RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (Full Version)

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thishereboi -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 4:39:28 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bongoman

And also, I am aware after that little sock remark a certain moderator switched my account.

Someone is about to get fired if they don't switch it back. You are not going to like the PR nightmare I'm going to bring up if you don't switch it back. Now be good and respect my privacy.



OMG this just keeps getting funnier and funnier. Come on little dude, show us what you've got. [8D]




ARIES83 -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 4:47:27 AM)

Who was the subbie boy?(following Xena)




ExiledTyrant -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 5:08:52 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

Who was the subbie boy?(following Xena)


Joxer the mighty!

[img]http://www.xena.nu/joxer.JPG[/img]




crazyml -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 5:19:10 AM)

Wow RS! This is a heck of a topic.

There are a few things that your op brought into my mind.

ProDommes... is it still kink if they're not getting a sexual buzz out of providing the services that they do? I'm asking this question, because I'm wondering if one of the objections to findommes is that they're not doing it to get their rocks off.

I happen to think it's still a kink if one party is getting their kinky oats. The other party may be doing it simply to pay the bills, but the guy who gets off on calling sex lines is indulging in a kink, even if the bored lady at the other end of the line is doing the washing up while she purrs into her headset.

Like you, I've no objection whatsoever to people that freely choose to work in the sex industry. To the extent that when DaddySatyr uses the term "common prostitute" in a way that is apparently disparaging I have to roll my eyes.

I take the view that if someone gets a buzz from calling a sex line or going to a dungeon and paying to be flogged then that's all cool with me.

In the same vein, if someone gets a buzz from paying money over to a girl who is (or at least presents as) an attractive woman while expecting nothing in return the that's a kink. The "getting nothing in return" is the buzz. Just as in orgasm denial the "denial" is the buzz.

So, the people (mostly guys it seems), that are attracted to finnies are kinky. So it's a kink. The finnies themselves... well if it's just a job then they're not kinky - they're simply sex workers (and fair enough).

I would say the same for a pro-domme - if she's not getting a buzz, and doing it for the cash she's not "kinky" (or not necessarily so), she's a sex worker. And again, nothing wrong with that.

The second thought, and I say this with complete respect to your massive involvement in and contribution to the world of kink.... I am not "into" the scene. I've been to a few munches (crammed with pitifully dull people) and a couple of kinky night clubs (seedy, expensive, smelly). I've never attended a "workshop" or joined an association. Now (to slightly spoil my argument) I have written about kink, and I've advised students on it so I'm not totally detached or ininvested - but...


Does this make me less kinky? Is my claim to be into BDSM somehow less valid than that of someone who does the whole munch, convention, seminar thing?

My third thought is this...

This is a free site, so anyone can post any bullshit here. The personals sections are crammed with married dudes pretending to be single, 50 y/olds pretending to be 30, and scammers pretending to be 23 years old and (exactly) 5'5" tall.

Some of them are proper scammers... they try to extract money from innocent suitors. But others are very up front. They make it clear... "buy me something from my wishlist and I will send you a nasty message". Now... they're offering a service, which a potential client can either buy or not. If a dude gets his rocks off at the thought of buying some expensive knickers for a total stranger, knowing that she'll just email him and tell him what a worm he is - then fair does. She's not kinky, but he is. And... I'm not going to judge him for it. If she promises something, in exchange for the wishlist purchase and doesn't fulfill the promise, then she's a scammer.





ARIES83 -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 5:22:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ExiledTyrant


quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

Who was the subbie boy?(following Xena)


Joxer the mighty!

[img]http://www.xena.nu/joxer.JPG[/img]


I thought he was in love with Gabriel.




crazyml -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 5:26:10 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
I haven't yet met a fin domme who claims to get sexually excited by the smell or feel of gifted money.


Right, I'm not a "domme" but... I have been a fin dom in a couple of relationships.

The first wasn't fin domming in the sense we're talking about here - it was more about control of her finances.

