:53 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VideoAdminGamma

Fast Reply

The discussion may seem disjointed in some places because of posts that were removed by someone that should never have been posting. I am not going to ruin the rest of the conversation because of one person causing problems.

Please message me if there are any further issues.

Thank you for being a part of CollarMe,
VideoAdminGamma

9 hours faster than my prediction.

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Don't blame me, I voted for Gary Johnson.

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RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 12:03:33 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

In FLORIDA LAW, to charge Manslaughter, ONLY TWO ELEMENTS MUST BE PROVEN.

1) Trayvon Martin is dead

2) George Zimmerman, through act or negligence killed Trayvon Martin.

That's it. We have evidence PROVING a violation of Florida's Manslaughter law.

Will you please stop making shit up? Florida's Title XLVI statutes define the crime of Manslaughter (782.07) as:

"The killing of a human being by the act, procurement, or culpable negligence of another, without lawful justification according to the provisions of chapter 776...."

You didn't get away with your faux Chapter 776 argument, and repeating this one won't get you anywhere either.

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/7/2012 12:06:29 PM >

(in reply to farglebargle)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 4:33:40 PM

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From: Albany, NY
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

In FLORIDA LAW, to charge Manslaughter, ONLY TWO ELEMENTS MUST BE PROVEN.

1) Trayvon Martin is dead

2) George Zimmerman, through act or negligence killed Trayvon Martin.

That's it. We have evidence PROVING a violation of Florida's Manslaughter law.

Will you please stop making shit up? Florida's Title XLVI statutes define the crime of Manslaughter (782.07) as:
"The killing of a human being by the act, procurement, or culpable negligence of another, without lawful justification according to the provisions of chapter 776...."
You didn't get away with your faux Chapter 776 argument, and repeating this one won't get you anywhere either.

K.

And where is the 'lawful justification' claim made? That's right! In the motion to dismiss!

And since it explicitly references 766, that means that Zimmerman needs to convince the Judge or Jury of all the elements needed to qualify under 766.041.

Good luck with that, given his trivial injuries.

< Message edited by farglebargle -- 4/7/2012 4:35:39 PM >

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 5:20:07 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And where is the 'lawful justification' claim made? That's right! In the motion to dismiss!

And since it explicitly references 766, that means that Zimmerman needs to convince the Judge or Jury of all the elements needed to qualify under 766.041.

Please stop making shit up. Please stop repeating the shit you make up. And in particular, please stop repeating shit that you know is shit. To paraphrase LafayetteLady's corrective post in one of your many other threads on this theme, unless the investigation determines that Zimmerman's account is implausible, incorrect, or highly unlikely, the case isn't going to the courts.

Thank you.

K.

(in reply to farglebargle)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 5:41:42 PM

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And the investigation did determine exactly that. Did you miss the part where Investigator Chris Serino filed a fucking affidavit to cover his ass when he tried to charge Zimmerman with manslaughter but was overruled?

The real question is, "Why did a cop feel so strongly that he stabbed all his fellow officers in the back by filing an affidavit to cover his own ass, leaving everyone else holding the bag?"

It's because no cop I've talked to gets past the Sanford PD going off the rails and not doing the old, One Element, Two Elements, that's chargeable and the defendant can tell his story to the Judge without laughing their asses off at how thoroughly FUCKED Bill Lee is.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 5:47:28 PM

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From: Dirty Jersey
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And where is the 'lawful justification' claim made? That's right! In the motion to dismiss!

And since it explicitly references 766, that means that Zimmerman needs to convince the Judge or Jury of all the elements needed to qualify under 766.041.

Please stop making shit up. Please stop repeating the shit you make up. And in particular, please stop repeating shit that you know is shit. To paraphrase LafayetteLady's corrective post in one of your many other threads on this theme, unless the investigation determines that Zimmerman's account is implausible, incorrect, or highly unlikely, the case isn't going to the courts.

Thank you.

K.

Food for thought......

_____________________________

"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals"

President Obama

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/7/2012 8:34:15 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

And the investigation did determine exactly that. Did you miss the part where Investigator Chris Serino...

Be advised that Chris Serino is a person, not an "investigation." And Serino's opinion notwithstanding, the state attorney's office declined charges on the basis that there was insufficient evidence. Now, a Grand Jury will review the matter. You'll allow them that privilege, being a decent sort of fellow, and wait to see whether or not they find sufficient cause. Right?

K.

< Message edited by Kirata -- 4/7/2012 8:51:44 PM >

(in reply to farglebargle)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/8/2012 4:57:21 AM

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From: Albany, NY
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Well, again, The point is there's no reason to wait at all unless you're planning on charging something other than Manslaughter.

This "wait and see" attitude might end up -- instead of Zimmerman getting a manslaughter charge dismissed on motion for self-defense -- him ending up on death row.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Kirata)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/8/2012 7:25:22 AM

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quote:

Surely because thats where points of law are decided. In a courtroom.

No.
Facts are determined in a courtroom.

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RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/8/2012 4:06:33 PM

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The Judge decides Issues of Law... In a courtroom.
The Jury decides Issues of Fact... In a courtroom.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to truckinslave)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/9/2012 6:29:07 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SoftBonds
IMHO they are trying to defend the law as written...
If it looks like the stand your ground law allows a wacko to kill with impunity, it will destroy the law in the court of public opinion, and this law is very important to the NRA for some reason.

Christ on a stick, is that what's going on. Seems like the Republican positions are getting so insane that I can't even understand them anymore. Personally, I think that we should have the right to defend ourselves and I think that the best way to convince our fellow American that we're not responsible enough to have that right is to defend people who chase children down and shoot them.

(in reply to SoftBonds)

RE: Zimmerman as racist meme crumbling? - 4/9/2012 7:04:41 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

Seems like the Republican positions are getting so insane that I can't even understand them anymore. Personally, I think that we should have the right to defend ourselves and I think that the best way to convince our fellow American that we're not responsible enough to have that right is to defend people who chase children down and shoot them.

I agree 100%! When I find someone that has chased down and murdered a child, I will be the first person calling for their scalp. I suspect, though that if there were evidence (not even proof but evidence) of Zimmerman doing that, he'd be cooling his heels in the Greybar Hotel and trying, desperately to get a decent lawyer.

The very fact that he hasn't been arrested yet tells me that this is most definitely not a slam-dunk case. It would be nice if it was so that we wouldn't have to speculate but, life doesn't always go our way.

Peace and comfort,

Michael

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