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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:12:06 PM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
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Here is my problem with high cap magazines, anything over ten rounds anyway.

Coming from my military and law enforcement careers, first it as a sniper, one shot, one kill.

As a cop, if you dont hit them with the first two or three rounds, what the hell makes you think you are going to have better luck with the remaining 27?

Unless you are shooting into a pack of wild hogs, thirty round mags dont mean you are going to hit your target.

I had a partner as a cop, big guy, 6'9" and about 300-320. I saw him take a .38 in the chest and the damn bullet lodged between two ribs. He promptly slapped the shit out of the druggie that shot him for ruining a new tailored shirt.

IMO a 38 has very little stopping power, a .357 is much better.

But I hit a 300 pound wild hog with my 50 desert eagle and stopped that sucker in mid stride.

So if your home is being invaded by a 300 pound wild hog, a 50 cal is better than a 38.

quote:

Look. . . wimminz are smaller. Colt made us equal. And the ammo just gets better.


One this problem, might I suggest miracle grow?

< Message edited by jlf1961 -- 1/11/2013 9:13:11 PM >


_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:12:42 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aylee

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: TheRyan7

Maybe the guy didnt want to kill her and just take her money.

last resort of the anti gun crowd depend on the high moral fiber of the criminals


I say we ban small caliber firearms and make everyone who has a home and kids purchase 50 cal desert eagles and load em with hollow points.


No.  Look, there is a targeting issue when you go with high calibers.  I likey a 9 mm hydroshock hollowpoint.  I am not a very big person and to expect me to be able to hold down the muzzle raise on a higher caliber is rather. . . insensitive. 

Look. . . wimminz are smaller.  Colt made us equal.  And the ammo just gets better.

to each his (or her ) own

(in reply to Aylee)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:16:30 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Here is my problem with high cap magazines, anything over ten rounds anyway.

Coming from my military and law enforcement careers, first it as a sniper, one shot, one kill.

As a cop, if you dont hit them with the first two or three rounds, what the hell makes you think you are going to have better luck with the remaining 27?

Unless you are shooting into a pack of wild hogs, thirty round mags dont mean you are going to hit your target.

I had a partner as a cop, big guy, 6'9" and about 300-320. I saw him take a .38 in the chest and the damn bullet lodged between two ribs. He promptly slapped the shit out of the druggie that shot him for ruining a new tailored shirt.

IMO a 38 has very little stopping power, a .357 is much better.

But I hit a 300 pound wild hog with my 50 desert eagle and stopped that sucker in mid stride.

So if your home is being invaded by a 300 pound wild hog, a 50 cal is better than a 38.

quote:

Look. . . wimminz are smaller. Colt made us equal. And the ammo just gets better.


One this problem, might I suggest miracle grow?

my problems with high capacity magazines is that they encourage spray and pray of course if they are shooting at me thats how I want them to do it, not like you would that said Aylee has a point and as I said earlier better to have them and not need them than to need them and not have them

< Message edited by BamaD -- 1/11/2013 9:18:26 PM >

(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:23:53 PM   
dcnovice


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Dammit, this is the second time I've been excited to see a thread about magazines, only to learn it was actually about guns.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to BamaD)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:30:00 PM   
DesideriScuri


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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice
Dammit, this is the second time I've been excited to see a thread about magazines, only to learn it was actually about guns.


Now you know how I feel when I hear the commercial talking about "living the High Life" and then come to find out that it was about beer. Talk about being deflated...

_____________________________

What I support:

  • A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  • Personal Responsibility
  • Help for the truly needy
  • Limited Government
  • Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)

(in reply to dcnovice)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 9:41:06 PM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Here is my problem with high cap magazines, anything over ten rounds anyway.

Coming from my military and law enforcement careers, first it as a sniper, one shot, one kill.

As a cop, if you dont hit them with the first two or three rounds, what the hell makes you think you are going to have better luck with the remaining 27?

Unless you are shooting into a pack of wild hogs, thirty round mags dont mean you are going to hit your target.

