RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election?

RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/6/2013 9:17:30 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: muhly22222 Besides, there really wasn't a change in the government at all. The President stayed the same, the Senate kept basically the same composition, and so did the House. It's not like Republicans were completely blown away at the ballots. No one said they were, least of all me. These types of laws are aimed at women. Contraception, abortion, social issues.... A 12 point win from women isnt something to be ignored. Many issues played into that difference, abortions and contraception being two major ones.

SadistDave -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 12:50:07 AM)
You're looking at women in general. Republicans don't give a shit about women who voted for the other guy any more than Democrats care about women who voted for the other guy. They're doing what they think the women who voted Republican want. Crying about Republicans voting for Republican issues on the Republican platform is pretty silly... I'm sure there are some Republican women who want all the freebies liberal women want. If they voted Republican though, then Republicans are right to believe that it's not as important as traditionally Democratic issues to them because if it was just a chick thing then all the women who voted Republican would have voted Democrat to get the taxpayer subsidized hand-outs... -SD-

tazzygirl -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 2:43:01 AM)
While certainly amplified in this gendered political environment, targeting women voters was not unique to the 2012 presidential contest. According to the Center for American Women and Politics at Rutgers University, women voters in the United States have both outnumbered and out-voted men since 1980. Their ability to shift electoral outcomes has caused parties, candidates, and strategists alike to recognize the value of women’s votes. In 2012, women made up 53% of voters on Election Day, casting over 64 million votes in the presidential race. As they have since 1980, women also voted differently than men, resulting in a gender gap in vote choice. This year, women were 10 percentage points more likely to vote for Barack Obama than were men. In fact, if women did not vote in this election, Mitt Romney would have won by 8 percentage points. The 10-point gender gap of this cycle ranks as the second largest gap we have seen since its emergence in 1980. Unmarried women undoubtedly drove much of this gap in 2012, as 67 percent of them voted for Obama and only 31 percent voted for Romney. Married women, on the other hand, were more likely to vote for Romney (53 percent) than Obama (46 percent). Both men and women of color voted overwhelmingly for Obama, but gender gaps remained whereby women were between 9 and 11 percentage points more likely than men to vote for the Democratic candidate. Similarly, while majorities of both white men and women voted for Romney, white women were 6 percentage points less likely to vote for the Republican candidate than white men. The persistence of the gender gap in presidential vote choice demonstrates the significance of women voters’ preferences in today’s election results. http://www.e-ir.info/2012/11/20/womens-voices-and-womens-votes-gender-and-the-2012-u-s-presidential-election/ You seem to want to make this a GOP vs Dem issue. Its not.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 4:23:14 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl quote: ORIGINAL: muhly22222 Besides, there really wasn't a change in the government at all. The President stayed the same, the Senate kept basically the same composition, and so did the House. It's not like Republicans were completely blown away at the ballots. No one said they were, least of all me. These types of laws are aimed at women. Contraception, abortion, social issues.... A 12 point win from women isnt something to be ignored. Many issues played into that difference, abortions and contraception being two major ones. Whether it was true or manufactured, the incessant beating of the "Republican War on Women" drum probably didn't have any effect, right? It's just that Democrats have women's best interests at heart, right? I'm sure there was no pandering at all. [8\|]

tazzygirl -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 6:43:47 AM)
That wasnt just a drum... that was the whole drum line. If you arent familiar with the movie.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eDXVgqmaYJk [:D]

Owner59 -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 7:56:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SadistDave I would argue that it's the Democrats who do not understand what happened during the last election. Maobama won the election by a pretty slim margin. The popular vote was actually pretty close. He only won by 3 1/2 percent of the popular vote. It was the EC votes that swept him into office. This mandate nonsense the Democrats are always talking does not exist. Republicans are doing their job. Like any politician on either side of the aisle, they are following the mandate of their constituents, and their constituents represent 47% of the popular vote from the last election. It's a little foolish and disingenuous to keep pretending that the Republicans should just roll over and do what the Democrats want. When the situation has been reversed in the past did you ever write your Democratic Congressmen and tell them quote: "Oh, and you know all that stuff you campaigned on that got you into office? You should forget all that and march in lockstep with those guys who won. We all need to follow their vision of the future from now on" I bet you never did... -SD- We don`t recall the gop being humbled by LOSING the popular vote in 2000....... You were saying?

