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RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 5:52:12 AM

Sinergy

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quote:

People are always fearful of the radical right, but to me the radicals on the left are just as dangerous. And just as ridiculous.

To me, the key word here is "radical." People who are radical anything are dangerous (from my point of view) because of the unwavering rigidity of their beliefs. Add to that the Self Appointed Moral Guardian status these people have awarded themselves, and nobody is safe from their predations.

And I am sure when reality slips through a worm-hole and chickens develop language skills, learn to use tools, and gain enlightenment, Colonel Sanders will be nominated boogie man the way Hitler is.

"How I hated the Colonel with his beady little eyes..." -- Mike Myers, So I Married An Axe Murderer.

The usual disclaimer of "This is just me, and I could be wrong" applies.

Sinergy

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(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 101

RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 9:17:23 AM

rain

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i agree with Sinergy on this one, anyone who is a radical, on either side, is someone to watch out for.

While i have my personal political beliefs and enjoy a healthy debate at times, i do not consider myself a "crusader" who's life's work is based on pushing my personal agenda onto others.

The more rigid or dogmatic one's beliefs, the more likely i am to steer clear of them.

And, in regards to PETA's and PCRM's "advertising" campaign- they should be ashamed of themselves!

PETA campaign coordinator Matt Prescott said he was aware of the council's views, but added: "We are not willing to end the campaign." He said he himself was Jewish.

Hard for me to believe that a Jewish person would not only condone but promote this type of advertising distrubs me. i am also Jewish, and, in my opinion, for chickens to be compared to Holocaust victims is offensive.

The other issue, in my view, is the fact that eating animals naturally occurs in life; the larger animals eat smaller animals to survive- just b/c humans are the largest/strongest animals doesn't mean we should NOT eat animals....that's evolution...and for the animal rights extremists: survival of the fittest.

BTW- i used to be a (quasi) vegetarian, but not b/c of animal rights issues. Today i eat only fish & poultry...and don't eat beef or pork b/c i don't care for it, and haven't eaten either in over 13 years.

~rain~

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(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 102

RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 11:10:23 AM

Sinergy

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quote:

While i have my personal political beliefs and enjoy a healthy debate at times, i do not consider myself a "crusader" who's life's work is based on pushing my personal agenda onto others.

I do consider myself somewhat of a crusader. I feel strongly enough about what I believe to I put on a padded suit and teach full-contact women's self defense at considerable danger to myself both in the fight as well as potential long term damage to my brain and spinal column from repeated impact.

www.impactpersonalsafety.com

But I merely go to class and do what I do. I dont force others to subscribe to my beliefs, insist it is the only way to go, and the only way I will involve myself in a problem relating to the abuse of a person (adult or child) is if there is an immediate threat to somebodies life or health.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to rain)

Post #: 103

RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 1:11:46 PM

Estring

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The problem with radicals or fanatics is that the truth gets trampled by an agenda. Taking a good idea like treating animals humanely gets subverted into an anti-human agenda. And in my opinion, PETA is anti-human. To equate humans with chickens is ridiculous.
And rain, I share your puzzlement with a Jew being behind standing behind this advertising.
A wonderful statement was said by my favorite feminist Tammy Bruce. She said that you can tell the state of a society by how they treat their Jews. I think this would apply here too.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 104

RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 1:40:39 PM

Sinergy

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I had a friend doing his PhD in immunology and he did experiments on live chickens which had been specially bred for the purpose.

He would put these chickens in a bag which came up to about the base of the neck. The chickens had had any sort of brain genetically engineered out of it, and he said they were so stupid they would starve to death before they could figure out how to get out of the bag.

quote:

To equate humans with chickens is ridiculous.

I have worked with people the same thing could be said about, so this statement is incorrect.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 105

RE: Atkins diet - 5/30/2004 9:22:45 PM

Estring

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I know you are being only half serious, but PETA equates The Holocaust with barbequeing chickens. Now whether a human can get out of a paper bag, they still are not chickens.
On the other hand, we can't lay eggs.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 106

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 1:50:08 AM

rain

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring
On the other hand, we can't lay eggs.

haven't you heard of the fabulous vibrating egg? Who said we can't "lay eggs"

hehehehe

~rain~

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Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today. - James Dean

(in reply to Estring)

Post #: 107

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 3:10:10 AM

Sinergy

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quote:

I know you are being only half serious, but PETA equates The Holocaust with barbequeing chickens. Now whether a human can get out of a paper bag, they still are not chickens.
On the other hand, we can't lay eggs.

