RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision)

RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (Full Version)

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heartfeltsub -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 6:43:26 AM)
shaking my head, i KNEW it was stupid to get into this mess.

mistoferin -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 6:53:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: devils Hi, i am just curious(and concerned)! I'am young and new to this...but my question doesn't have to do with BDSM! any way here is my question: I am sircumcised(since i was born) and when i masturdate i almost never lubricate i just use a cloth, my blouse for instence, so i was wondering if this makes me(or has made me already)less sensitive in that area? And an other question i just thought of....do you prefer sircumcised or non-sircumcised penises and why/why not? To the OP....on the off chance that you actually make it through this thread far enough to get to this...... As to your first question, that is hard for me to answer as I do not have a penis...circumcized or not. I did ask my mother if my father mentioned anything about less sensitivity after his circumcision and she said that he actually had the opposite experience. He and two of his brothers all had to have the surgery as adults for health reasons. I can tell you that all of them had wished it had been done in infancy as the surgery and recovery were excrutiatingly painful by their accounts. As to your second question....I have never experienced an uncircumcized penis so I can't say that I have a preference other than I "think" that I prefer circumcized. I polled a few of my girlfriends and they all said they prefer circumcized and a few of them had experienced both. In asking men that I know, they all said they are glad they are circumcized, including my own boys. I know, I am a horribly "abusive" parent who condoned the "torture" of my own children. But when I asked them if they would have preferred that I had left them intact, one's response was "Nope, I am glad that it's the way it is"....and the other's response was a loud "Oh, hell no!!!!".

darkinshadows -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 6:54:12 AM)
The op asked about sensitivity of the penis. My explainations have tried to explain what the medical community have suggested. In doing that, of course topics always move in different tangents. But there is still the underlying discussion as to whether sensitivity is lost. Child circumcisions would be assumed to make the penis less sensitive, by the medical community, due to the destruction and removal of excess tissue as an infants foreskin is fused. Males (edit for adding males circ in later life) who have been circumcised have, in the majority of cases, noticed a decrease in sensitivity - however for some males, it does have other advantages. But at least as an adult - they had a choice.* (again - I am not voicing an opinion based on moral/religious choice - another persons faith is something I refuse to debate as that is a different issue altogether) I hope you caught my explaination on ethic/morals that I added to my post to you erin. Peace and Rapture

mistoferin -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 7:02:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: darkinshadows I hope you caught my explaination on ethic/morals that I added to my post to you erin. Yes I did. I still disagree though[;)].

darkinshadows -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 7:44:17 AM)
grins... but ya love me still... like I do you.[:)] Peace and Rapture

talibahh -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 7:51:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule quote: ORIGINAL: talibahh However... my youngest had to see the surgeon just yesterday, to assess having a circumcision FOR MEDICAL REASONS, a tight foreskin which does not allow the urine to escape freely, but rather builds up around the base of the penis and has caused infection and bleeding. Needless to say, he will have this procedure done, in hospital under a general anaestheic by a qualified surgeon.... because he HAS TO! The foreskin will adapt to stretching, becoming larger. So if this foreskin is repeatedly stretched for half an hour three times daily, the problem should remedy itself within a couple of weeks. Simply instruct the boy to keep stretching the foreskin whenever he has the opportunity and the problem will pass. It is my impression that a lot of people think that circumcision is necessary because they have never learned to handle such little problems themselves, having no family history of being not circumcised. Alternatively, an incision might be made lengthwise. Either You are ignorant or do not read a full post, only the bits You choose to... my sons father is uncircumcised AND i am an experienced health professional and DO know how to care for my son and his penis, thank You very much! i appreciate Your advice as it were, but You do not know the full story, You dont even know how old my son is. You have NO IDEA what practices/treatments have already been tried, DO YOU? You assume way too much! But i will NOT debate my son here in public... i was merely giving an example of how it CAN BE a medical necessity! i would be very much interested to know just what Your credentials/qualifications are? tali

talibahh -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 8:04:45 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Sensualips quote: Needless to say, the pain the baby felt and the trauma to both the baby and myself was very real That is interesting. I was present for both my boy's circumcisons and it was not a pleasant experience. However, it was brief and seemed much less traumatic for us both than some of the immunizations. They were soothed quickly and easily when the procedure was done and aftercare showed very little pain. IE: when cleaning or handling the area they did not flinch, cry, etc. This is not a justification, but just an obervation based on limited personal experience. with respect Sensualips... why do people only partially quote something, to fit it to their needs? If you go back and read the full paragraph, you will see that: 1) i stated this was done in the late 1980's 20 years ago!* and* 2) that i also went on to state and i quote although nowadays, this is not the normal practice (thank God), it is now done in theatres under anaesthetic..., and if not done in theatre, often a local anaesthtic gel is used. i am not here to either judge you for your decisions nor to try and force my opinions or beliefs on anyone, i simply try to provide another point of view... but if you are going to quote me, please have the decency to use it in context! Thanks, tali