JeffBC -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 8:23:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DaNewAgeViking It is fashionable to accuse the Dems of being as bad as the Radicals, but when you look closely, they are simply clinging desperately to what has been gained over the last one hundred and fifty years, trying to prevent all our social institutions from being utterly trashed. As they work their corporatist agenda continuing to skew our economy towards an ever greater divide between the rich and the poor and create a two class nation. Dude... I'm sorry. But "sticking up for women's rights" while they sell us all into slavery just isn't going to work for me. NOBODY is going to have any rights but the wealthy if this continues. quote: They have had to become hard core in the process, to the detriment of their reputation. The critical thing to remember is that the Dems are at least trying to solve our problems of trade, jobs, economics, education, etc. In your mind. In my mind they are simply the pig with nicer lipstick on doing the exact same thing as the republicans. Just as one example, you understand that there is at this point NO question whatsoever about massive and endemic fraud in the banking industry yet there have been zero prosecutions. I would love it if the truth were actually becoming fashionable... particularly among the liberals.

Owner59 -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 8:27:58 AM)
Please then ....tell us liberals.......the twuth....[8\|]

JeffBC -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 8:28:25 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri Whether it was true or manufactured, the incessant beating of the "Republican War on Women" drum probably didn't have any effect, right? It's just that Democrats have women's best interests at heart, right? I'm sure there was no pandering at all. [8\|] We can debate whether it is a "war on women" or not to seek to restrict access to health care and reduce the current set of rights regarding abortion. But surely you cannot be saying that there isn't a MARKED difference between the two parties on these issues and that most women see it as hostile. Further, when you start getting nationwide concerted efforts operating at all levels of government I have to think the word "war" isn't all that far off. Oh.. and let's not even get started on the "50 shades of rape" debacle.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:14:43 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JeffBC quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri Whether it was true or manufactured, the incessant beating of the "Republican War on Women" drum probably didn't have any effect, right? It's just that Democrats have women's best interests at heart, right? I'm sure there was no pandering at all. [8\|] We can debate whether it is a "war on women" or not to seek to restrict access to health care and reduce the current set of rights regarding abortion. But surely you cannot be saying that there isn't a MARKED difference between the two parties on these issues and that most women see it as hostile. Further, when you start getting nationwide concerted efforts operating at all levels of government I have to think the word "war" isn't all that far off. Oh.. and let's not even get started on the "50 shades of rape" debacle. There have been plenty of morons on the Right saying stupid things about rape. I wouldn't chalk it up to that being specifically as a way to reduce the rights of women. If it's going to be claimed that there is a "war on women," there damn sure better be active and purposeful statements about it. Mistakenly not seeing how something could seriously limit a woman's rights certainly isn't part of the "war." Without the incessant message being pounded out, I seriously doubt women would have gotten as jaded as they did. I'm not saying they wouldn't have or that none would have, but, seriously, the Liberals pounding that message home worked like a charm.

RacerJim -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:18:27 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl A group of House Republicans said Tuesday that a bill to fund the federal government should include provisions targeting the contraception mandate in President Obama's healthcare law. GOP lawmakers reintroduced a bill Tuesday to repeal the contraception mandate. They also pressed their party's leaders to roll back the provision as part of a continuing resolution later this month to keep the federal government operating. "This attack on religious freedom demands immediate congressional action," the 14 lawmakers wrote. "Nothing short of a full exemption for both nonprofit and for-profit entities will satisfy the demands of the Constitution and common sense." The continuing resolution that House appropriators released Monday would not cut off funding for the Affordable Care Act, despite years of conservative pressure to defund the healthcare law. But Tuesday's letter, led by Rep. Diane Black (R-Tenn.), indicates that fights over the health law could still roil the funding debate. Black declined to say whether she would vote against the continuing resolution if it does not include provisions aimed at rolling back the contraception mandate. "Congress cannot ignore the relentless assault on the First Amendment right to religious freedom, and must act before the (Affordable Care Act) provisions are fully enacted in August of this year," the lawmakers wrote to GOP leaders and appropriators in both chambers. http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch/abortion/286217-gop-lawmakers-say-spending-bill-should-target-contraception-mandate#ixzz2MlNDfeyU Considering how the last election was decided .... WTF? I am really confused as to what is going through some of their minds. The GOP understood the last election the same way the Dems understood the previous election.

