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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 4:57:15 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		to get back again to what this is all about and what happens these days

recent figures of refugee arrivals in Austria (Nickelsdorf) via Hungary (Hegyeshalom) (news at noon orf.at): between 8000 and 10000 per day, on transit to Germany

(in reply to Politesub53)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 1:35:55 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		THIS is not good

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 3:43:07 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		I cant find anything to back up the Daily Mails story. Then again the paper is just a scaremongering rag these days.

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 4:26:33 PM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		Most of it - especially the "interview statements" and the abuse stories - is tabloid hotchpotch about as reliable as next year's weather report

(in reply to kdsub)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 6:20:54 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		So you are willing to say there is NO validity to the story? Is there any doubt in your mind?

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 9/28/2015 6:21:50 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/28/2015 6:37:48 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		How about THIS article and source?

If you read it closely you will come to the part where they acknowledge the problem of illegal emigrants mixing in with asylum seekers and how they plan on dealing with them. I don't believe this is a deal breakers as the first link, that was posted from Yahoo, seems to insinuate... but it is evidently a problem that they will be dealing with.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to kdsub)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/29/2015 3:54:57 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		article and source are realistic and rather objective, but outdated by now -
did you notice the date of publication? latest July edition, when the estimates for the year 2015 were 400 000; we had about 130 000 new arrivals of refugees here after that article was published (August figures only), and there are more still arriving in thousands week after week

I kept you all updated with more recent figures and events

there is a lot of spreading rumours on fartbook and elsewhere lately: latest example is that the refugees would have butchered the goats in Erfurt zoo; it has been checked by now and there is proof the goats are alive and well

posters spreading these rumours usually are not interested in facts but playing with absurdities to feed prejudices (and paper and internet tabloids)

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/29/2015 6:36:06 AM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides (please note potential, as at this point in time, these downsides remain unrealised fears, not realities) of the refugee crisis.

It is especially depressing that they are choosing to ignore the generosity of Germans and other Europeans who are offering asylum to those who are in desperate need of it. Germany's decision to accept up to 400,000 is breathtaking in the scale of its generosity yet is ignored by those who choose to highlight dark and sometimes xenophobic fears instead. For me, the German offer and the kindness and generosity of so many ordinary Europeans stand out in the gloom of the refugee tragedy.

Those of us far away ought to be congratulating the Europeans not expressing dark and dubious fears from the comfort of distance. Australians have forced our normally viciously anti-refugee Govt to accept an extra 12,000 refugees from Syria which represents a virtual doubling of our annual refugee intake of 13,000. If there are a few bad seeds among the many, they can be sorted out and dealt with later, after the immediate human tragedy has been dealt with. They are not grounds to question the entire project.

I applaud those in Europe who are welcoming the refugees. Their generosity is inspiring, it illustrates the best of humans, it shows us that compassion comes from strength of character not weakness.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 9/29/2015 6:51:12 AM >

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/29/2015 3:43:33 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline 		To get around the issue of those trying to get into the UK for economic reasons, Cameron has said we will take asylum seekers direct from camps in Syrias neighbouring countries.

< Message edited by Politesub53 -- 9/29/2015 3:47:13 PM >

(in reply to tweakabelle)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/29/2015 5:01:43 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides


Tweak this is a discussion forum and all sides of any issue are important. Too often nations run head long into problems, as we did in Somalia, without thinking things through.

I am not advocating not taking in refugees but I think it important not to ignore potential problems... Otherwise I am all for extending a helping hand... I would however not give a hug and turn my back until I am sure they would not stab me in the spine.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 250
RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/30/2015 9:56:18 AM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides


Tweak this is a discussion forum and all sides of any issue are important. Too often nations run head long into problems, as we did in Somalia, without thinking things through.

I am not advocating not taking in refugees but I think it important not to ignore potential problems... Otherwise I am all for extending a helping hand... I would however not give a hug and turn my back until I am sure they would not stab me in the spine.

Butch

how exactly do you do that then? the Boston Marathon bombers were refugees, they lived in the US for many years, they were helped, they were educated here, etc and yet they became disenchanted with US and the fact that they didnt achieve their "American dream" so much so that... they became terrorists..

There is no way to be sure of anyone.. even Americans born here can be terrorists...

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/30/2015 10:37:52 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		latest update of figures:
Federal office of statistics and Federal Commissioner for Refugees estimate (!) that 290 000 refugees arrived in Germany in August and September - there are no exact figures for September to be expected for quite a while

(in reply to tj444)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/30/2015 11:48:56 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

disenchanted with US and the fact that they didnt achieve their "American dream" so much so that... they became terrorists.


There was no disenchantment with a dream... They were living it quite well... Their bastardized religion not the American way turned them to terrorism.

But it is a good question what to do with them... I would not immediately try to absorb them into society until they were thoroughly vetted as to their history and allegiance. If they could not provide the information then their asylum would be denied. This would mean properly run and policed refugee camps and time for a proper investigation.

Still there will be terrorists that will get through the system but it should make it harder for them anyway.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 9/30/2015 11:49:15 AM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tj444)
Profile   Post #: 253
RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 9/30/2015 4:35:23 PM   
Kirata


Posts: 15477
Joined: 2/11/2006
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides (please note potential, as at this point in time, these downsides remain unrealised fears, not realities) of the refugee crisis.

Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately, says German police chief

As attacks on Christians in asylum seeker centres increase and religious groups clash, Jörg Radek says refugees should be separately accommodated... Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately in Germany to minimise tensions following growing levels of violence... "The police have reached their absolute breaking point," said Mr Radek.

But hey, things will be ever so much better once they're released into the German population.

K.



< Message edited by Kirata -- 9/30/2015 4:55:57 PM >

(in reply to tweakabelle)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/1/2015 9:05:24 AM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

disenchanted with US and the fact that they didnt achieve their "American dream" so much so that... they became terrorists.


There was no disenchantment with a dream... They were living it quite well... Their bastardized religion not the American way turned them to terrorism.

But it is a good question what to do with them... I would not immediately try to absorb them into society until they were thoroughly vetted as to their history and allegiance. If they could not provide the information then their asylum would be denied. This would mean properly run and policed refugee camps and time for a proper investigation.

Still there will be terrorists that will get through the system but it should make it harder for them anyway.

Butch

sure, they had a decent life, not what I would call "living quite well" tho.. the mother was caught shoplifting some pretty expensive stuff so she wasnt rich enough to buy it, but its not like she was stealing food cuz they were starving.. the older one wanted to be in the Olympics, that was his American dream.. which was very unrealistic for him and his horrid mother's dream of being rich here wasnt realistic.. when people become disenchanted (or whatever you want to call it), then there is a risk that they will turn to something bad, for them it was their view of their religion.. for others it might be turning to crime sprees.. and it can happen to disenchanted Americans born here just as easily, imo..

Yes, some will get thru (no country is immune to that) but imo here its made pretty hard for them now.. even the wars in Iraq & Afghanistan, those that put their lives on the line to help the US and were promised asylum here have been shut out and abandoned by the US govt to unpleasant fates and even death there.. so, getting into the US isnt easy at all (unless you are a Saudi friend of the Bush's)...

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/1/2015 9:27:35 AM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

the mother was caught shoplifting some pretty expensive stuff so she wasnt rich enough to buy it


lol... she was a thief...she was not stealing food or necessities because they were destitute... she stole DRESSES.

How many times did the family fly them back and forth to Chechnya...do you know what that costs? Come on... the kid was in college supported by relatives in a comfortable life... There are no excused for disenchantment... They just followed their Mother's radical religion and became murderers who I hope will rot in Hell.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tj444)
Profile   Post #: 256
RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/2/2015 1:39:13 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides (please note potential, as at this point in time, these downsides remain unrealised fears, not realities) of the refugee crisis.

Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately, says German police chief

As attacks on Christians in asylum seeker centres increase and religious groups clash, Jörg Radek says refugees should be separately accommodated... Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately in Germany to minimise tensions following growing levels of violence... "The police have reached their absolute breaking point," said Mr Radek.

But hey, things will be ever so much better once they're released into the German population.

K.





There have been two crowd fist fights reported so far (if you like: an increase of 200%? from none to two) one in Suhl when someone tore up a Qoran and flushed pages down the toilet (the most active participants arrested and on trial by now), and another in Kassel-Kalden last week.
From my experience with the effect of adrenaline overdose on males this is a pretty low figure.

And the refugees have been and are "released" into the population for decades ... so there is no need for "ominous prophecies" but quite some experience, as usual some good some bad and some mistakes to avoid.
Many of this population have been refugees and migrants or descending from those themselves.

(in reply to Kirata)
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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/2/2015 9:09:42 AM   
tj444


Posts: 7574
Joined: 3/7/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

the mother was caught shoplifting some pretty expensive stuff so she wasnt rich enough to buy it


lol... she was a thief...she was not stealing food or necessities because they were destitute... she stole DRESSES.

How many times did the family fly them back and forth to Chechnya...do you know what that costs? Come on... the kid was in college supported by relatives in a comfortable life... There are no excused for disenchantment... They just followed their Mother's radical religion and became murderers who I hope will rot in Hell.

Butch

yes I know she stole dresses, expensive ones.. yes she was a thief, a shrew and yes, they had no reason to be disenchanted but thats what they were.. what they had wasnt enough for them cuz they were selfish and greedy and thought the streets here were paved with gold and they wanted more than their share of if, not willing to work hard for it, they wanted it handed to them on a silver platter.. they were the worst of the worst but how they appeared when they first immigrated to the US is very different from how we know them to be now.. at least her and her useless weak ex-husband are back in their home country where they can screw their fellow man instead.. That American born wife of the oldest terrorist should have gone with them too, you cant tell me she didnt know what was going on and what they were up to..

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/3/2015 4:30:59 AM   
blnymph


Posts: 1612
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline 		back to topic:
did you find any information about UNHCR underfunding in US media recently?

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RE: Heartbreaking -- Drowned Syrian Boy -- Whole Family... - 10/3/2015 5:04:49 PM   
Politesub53


Posts: 14862
Joined: 5/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kirata

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

It is depressing that some people are choosing to focus on the potential downsides (please note potential, as at this point in time, these downsides remain unrealised fears, not realities) of the refugee crisis.

Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately, says German police chief

As attacks on Christians in asylum seeker centres increase and religious groups clash, Jörg Radek says refugees should be separately accommodated... Christian and Muslim refugees should be housed separately in Germany to minimise tensions following growing levels of violence... "The police have reached their absolute breaking point," said Mr Radek.

But hey, things will be ever so much better once they're released into the German population.

K.




The clashes were over food, not Religion. The "police chief" is just a union rep. All this from your link.

(in reply to Kirata)
Profile   Post #: 260
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