Proprietrix -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 10:25:32 AM)
I wanted to comment briefly on why some parents routinely have their sons circumcised. My personal experience was that the nurses in the hospital presented me with the circumcision papers to sign while I was still medicated and doped up from having just given birth. I was 17 years old and really had no clue at all what I was "supposed to do" and "not supposed to do" as a new mom. So when these trained medical professionals who had my life in their hands for the past 16 hours brought in a paper and said "Sign here for his circumcision", I signed on the dotted line. It was a paper in a bunch of others. Sign here for his bracelet. Sign here for his blood test. Sign here for his X-ray. Sign here for his formula in case you can’t breast feed. Sign here for his picture to be taken. Sign here for his circumcision. What I was thinking at the time was "I’m exhausted. I’m in pain. I need sleep. I feel stoned." It had nothing to do with my religious or health stance or even as my stance as a parent. I can’t tell you how many other mothers I know who went through the same thing. Approaching someone in a drug induced state, after hours upon hours of physical pain, directly after a major life change, when they are physically exhausted, to routinely have them sign a plethora of documents, is absolutely wrong in my opinion. The circumcision was as natural to these nurses as punching the time clock each morning. It was nothing more than part of the routine. And looking back on the situation, I don’t feel that I really had any say in the matter. Yes, I signed the papers, but I did so when I wasn’t in any physical or mental condition to be making any sort of decision. I think it would have been more appropriate to have waited until I was coherent and discharged and made that decision with my pediatrician. If I had really been given the option, I would not have had my son circumcised. I would have left that decision up to him to make in life if and when he wanted to. I’m not arguing for or against it either way. I have no problem with people who choose to do it or choose not to do it. I’m just talking about my experience (and the experience of many women I know) of why it's routinely done.

darkinshadows -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 10:36:55 AM)
Proprietrix I send my thoughts and love to what you had to endure. I tried to work out what year that you had to deal with such trauma. If it was after february 1996, you might want to have a look into AAP recommendations on unethicial procedures of circumcision. Peace and Rapture

Chaingang -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 10:40:45 AM)
Mistoferin: When do we get to see the 15" of flesh from your own genitals? I think a photograph of it in a neat little pile will suffice. Which 15" from your own genitals will you choose to have removed? I am giddy with the anticipation of your response. [;)] I'm only half joking, BTW...

mistoferin -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 11:01:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chaingang Mistoferin: When do we get to see the 15" of flesh from your own genitals? I think a photograph of it in a neat little pile will suffice. Which 15" from your own genitals will you choose to have removed? I am giddy with the anticipation of your response. [;)] I'm only half joking, BTW... Well then in that case I will only half seriously answer you.[sm=biggrin.gif] 15"???? I don't think that even with the growth that they have experienced that little snippet would have amounted to 15 inches today. 15"....my.....I guess that if that is accurate then most of the men in this country would be sexually incompatible to the women of this country. I would like to change my response....if there is a 15" difference between circumcized and uncircumcized.....I really DO prefer circumcized. Loss of sensitivity?????? Then I will say that men should do women a favor and run right out and be circumcized if they are still intact as one of the problems that I frequently hear that women find with men is that they have too much sensitivity and can't last long enough to be satisfying. Hence the booming dildo market. Actually, truth be known, I think that alot of men could really do alot of women a giant favor by just having that 15 lbs of arrogance that sits on top of their necks removed.....but that is a whole other thread. [sm=flying.gif] I know what a horrible person I am for having made the choice I did. Good thing that my salvation is between me and my God and not between me an you. I know that what I did is to you "indefensible". I am glad however, that my boys have forgiven me and even appreciate my decision....I guess that is all that really matters to "me". Maybe you would like for me to be publically flogged for the grievous error in judgement I made.....oh wait.... I've already had that done.[sm=mrpuffy.gif] edited to add that I have had far worse done to my own genitalia for no reason other than it made someone's dick hard and it put a smile on their face. And that is my half serious answer to your half joking question....lol....and I'll still respect ya in the morning!!!!!!!

