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RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 6:54:00 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Oh, what other photo of Trayvon is out there?



I was referring to the one I posted at the 7-11 with his clothes bulging out.



quote:

lol... thats no artifact.. and you dont need to blow it up in hopes of seeing it "better" like you did the arm that you have coming out of his hip


Shoulder. Not hip. And blowing it up to triple life size (advantage of using a 120" display) has me even less convinced the curve is the outline of his head. There are other perfect circles inside that curve for instance.

quote:

We don't know, but it seems more probable that the arm looking thing extending from the shoulder looking thing is maybe an arm, absent a photo with, maybe, something more to see.



quote:


The only one seeing holes there is you.... conveniently to make your own case.


Nope. Why did Chad Green say that he watched the game with Trayvon until halftime, at which time Trayvon said he was going to the store...when Trayvon was at the store soon after 6pm and dead before the game started at 7:30? Is that why Trayvon's dad told police he last saw Trayvon an hour after he died; because that's what Chad said? Is that the birth of the narrative of the kid coming home during halftime of a game (even though the game hadn't started?)

Innocuous in itself; then you listen to W8's testimony. She gave 2 interviews...one with Matt Gutman of ABC to draw attention to the claim that "proves George was lying", while Crump kept her hidden for some time after before she finally talked to BDLR; and gave a narrative consistent with Crump's version of the story in contradiction to the evidence.

When the Matt Gutman version of the interview was supplied to the Defense (and therefore open to discovery), why was the entire thing so fuzzy as to be impossible to understand? (when the interview clips shown on ABC were perfectly clear?) Why did W8 tell Bernie that Trayvon said he was "rushing home to watch...to finish watching the game"...correcting herself mid-sentence to a statement we know now to be false? Did Crump not think to check when the game started before coaching her on that story? Why did she claim it was an "old man" speaking to Trayvon, she knew this because of his "deep voice"...when Trayvon's voice is deeper than George's?

Why does she describe a chase that leaves Trayvon winded even after a couple minutes to catch his breath, where he made it "right by his dad's house", before George catches up winded; and yet the encounter actually took place in the same spot that George was on the phone with NEN and couldn't see Trayvon? Within line of sight of George's truck even.

Then we have the screams of pain occurring simultaneously with Trayvon being on top of George...and only George sustaining any significant injury simultaneous with those screams of pain; forensics consistent with George's story, etc. etc.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 601
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 7:48:08 AM   
tazzygirl


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Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

Shoulder. Not hip. And blowing it up to triple life size (advantage of using a 120" display) has me even less convinced the curve is the outline of his head. There are other perfect circles inside that curve for instance.


lol.. yes... sometime you may want to take a look at a black person's hair when its cropped close.

As to the rest... I am basing what I am saying simply on the physical evidence and what George has said. I have never once brought up any testimony from anyone on Trayvon's side.

_____________________________

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Profile   Post #: 602
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 7:55:27 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

As to the rest... I am basing what I am saying simply on the physical evidence and what George has said. I have never once brought up any testimony from anyone on Trayvon's side.


Well they're a key part to the State's case; which you claimed only I see holes in. So I can certainly understand you not seeing any holes in the State's case when you don't look at all the evidence.

quote:

sometime you may want to take a look at a black person's hair when its cropped close.


I'm amused that you'd think hair patterns would be visible when not even the entire body is visible. (Or even what you claim is the head.)

< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/5/2012 7:56:16 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 603
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:20:52 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Of course they would be.. which tells me thats the head. Nothing from the waist down was that dark. And if his ass is that round we would have heard about it long before now.

quote:

Well they're a key part to the State's case; which you claimed only I see holes in. So I can certainly understand you not seeing any holes in the State's case when you don't look at all the evidence.


I dont need too. Its Z's story of events that is not adding up as to body position. Check back, other than the bond hearings, all I have spoken about is the body.

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 10/5/2012 8:22:19 AM >

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 604
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:36:25 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Of course they would be.. which tells me thats the head.


Except those same circles appear elsewhere in the photograph; unless you're suggesting his head takes up the majority of the photo.

quote:

Nothing from the waist down was that dark.


And his sweatshirt was as dark if not darker than his head, yet it's all lit up, including the arm out to the side.



quote:


I dont need too. Its Z's story of events that is not adding up as to body position.


There's absolutely nothing at present to contradict Z's version as to body position.

quote:

Check back, other than the bond hearings, all I have spoken about is the body.


And attacked my assertion that the State's story is full of holes, which I then refuted.

< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/5/2012 8:37:24 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 605
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:41:44 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

Except those same circles appear elsewhere in the photograph; unless you're suggesting his head takes up the majority of the photo.


Wow, you do keep stretching... lol... its sorta cute the way you can never admit you are wrong.

quote:

And his sweatshirt was as dark if not darker than his head, yet it's all lit up, including the arm out to the side.


In a flood of light, surrounded by all that darkness, it will be lighter.

quote:

There's absolutely nothing at present to contradict Z's version as to body position.


The police report of the officer who started CPR.

quote:

And attacked my assertion that the State's story is full of holes, which I then refuted.


Z's story is full of holes.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 606
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:46:45 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		Red is the head... yellow are the arms... placement consistent with the police report... no blow up needed.






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 607
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:49:18 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Wow, you do keep stretching... lol... its sorta cute the way you can never admit you are wrong.


