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Reinertsslave75 -> To all Masters (4/29/2016 3:46:40 PM)
What types of punishments do you dish out for when your slave disobeys and plays with herself. Also how would you discipline them if they backtalked you, called you Sir when you told them it's Master not Sir.

OsideGirl -> RE: To all Masters (4/29/2016 3:50:28 PM)
We don't have a punishment dynamic. If I've done something wrong, we talk about it and decide how to move forward in a manner that creates obedience.

freedomdwarf1 -> RE: To all Masters (4/29/2016 4:01:30 PM)
Pretty much the same here - no punishment regime at all.

peppermint -> RE: To all Masters (4/29/2016 4:40:33 PM)
Gotta agree with the others. We're grown ups and discuss any problems we have. Eleven years ago he did punish me once. The relationship was brand new and we were still figuring out what we wanted it to be. Wouldn't let me read my books at night for a week. It was awful.

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (4/29/2016 6:19:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Reinertsslave75 What types of punishments do you dish out for when your slave disobeys and plays with herself. I don't punish my slave for playing with herself. A lack of sexual stimulation diminishes a woman's sex drive, and I want her horny, so punishment for that would be counter productive. quote: ORIGINAL: Reinertsslave75 Also how would you discipline them if they backtalked you For backtalk earlier this week, her punishment was to go pick up rocks out of the yard (where I'm planning of having vegetable beds later) to the amount of 1 full bucket. It took her about 2 hours. quote: ORIGINAL: Reinertsslave75 called you Sir when you told them it's Master not Sir. If it's an honest mistake, because she isn't used to it yet, I'd merely remind her of proper form, and make her restate the sentence using proper form. I'd repeat this as long as it took for her to form the new habit. If it was a deliberate act of defiance, I'd treat it the same as I would back talking and assign her some boring or annoying task.

DesFIP -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 7:48:27 AM)
Try talking to her and find out why she can't follow your rules. If denial causes sleep deprivation and she has to drive the next day, then risking her life is wrong. Federal stats on automobile fatalities due to sleep deprivation are frightening. Same for everything else. If she finds the term Master to be offensive the you either find a different term or let her find a partner who will.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 8:45:33 AM)
quote: called you Sir when you told them it's Master not Sir. Really? That's the shit you worry about?

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 11:29:34 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick quote: called you Sir when you told them it's Master not Sir. Really? That's the shit you worry about? Why exactly is that an issue? It's some of the shit I worry about. My slave girl has rules that regulate how she's supposed to address people and such. Willful disobedience on those rules will be dealt with, just like any other willful disobedience would. Just because she's still using a form of polite address doesn't mean that it's the correct one, or that lapses in obedience on the subject should be tolerated. At the same time, during training, accidental slip-ups while she's getting used to new rules aren't punished, they're merely corrected, and punishing a slave who's diligently try to learn to obey a new rule but isn't perfect yet seems counterproductive to me. One should take intentions and efforts into account when it comes to these types of lapses. On the other hand, rules aren't optional. What would be the purpose of having a rule to begin with if it's up to her to be permitted to pick and choose which rules she wants to obey, and when, and to what extend? So if "Master" is the only correct form of address, "Sir" is wrong, and a correction is needed when she accidentally resorts to that form. If she's deliberately refusing to use the proper form, punishment would be in order (though I think it's rare, to non-existent, that a well managed slave resorts to deliberate disobedience... if they frequently do, it's probably an issue of mismanagement).

WickedsDesire -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 11:35:11 AM)
I would thrash them into next week with pots and pans, soup ladles for sure, and the kitchen sink. They must be shown the error of their ways, and dumped in a wheelie bin of utter garbage, or preferably sold on muffin bay, for cake money, so that some good may come of their folly.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 5:21:27 PM)
quote: Why exactly is that an issue? Because it strikes me as fucking ridiculous thing to get your panties in a bunch over.