GoddessManko -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:21:32 AM)
I have a better question: when will the Republican party move into the 21st century?" Oh, that's right, 70 is YOUNG for Congress. We have a bunch of geriatric conservatives trying to tell a young population what to do. Part of the problem? eats the vanilla ice cream next to my name What do you guys think of the Republicans coting NO to giving jobs to 9/11 responders? How dare Obama! Lol..."we will never forget". Bless their bleeding hearts :-)

tazzygirl -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:22:33 AM)
Wow, really? I voted for Bush his second term. And, yet, Im a Dem. Same thing happened this time, conservative women voted for Obama. Crossing party lines isnt that hard. Now, when is the GOP machine going to wake up and realize what most of the voters already know.

JeffBC -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:26:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri Without the incessant message being pounded out, I seriously doubt women would have gotten as jaded as they did. I'm not saying they wouldn't have or that none would have, but, seriously, the Liberals pounding that message home worked like a charm. Perhaps. Remember I'm a liberal. I rejected the "war on women" jargon initially because I'm getting sick and tired of using the word "war" to describe everything in the god damned world and I'm also getting more than a little suspicious of feminism. Then I read up on what was being done. It wasn't the liberal messaging which convinced me. That actually worked against convincing me. What convinced me was the actual truth of what was going on.

tazzygirl -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 10:33:48 AM)
Thank you Jeff. DS, women arent as stupid as you seem to wish we were. I dont go on and on about wars on ____.. I make allowances and look for the truth. Lucy and kalik and a few other women on these threads are the same way. We call bullshit when we see it, on both parties. When I see state after state attempting to override a SC decision, when I see businesses using RELIGION as an excuse to treat women differently then men. When I see a political party using every excuse in the book to keep women "barefoot and pregnant", even going so far as to actually say that rape prevents pregnancy... I see a war. These were not isolated incidents but wide spread. Vulgar attempts to control women based upon their own morality. And, before someone can come along and say the liberal agenda is to force "Christians" to accept something they find abhorrent, liberals have made no attempts to force women to have abortions, to force them to take contraceptives, to force anyone to agree that abortions are morally acceptable. When that happens, then you can say liberals are forcing their own morality onto everyone else.

DesideriScuri -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 11:29:24 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Thank you Jeff. DS, women arent as stupid as you seem to wish we were. I dont go on and on about wars on ____.. I make allowances and look for the truth. Lucy and kalik and a few other women on these threads are the same way. We call bullshit when we see it, on both parties. When I see state after state attempting to override a SC decision, when I see businesses using RELIGION as an excuse to treat women differently then men. When I see a political party using every excuse in the book to keep women "barefoot and pregnant", even going so far as to actually say that rape prevents pregnancy... I see a war. These were not isolated incidents but wide spread. Vulgar attempts to control women based upon their own morality. Fuck that. "Control women." That's the bullshit about it. So, the abortion debate is about reducing a woman's choice? Or, is it about supporting the growing life within her womb? You say it's the former, I say the latter. We agree that birth control medications should be covered for non birth control uses. We disagree that birth control for birth control purposes should be covered. I don't think it's anyone's damn business what insurance benefits a business is offering. You see an idiot who spouts anatomical nonsense as one party's bent against women, while I see an idiot spouting anatomical nonsense because he's an idiot. quote: And, before someone can come along and say the liberal agenda is to force "Christians" to accept something they find abhorrent, liberals have made no attempts to force women to have abortions, to force them to take contraceptives, to force anyone to agree that abortions are morally acceptable. When that happens, then you can say liberals are forcing their own morality onto everyone else. Oh, stop that. Forcing a Christian organization to provide birth control (solely for birth control reasons), when it is against its belief system, is the Liberals forcing their morality. So, it's morality forcing, even if it's but one facet.