I had a partner as a cop, big guy, 6'9" and about 300-320. I saw him take a .38 in the chest and the damn bullet lodged between two ribs. He promptly slapped the shit out of the druggie that shot him for ruining a new tailored shirt.

IMO a 38 has very little stopping power, a .357 is much better.

But I hit a 300 pound wild hog with my 50 desert eagle and stopped that sucker in mid stride.

So if your home is being invaded by a 300 pound wild hog, a 50 cal is better than a 38.

quote:

Look. . . wimminz are smaller. Colt made us equal. And the ammo just gets better.


One this problem, might I suggest miracle grow?

my problems with high capacity magazines is that they encourage spray and pray of course if they are shooting at me thats how I want them to do it, not like you would that said Aylee has a point and as I said earlier better to have them and not need them than to need them and not have them



I own a couple of AR framed rifles in .308, and only time I use high cap mags outside of the range is when I am dealing with wild hogs. For the first two or three minutes they stay bunched, then they take off in all directions.

I have one of Red Jacket's hog guns on order, cant wait for it to get here.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to BamaD)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 10:08:50 PM   
lovmuffin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Here is my problem with high cap magazines, anything over ten rounds anyway.

Coming from my military and law enforcement careers, first it as a sniper, one shot, one kill.

As a cop, if you dont hit them with the first two or three rounds, what the hell makes you think you are going to have better luck with the remaining 27?

Unless you are shooting into a pack of wild hogs, thirty round mags dont mean you are going to hit your target.

I had a partner as a cop, big guy, 6'9" and about 300-320. I saw him take a .38 in the chest and the damn bullet lodged between two ribs. He promptly slapped the shit out of the druggie that shot him for ruining a new tailored shirt.

IMO a 38 has very little stopping power, a .357 is much better.

But I hit a 300 pound wild hog with my 50 desert eagle and stopped that sucker in mid stride.

So if your home is being invaded by a 300 pound wild hog, a 50 cal is better than a 38.

quote:

Look. . . wimminz are smaller. Colt made us equal. And the ammo just gets better.


One this problem, might I suggest miracle grow?




I've seen many of your postings favor the seemingly small concession of limiting civilian magazine capacity to 10 rounds. Where as you are correct that most self defense situations don't require 13 or 16 rounds, and shot placement is more important than anything else in a gun fight, some situations might call for expending a crap load of ammo and could be the difference between life and death. It's also illogical for a full size handgun capable of holding 13 or 16 or whatever number of rounds and limiting yourself to 10.

It's a useless limitation that accomplishes nothing and won't save innocent lives or prevent fireaem mass murder.

< Message edited by lovmuffin -- 1/11/2013 10:30:29 PM >


_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/11/2013 10:59:27 PM   
jlf1961


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Lovemuffin, most domestic defense situations are at ranges of 15 feet or less. If you dont hit the intruder with the first two rounds, you are, in the current street lingo, screwed.

In point of fact, an assault rifle in a situation like that is pretty much useless. I have a number of semi automatic rifles, three based on the AR15 frame, but my home defense weapons are my .45 1911 colt automatic and a .50 desert eagle.

As stated earlier, large cap mags basically are for spray and pray shooting, at least in a rifle. Granted if the max cap is 13 or 14 in a pistol, then it should be allowed.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to lovmuffin)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:01:56 AM   
lovmuffin


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Joined: 9/28/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Lovemuffin, most domestic defense situations are at ranges of 15 feet or less. If you dont hit the intruder with the first two rounds, you are, in the current street lingo, screwed.

In point of fact, an assault rifle in a situation like that is pretty much useless. I have a number of semi automatic rifles, three based on the AR15 frame, but my home defense weapons are my .45 1911 colt automatic and a .50 desert eagle.

As stated earlier, large cap mags basically are for spray and pray shooting, at least in a rifle. Granted if the max cap is 13 or 14 in a pistol, then it should be allowed.



