RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... )

RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (Full Version)

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Phydeaux -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 4:41:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1 FR~ It is also interesting as a side-issue, those countries that are less religion-centric, socially more open, and teach some form of sex education at younger ages, have lower teen pregnancies and also lower rape crimes. The two highest-rated countries where religion clouds sex education into obscurity and general thinking appear to want abstinance observed and sex swept under the carpet are....... TADA!!! India and the US. And guess who is #1, top of the list with rape crimes? The US of A no less. From the site "...This super power is at the first position in the race of rapes. Males are majorly the rapist holding a proportion of 99%. Out of all the victims, 91% are females while 9% are males. Out of all, only 16% of the total cases are reported. Outdoor rape is not common in USA rather most of the rape cases takes place inside homes. Girls in the villages are at risk more than those living in populated cities. Almost the quarter of the college girls are reported to be the raped ones mostly at the age of 14" Source: http://listtoptens.com/top-10-countries-with-highest-rape-crime/ Thailand, a very sexual country where just about anything goes, including child sex, is only 10th. Sweden, one of the most sexually liberal of first-world countries comes a lowly 7th. Canada comes in at #5. The UK rolls in at #3. In the interest of fairness - there are known to be widespread methodology problems with this survey. For example, countries that don't report rapes - show up as having low incidences of rapes. Could just be they don't report them.

eulero83 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 5:22:37 PM)
In the industrialized countries they are reported as much as in the usa.

Phydeaux -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 7:18:54 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: eulero83 In the industrialized countries they are reported as much as in the usa. Really? And you know that... how?

eulero83 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 8:38:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: eulero83 In the industrialized countries they are reported as much as in the usa. Really? And you know that... how? As you are implying a negative thing about other countries you should be the one to proove it. Can you demostrate that in europeans countries or canada rapes are treated in a different way?

Phydeaux -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 11:30:04 PM)
Sorry You made the unsupported assertion. You prove it. While u r at it dig up proof for China and Japan since you said k industrialized countries. #2 probably qualify. Good luck.

GotSteel -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/3/2014 11:54:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri I will call it bullshit, because it is. 1. Only in your fantasy land. Just because something makes sense in your head doesn't mean it actually works that way in reality. That's why every actual method of birth control is tested instead of just assumed. 2. There are more effective methods of birth control than condoms, I'll need to get on an actual computer to bring that up but I remember at least one that's tested 100% 3. It's possible to stack multiple forms of birth control to get solutions which have tested 100%

DesideriScuri -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 3:23:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen And if I am using condoms as my BC method and fail to wear one.... If you fail to wear one, you aren't using condoms as your method of birth control, now are you?

DesideriScuri -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 3:29:37 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri I will call it bullshit, because it is. 1. Only in your fantasy land. Just because something makes sense in your head doesn't mean it actually works that way in reality. That's why every actual method of birth control is tested instead of just assumed. 2. There are more effective methods of birth control than condoms, I'll need to get on an actual computer to bring that up but I remember at least one that's tested 100% 3. It's possible to stack multiple forms of birth control to get solutions which have tested 100% 1. Right. My head tells me that not having sex will lead to fewer pregnancies than two people (of opposite genders who both have the actual potential to be fertile) having sex, regardless of their chosen use of birth control. 2. And, your point is...? 3. That would depend on how you round those results. Typically, if you have a 1 in 100 chance for condoms and 1 in 100 chance for the pill (both numbers are made up and any resemblance to the true odds are purely chance), you would multiply them to get odds of 1 in 10,000 chance, or 0.99% risk of pregnancy. While that is extremely low, that's not necessarily 100%.

jlf1961 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 3:57:50 AM)
Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Seriously, the debate about teaching abstinence only in sex ed has been going on for years. I think in addition to abstinence, other forms of birth control should be taught. Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control?