A true radical can (and will) take any information at their disposal which could be linked to their agenda, discarding the mountains of evidence which contradict their agenda, and attempt to be the last one screaming their vitriole.

I have a friend who is a PETA person who rescues cats. We have discussed it at great length, and she tended to dislike my ideas.

1) If you feed them, they will breed more until they have overwhelmed the available resource supply and then start to die off.

Postponing the inevitable was preferable (for her) than facing the reality of the situation.

2) The humane thing to do is to sterilize feral cats and let them live out their happy feral cat lives in a way that does not make more feral cats in the future.

Sterilizing cats "disturbs their wa" and makes them walk around in pain for the week or so they take to recover.

I wasnt going to play dueling radical ideas with her, so I just let it go.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to rain)

Post #: 108

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 3:39:13 AM

Estring

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Yes your friend believes that compassion is the most important thing. But compassion without moral clarity just makes things worse. Welfare is a perfect example. Her compassion will actually hurt those that she wants to help. And it was probably best to let it go.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 109

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 9:29:06 AM

perverseangelic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy
1) If you feed them, they will breed more until they have overwhelmed the available resource supply and then start to die off.

Postponing the inevitable was preferable (for her) than facing the reality of the situation.

2) The humane thing to do is to sterilize feral cats and let them live out their happy feral cat lives in a way that does not make more feral cats in the future.

Sterilizing cats "disturbs their wa" and makes them walk around in pain for the week or so they take to recover.

this makes me sad. catch and release spaying is one of the most effective methods of REDUCING feral animals, especially cats. people have a habit of adopting a kitten, then tossing it when it's not a kitten anymore. often these animals aren't sterilized.

i can understand feeding feral animals, i volunteer sometimes at a cat colony that does just that. (the rational here is that if the animals have an easier source of food they are less likely to harass the native wildlife-ground nesting birds, etc. seems to be fairly effective) but the program catches, sterilizes, and tags all its cats.

sterilizing and animal does NOTHING to it except make it live a longer and happier life. ~sigh~
know i'm preaching to the choir here, but still. i consider myself an animal activist, and as such i've made a point of learning about things that "might" harm the animal. spaying or neutering isn't one of them.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 110

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 11:17:35 AM

Sinergy

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quote:

sterilizing and animal does NOTHING to it except make it live a longer and happier life. ~sigh

Well, not sure I am reading this right, but to me this sentence means one of two things

1) an animal in captivity lives a longer and happier life if sterilized. No disagreement there.

2) a feral animal lives a longer and happier life.

If you meant number 2, the cats it prevents from overflowing the system space are the multitudes of kittens produced by the cat, who then produce more kittens, and so on, and so on, and so on.

On a related note my ex-brother-in-law is a dairy farmer who has barn cats. These barn cats reproduce in droves until the barn is filled with 70-100 semi-feral cats by April. By December these cats have been reduced to about 9 by distemper and other cat illnesses, cows stepping on them, predations of predatory things like feral dogs, etc. He could spay and neuter the cats, but the life of a barn cat is fraught with peril and without letting them breed indiscriminately he would be barn cat challenged in less than a year.

He has 3 house cats which live happy, spayed or neutered, vaccinated, and cared for cat lives and are never allowed in near the barn or out of the house.

It is an example of a system space which is self-correcting in terms of populations. There is no reason to introduce outside influences (feeding them, vaccinating them, sterilizing them) because there is no danger of a population overflow.

The logic applies to the human population as well. People need to control population growth or the system will control it for us...

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 111

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 1:45:53 PM

perverseangelic

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i guess you're right, i should have been more clear.

sterlized cats have less occurances of a huge number of diseases. most notably certain types of cancer. i meant that it does not effect the animals ability to live, either in the nominal wild or in the house.

honestly, i think it is irresponsible of -any- animal owner to keep his/her animal unaltered. except, perhaps, in rare cases when an owner wishes to breed, but honestly i see little to no reason for most to breed animals.

anyway, this is my soapbox, and unrelated to the main thread. i'll shut up now.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 112

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 2:47:00 PM

Sinergy

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quote:

honestly, i think it is irresponsible of -any- animal owner to keep his/her animal unaltered. except, perhaps, in rare cases when an owner wishes to breed, but honestly i see little to no reason for most to breed animals.