You are correct about domestic defensive situations and in most cases a long gun is not a great choice. The need for a high cap mag in a long gun would come down to varmints or some such thing but the best reason to own them is it horrifies the likes of certain sanctimonious crooked politicians. I still fail to see the logic for banning them. A ban will do zero to stop firearm mass murder. What's the point ?



And also they are a convienience for target shooting not to mention the rare instance when you actually do need them. There was a guy who testified to congress before the Clinton ban passed. He was attacked by 2 armed intruders while camping. He said if he hadn't had his Mini 14 and 20 round mag through the prolonged gun fight, he would have been dead.

< Message edited by lovmuffin -- 1/12/2013 12:15:26 AM >


_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:09:56 AM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Lovemuffin, most domestic defense situations are at ranges of 15 feet or less. If you dont hit the intruder with the first two rounds, you are, in the current street lingo, screwed.

In point of fact, an assault rifle in a situation like that is pretty much useless. I have a number of semi automatic rifles, three based on the AR15 frame, but my home defense weapons are my .45 1911 colt automatic and a .50 desert eagle.

As stated earlier, large cap mags basically are for spray and pray shooting, at least in a rifle. Granted if the max cap is 13 or 14 in a pistol, then it should be allowed.

being in law enforcememnt you know that officers often empty thier weapons without realising it part of the reason I like the single action makes you take you time and aim

(in reply to jlf1961)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:11:28 AM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Lovemuffin, most domestic defense situations are at ranges of 15 feet or less. If you dont hit the intruder with the first two rounds, you are, in the current street lingo, screwed.

In point of fact, an assault rifle in a situation like that is pretty much useless. I have a number of semi automatic rifles, three based on the AR15 frame, but my home defense weapons are my .45 1911 colt automatic and a .50 desert eagle.

As stated earlier, large cap mags basically are for spray and pray shooting, at least in a rifle. Granted if the max cap is 13 or 14 in a pistol, then it should be allowed.



You are correct about domestic defensive situations and in most cases a long gun is not a great choice. The need for a high cap mag in a long gun would come down to varmints or some such thing but the best reason to own them is it horrifies the likes of certain sanctimonious crooked politicians. I still fail to see the logic for banning them. A ban will do zero to stop firearm mass murder. What's the point ?

sets a precidence if 11 are evil why can't we make it six or 2

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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:12:52 AM   
jlf1961


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From: Somewhere Texas
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Bama, that is true, but I always did a three tap. But then I was in the tactical unit.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to BamaD)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:14:24 AM   
Edwynn


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quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe


Gun rights groups say Georgia home invasion proves their point

This woman retreated to the attic with her kids and a .38 six shot revolver. The intruder kept coming. As a last resort she shot him. She hit him with five of the six shots (which is pretty amazing in itself) in his face and torso. She knocked him down long enough for her and her kids to leave the house safely. He survived and made it outside to his car and crashed into a tree.

Had she not hit him with all of those five shots or had there been more than one intruder this story could have ended much differently. She emptied her weapon but it possibly saved her and her kid's lives. Everyone who wants to be able to legally own a higher capacity firearm is not some crazed gun fanatic. Many are just people who want the right to protect themselves.

To the mods: If this post is out of line please kill the thread and accept my apologies. I've given up trying to keep track of what we can and cannot start threads about. Keeping abreast of the daily changes around here is only slightly more difficult than tap dancing in quicksand.




Fine.

She would have been better off with a 9 mm and two ten-round clips.

This has to do with military assault rifles and 15-20 mags of 30 rounds each, just how?

(in reply to LizDeluxe)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:19:38 AM   
lovmuffin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn


quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe


Gun rights groups say Georgia home invasion proves their point

This woman retreated to the attic with her kids and a .38 six shot revolver. The intruder kept coming. As a last resort she shot him. She hit him with five of the six shots (which is pretty amazing in itself) in his face and torso. She knocked him down long enough for her and her kids to leave the house safely. He survived and made it outside to his car and crashed into a tree.

Had she not hit him with all of those five shots or had there been more than one intruder this story could have ended much differently. She emptied her weapon but it possibly saved her and her kid's lives. Everyone who wants to be able to legally own a higher capacity firearm is not some crazed gun fanatic. Many are just people who want the right to protect themselves.