The second was definitely in the sense we're discussing here - She paid me money to humiliate her. The fact that she was paying for it added (enormously) to her buzz.

And it gave me a huge buzz to see her face as she handed over the cash.

Now... I didn't make a living out of it, and it wasn't a very long relationship, but there ya go...

Now you know of at least one dominant person who gets a rush out of financial domination ;-)




ResidentSadist -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 1:08:49 PM)

Thank you for taking the OP with the sincerity it was posted and getting this thread back on topic. So far it has been a good read despite the puppet show and has expanded my perspectives.

I feel like some of the replies are mixing financial control with financial domination. To exert financial control over your s-type is financially dominating, but it is not the money based fetish of financial domination. That is like errantly mixing the terms "submissive" when talking about a personality trait verses a submissive relationship role in BDSM. It's not the same.

I am very aware of financial control being exerted over slaves, as I do that myself and have seen many others do that with their s-type partners. But I perceive a difference between exerting control over a submissive's life in general including their money vs only exerting control over their wallet, of which they are to give a portion to you… and explaining that that transfer of money is a fetish.

Judging from profiles for some of the replies, I think they could give a workshop demo on domination without needing an ATM machine. Their profiles aren't cash-centric. However, seeing them explain budget control as an extension of domination to explain financial domination (the fetish) is an error as I understand it. If what they describe is financial domination, than I am also a FinDom and have been since I was a teenager with my first slave that lived with me. We had a joint bank account, she worked and put her check in our joint account. I had absolute rule over her and the finances and continued that tradition to this day.

So please don't mix apples and oranges.




TNDommeK -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 3:31:17 PM)

I think my question would be "are we talking about fin dommes or fin ducks"
If I remember correctly Rochsubs thread defined the two.





ResidentSadist -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 3:52:52 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TNDommeK

I think my question would be "are we talking about fin dommes or fin ducks"
If I remember correctly Rochsubs thread defined the two.



Are you talking about his 98 page thread from 2012?

Is financial domination a legitimate form of D/s?





TNDommeK -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 3:55:33 PM)

Yes!! That was a great read once the bullshit was weeded through.




thishereboi -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 3:58:36 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: ARIES83

Who was the subbie boy?(following Xena)


Joxer the Mighty


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5gIGk9PATvs




Moderator3 -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 4:23:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: Bongoman

And also, I am aware after that little sock remark a certain moderator switched my account.

Someone is about to get fired if they don't switch it back. You are not going to like the PR nightmare I'm going to bring up if you don't switch it back. Now be good and respect my privacy.



OMG this just keeps getting funnier and funnier. Come on little dude, show us what you've got. [8D]


I couldn't decide whether I was going to wet myself from fear or laughing. I went with laughing, but my batman underware sold on ebay for like a thousand dollars.

Oh no... I'm on topic. [sm=afraid.gif]

Bad mod! Bad, bad, bad!




TNDommeK -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 7:33:42 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: TNDommeK

Yes!! That was a great read once the bullshit was weeded through.



And just to point out, I had two of my fin subs comment on Roch's thread. They explained their fetish and turn-ons with the kink. Who are you (general) to say its not legit?




Awareness -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 10:00:33 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamlady
There is nothing sexier than having a man with a powerfully masculine presence turn out to be sexually submissive to the ONE woman he desires to be utterly devoted to. It's sexy and intoxicating.
Wrong. What's sexier than that is a man who owns himself utterly and is immune to every attempt at manipulation you employ.

Experience has taught me that even women who are ostensibly feminist ball-busters are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant masculinity. Christ, I got supposed Dommes emailing me and asking permission to speak. There appear to be a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" whose dominance is more about exploiting the desperation of submissive men, than it is about doing what really yanks their crank.

I put FinDommes into that category. We don't have "RopeDommes" or "FloggerDommes" or "MedicalDommes", yet every woman who falls into this category announces herself as a FinDomme.

Why is that?

The answer, is advertising. FinDommes are fundamentally engaged in exploitative commerce. They're every bit as commercial as a ProDomme, they just deliver little to no value in return for sucking someone dry of filthy lucre.