eulero83 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 4:13:12 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: GotSteel quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri I will call it bullshit, because it is. 1. Only in your fantasy land. Just because something makes sense in your head doesn't mean it actually works that way in reality. That's why every actual method of birth control is tested instead of just assumed. 2. There are more effective methods of birth control than condoms, I'll need to get on an actual computer to bring that up but I remember at least one that's tested 100% 3. It's possible to stack multiple forms of birth control to get solutions which have tested 100% 1. Right. My head tells me that not having sex will lead to fewer pregnancies than two people (of opposite genders who both have the actual potential to be fertile) having sex, regardless of their chosen use of birth control. 2. And, your point is...? 3. That would depend on how you round those results. Typically, if you have a 1 in 100 chance for condoms and 1 in 100 chance for the pill (both numbers are made up and any resemblance to the true odds are purely chance), you would multiply them to get odds of 1 in 10,000 chance, or 0.99% risk of pregnancy. While that is extremely low, that's not necessarily 100%. 2. that you can have a satisfying sexual life without rising a pregnancy, it looks pretty clear to me. 3. odds of 1 in 10,000 is the same to die in a car crash but I think you drive notwithstanding this, and by the way 1 out of 10,000 is 0.01% ormonal contraceptive have a pregnancy risk of 0.02%. quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen And if I am using condoms as my BC method and fail to wear one.... If you fail to wear one, you aren't using condoms as your method of birth control, now are you? actually yes, statistics on faliure consider pregnancies from couples that choose that method and go on with their sex life than pregnancies are counted, so if they take the chances when having sex in a car with condoms at home than it is part f their yearly tipical use.

DomKen -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 4:15:47 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri quote: ORIGINAL: DomKen And if I am using condoms as my BC method and fail to wear one.... If you fail to wear one, you aren't using condoms as your method of birth control, now are you? Yes, just as much as a girl who says abstinence is her method and still gets pregnant.

MsMJAY -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 4:45:31 AM)
What you see as animosity is really frustration on the part of some of us. This whole thing about abstinence only working and "just don't have sex" is still being peddled where I live. The STD and pregnancy rate continues to be the highest in the country and the powers that be have the same solution."Teach abstinence." There are honestly a lot of grown ass overly religious idiots who want kids to get pregnant and STDs so they can suffer for disobeying God. That's why they this teach bullshit abstinence only. That's why these bullshit programs give kids bullshit false information regarding the use and effectiveness of contraceptives. They WANT kids to get pregnant and STD's. (after all they are going against God's will.) And don't go spreading this chastity belt solution. Because if they could legally get away with it, some of these people would do it. quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Seriously, the debate about teaching abstinence only in sex ed has been going on for years. I think in addition to abstinence, other forms of birth control should be taught. Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control?

Phydeaux -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 11:23:05 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: MsMJAY What you see as animosity is really frustration on the part of some of us. This whole thing about abstinence only working and "just don't have sex" is still being peddled where I live. The STD and pregnancy rate continues to be the highest in the country and the powers that be have the same solution."Teach abstinence." There are honestly a lot of grown ass overly religious idiots who want kids to get pregnant and STDs so they can suffer for disobeying God. That's why they this teach bullshit abstinence only. That's why these bullshit programs give kids bullshit false information regarding the use and effectiveness of contraceptives. They WANT kids to get pregnant and STD's. (after all they are going against God's will.) And don't go spreading this chastity belt solution. Because if they could legally get away with it, some of these people would do it. quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Seriously, the debate about teaching abstinence only in sex ed has been going on for years. I think in addition to abstinence, other forms of birth control should be taught. Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control? Utter bullshit to say people want other people to get STD's and get pregnant. Reducing to the absurd: Lets think about this. KKK members want more black babies. Do you see an epic logic fail here? In reality, those opposed to your position value things differently than you do. That doesn't mean they want women, minorities to have more children - gets STDS etc. And it adds nothing to the discussion to make those kinds of accusations.

eulero83 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 12:01:34 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: MsMJAY What you see as animosity is really frustration on the part of some of us. This whole thing about abstinence only working and "just don't have sex" is still being peddled where I live. The STD and pregnancy rate continues to be the highest in the country and the powers that be have the same solution."Teach abstinence." There are honestly a lot of grown ass overly religious idiots who want kids to get pregnant and STDs so they can suffer for disobeying God. That's why they this teach bullshit abstinence only. That's why these bullshit programs give kids bullshit false information regarding the use and effectiveness of contraceptives. They WANT kids to get pregnant and STD's. (after all they are going against God's will.) And don't go spreading this chastity belt solution. Because if they could legally get away with it, some of these people would do it. quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Seriously, the debate about teaching abstinence only in sex ed has been going on for years. I think in addition to abstinence, other forms of birth control should be taught. Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control? Utter bullshit to say people want other people to get STD's and get pregnant. Reducing to the absurd: Lets think about this. KKK members want more black babies. Do you see an epic logic fail here? In reality, those opposed to your position value things differently than you do. That doesn't mean they want women, minorities to have more children - gets STDS etc. And it adds nothing to the discussion to make those kinds of accusations. I don't know how you could understand this from what she wrote... I understand there are people, some of which occupy power offices who think: "or you do my way or you deserved whatever bad happens to you"... what was the reason to put in the middle minorities?