To the mods: If this post is out of line please kill the thread and accept my apologies. I've given up trying to keep track of what we can and cannot start threads about. Keeping abreast of the daily changes around here is only slightly more difficult than tap dancing in quicksand.




Fine.

She would have been better off with a 9 mm and two ten-round clips.

This has to do with military assault rifles and 15-20 mags of 30 rounds each, just how?



The magazine bans under proposal and under the Clinton bans limited anything semi automatic to 10 rounds including handguns.

_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

(in reply to Edwynn)
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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 12:46:59 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
Joined: 6/10/2008
From: Somewhere Texas
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn


quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe


Gun rights groups say Georgia home invasion proves their point

This woman retreated to the attic with her kids and a .38 six shot revolver. The intruder kept coming. As a last resort she shot him. She hit him with five of the six shots (which is pretty amazing in itself) in his face and torso. She knocked him down long enough for her and her kids to leave the house safely. He survived and made it outside to his car and crashed into a tree.

Had she not hit him with all of those five shots or had there been more than one intruder this story could have ended much differently. She emptied her weapon but it possibly saved her and her kid's lives. Everyone who wants to be able to legally own a higher capacity firearm is not some crazed gun fanatic. Many are just people who want the right to protect themselves.

To the mods: If this post is out of line please kill the thread and accept my apologies. I've given up trying to keep track of what we can and cannot start threads about. Keeping abreast of the daily changes around here is only slightly more difficult than tap dancing in quicksand.




Fine.

She would have been better off with a 9 mm and two ten-round clips.

This has to do with military assault rifles and 15-20 mags of 30 rounds each, just how?


She would have been better off with a 44 desert eagle loaded with hydroshocks.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to Edwynn)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 2:22:48 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn


quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe


Gun rights groups say Georgia home invasion proves their point

This woman retreated to the attic with her kids and a .38 six shot revolver. The intruder kept coming. As a last resort she shot him. She hit him with five of the six shots (which is pretty amazing in itself) in his face and torso. She knocked him down long enough for her and her kids to leave the house safely. He survived and made it outside to his car and crashed into a tree.

Had she not hit him with all of those five shots or had there been more than one intruder this story could have ended much differently. She emptied her weapon but it possibly saved her and her kid's lives. Everyone who wants to be able to legally own a higher capacity firearm is not some crazed gun fanatic. Many are just people who want the right to protect themselves.

To the mods: If this post is out of line please kill the thread and accept my apologies. I've given up trying to keep track of what we can and cannot start threads about. Keeping abreast of the daily changes around here is only slightly more difficult than tap dancing in quicksand.




Fine.

She would have been better off with a 9 mm and two ten-round clips.

This has to do with military assault rifles and 15-20 mags of 30 rounds each, just how?

because in the currently proposed law the two are linked

< Message edited by BamaD -- 1/12/2013 2:25:13 AM >

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RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 2:24:33 AM   
BamaD


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Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Bama, that is true, but I always did a three tap. But then I was in the tactical unit.

I have always figured that my 12 ga coach gun one load of double 0 buck and there is nothing to do but mop

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 2:27:16 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961


quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn


quote:

ORIGINAL: LizDeluxe


Gun rights groups say Georgia home invasion proves their point

This woman retreated to the attic with her kids and a .38 six shot revolver. The intruder kept coming. As a last resort she shot him. She hit him with five of the six shots (which is pretty amazing in itself) in his face and torso. She knocked him down long enough for her and her kids to leave the house safely. He survived and made it outside to his car and crashed into a tree.

Had she not hit him with all of those five shots or had there been more than one intruder this story could have ended much differently. She emptied her weapon but it possibly saved her and her kid's lives. Everyone who wants to be able to legally own a higher capacity firearm is not some crazed gun fanatic. Many are just people who want the right to protect themselves.