If a woman was genuine, if this was simply an aspect of her fetish, she wouldn't feel the need to announce it up front. It'd simply be an aspect of her engagement with men. (And it's always men - women don't need to give away their money... ever wonder why that is?)

To call oneself a FinDomme is to cast a lure into the world of pathetic, weak-minded men. There's nothing even remotely genuine about it.

And don't get me started on why regulating such things is important. Because a free market always produces losers. It's why we have to beat corporations into submission with regulation - because otherwise they do what's good for them, even if it means killing their customers. Regulation is necessary to change the game so that optimal strategies for corporations result in the best outcomes for consumers.

Similarly, failure to regulate gets you the kind of shitty community you have in Fetlife - a site dominated by "fetish models" (read wannabe porn actresses) and women attempting various strategies to exploit the losers who show up (the number of Amazon wish lists is fucking phenomenal).

The result is a community polluted by commerce, where opportunities for real, genuine, engagement are lost amidst a sea of prostitution. The community self-regulates in response to women exploited by men, why doesn't it self-regulate in response to men who are exploited by women?

When I was banned from CollarMe, I didn't worry overmuch because it was clear to me, this place was a FinDommes paradise. Dominant men weren't welcome unless they were warm and fluffy and tolerated the dreck which passed for argument in this place. I just presumed CollarMe was talking a cut from all the Findomme activity exploiting the male subs and people like me who upset the FinDomme applecart just got in the way of that action.




Spiritedsub2 -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/18/2015 10:28:55 PM)

I don't think collarme/space is getting a cut from the fin dommes. I believe the fins and pros are welcomed here because they are women, and they stock up the female membership pool. Without the fins and pros, there would be so few women members that the men would eventually stop visiting the site. THEN the money would dry up.

Not my original thoughts; a post from a couple of years ago laid this out.




dreamlady -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/19/2015 2:10:59 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamlady

There is nothing sexier [to me] than having a man with a powerfully masculine presence turn out to be sexually submissive to the ONE woman [namely, me] he desires to be utterly devoted to [moi]. It's sexy and intoxicating [to me and many ladies whom I know].

[Edit - clarification]


Wrong.

Wrong, for you. You're a straight male. [:)]

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
What's sexier than that is a man who owns himself utterly and is immune to every attempt at manipulation you employ.

I hardly think that you as a straight male would know what women find sexy in a male better than we do. [8|] At best, whatever knowledge you think you've acquired is second hand.

Furthermore, I don't know what manipulation you're referring to, because women don't have a monopoly on being manipulative any more so than there are manipulative men looking to get over on others. Feminine wiles are not strictly utilized for the purposes of (self-serving) manipulation. There are consensual uses, akin to instinctive mating rituals. Being flirtatious is considered to be a feminine trait, how a woman shows interest. Teasing builds up excitement and intrigue, and both flirting and teasing are forms of sexual foreplay which both women and men employ and engage in interactively.

Or a man could prefer to be dull, lacking both passion and ardor. A cold fish.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Experience has taught me that even women who are ostensibly feminist ball-busters are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant masculinity. Christ, I got supposed Dommes emailing me and asking permission to speak. There appear to be a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" whose dominance is more about exploiting the desperation of submissive men, than it is about doing what really yanks their crank.

It's no surprise that this would indeed be the type of woman who would contact you. Most of the Doms who contact me inform me that they are actually switches, secretly submissive, or else take the lead in vanilla life but enjoy being submissive in the bedroom. [8D]
Btw, there are a good number of submissive women who consider themselves to be feminists. Even a Male Supremacist or two.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Dominant men weren't welcome unless they were warm and fluffy and tolerated the dreck which passed for argument in this place.

There is a whole boatload of questionably shady, unsafe, squicky and weird-ass shit that I force myself to tolerate around all you sadists, masochists, and fetishists. But guess what? YKINMYK.

Respectfully,
DreamLady




Svale -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/19/2015 2:49:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB

This is an interesting read.