Hillwilliam -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 11:32:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: RacerJim quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl A group of House Republicans said Tuesday that a bill to fund the federal government should include provisions targeting the contraception mandate in President Obama's healthcare law. GOP lawmakers reintroduced a bill Tuesday to repeal the contraception mandate. They also pressed their party's leaders to roll back the provision as part of a continuing resolution later this month to keep the federal government operating. "This attack on religious freedom demands immediate congressional action," the 14 lawmakers wrote. "Nothing short of a full exemption for both nonprofit and for-profit entities will satisfy the demands of the Constitution and common sense." The continuing resolution that House appropriators released Monday would not cut off funding for the Affordable Care Act, despite years of conservative pressure to defund the healthcare law. But Tuesday's letter, led by Rep. Diane Black (R-Tenn.), indicates that fights over the health law could still roil the funding debate. Black declined to say whether she would vote against the continuing resolution if it does not include provisions aimed at rolling back the contraception mandate. "Congress cannot ignore the relentless assault on the First Amendment right to religious freedom, and must act before the (Affordable Care Act) provisions are fully enacted in August of this year," the lawmakers wrote to GOP leaders and appropriators in both chambers. http://thehill.com/blogs/healthwatch/abortion/286217-gop-lawmakers-say-spending-bill-should-target-contraception-mandate#ixzz2MlNDfeyU Considering how the last election was decided .... WTF? I am really confused as to what is going through some of their minds. The GOP understood the last election the same way the Dems understood the previous election. Yo, Jimbo. The Dems uhhhhhhhh. Well, they WON the previous election too. Yaknow that's why the guy was REelected.[8\|]

mnottertail -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 12:22:23 PM)
quote: Oh, stop that. Forcing a Christian organization to provide birth control (solely for birth control reasons), when it is against its belief system, is the Liberals forcing their morality. So, it's morality forcing, even if it's but one facet. That is not the situation, never has been the situation, and never will be the situation, Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof. It in no way prohibit the exercise of religious belief, don't eat the goddamn pill; feeble-minded christians if you believe you should not, nor does it establish a religion.

DomYngBlk -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 12:25:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: muhly22222 I don't know what to take away from the election, honestly. It's not like either of the presidential candidates had a sparkling new vision or was/is a transformative personality. A lot of people who voted didn't vote because they were in love with either candidate, they voted the way they did because they viewed that candidate as the lesser of two evils. Besides, there really wasn't a change in the government at all. The President stayed the same, the Senate kept basically the same composition, and so did the House. It's not like Republicans were completely blown away at the ballots. There are very few elections in American history that stand out as being remarkable. 1800, the first time an opposition party triumphed (and the world didn't end!); 1828, the onset of the Jacksonian era; 1860, Lincoln's election as an anti-slavery candidate; 1932, the beginning of the New Deal...and that's probably it. You could make an argument for JFK or Reagan's elections coming to that level, if you like, but JFK didn't have a chance to make the changes that he could have made, and Reagan's legacy is (in my opinion) still being determined. Lost seats in house and senate and didn't win back the presidency. I'd say that was an ass kicking.

DomYngBlk -> RE: Did the GOP really understand the last election? (3/7/2013 12:28:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: tazzygirl Thank you Jeff. DS, women arent as stupid as you seem to wish we were. I dont go on and on about wars on ____.. I make allowances and look for the truth. Lucy and kalik and a few other women on these threads are the same way. We call bullshit when we see it, on both parties. When I see state after state attempting to override a SC decision, when I see businesses using RELIGION as an excuse to treat women differently then men. When I see a political party using every excuse in the book to keep women "barefoot and pregnant", even going so far as to actually say that rape prevents pregnancy... I see a war. These were not isolated incidents but wide spread. Vulgar attempts to control women based upon their own morality. Fuck that. "Control women." That's the bullshit about it. So, the abortion debate is about reducing a woman's choice? Or, is it about supporting the growing life within her womb? You say it's the former, I say the latter. We agree that birth control medications should be covered for non birth control uses. We disagree that birth control for birth control purposes should be covered. I don't think it's anyone's damn business what insurance benefits a business is offering. You see an idiot who spouts anatomical nonsense as one party's bent against women, while I see an idiot spouting anatomical nonsense because he's an idiot. quote: And, before someone can come along and say the liberal agenda is to force "Christians" to accept something they find abhorrent, liberals have made no attempts to force women to have abortions, to force them to take contraceptives, to force anyone to agree that abortions are morally acceptable. When that happens, then you can say liberals are forcing their own morality onto everyone else. Oh, stop that. Forcing a Christian organization to provide birth control (solely for birth control reasons), when it is against its belief system, is the Liberals forcing their morality. So, it's morality forcing, even if it's but one facet. Plenty of "christians" in countries with one payer systems that are quite happy to pay taxes so everyone has equal access to health care. what makes "christians" here so special? More pure perhaps?

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