To the mods: If this post is out of line please kill the thread and accept my apologies. I've given up trying to keep track of what we can and cannot start threads about. Keeping abreast of the daily changes around here is only slightly more difficult than tap dancing in quicksand.




Fine.

She would have been better off with a 9 mm and two ten-round clips.

This has to do with military assault rifles and 15-20 mags of 30 rounds each, just how?


She would have been better off with a 44 desert eagle loaded with hydroshocks.

If she could control it seems to be a big if since she shot him 5 times and he still got to his car and the last I heard was expected to live I agree with you about the bigger bore but if you can't control it a bazooka won't do the job, not that I would recommend one for home defense backflashcan be a real pain

< Message edited by BamaD -- 1/12/2013 2:30:01 AM >

(in reply to jlf1961)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 3:21:54 AM   
jlf1961


Posts: 14840
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From: Somewhere Texas
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Bama, I was being sarcastic, personally I have found that most women I instruct seem to be able to handle a .40 caliber automatic with little trouble. Strangely enough, every one of the women I have instructed always wants to try my desert eagle, which is good for a few laughs.

I have heard both good and bad things about the 10mm, but have never fired one.

As for the man that got into a gunfight while camping.

While the only firefights I ever got involved in was while I was in the army, and actually can be counted on one hand, my sniper rifle, in my opinion was quite useless. In those situations I would have preferred an M16.

As for the whole ban idea proposed by Feinstein. The first ban did nothing to prevent mass shootings, Columbine happened in the middle of the first ban.

I think the effort should be put in better back ground checks, and having mental conditions reported to the proper authorities so it would show up on a background check.

I agree with Tazzy's idea about a mandatory weapons security reg, enforcing a minimum standard of securing semi automatic rifles, but I really cannot see how it could be enforced.

_____________________________

Boy, it sure would be nice if we had some grenades, don't you think?

You cannot control who comes into your life, but you can control which airlock you throw them out of.

Paranoid Paramilitary Gun Loving Conspiracy Theorist AND EQUAL OPPORTUNI

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Why people support higher capacity magazines - 1/12/2013 11:13:35 AM   
BamaD


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Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jlf1961

Bama, I was being sarcastic, personally I have found that most women I instruct seem to be able to handle a .40 caliber automatic with little trouble. Strangely enough, every one of the women I have instructed always wants to try my desert eagle, which is good for a few laughs.

I have heard both good and bad things about the 10mm, but have never fired one.

As for the man that got into a gunfight while camping.

While the only firefights I ever got involved in was while I was in the army, and actually can be counted on one hand, my sniper rifle, in my opinion was quite useless. In those situations I would have preferred an M16.

As for the whole ban idea proposed by Feinstein. The first ban did nothing to prevent mass shootings, Columbine happened in the middle of the first ban.

I think the effort should be put in better back ground checks, and having mental conditions reported to the proper authorities so it would show up on a background check.

I agree with Tazzy's idea about a mandatory weapons security reg, enforcing a minimum standard of securing semi automatic rifles, but I really cannot see how it could be enforced.

as for your first set of conditions I agree 100% plus cracking down on people who lie on the background check form and straw buyers like the oneswho got the guns for the colimbine kids knowing the kids could not get them legally I agree with Tazzy that it should be manditory to report lost or stolen guns. What possible legitimate reason could there be for not reporting a stolen gun that you owned lagally, and if it just disaperaed good chance it was stolen

The second part I share your concerns the only way that I see it could be inforced would be suprise "inspections" which would need to turn into searches because you know how easy it would be to have a gun safe and keep "a couple" outside "just in case
Do not get me wrong I totally aprove of gun safes

I notice that you favor like I do those aspects that do not penalize legal gun owners.

PS
I had assumed that most of our exchanges on shooting people were largely tongue in cheek
If you think your .44 provided laughs you should have seen the 19 year old 30 years ago who went into a squating position
wit his rear off the ground fireing up a slight grade(with a tall hill behide the target) and his weight on the balls of his feet when he fired my 03A3 springfield

< Message edited by BamaD -- 1/12/2013 11:17:49 AM >

(in reply to jlf1961)
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