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 5:41:21 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick quote: Why exactly is that an issue? Because it strikes me as fucking ridiculous thing to get your panties in a bunch over. It's not a matter of 'getting panties in a bunch', it's a matter of 'why have any rules whatsoever at all if they're just going to be optional'? She's not a girlfriend, she's a slave. When she gets an order, it's not up to her to decide that it's trivial enough to ignore. There's no pantie bunching going on over that, there's just an enforcement of the fact that it's not up to her to pick and choose the rules. It's not any different from the expectation that my coffee gets served to me the way I like it. I specified that I like a certain amount of cream in my coffee, so when I get it, it best have that exact amount of cream in it. If she's just going to pick and choose how much cream to put in, then how exactly is she serving me? At that point, it's not pleasing to get her to serve coffee at all, I'm better off doing it myself. That argument extends to everything else as well. If it's more pleasing to be addressed as "Master" then Master is what it ought to be. "Sir" would be less pleasing in that circumstance, and if you're at the point where the person "serving" you is doing so in a way they explicitly know is not pleasing to you, they might as well go ahead and address "hey you" or your first name instead, because you ain't being pleased/served by them anyways. At that point you don't have a submissive or a slave, you have somebody who engages in whatever kink they find pleasurable, whenever they feel like it. While there's nothing wrong with that, it's not D/s, not M/s and certain not TPE, because in that circumstance, the Top has literally no actual power or authority at all. Why bother having any rules if they're going to be optional? At that point you're just hanging out with somebody who 'acts' submissive when they feel like it, but who doesn't actually submit.

DesFIP -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 8:16:03 PM)
And some people have good and sufficient reasons for a refusal. Bad associations, triggers etc. ordering them to not have those previous associations doesn't work. You need to find out why they have a mental block and figure out a strategy to overcome it. Or decide that it isn't possible to fix it and move on. I know I've mentioned this before but in the beginning, when we were first living together, I got snotty damn near every afternoon. Punishing me would not have fixed the problem, it would have exacerbated it. When he started asking me why, we were both surprised to discover that the cause was hunger/low blood sugar. In order to fix the problem, it was necessary to discover the real cause and address it. In this case adding in a lunch break and keeping nuts and water in the car. Saying "you're a slave, you can't get tired or hungry" would have lost him my respect. Because it's an obviously undo able thing to demand. It would be equally stupid for me to say when he catches a cold "real masters never stay in bed sick. You must be a fake".

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 8:32:50 PM)
I didn't advocate punishing for a undeliberate act of disobedience. In fact, I specifically stated that if it's a slip up caused by not yet knowing the rule, it should be corrected, not punished. If we're at the point where he's told her to address him as "Master" and she hasn't brought up an issue then, there shouldn't be a mental trigger/block issue at this point, else it should have been addressed from the get go. People with triggers generally know what they are, and even when they don't, the fact that there is an issue becomes apparent when the new situation arises, and unexpected reactions can be addressed then. As far as 'snottiness' due to low blood sugar goes, my girl, Tess, has that same problem. If she gets low on blood sugar, her attitude becomes worse. Issues like that are indeed managed by fixing the problem, and not by punishment. At the same time, I don't tolerate from her an unacceptable attitude just because she has blood sugar issues. Even when she is having issues, she's expected to keep her emotions enough in check to deal with them in an adult way. This isn't any different from the fact that she needs to manage her emotions at work. Just because she's having a blood sugar crash, doesn't mean that she can say whatever she wants to her boss, or storm out of work mad. Doing so would get her fired, and so she manages her blood sugar crashes well enough at work. Sure, she might be moody, and her colleagues and boss might be able to tell that something is 'off', but she still manages to be respectful and functional enough to not get fired. The same thing is expected from her at home: if she has blood sugar issues, she can act in an 'off' way, but she cannot act in a way that if she would do it with her boss, a client, or a colleague, would get her fired. When Ullr or I notice her being 'off', she gets asked if blood sugar (or lack of sleep, or stress, or something else) might be an issue, and then the issue gets fixed. There is no punishment for that, rather an addressing of the issue. However, if she instead of being 'off' would act in a way that would get her fired at work, what happens is that we figure out what the issue is, fix it, and then she gets punished for behaving in an unacceptable way. She's not excused for behaving in a minimally respectful and adult way, just because she feels like shit. Just because we're closer to her than her boss is, doesn't mean that she gets to treat us with any less respect than she would manage with him when feeling like crap.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 9:30:44 PM)
quote: It's not a matter of 'getting panties in a bunch', it's a matter of 'why have any rules whatsoever at all if they're just going to be optional'? Meh, it's really dumb ass rule to my mind. quote: While there's nothing wrong with that, it's not D/s, not M/s and certain not TPE, Sure it is, it's just not the way you do it. quote: At that point you're just hanging out with somebody who 'acts' submissive when they feel like it, but who doesn't actually submit. Oh dear, forgive me for not following the one true way.