This is true in most cases, however, as I mentioned in my post, barn cats fulfill a valuable service (working animals) by keeping down the vast populations of rats and other vermin which infest working barns. Sterilizing them would result in complete collapse of a cat population (dont have enough kittens born to maintain the population results in the population dying out) necessary to keep the vermin down, and vaccinating them would be outrageously expensive to do to animals which probably will not survive 3 years due to natural selection by accident / predation.

I love cats, but in this case, it is a situation where the method used works and the alternative is unlikely to work in the long run.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 113

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 2:49:41 PM

Sinergy

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quote:

sterlized cats have less occurances of a huge number of diseases. most notably certain types of cancer. i meant that it does not effect the animals ability to live, either in the nominal wild or in the house.

Also cuts dramatically down on infections from fighting (cat mating rituals) with other cats, as well as removing primal urges causing the animals to wander far afield of their known territories.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 114

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 2:55:56 PM

Sinergy

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quote:

It is best to drink sports drinks like Gatorade in that case

Problem with Gatorade and other sports drinks is they generally have a huge amount of sugar in them, which:

a) requires more water to process in the body, so one becomes more dehydrated drinking them rather than less, requiring drinking more water.

b) causes insulin production and the associated fat storage which the Atkins diet is intended to eliminate / lower in the body.

There are sports drinks out there which have the electrolytes (that too much water eliminates from the body) without the sugar / carb content in them. I generally use the carb free Emergen-C powder in a 2 litre bottle of water when I am exercising. The one I prefer is the one with glucosamine / chondroiton in it. This aids in maintaining connective tissue / ligaments, etc.

Sinergy

_____________________________

"There is a fine line between clever and stupid"
David St. Hubbins "This Is Spinal Tap"

"Every so often you let a word or phrase out and you want to catch it and bring it back. You cant do that, it is gone, gone forever." J. Danforth Quayle

(in reply to EStrict)

Post #: 115

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 3:55:23 PM

perverseangelic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

quote:

This is true in most cases, however, as I mentioned in my post, barn cats fulfill a valuable service (working animals) by keeping down the vast populations of rats and other vermin which infest working barns. Sterilizing them would result in complete collapse of a cat population (dont have enough kittens born to maintain the population results in the population dying out) necessary to keep the vermin down, and vaccinating them would be outrageously expensive to do to animals which probably will not survive 3 years due to natural selection by accident / predation.

yup. 's why i said most cases. i don't necessarially -like- the situation you've described on a personal level, but i can see that such animals are being useful, and aren't being dumped in city pounds. rather, they're doing something valuable.

i don't see a reason for -most- to breed. you've given a good reason for breeding.

(in reply to Sinergy)

Post #: 116

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 6:55:48 PM

rain

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hmm, this thread has almost come full circle: from the original topic, atkins diet & nutrition, weight loss, animal rights, fanatics, and feral cats!

are we missing anything else?

~rain~

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Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today. - James Dean

(in reply to perverseangelic)

Post #: 117

RE: Atkins diet - 5/31/2004 7:48:42 PM

inyouagain

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rain
...are we missing anything else?

Nobody mentioned that breast augmentation usually results in natural male enhancement

Inyouagain

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Post #: 118

RE: Atkins diet - 6/1/2004 12:33:50 AM

ShadeDiva

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LOL!

You people just crack me up! LOL

~ShadeDiva

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Post #: 119

RE: Atkins diet - 6/22/2004 3:20:17 PM

rightome

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I don't know about the Adkins diet...but I eat based on my blood type...I have lost 35lbs since Feb and have been able to stop taking about 5 types of medications...I do not eat wheat or gluten products, rather use spelt and Ezekiel 4:9 Bread and wraps.

Have not felt this great in years! Book: Eat Right For Your Type.

(in reply to iwillserveu)

Post #: 120

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