quote:

ORIGINAL: bignipples2share

In reply to your post #156
I don't see how you can say it's always a 50/50 cause and effect. Are you saying because someone believe in their partner and trust that they will be faithful, that it's their fault when they find out they aren't? Everything in the relationship can have been worked on a daily basis, everything looks wonderful, both parties think everything is going fantastic and then the boom is lowered...one of them may have been cheating from day one. How is this the fault of the other, if their only fault was believing the cheater in the first place?

I did not say that when a spouse cheats, it is the fault of the other. This is the perfect example of word twisting.
I said  is my belief that when long term relationship succeed/fail, that it is because of both parties involved.  Both make mistakes.  And I dont think its ok to say that one persons mistakes are acceptable and the other persons mistakes are worse. Im sorry, but I cannot agree with you here.


Yes, there are people who think that divorce is worse than being with a cheater, but then it should be that persons option to at least know what their options are.

Of course it should, thats why I said the other spouse should be told. What you are refering to wasme discussing the breaking of vows and how the breaking of certain vows are more painful than the breaking of other vows, depending on the person.  No one said that the other party shouldnt be told and allowed to have their own options.

There are religeons that don't allow or recognize divorce, in which case the one being cheated on has the option to be permanantly seperated and have NO further contact, or forgive and stay.

Alot of people forgive their spouses for cheating.  In fact, in some cases, one in particular that I know of, It actually improved the marriage, because both parties took a long hard look at what they were doing wrong and corrected it.

No matter how you look at it, one is a choice and I see nothing in the other that gives any type of choice.
As I see it, this should be titled two worlds of lies.

Fine, the OP is getting a group together, great. It'll probably end up, somewhere down the line, with a great deal of information on how not to get caught.

Sarcasm helps no one. I did not pick up on this being the OP's jist.  But of course you are entitled to your interpretation of her words.  However please do not re-word my statements for me.  Thank you.
 


~Big
_____________________
ahhhh I see sounds

quote:

ORIGINAL: ZenDragoness



What is your REAL point?  Not to judge someone else?  Not to compare morals?

The above are questions feastie asked me.

Compassion first, Judgement last.

quote:

ORIGINAL: TallDarkAndWitty

quote:

ORIGINAL: sskitten
And this is how and why I live in two worlds of trust.

Sorry to be blunt, but this is a load of crap.  You are unsatisfied in your vanilla marriage so you lie and cheat.  You are a liar and a cheater and to think you live in "two worlds" is just a bit of self-delusion you need to face yourself in the mirror in the morning.

I speak from experience here.  I lied and I cheated and I told myself it was for some higher purpose and that my wife would never understand that I really needed this.  I didn't want to risk my marriage, even though the lies and the cheating had destroyed any real relationship I had or could have with my ex-wife. 

What you are doing is not noble and it is not necessary.  It is unfair to your spouse and, in all honesty, it is unfair to yourself.  There is nothing more wonderful than to live your life in honesty with all of those you love (and who love you)...and nothing worse than sharing a bed with someone who doesn't even know the real you.

The sooner you realize that this web of self-denial you have woven is nothing but a self-destructive affirmation, the sooner you can get out of your unsatisfying marriage (and let your husband get out of what must be a rather bad marriage) and the sooner you can get on with your life.

Life is too short to share it with someone you can't be honest with, and it is way too short to spend it with someone who is not honest with you.

Taggard

quote:

ORIGINAL: agirl

I wouldn't condemn a person for keeping their marriage intact and having *another life* also.

I wouldn't care to judge someone on the whys and wherefores of their choices. Relationships are SO complicated and the reasons for people being unhappy/unfaithful in them, are too. It's too easy to say *come clean*. It iSN'T always the *good, kind and noble* thing to do. It's a personal moral dilemma.

I certainly don't see that my personal moral code should be applied to anyone other than me.

When I stop being an imperfect person and always make the correct choices and decisons for all concerned and for myself, maybe I'll be in a position to judge other people.

agirl

quote:

ORIGINAL: BrattyBottomRN

THANK YOU KITTEN!

yeah, I cheat... no I'm not a monster.  I cheat to accomplish something.  Yeah that sucks for my husband and yeah it's a horrible thing to do.  But the alternative is giving my child a divorced household because mom needs kink. 

It seems to be split here, there are a lot of people who think when we "cheaters" get our hearts broken (like silly little naieve, inexperienced me just did) by a Dom, we deserve it.  We don't.  Nobody deserves that.

And SHIT why does everybody have to be so damned judgemental?  Walk a mile in our shoes, then judge!  Spend ten minutes in my head, twenty minutes with my emotions, then talk.  I'm with ya chickie.   (((((((hugs)))))))

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

And I would agree that those who yell the loudest about their intergrity are usually the ones who are not nearly as pure as they seem to think they are, *but* they truly *believe* they are. 

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo

quote:

ORIGINAL: bignipples2share

In reply to your post #156
I don't see how you can say it's always a 50/50 cause and effect. Are you saying because someone believe in their partner and trust that they will be faithful, that it's their fault when they find out they aren't? Everything in the relationship can have been worked on a daily basis, everything looks wonderful, both parties think everything is going fantastic and then the boom is lowered...one of them may have been cheating from day one. How is this the fault of the other, if their only fault was believing the cheater in the first place?

If you read the previous statement, before the question, I said 50/50. I then went on to discuss one part of the 50/50 situation, as in, how can there be 50% fault on the one being cheated on. No matter that it's a new relationship or old, if their only fault was to not see that the other was cheating on them. If they believe, after giving all they can, working on it and being told everything is great. I just don't see how this is a 50/50 deal and asked. There is a question mark after I wrote those words.

quote:


I did not say that when a spouse cheats, it is the fault of the other. This is the perfect example of word twisting.