Lucylastic -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 12:17:51 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control? how bout we teach boys to use condoms and chastity belts or teach them that rape is not acceptable or that it is THEIR responsibility for their own genes and what comes of them As well To only prohibit one gender in a two gender issue is really pathetic.

MsMJAY -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 1:32:56 PM)
You have no idea what you are talking about. I don't know how things work wherever you are from. I know that here, people say this. Preachers preach it. Religious people believe it. I am not telling you what I think. I am a member of an Evangelical, Christian fundamentalist church. I know what they say because I hear them say it. "She doesn't need birth control. If she doesn't want to get pregnant she should just keep her legs closed." "You don't need to teach them anything. Maybe if enough of them get diseases they will learn to stop having sex." "So you think we should just let them have sex and just remove all the consequences from it?" "If you give them birth control they will just think what their doing is ok. They need to learn obey God or learn to accept His judgment." Every single one of these quotes have been said to me. There are people who want others to suffer the hardships of pregnancy or STDs if they choose to have sex. There is an Obstetrician right here where I live who refuses to give single mothers any kind of pain medicine when they are in labor because he thinks they need to suffer through natural labor to learn a lesson about getting pregnant without a husband. He proudly says this crap and a lot of parents in this area will deliberately take their daughters to him for that reason. (the failure is that some of them have taken their daughters to him 2 or 3 times.) I am not making accusations. I am stating facts. AND PS- The KKK do want more black babies. Who else are they gonna use to fill up those prisons for profits? quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: MsMJAY What you see as animosity is really frustration on the part of some of us. This whole thing about abstinence only working and "just don't have sex" is still being peddled where I live. The STD and pregnancy rate continues to be the highest in the country and the powers that be have the same solution."Teach abstinence." There are honestly a lot of grown ass overly religious idiots who want kids to get pregnant and STDs so they can suffer for disobeying God. That's why they this teach bullshit abstinence only. That's why these bullshit programs give kids bullshit false information regarding the use and effectiveness of contraceptives. They WANT kids to get pregnant and STD's. (after all they are going against God's will.) And don't go spreading this chastity belt solution. Because if they could legally get away with it, some of these people would do it. quote: ORIGINAL: jlf1961 Might I suggest chastity belts for teen age girls? Seriously, the debate about teaching abstinence only in sex ed has been going on for years. I think in addition to abstinence, other forms of birth control should be taught. Lastly, I would have expected the animosity between posters in a politics thread, but in birth control? Utter bullshit to say people want other people to get STD's and get pregnant. Reducing to the absurd: Lets think about this. KKK members want more black babies. Do you see an epic logic fail here? In reality, those opposed to your position value things differently than you do. That doesn't mean they want women, minorities to have more children - gets STDS etc. And it adds nothing to the discussion to make those kinds of accusations.

GotSteel -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 2:18:18 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri If you fail to wear one, you aren't using condoms as your method of birth control, now are you? face palm It's like I'm talking to the guy from Memento, do you really not remember any of the last 20 pages of the thread where you've been surrounded by people telling you yes that completely counts over and over?

GotSteel -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 3:51:13 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri If you fail to wear one, you aren't using condoms as your method of birth control, now are you? Condoms are tested by their manufacturers and the FDA assuring that they're at least 99.6% effective. http://www.fda.gov/ICECI/ComplianceManuals/CompliancePolicyGuidanceManual/ucm073902.htm This of course is very different from ALL of the percentages you've talked about for condoms. Why is that, well predictably because humans are involved.

Phydeaux -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/4/2014 9:06:52 PM)
I think my only reply will be to highlight your RACIST post - as if conservatives are the KKK. quote: ORIGINAL: MsMJAY The KKK do want more black babies. Who else are they gonna use to fill up those prisons for profits?

eulero83 -> RE: End ABSTINANCE "education"! ( Since it's not science and all... ) (1/5/2014 2:21:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux I think my only reply will be to highlight your RACIST post - as if conservatives are the KKK. quote: ORIGINAL: MsMJAY The KKK do want more black babies. Who else are they gonna use to fill up those prisons for profits? is this an attempt to hijack the thread on racial issues?

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