RE: What do the atheists get right?

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 6:38:45 AM

chatterbox24

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Hi Ben
anything interesting to add today?h

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 7:00:22 AM

BenevolentM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Hi Ben
anything interesting to add today?h

I have grown in my appreciation of the Holy Inquisition. Though the Church is cold and can be a predator at times, I side with the Church.

Few have ever come as close to the Truth as I have. It is my word that matters.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 7:31:44 AM

chatterbox24

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Thats great! Oh how I dislike the cold shoulder. Have to admire your loyalty, kudos to that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Hi Ben
anything interesting to add today?h

I have grown in my appreciation of the Holy Inquisition. Though the Church is cold and can be a predator at times, I side with the Church.

Few have ever come as close to the Truth as I have. It is my word that matters.

< Message edited by chatterbox24 -- 5/17/2014 7:34:53 AM >

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 7:39:39 AM

BenevolentM

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It has to do with what Saint Augustine said. Given two evils, we are called to discern which is from God and ultimately for the good and which is not. That which is not of God is meant to perish. What good is knowledge that draws you away from God? The Heart of the Church is Good. What else do I need to know?

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 7:46:19 AM

chatterbox24

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I do believe that. Its really a matter of why one might need the knowledge, how it is used? In example if you use knowledge to be able to understand anothers position better. Is this acceptable? I just wondered your position on that?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

It has to do with what Saint Augustine said. Given two evils, we are called to discern which is from God and ultimately for the good and which is not. That which is not of God is meant to perish. What good is knowledge that draws you away from God? The Heart of the Church is Good. What else do I need to know?

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 7:55:26 AM

PeonForHer

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM
What else do I need to know?

Are you asking for a list?

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 8:01:23 AM

angelikaJ

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Hi Ben
anything interesting to add today?h

I have grown in my appreciation of the Holy Inquisition. Though the Church is cold and can be a predator at times, I side with the Church.

Few have ever come as close to the Truth as I have. It is my word that matters.

The politically, fear and ignorance driven inquisition, or was there another one?

The Church is made up of very infallible men who sometimes have huge egos.

Torture and murder were not part of what Christ taught and what he taught is what the church is supposed to be based upon.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 8:06:24 AM

chatterbox24

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I am under the impression the church does evolve, but I could be wrong. He would have to answer that.
I am curious too.

quote:

ORIGINAL: angelikaJ

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

Hi Ben
anything interesting to add today?h

I have grown in my appreciation of the Holy Inquisition. Though the Church is cold and can be a predator at times, I side with the Church.

Few have ever come as close to the Truth as I have. It is my word that matters.

The politically, fear and ignorance driven inquisition, or was there another one?

The Church is made up of very infallible men who sometimes have huge egos.

Torture and murder were not part of what Christ taught and what he taught is what the church is supposed to be based upon.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 8:06:46 AM

BenevolentM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

I do believe that. Its really a matter of why one might need the knowledge, how it is used? In example if you use knowledge to be able to understand anothers position better. Is this acceptable? I just wondered your position on that?

What you wrote reminds me of a woman who I once loved. She was a peacemaker and devoted much time and energy to it. Next to GotSteel she was a virgin. She was married the whole of her adult life. She was innocent. It is a thing to celebrate. Carnal knowledge is wicked.

Having said that the problem the religious face in particular the Protestants is that the atheists are right when they say that you cannot divorce the truth from the Truth. The devil speaks in half truths. Sometimes he claims something as his hoping that you will believe what the devil has to say and consider it his so that you will rebuke it and thereby rebuke not him, but God. The Protestants in particular have rebuked the truth and in so doing have rebuked the Truth.

What may be my gift to the world? A rude awakening concerning how much it got wrong, a vision of the state of its soul. It may be too much to take.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 8:18:48 AM

chatterbox24

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I am flattered thank you. I thought if you truly loved someone it never ended. Call me naive. If it does end it was never true.
Its pretty difficult sorting out half truths and full truths. I am afraid my skill is much to be desired at this point. I work on it though.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 8:44:24 AM

BenevolentM

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How many of the religious when they are called to face God hence the Truth will face the Truth with gnashing teeth?

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

I am flattered thank you. I thought if you truly loved someone it never ended. Call me naive. If it does end it was never true.

Sounds wiccan. Love is something you make happen, but sadly it takes two to tango. In the same way two people can fall out of love, one can fall out of love with God. He was untrue to her. She was a trophy which honored me. Success is what happened to him. He wanted to cash in while he was still young enough where money is enough to compensate for your age. He wanted all the blessings that prosperity had to offer and was willing to sacrifice the wife of his youth and family to do it. He was a fool. No one in her family had ever divorced. She would have remained at his side to the bitter end and in truth would have tolerated even him keeping his mistress. She was good. Apparently, he felt it was better not be a hypocrite and instead embrace his Sin fully.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 9:05:06 AM

BenevolentM

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We are called by Our Lord Jesus Christ to have a love that is as hard as nails, to follow His example. If you can fail to love your spouse, you can fail to love God.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 9:38:55 AM

chatterbox24

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What an interesting story. Was he really a bad person? Very strange. On one hand you havve someone chasing a worldly dream, and then in the right hand you have complete honesty. So what is this full truth or half truth?
I cant tell!

quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM

quote:

ORIGINAL: chatterbox24

I do believe that. Its really a matter of why one might need the knowledge, how it is used? In example if you use knowledge to be able to understand anothers position better. Is this acceptable? I just wondered your position on that?