I did not say you said this either, I asked you a question. That's not twisting words.

quote:


I said  is my belief that when long term relationship succeed/fail, that it is because of both parties involved.  Both make mistakes.  And I dont think its ok to say that one persons mistakes are acceptable and the other persons mistakes are worse. Im sorry, but I cannot agree with you here.

Yes, both parties do make mistakes, I also think that the longer a couple are together, there will be an accumualtion of mistakes and as they are made, you work through them, or you move on when all else fails. I don't really see cheating as a mistake though, I see it as someone making the decision to get into bed with someone other than their partner. I will clarify this with,  I know you didn't say it's okay to cheat.

quote:


Yes, there are people who think that divorce is worse than being with a cheater, but then it should be that persons option to at least know what their options are.

Of course it should, thats why I said the other spouse should be told. What you are refering to wasme discussing the breaking of vows and how the breaking of certain vows are more painful than the breaking of other vows, depending on the person.  No one said that the other party shouldnt be told and allowed to have their own options.

There are religeons that don't allow or recognize divorce, in which case the one being cheated on has the option to be permanantly seperated and have NO further contact, or forgive and stay.

Alot of people forgive their spouses for cheating.  In fact, in some cases, one in particular that I know of, It actually improved the marriage, because both parties took a long hard look at what they were doing wrong and corrected it.

I have seen where this has happened as well. I don't think that it's the right way to make a marriage stronger though and no, by saying this, I'm not implying that you think it is either.

From this point down, nothing was directed at you. It was a rant on the subject and yes, the original post.
I now know to make sure I use different posts so that there is no confusion and to word everything that I type in at least four different ways and make copies, so that my meanings are not misunderstood, as I see happen so often on forums and of others, not just me, or you.

quote:


No matter how you look at it, one is a choice and I see nothing in the other that gives any type of choice.
As I see it, this should be titled two worlds of lies.

Fine, the OP is getting a group together, great. It'll probably end up, somewhere down the line, with a great deal of information on how not to get caught.

Sarcasm helps no one. I did not pick up on this being the OP's jist.  But of course you are entitled to your interpretation of her words.  However please do not re-word my statements for me.  Thank you.

Again, I don't believe I twisted your words. 
The part you did get right in my meaning was the sarcastic part, but I also do believe there will be questions asked as to, how did you hide it so well, and there will be others, running for their notepads.


~Big
_____________________
ahhhh I see sounds

quote:

ORIGINAL: incognitobynight

So far I am not a cheater, but I am contemplating.  I have been with my husband for nearly 10 years.  We have never had an intimate physical relationship. Not one night!  I have told him that if he could not show me some kind of affection (other than to tell me that he loves me), that I should be allowed to find  and fulfill that need in me somewhere else. I have tried to leave him.  He will not allow me to find it somewhere else (and goes to extreme lengths to make sure I don't), but has pleaded with me not to leave him.  We do have a good life together otherwise.  People say, "he will be better off knowing the truth.  Better off alone".  Bull shit!  He can do nothing to change who he is (I won't go into details, but he can't), and I don't want to spend the rest of my life without physical intimacy.  It would be best for ME to leave him....I know this.  But is it best for him?  Who are you kidding?  He will lose everything ELSE that we have built together.  He will lose the only family he has.  He will lose the woman who has for the last 10 years SHOWERED him with gifts and attention and who has focused everything on HIM.  If I pull all that out from under him now (and I confess, I am thinking of it), how is that better for HIM???  You think this frees him to go find a woman who can't stand to be touched?  Get real!.  Kitten, you know who I am.  Yeah, in a perfect world, I wish I could have a totally open and honest relationship with someone who fulfills my needs, but we don't live in a perfect world.  We are all just doing the best that we can.  I'm trying not to destroy my husband, if he finds out...he will be hurt.  But I'M HURTING NOW!

quote:

ORIGINAL: bandit25

Sorry I couldn't respond until now, meatcleaver.  I'm a bit confused by your response...what woman are you talking about?  The OP or the one you spoke of earlier?  When I said the OP self righteous stance, I meant that she didn't seem contrite.  And how IS this two worlds of trust?  Even one world of trust since that second world is based on a lie in the first world?

quote:

ORIGINAL: incognitobynight

So far I am not a cheater, but I am contemplating.  I have been with my husband for nearly 10 years.  We have never had an intimate physical relationship. Not one night!  I have told him that if he could not show me some kind of affection (other than to tell me that he loves me), that I should be allowed to find  and fulfill that need in me somewhere else. I have tried to leave him.  He will not allow me to find it somewhere else (and goes to extreme lengths to make sure I don't), but has pleaded with me not to leave him.  We do have a good life together otherwise.  People say, "he will be better off knowing the truth.  Better off alone".  Bull shit!  He can do nothing to change who he is (I won't go into details, but he can't), and I don't want to spend the rest of my life without physical intimacy.  It would be best for ME to leave him....I know this.  But is it best for him?  Who are you kidding?  He will lose everything ELSE that we have built together.  He will lose the only family he has.  He will lose the woman who has for the last 10 years SHOWERED him with gifts and attention and who has focused everything on HIM.  If I pull all that out from under him now (and I confess, I am thinking of it), how is that better for HIM???  You think this frees him to go find a woman who can't stand to be touched?  Get real!.  Kitten, you know who I am.  Yeah, in a perfect world, I wish I could have a totally open and honest relationship with someone who fulfills my needs, but we don't live in a perfect world.  We are all just doing the best that we can.  I'm trying not to destroy my husband, if he finds out...he will be hurt.  But I'M HURTING NOW!