Of course I do...when I'm wrong. I even admit the possibility of being wrong when I feel it exists, though in this case I feel it's pretty small.


quote:

In a flood of light, surrounded by all that darkness, it will be lighter.


That's a a weird flood of light to selectively ignore the "head" (it stops right at the curve).


quote:

The police report of the officer who started CPR.


Nope. Not even if he was right, he doesn't contradict it. A period of time passed between what George says happened and what Ayala saw. A witness in between that time saw Trayvon's arms out consistent with George's telling.

quote:


Z's story is full of holes.


No one has been able to show a single one proven by the evidence. There's allegations, theories, speculation, but no proof.


< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/5/2012 8:53:00 AM >

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 608
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:55:26 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline 		My version fits the photo better.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 609
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:58:22 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

That's a a weird flood of light to selectively ignore the "head" (it stops right at the curve).


LOL.. shadows... if the body is rounded upwards because the hands are beneath... ahem. It doesnt ignore the head.... it ignores the legs.

quote:

Nope. Not even if he was right, he doesn't contradict it. A period of time passed between what George says happened and what Ayala saw. A witness in between that time saw Trayvon's arms out consistent with George's telling.


So Ayala's report was wrong about the placement of the hands.. even though HE was the one who initiated CPR? Again, I gotta ask you.. who would know better? A shaken bystander or a police officer at the scene?

quote:

No one has been able to show a single one proven by the evidence. There's allegations, theories, speculation, but no proof.


Z's story is filled with his version of the truth... which many many people doubt. Is it any wonder he doesnt want a jury trial?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 610
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 8:59:33 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun

My version fits the photo better.




Your version has his arms coming out from his hips.


_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 611
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:05:28 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl


So Ayala's report was wrong about the placement of the hands.. even though HE was the one who initiated CPR? Again, I gotta ask you.. who would know better? A shaken bystander or a police officer at the scene?



Nice selection of words. Who would know better, the bystander with time to look from a distance, or the guy frantically rushing to save the kid's life, such that he couldn't accurately describe what he was wearing?

quote:



Is it any wonder he doesnt want a jury trial?



That logic has no point. Why would any innocent man prefer a jury trial over a pre-trial dismissal?

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 612
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:06:57 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline 		And of course, I brought up the possibility that they both might be right. W6 saw Trayvon's corpse right after the shooting and described it in that state. Ayala saw it later after a short period of time had passed. They weren't describing the body at simultaneous moments.

W6, however, saw it closer to the moment George described than Ayala; so the fact his description matches George is what's important.

< Message edited by Raiikun -- 10/5/2012 9:07:38 AM >

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 613
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:14:10 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Raiikun


quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

I could almost buy that.. except Z's family is also in law.


Z's family. Z hadn't even completed a bachelor's yet, and was in jail with limited contact with his family.

There's nothing in those jail calls I've seen to indicate anyone corrected Zimmerman on what he understood from his attorney.


I love the suggestion that Zimmerman, who comes off as a creepy police-fetishist, doesn't have a clear understanding of the expectations of The Court to tell the Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing But The Truth.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 614
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:14:20 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

W6, however, saw it closer to the moment George described than Ayala; so the fact his description matches George is what's important.


For that to be possible, someone would have had to move the body, moving the hands beneath him. And, I can assure you, a description from an emergency worker will always be more accurate than a bystander.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 615
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:14:48 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Your version has his arms coming out from his hips.



Shoulders.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 616
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:16:48 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

For that to be possible, someone would have had to move the body, moving the hands beneath him.



Not necessarily. Trayvon was alive for several minutes after the shot, and conscious for part of it according to experts.

quote:

And, I can assure you, a description from an emergency worker will always be more accurate than a bystander.


That emergency worker was provably wrong in his description.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 617
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:31:35 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		On pants and shoe colors.... lol.. Hell.. I could have gotten that much wrong. But physical placement of a body... not hardly.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 618
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:34:12 AM   
Raiikun


Posts: 2650
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

On pants and shoe colors.... lol.. Hell.. I could have gotten that much wrong. But physical placement of a body... not hardly.


In other words, who cares about the details he gets wrong as long as the one detail you need to be right has a chance of being right.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 619
RE: Update on Trayvon Martin case - 10/5/2012 9:34:26 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

Not necessarily. Trayvon was alive for several minutes after the shot, and conscious for part of it according to experts


The 17-year-old survived for several minutes, according to two experts who reviewed Trayvon's autopsy for the Orlando Sentinel.

"You're talking about minutes, at least, for him to survive," said Dr. William Anderson, a forensic specialist and former deputy medical examiner for Orange and Osceola counties. "I think he would have been conscious … for a little time, anyway."



What killed the Miami Gardens teenager was massive internal bleeding, said Anderson and Dr. William L. Manion, a board-certified anatomical, clinical and forensic pathologist and lawyer in Mount Holly, N.J.

At 7:17 p.m. on Feb. 26, the bullet that killed Trayvon entered his chest square-on, just to the left of his breastbone, according to his autopsy. It punched a hole in his right ventricle, the lower right chamber of the heart, and broke into three pieces.

Uh huh.. those few precious moments he was alive are those George swears he had the kid with his arms outstretched. So, again, how did they get under him?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to Raiikun)
Profile   Post #: 620
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