Chaingang -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 11:24:46 AM)
In truth, I would favor legislation to have the procedure not only banned but criminalized - both for parents and doctors. I would like to add that your boys aren't qualified to know what was denied them - they don't know any kind of before or after. And I find it a wonder that so many Americans have these medical emergencies involving their foreskins - as my family comes from a South American country where the procedure is not generally performed and I have rarely heard of any adults requiring the procedure. I'm going to have to add this to a long list of unnecessary procedures routinely performed in the U.S. I am sure it all adds up to nice European vacations for the doctors. All of these foreskin emergencies is starting to seem like "dead dom syndrome" in terms of their non-existence - it's not that I don't believe these people are having the procedure performed, it is that I am wondering about the criteria triggering the supposed "need" for the surgery. BTW, as to the 15" - it's simple really. The foreskin is doubled over, all you have to do is imagine a stretch of flesh starting from behind the head of a cock and that extends completely over the head and then making a kind of pinched closure over the tip, - say a minimum of 1.5" x 2 (because it's doubled over) x 5" for the circumference of the average penis = 15" approx.

mistoferin -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 11:44:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chaingang I would like to add that your boys aren't qualified to know what was denied them - they don't know any kind of before or after. What a wonderful point you make. The only people who are really qualified to have this discussion are those who have indeed had the experience of having it both ways. I would also add that we would have to further limit it to those who have had the procedure done in adulthood after experiencing a sex life while still intact and having one after surgery. So...I guess that if that is the baseline qualifier of the validity of opinions on the subject....we would then have to discount most of what has been said on this thread and limit the future discussion on here to only those qualified to have it. Great idea! [:D]

Kedikat -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 12:33:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Rule quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat I disagree with the concept of it being room for elongation. In that case people - and land mammals - with a non-mutilated penis should still have a foreskin when their penis is in erection, shouldn't they? However, they do not for in erection the foreskin becomes part of the skin of the shaft of the penis. Your thesis thus is contradicted by observable fact. I trust that you will agree with this conclusion, as you seem to be a rational man. quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat Consider the sensitivity of the penises head! Nature would have created a cover for it, to protect it. Few women have a clitoris that protrudes all the time. This is a good argument. However, eyes and lips and fingertips and sometimes nipples also are extremely sensitive and vulnerable, yet they are not protected by folds of skin. Admittedly, skin has a protective function. It protects against dehydration and against heat loss and against infection. When subjected to excessive abrasion it will develop a callosity, a hardenend and thickened part of skin. Since the foreskin lacks such a callosity, it may be assumed that it does not serve to protect the glans from physical harm. The organ that is excessively protected from physical harm is the brain, which is encased completely in bone. The foreskin is skin, though, not bone. As for protecting the sensitivity of the glans, you may have a point. Removing the foreskin then would be stupid, wouldn't it be? quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat The comment of foreskin enhancing evolution is ridiculous. According to the Law of Murphy then, it must be correct. People used to say that the concept of Earth being spherical was ridiculous, because if it was, then people on the nether side of the Earth would fall off. Lots of theories have been called ridiculous that eventually were accepted as true - the movement of continents hypothesis by Alfred Wegener for example. I expect that upon reconsideration that you will agree that your antithesis is not an argument, but an opinion. quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat We have naturally lost many things during evolution, that in some circumstances could be useful, but nature itself found to be not worth the effort to continue. Maybe you could have a doctor surgically reinstall what used to be of your appendix, that nature so brutally robbed you of. This idea is caused by a misconception about the way natural selection works. Anything that evolution has no use for is lost relatively faster than lightning strikes. If nearly everbody and every mammalian species has an innate organ or a piece of an organ, though, you may bet that it is extremely useful to that organism. The appendix, for example, is a refuge for useful bacteria and is surrounded my tiny immunologically active organs. Luckily the human body has some inbuild (or is it inbuilt?) redundancy. I expect, though, that it is safer to remove a redundant finger than a redundant appendix. Thus evolution theory proclaims that the foreskin is an extremely useful organ. quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat And I am curious if you have ever used any of the benifits of medical science? Isn't it more natural for you to die of gangrene from a minor cut? Do you wear glasses? Shouldn't you just die due to accident of poor sight? Etc..... Unfortunately, yes. In my - in this case very subjective - opinion, the best physician is a dead physician. quote: ORIGINAL: Kedikat The foreskin is most obviously a protective covering. Yes, obviously. Obviously the Earth is flat. Obviously the Moon consists of Swiss cheese. That some things are obvious, does not make them true. Recall this variant of the Law of Murphy: Anything that a human deems obvious, is obviously false. Generally all your counters are weak. Some only supported by the science of Prof Murphy and the like. Some are nicely circular in logic. I just stand by what I said. And live perfectly well with the observable facts of being circumcised. I am curious if there are people born with little or no foreskin. Nature being so various. If there are, should we fix it as a deformity at birth? After all that, I still think it is a choice. I think it is less dramatic/traumatic a thing than is spoken here. Except when done under terrible circumstances.