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (4/30/2016 10:44:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick quote: While there's nothing wrong with that, it's not D/s, not M/s and certain not TPE, Sure it is, it's just not the way you do it. quote: At that point you're just hanging out with somebody who 'acts' submissive when they feel like it, but who doesn't actually submit. Oh dear, forgive me for not following the one true way. It's not a matter of "one twue way" it's a matter of the fact that the definition of submission is: quote: sub·mis·sion səbˈmiSHən/Submit noun 1. the action or fact of accepting or yielding to a superior force or to the will or authority of another person. "they were forced into submission" When one takes an attitude of "I'm only going to follow rules I feel like following, when I feel like following them" there is no yielding to the the will of another. What there is is a choice made to do what one feels like when one feels like it. Without a yielding or accepting the will of another, there is no submission. There's something. And that something might be very fulfilling and gratifying to both parties involved, but there is -by definition- no submission. Without submission, there is no M/s or D/s. shrugs Words happen to mean the things they mean. You can claim a hundred times that people can fly if they want to, or that people can submit when they only do whatever they feel like, but that doesn't make it so. You want to invent your own little language where words mean the opposite of what they do in English, and where "submission" means "I do what the Top says only when I approve, agree and don't think it's a dumb ass rule", then be my guest, but that doesn't mean that it suddenly magically becomes true in the English language.

areallivehuman -> RE: To all Masters (5/1/2016 3:47:40 AM)
I would first ask myself what I'm doing wrong, then sit her down for a talk, reevaluate, make any necessary changes, and move forward.

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: To all Masters (5/1/2016 5:34:28 AM)
quote: It's not a matter of "one twue way" Yes dear, whatever you say

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: To all Masters (5/1/2016 5:38:06 AM)
quote: and where "submission" means "I do what the Top says only when I approve, agree and don't think it's a dumb ass rule", then be my guest, but that doesn't mean that it suddenly magically becomes true in the English language. And yet that is EXACTLY how it works in real life, as what you have described is in fact the whole process of negotiation.

Kaliko -> RE: To all Masters (5/1/2016 8:33:03 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick quote: and where "submission" means "I do what the Top says only when I approve, agree and don't think it's a dumb ass rule", then be my guest, but that doesn't mean that it suddenly magically becomes true in the English language. And yet that is EXACTLY how it works in real life, as what you have described is in fact the whole process of negotiation. I can assure you, that is not (necessarily) how it works. I've been known to disagree with even his most sensible rule, never mind the ones I might mutter about. And yet, I still find myself responsible for adhering to them, no matter how much I may not want to at the time.

UllrsIshtar -> RE: To all Masters (5/1/2016 9:25:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: ThatDizzyChick quote: and where "submission" means "I do what the Top says only when I approve, agree and don't think it's a dumb ass rule", then be my guest, but that doesn't mean that it suddenly magically becomes true in the English language. And yet that is EXACTLY how it works in real life, as what you have described is in fact the whole process of negotiation. shrugs If ever single rule the Top is allowed to pose is negotiated, what you end up with is by the dictionary definition not submission. There is no submission without a yielding to authority, and there cannot be yielding to authority if the authority needs your permission before they're allowed to make a rule. I didn't define the words... they were there before I even learned the language. The fact that you don't like them doesn't change what they are.

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