A third of the way down it says: Even in the world of online BDSM, where pretty much anything goes as long as it’s safe and consensual — enforced chastity, cock-and-ball torture, even fart fetishes — there’s an element of financial domination that strikes many as unsavoury or taboo. “No one talks about it, and no one really wants to talk about it,”

I think we do try to talk about it but its such a dodgy subject because 'we' the BDSM/fetish crowd are supposed to be so tolerant.




You are right. But tolerance does not mean that we cannot discuss things, that would be a misunderstanding in my opinion, just censorship, not tolerance.

My opinion is that commercial interests and social organizations or sites should be kept apart - with water tight shutters! But then I come from another culture than the American.




crazyml -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/19/2015 3:26:36 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness


quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamlady
There is nothing sexier than having a man with a powerfully masculine presence turn out to be sexually submissive to the ONE woman he desires to be utterly devoted to. It's sexy and intoxicating.
Wrong. What's sexier than that is a man who owns himself utterly and is immune to every attempt at manipulation you employ.


I suspect that when dreamlady said "there is nothing sexier", she was talking about her own preferences. It is a little bit silly to argue that her own preferences are wrong.

You have your preferences and beliefs, she has hers. And as long as neither of you descend into absurdly wild generalisations about the rest of the world neither of you is "wrong".

quote:


Experience has taught me that even women who are ostensibly feminist ball-busters are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant masculinity. Christ, I got supposed Dommes emailing me and asking permission to speak. There appear to be a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" whose dominance is more about exploiting the desperation of submissive men, than it is about doing what really yanks their crank.


Your experience is limited to... well ... your experience. I've been contacted by Dommes asking permission to speak as well but my broader experience is that a very significant proportion of Dommes are just that - Dominant women, comfy in their skins and perfectly ok with their role.

Yup, there are a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" who are setting out to exploit, there's no sensible denying that.

quote:


I put FinDommes into that category. We don't have "RopeDommes" or "FloggerDommes" or "MedicalDommes", yet every woman who falls into this category announces herself as a FinDomme.

Why is that?

The answer, is advertising. FinDommes are fundamentally engaged in exploitative commerce. They're every bit as commercial as a ProDomme, they just deliver little to no value in return for sucking someone dry of filthy lucre.


All "commerce" can be described as "exploitative" if you really want to be pedantic. The whole point of commerce is to exploit a market demand.

Now, you may regard the services of a findomme as being of no value, and I'm pretty certain that you, like me, have never been remotely tempted to pay for the services of a findomme. But other people have other preferences, needs and wants. If a man wants to pay for the services of a findomme, and he receives the services that were advertised then I don't see it as exploitative in the pejorative sense at all, it's a transaction.

quote:


If a woman was genuine, if this was simply an aspect of her fetish, she wouldn't feel the need to announce it up front. It'd simply be an aspect of her engagement with men. (And it's always men - women don't need to give away their money... ever wonder why that is?)


If a woman gets a kinky thrill from doing it, then it's her kink. If she doesn't but is simply providing a service to fulfil someone else's kink she's a sex worker. And I'm happy for her to be so. If she doesn't get a rush out of it, and is setting out to scam desperate people she's a scam artist.

quote:


To call oneself a FinDomme is to cast a lure into the world of pathetic, weak-minded men. There's nothing even remotely genuine about it.


This is nonsense. The extent to which a "findomme" is genuine rather depend on what she says, and whether she keeps her word. If a findomme offers "x" in exchange for "y" and genuinely does provide "x" in return for "y" then there's nothing remotely ungenuine about it.


quote:


And don't get me started on why regulating such things is important. Because a free market always produces losers. It's why we have to beat corporations into submission with regulation - because otherwise they do what's good for them, even if it means killing their customers. Regulation is necessary to change the game so that optimal strategies for corporations result in the best outcomes for consumers.


