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[Poll]

Does being religious mean that you are:

More moral than the non-religious

13% (8)

As moral as the non-religious

36% (22)

Less moral than the non-religious

18% (11)

chose none of the above as I refuse to voice an opinion yet still vote

31% (19)

Total Votes : 60

(last vote on : 5/14/2014 8:05:37 PM)
(Poll will run till: -- )

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RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 3:46:08 PM

Yachtie

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Being Christian, one should have an idea of the moral compass I should operate by. If one is Muslim I too should have an idea of the moral compass they should operate by. When it comes to an Atheist, I really have no idea at all.

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(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 21

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 3:50:16 PM

JeffBC

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FunCouple5280
I agree some of this is humanity, but you can also see that there is a trend in certain elements of human behavior to belong to a religion. Many who like that certitude and so forth love the trappings of what religion brings to the table.

Let's restate that a bit. Almost all humans are pretty submissive. Religions hand out dogma by the bucket full which panders neatly to peoples' need to be told what to do. I just think that religion is one tool among zillions for accomplishing that. They WANT to be told what to do and how to think and what is right & wrong. It's easy to sell people on stuff they want.

And religion with it convenient beliefs make a potent force against reason and convenient smoke screen for hiding that immoral behavior.
Sure it does. But obviously I am WAY more cynical than you *laughs* because I can see about 2 jillion other very convenient smoke screens. We see them all the time on these very boards. What I don't understand is why you insist on seeing religion as anything other than another control mechanism. It's exactly as good/evil as all the others. Before you get too down on religion let's remember that very recently the US killed upwards of 200,000 people at a cost of a few trillion dollars for no apparent reason. The "smoke screen" there was first "weapons of mass destruction" then it was "freeing them from an oppressive regime". 200,000 deaths is not something to be sneezed at. We're discussing 4% of the holocaust that the US accomplished almost as an afterthought. Yet no religion was required to pull that off. Hell, we're not even sorry about it after the fact.

As I alluded to in the post that I know you cannot prove or disprove the existence of god, I believe atheism requires just as much faith as the believer.
I find that an odd argument and I always have but it's a popular one and not relevant to this thread so...

I would question it as if you don't have the certitude/faith, wouldn't you question killing yourself for a greater purpose a lot more than the person who doesn't possess any doubt?. IE, you would want to know damn sure what you are doing is worth it.
Incorrect. I wouldn't do either because I'm not submissive. Anyone else trying to convince me to lay down my life is going to need to actually convince me to my own satisfaction that their cause is worth that. Most of humanity will rally around the banner simply because it's got pretty colors.

quote:

Without that reinforcement of bad ideology one is more likely to adapt to get along.

True... but why you single out "religion" as if it's somehow different than "politics" is the part I don't get.

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Post #: 22

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 3:50:50 PM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
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Interesting poll.

Unfortunately, I was unable to vote as I believe in assessing others on the basis of the individual, rather than by category.

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Post #: 23

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 4:25:58 PM

DomKen

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Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

Being Christian, one should have an idea of the moral compass I should operate by. If one is Muslim I too should have an idea of the moral compass they should operate by. When it comes to an Atheist, I really have no idea at all.

Do no harm has always worked pretty well for me.

(in reply to Yachtie)

Post #: 24

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 4:38:56 PM

cordeliasub

Posts: 528
Joined: 11/4/2012
Status: offline

I would like to think that someone who claims adherence to a faith that has clear moral guidelines is more moral. Sadly, I have met (and gone to church with) more than a few people for whom it apparently makes no difference. Sadly, even in my own life I have gone through periods where my life and my faith did not line up.

(in reply to DomKen)

Post #: 25

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 5:08:24 PM

Charles6682

Posts: 1820
Joined: 10/1/2007
From: Saint Pete,FL
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I consider myself spiritual,non-religous.I also believe in a God and a Goddess.I have just as much "morals" as anyone who claims they are "religious".My spirituality plays an very important role in my life.

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Post #: 26

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 5:33:37 PM

FunCouple5280

Posts: 559
Joined: 10/30/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffBC

True... but why you single out "religion" as if it's somehow different than "politics" is the part I don't get.

Its not. But for the sake of discussion you have to narrow it down. There are often infinite variations of an topic. One thing at a time.

(in reply to JeffBC)

Post #: 27

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 5:36:52 PM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

Being Christian, one should have an idea of the moral compass I should operate by. If one is Muslim I too should have an idea of the moral compass they should operate by. When it comes to an Atheist, I really have no idea at all.

Does this mean you can only recognise a person for being good, decent and principled etc IF they have a religious allegiance to validate them? Kinda like (the dreaded) references?

Cos right now, the Australian government is putting the Catholic Church in particular under a looooong overdo microscope for the past treatment of children under their care, and of the aligned paedophile criminals (priests) doing the "caring". For too long, the real crime as far as the church was concerned was of the negative publicity of said activity.

The children are fanciful, liars even, but we'll simply transfer priest 'X' elsewhere, kinda morality....

Focus.

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(in reply to Yachtie)

Post #: 28

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 5:50:39 PM

Kirata

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From: USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

Being Christian, one should have an idea of the moral compass I should operate by. If one is Muslim I too should have an idea of the moral compass they should operate by. When it comes to an Atheist, I really have no idea at all.

Does this mean you can only recognise a person for being good, decent and principled etc IF they have a religious allegiance to validate them?

I seriously doubt that a reasonable person familiar with the English language could come to the conclusion that he said anything of the kind. But it's nice to see somebody trying to liven the thread up a bit.