What you wrote reminds me of a woman who I once loved. She was a peacemaker and devoted much time and energy to it. Next to GotSteel she was a virgin. She was married the whole of her adult life. She was innocent. It is a thing to celebrate. Carnal knowledge is wicked.

Having said that the problem the religious face in particular the Protestants is that the atheists are right when they say that you cannot divorce the truth from the Truth. The devil speaks in half truths. Sometimes he claims something as his hoping that you will believe what the devil has to say and consider it his so that you will rebuke it and thereby rebuke not him, but God. The Protestants in particular have rebuked the truth and in so doing have rebuked the Truth.

What may be my gift to the world? A rude awakening concerning how much it got wrong, a vision of the state of its soul. It may be too much to take.

< Message edited by chatterbox24 -- 5/17/2014 9:40:40 AM >

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 10:05:55 AM

BenevolentM

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Christ made it clear that who is going to make it into Heaven will have little to do with our opinion.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 10:16:31 AM

BenevolentM

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As I pointed out earlier things of God are not fully within our grasp. To God we are foolish children in need of parenting.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 12:16:33 PM

GotSteel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

Being born gay isn't a choice, sexual attraction is an instinct, one of our more potent ones.

Instinct is a very strong word as it precludes any learning and enculturation.

While attraction is an instinct that doesn't mean there's nothing to be learned, for instance I recently learned a new sex position.

We also have a survival instinct, that doesn't preclude the ability to learn and acquire strategies that improve our ability to survive.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 12:22:13 PM

dcnovice

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quote:

It seems to me if you claim 'a born that way' for homosexuals you have to defend the same claim for hetero x-dressers . . .

Why?

quote:

In fact, one might expect that every fetish should be considered inherited.

Is homosexuality a fetish?

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 2:36:46 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

quote:

It seems to me if you claim 'a born that way' for homosexuals you have to defend the same claim for hetero x-dressers . . .

Why?

quote:

In fact, one might expect that every fetish should be considered inherited.

Is homosexuality a fetish?

To answer your first question: cross dressing seems to be an erotic orientation. The same can be said for sexual sadism and masochism. People identify themselves by their behavior in these categories just as gay people identify themselves in their category. So, my question goes to if genetics is at the root of gay sexual orientation should we not consider all the varieties of sexual orientation as inborn? I seriously don't think so.

To your second question: it might seem so if you accept the definition that a fetish is a normal variation of human sexuality.

In any case we are still left with the probably unsolvable question of what combination of heredity and nurture lead to the development of sexual preference. I suspect that the notion that homosexuality is inbred was a political development, wisely adopted to put an end to abusive prejudice. We are probably all of us bouncing about on a spectrum of sexual preferences and identities. You may argue that my view takes away any specialness of being gay, and I would agree.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 2:40:55 PM

GotSteel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BenevolentM
As I pointed out earlier things of God are not fully within our grasp. To God we are foolish children in need of parenting.

God's not doing any parenting. If there was such a being who was actually acting as a parent there would be no need to come up with rationalizations like this.

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RE: What do the atheists get right? - 5/17/2014 2:51:16 PM

vincentML

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GotSteel

quote:

ORIGINAL: vincentML

quote:

Being born gay isn't a choice, sexual attraction is an instinct, one of our more potent ones.

Instinct is a very strong word as it precludes any learning and enculturation.

While attraction is an instinct that doesn't mean there's nothing to be learned, for instance I recently learned a new sex position.

We also have a survival instinct, that doesn't preclude the ability to learn and acquire strategies that improve our ability to survive.

I am not convinced we have either an instinct for procreation nor an instinct for survival. Those notions seem pretty simplistic.

Outside of the pleasures of fucking I don't see any evidence for a set of genes that make an imperative of having children. I would suggest the imperative comes from the tribe or social structure. As far as sexual attraction we have a host of chemical signals modified by social learning that leads to same sex or opposite sex attraction. But sexual attraction is only a means to procreation; it is not an imperative for procreation. Many people screw with no desire to have kids. Clearly, homosexual attraction informs us that we do not have an instinct for procreation. There are the issues that males supposedly feel compelled to spread their seed wide and far whilst females choose mates who are more likely protective and monogamous. Sorry to be nit picky but these are all mechanisms toward procreation but they are not universal among individuals. Among the species perhaps, yes.

I also think the so called instinct for survival is specious and based on the long standing observation of the flight or fight syndrome. A built in convenience that the survivors have passed along, I think.

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