Chaingang -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 12:33:55 PM)
Ah, you miss the important differences between information gained anecdotally versus that gained from scientific observation. There's lot's of nerves in those missing 15", and I doubt that they are there for nothing. But just theoretically, what portions of your vagina are available for the chopping block? I'd like to know. Maybe you come too fast also, and removing some sensitive portions of your vagina might help you last longer.

Sensualips -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 1:40:45 PM)
quote: if you are going to quote me, please have the decency to use it in context! I typically only snip the part of the quote I am replying to, assuming the posters have already read the original post in the thread. It is more a marker or reminder. I am not really sure why this is upsetting to you as I was just reflecting on the my experiences. The part I snipped is what prompted my thought process. I understand that it was a different decade and a different continent. I agree that it is unpleasant and even traumatic. I did hold down both babies and if I recall one had no anesthesia and another had a topical ointment or gel type thing. My point was that I was surprised but pleased with the quick recovery of the boys. Perhaps I should have been more clear.

wild1cfl -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 1:53:44 PM)
When my wife and I decided that we were going to have children, adn we hoped that we would have a boy, we talked about circumcision. My wife is vehemently opposed to it and I was at first not committed to either way. After talking with my wife and several other health professionals on both sides of the argument, we decided that we would not have our son circumcised. This was a conscious decision that we made way before she was pregnant. We also had made other decisions about any children that we had such as no glucose water being used due to diabetes being present in both families, no formula being used, only mother's breast milk as well as other decisions. All of this was in a written document that we presented to the hospital and the Dr who was going to be delivering our babies. This is our right as patients to write things like this out and if the directives are not followed the DRs. and hospital can be held liable. This prevented a lot of probelms when our children were born but it still did not prevent 2 Drs. from trying to pressure my wife into having our son circumcised. She almost slugged one of the Drs. and as I was just returning from getting something to eat, I chased both of them out of her room and we never saw them again. We also filed a complaint with the hospital on the Drs. in question and they were reprimanded for their behavior. My son is now 16 years old and he is glad that we made the decision not to have him circumcised.

meatcleaver -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 2:17:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chaingang All of these foreskin emergencies is starting to seem like "dead dom syndrome" in terms of their non-existence - it's not that I don't believe these people are having the procedure performed, it is that I am wondering about the criteria triggering the supposed "need" for the surgery. There are very few circusions in Britain and with all those foreskins around if there were such a thing as medical emergencies requiring circumcision I'm sure I would have heard of one. Yet I only know of one person who has been circumcised for medical reasons and that wasn't an emergency but a procedure he discussed in depth with his doctor. Maybe I would have heard of more if doctors were paid a bonus for the number of circumcisions they did.

mistoferin -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 2:32:57 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Chaingang But just theoretically, what portions of your vagina are available for the chopping block? I'd like to know. Well there were certainly large portions of it that were on the chopping block for the episiorectomies that were done to facilitate the births of my sons. The last one required over 160 stitches. I'm fairly certain there were a large number of nerves that were sacrificed for a procedure that, by the way, is totally unnecessary in the vast majority of cases. It's one of those things that is done routinely and not very often questioned.....kind of like circumcision. Often times things like episiotomies, C-sections and inducement of labor are done, not for benefit of health, but for convenience, time and cost effectiveness of the doctor, although you won't hear a doctor readily admit that. How else would they justify the amount of their bills if women weren't convinced by them that they are incapable of doing what their bodies were designed to do and managed to do it for how many thousands of years without their intervention? Really Chaingang, I'm not trying to be a smart ass but we all have valid reasons to question the necessity or validity of many medical practices..that 1/4 inch snip of foreskin being only the "tip" of the iceberg...no pun intended. We could go on like this 'til the second Tuesday of next week....but NONE of it is relevant or helpful to the OP.

meatcleaver -> RE: Need a health answer(about sircumcision) (6/14/2006 3:10:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: mistoferin Really Chaingang, I'm not trying to be a smart ass but we all have valid reasons to question the necessity or validity of many medical practices..that 1/4 inch snip of foreskin being only the "tip" of the iceberg...no pun intended. We could go on like this 'til the second Tuesday of next week....but NONE of it is relevant or helpful to the OP. The OP asked if circumcision made him less sensitive (or was it masturbating without lube?). If he did ask about circumsion making him less sensitive, the answer is a most emphatic YES! Actually if he wasn't circumcised he wouldn't have to consider lube as the foreskin helps to lubtricate the glans, yet another function of the foreskin. He then asked do you prefer circumcised or uncircumcised penises. Now this might be taken as a question to women only but he doesn't state that. So those men that have put in their two penneth worth are answering the question.

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