K.

(in reply to Focus50)

Post #: 29

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 5:54:29 PM

dcnovice

Posts: 37282
Joined: 8/2/2006
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quote:

As I see it, sitting in a church doesn't make you moral, just like sitting in a garage doesn't make you a car.

If one's church is truly no more engaging than a garage, it might be time to consider exploring options.

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it's never enough to keep up.

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(in reply to DesideriScuri)

Post #: 30

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 6:01:42 PM

FrostedFlake

Posts: 3084
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From: Centralia, Washington
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The trouble with believing in a god is, you have to figure out what it wants. If god wants you to mind your neighbors business, as it seems is always so, then the religious folks become not just persistently annoying but actually quite dangerous. They cannot be talked out of their nonsense because they make decisions based on imaginary things. It only takes one of them swinging a stick to make his point plain to start no end of trouble.

What does 'holy' mean?

I'm looking at YOU, Marini.

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Post #: 31

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 6:15:15 PM

Marini

Posts: 3629
Joined: 2/14/2010
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quote:

I'm looking at YOU, Marini.

Why are you looking at ME?
nooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Actually, you can look all you like.
Just don't chase me with a stick.

< Message edited by Marini -- 4/3/2013 7:12:01 PM >

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As always, To EACH their Own.
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Post #: 32

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 8:25:41 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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Those who believe in something, will have a foundation and framework to support themselves on when their values are tested.

Those who believe in nothing, will not.

Easy question. The only bone of contention will be for those who don't like the word used to describe such belief.

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Post #: 33

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 8:40:57 PM

DomKen

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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Those who believe in something, will have a foundation and framework to support themselves on when their values are tested.

Those who believe in nothing, will not.

Easy question. The only bone of contention will be for those who don't like the word used to describe such belief.

nonsense.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 34

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 8:44:19 PM

TheHeretic

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From: California, USA
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And it's safe to assume that some will get pissy about it.

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If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 35

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 8:59:20 PM

Marini

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quote:

Those who believe in something, will have a foundation and framework to support themselves on when their values are tested.

I can't speak for non-believers, I don't know what they have for a foundation or framework to support themselves when their values are tested.
It's not for me to say, maybe they do very well.

But for me, being a Believer gives me a foundation, a framework, hope and the strength to deal with whatever comes my way.

< Message edited by Marini -- 4/3/2013 9:01:07 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 36

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 9:00:44 PM

Focus50

Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: Focus50
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yachtie

Being Christian, one should have an idea of the moral compass I should operate by. If one is Muslim I too should have an idea of the moral compass they should operate by. When it comes to an Atheist, I really have no idea at all.

Does this mean you can only recognise a person for being good, decent and principled etc IF they have a religious allegiance to validate them?

I seriously doubt that a reasonable person familiar with the English language could come to the conclusion that he said anything of the kind. But it's nice to see somebody trying to liven the thread up a bit.

Because..... he's that rarest of species who usually supports your skewed pro-gun views?

See, I asked a question as part of a *discussion* - a concept you perpetuate as alien to you. Whether or not I likely know his answer is irrelevant.

And hell, this isn't even a gun thread, so shoo and let the grownups discuss...! That or surprise us all with a personal opinon ON TOPIC of your own.

(just kidding there, natch)

Errrm, could you at least manage to check a poll box?

Focus.

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(in reply to Kirata)

Post #: 37

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 9:09:34 PM

TheHeretic

Posts: 19100
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From: California, USA
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You don't have to believe in God, or gods, to believe in something, Mari.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.

(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 38

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 9:12:52 PM

Marini

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Joined: 2/14/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

You don't have to believe in God, or gods, to believe in something, Mari.

Of course you can believe in "anything", I totally agree.
There are people that worship statues, the list is endless!

< Message edited by Marini -- 4/3/2013 9:25:20 PM >

_____________________________

As always, To EACH their Own.
"And as we let our own light shine, we unconsciously give other people permission to do the same. "
Nelson Mandela
Life-long Democrat, not happy at all with Democratic Party.
NOT a Republican/Moderate and free agent

(in reply to TheHeretic)

Post #: 39

RE: Does being religious mean that you are: - 4/3/2013 9:50:47 PM

FrostedFlake

Posts: 3084
Joined: 3/4/2009
From: Centralia, Washington
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marini

quote:

I'm looking at YOU, Marini.

Why are you looking at ME?
nooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Actually, you can look all you like.
Just don't chase me with a stick.

She saw that. I saw her see it. You did too. But she didn't say what holy means. I don't think she knows.

quote:

Marini
quote:

Heretic (fragment)
Those who believe in something, will have a foundation and framework to support themselves on when their values are tested.

I can't speak for non-believers, I don't know what they have for a foundation or framework to support themselves when their values are tested.
It's not for me to say, maybe they do very well.

But for me, being a Believer gives me a foundation, a framework, hope and the strength to deal with whatever comes my way.

I think being a believer gives you a crutch, a cage, an excuse and someone to pass the buck to when you don't have a satisfying answer to an important question.

Like, what does 'Holy' mean?

To put that another way... ...what does 'Religion' mean?

This should be easy. It is after all the product you are selling.

And let's not any of us suppose I'm picking on Marini. Feel free to step up and hold forth.

_____________________________

Frosted Flake
simul justus et peccator
Einen Liebhaber, und halten Sie die Schraube

"... evil (and hilarious) !!" Hlen5

(in reply to Marini)

Post #: 40

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