I don't disagree, the question then becomes "what regulation" and "how to enforce it"

quote:


Similarly, failure to regulate gets you the kind of shitty community you have in Fetlife - a site dominated by "fetish models" (read wannabe porn actresses) and women attempting various strategies to exploit the losers who show up (the number of Amazon wish lists is fucking phenomenal).

The result is a community polluted by commerce, where opportunities for real, genuine, engagement are lost amidst a sea of prostitution. The community self-regulates in response to women exploited by men, why doesn't it self-regulate in response to men who are exploited by women?


I'm baffled by this "sea of prostitution"... I've no doubt that there's a lot of it about, but I just don't encounter it - largely, I think, because I subconsciously filter out dodgy profiles. It doesn't seem that difficult to do.





Awareness -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/19/2015 4:19:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: dreamlady
Wrong, for you. You're a straight male. [:)]
Yeah and this is the thing. As a straight male, I've come to understand heterosexual women pretty damn well.

Lesson #1: Ignore what women say.

Pretty much all women have a huge variation between their actual selves and the self-image they possess inside their head. When they're discussing any given issue, they'll answer in accordance with the self-image they've built and which they wish to project to the rest of the world.

The degree of variance between a woman's actual self and her self-image is highly dependent upon her degree of self-awareness and her willingness to be honest with herself. Consequently, it's unwise to give much credence to what a woman says unless her behaviour matches the image she's projecting.

The majority of women lack that self-awareness. They won't admit to being manipulative, they won't admit that they test men, they won't admit that their behaviour is out of line when they're pre-menstrual. Most of all, they have a real hard time admitting when they're wrong. But I digress...

I don't give a flying fuck what a woman tells me about what she's attracted to. It's utterly irrelevant. I watch her actions. And those actions tell me what her words don't.

quote:


I hardly think that you as a straight male would know what women find sexy in a male better than we do. [8|] At best, whatever knowledge you think you've acquired is second hand.
See above. Women are not only often not honest about such things, but they're often unaware of their own buttons and how they can be pushed.

quote:

Furthermore, I don't know what manipulation you're referring to, because women don't have a monopoly on being manipulative any more so than there are manipulative men looking to get over on others.
Women have a monopoly on using their sexual power to manipulate men who have few options when it comes to getting laid. Women experiment with that power as they discover it and use it on men incessantly. FinDommes rely on that power, because without it, they would not exist. Without the sexual tease, a heterosexual FinSub could go get his "itch" scratched by anyone of any sex.

Trying to disconnect the sexual tease from the manipulative exploits of FinDommes is just plain dishonest. That's an intrinsic component of the whole experience.

quote:


Feminine wiles are not strictly utilized for the purposes of (self-serving) manipulation.
No, but they're mostly used for that. I know women. I know they manipulate men and I know they talk to each other about it. I also know the men they can't manipulate tend to be wildly attractive to them.

quote:

There are consensual uses, akin to instinctive mating rituals. Being flirtatious is considered to be a feminine trait, how a woman shows interest. Teasing builds up excitement and intrigue, and both flirting and teasing are forms of sexual foreplay which both women and men employ and engage in interactively.
That's exactly how I feel about dominant masculinity. It's incredibly effective - which is why I view male subs as idiots who are cutting off their nose to spite their face. Why on earth would you turn yourself into a supplicant with an incredibly low chance of success when you have the raw material to have so many more options?

quote:


Or a man could prefer to be dull, lacking both passion and ardor. A cold fish.
What I find dull are women who expect men to present themselves and hope to be chosen. I honestly don't understand how any woman could take satisfaction in being a "Domme". There's no challenge whatsoever. These pitiful specimens of manhood show up, supplicate and hope for the best. No Domme has to work for anything at all. It's meaningless.

Whereas there is an inherent satisfaction in conquering a woman. Especially a woman who's not easily conquered.

quote:


quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness
Dominant men weren't welcome unless they were warm and fluffy and tolerated the dreck which passed for argument in this place.

There is a whole boatload of questionably shady, unsafe, squicky and weird-ass shit that I force myself to tolerate around all you sadists, masochists, and fetishists. But guess what? YKINMYK.
Not relevant. There's a difference between tolerance of difference and outright censorship to keep the Findomme train rolling on and the pathetic paypiggies rolling in.




MariaB -> RE: -=Money Pigs/FinDomery - real fetish or fake? (soapbox)=- (4/19/2015 6:03:53 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness



Experience has taught me that even women who are ostensibly feminist ball-busters are helpless to stop themselves responding to dominant masculinity. Christ, I got supposed Dommes emailing me and asking permission to speak. There appear to be a substantial number of alleged "Dommes" whose dominance is more about exploiting the desperation of submissive men, than it is about doing what really yanks their crank.


I have a few very good friends who carry a huge amount of dominant masculinity. Equally they would tell you that I carry a huge amount of feminine masculinity. I'm not sexually attracted to these men but this is why our friendships have been able to continue over the years. I don't want or need dominance in a lover and neither do they.

I too have supposed dominant men emailing me or whispering their submissive needs to me at some party. I have at least one email a week from a needy submissive male who only has a dominant profile on here. Once these men feel ultimately comfortable with a dominant woman and have assured themselves that she would never switch, they reveal themselves within that save haven. At one point and this was some years ago, I strongly suspected that no man was really dominant and all this dominant bollox they tried to portray to the bigger world was merely a disguise to hide their own submission. Of course it would be ridiculous for me to assume that no man is really dominant, just as its ridiculous for you to assume the same about women. Whilst I understand your suspicion, that suspicion works both ways.

quote:


I put FinDommes into that category. We don't have "RopeDommes" or "FloggerDommes" or "MedicalDommes", yet every woman who falls into this category announces herself as a FinDomme.

Why is that?




I know a lot of dominant women who specialize in specific areas, including myself. When we move away from purist D/s and get into the realms of S&M play, many of us have preferences and become well practised in the subject we are interested in. I consider myself very good at medical play. If anyone on the London scene were to enquire about medical domination, people would point them in my direction. Equally, I know some fantastic Shibari Dommes who aren't pro or fin Dommes.

quote:



That's exactly how I feel about dominant masculinity. It's incredibly effective - which is why I view male subs as idiots who are cutting off their nose to spite their face. Why on earth would you turn yourself into a supplicant with an incredibly low chance of success when you have the raw material to have so many more options?



I think you're taking this far too seriously!. There are many successful Domme/sub relationships, you only have to get out and about to see them. I agree that a mans options on here are severely limited if he shows up as a single submissive but this is merely a tiny percent of the BDSM world. I know male subs who are so popular (I'm talking rl) within the fem Domme circles that women literally fight over them.

Sexual preference is as diverse as our fingerprint. People rarely wake up one morning and decide to give it a go as a dominant or a submissive. Most of this comes from a deep seated fantasy that likely started before adulthood.

quote:


What I find dull are women who expect men to present themselves and hope to be chosen. I honestly don't understand how any woman could take satisfaction in being a "Domme". There's no challenge whatsoever. These pitiful specimens of manhood show up, supplicate and hope for the best. No Domme has to work for anything at all. It's meaningless.

Whereas there is an inherent satisfaction in conquering a woman. Especially a woman who's not easily conquered.



I think very few dominant women gain satisfaction from submissive males who offer themselves up on a plate; I certainly don't. I've had to work for every D/s relationship I've had. A few of those relationships have been with fem subs who I happen to enjoy because they tend to be hugely fussy, especially the ones who have been around for a while but its the same with some male subs that have come out of long term D/s relationships. Unfortunately a lot of men equate submission to being overly compliant at the drop of a hat. The experienced ones know that's a fools game. Believe it or not Awareness, there are 'hard to get' male submissives too...this site just isn't the place to find good examples of them.

I do know some female Dommes who genuinely believe there is no such thing as a dominant man and that all men are potential submissives. Its a condition called 'Dominatrix Toxaemia'. I guess the male version of that is Dominant Toxaemia!




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