RE: Papa John's Loses Dough

RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (Full Version)

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MrRodgers -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/10/2017 7:16:30 PM)
Poor baby, a fucking billionaire saw his stock plummet $70 million in 1 day. Fuck him, I couldn't care less. The NFL is taking a hit because the fickle football fan doesn't think we have a right to certain displays of dissent. Fuck them, I couldn't care less. The only reason all of them owners/players/management/coaching, make/have as much as they do by a full measure, is the taxpayers and govt. The NFL itself is a non-profit corp., has no federal tax as it divides (shares all revenues equally) all proceeds above a league stipend. The NFL also enjoys an anti-trust exemption and billion$ in taxpayer handouts. I couldn't give a fuck what happens except that it might take some of my action. Professional sports in its entirety, is point spread, moneyline and over/under, in my book. The rest is conversation.

LadyPact -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/11/2017 8:53:26 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV I think the most disappointing things for the franchise has been that the taking a knee controversy has completely overshadowed what the Cowboys and Jimmy Jones himself have done to raise & contribute money towards Hurricane Harvey relief. They certainly didn't get enough 'feel good press' time from that before the Anthem thing hit. And I think that kind of stuff (the good news stuff) is what people need to see from the NFL to get viewership back to where they want it. I think it's always important to see the sports teams do community outreach whenever possible, but especially when your community is hurting like that. I agree with you on this, completely. They could absolutely do better in the 'feel good press' area. Not just disaster relief, but go back to spotlighting players visiting schools to promote literacy and stuff like participating in the Make a Wish Foundation. quote: I think all of this was an attack by an irresponsible Twitterer-In-Chief that had nothing to bitch about at 3am that night because Rosie O'Donnell was quietly shooting a TV show, SNL was on hiatus for the summer still, and nobody had bothered to tell him that he was President of Puerto Rico & the Virgin Islands yet. Trump made the conversation far more public than it ever should have been, purposefully sabotaging the league because they wouldn't sell his ever-bankrupting ass a team however long ago. If nobody else mentions it, I found this amusing. [;)] The easiest way to distract the American public from actual issues is to make something out of nothing. I'll give credit where it's due. Trump's good at that. <Trimmed some.> quote: I don't watch much TV, so TV advertising doesn't impact my decisions on buying food. I do use coupons that are mailed out from time to time and I don't get any of those for Papa John's. But I tend to order pizza from Domino's because they're the only ones that will deliver to my house. If Pizza Hut has a better deal or a good rice on specialty pizzas, then I'll pick that up on the way home. And if I ever got fliers from Papa John's, I'd probably order from them too. That puts you in a market that is rather obscure and coming really close to being obsolete. The 'offer only good when presenting coupon' thing isn't what most chains are going for, so except for that reminder deal that you get in the mail, they are pretty much useless. Every coupon that you're using is already in every fast food chain's system. All you ever have to do is ask. For a while there, the Papa Johns thing was smart because their advertising spots during games offered promo codes that would only be accepted during the televised event. It helped to make Sundays and Mondays bigger sales nights when off season, those nights languished. (I can't say much about the change since Thursday night football became a thing.) quote: To my knowledge, there is currently no boycott against NFL advertisers. We aren't seeing McDonald's, Geico, or any beer or car company claiming the NFL is hurting their business. So I think it's safe to say that other factors are a bigger issue for Papa John's, but Papa & Jimmy don't want to see it that way. There's a key element that you're not really presenting. McDonald's, Geico, Doritos, and Budwiser don't have the same type of sales spikes during televised play. The stuff that you buy prior to the game (food, alcohol, etc.) is spread out in sales during the week. As trivia, SuperBowl Sunday is still in the top five highest sales day of the entire year. The others are Halloween, New Year's Eve, the day before Thanksgiving, and New Year's Day.

bounty44 -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/11/2017 9:19:49 AM)
i think another consideration is that papa john's is an "official sponsor" of the nfl, and no other companies advertising on tv have that designation. while I hold to a statement I made earlier in the thread, that less people are seeing the commercials because they aren't watching the games, I will still allow for the possibility that some people aren't buying the pizza simply because of its association with the league. on another hand, and id have to study this to speak more than speculatively, im going to guess that papa john's commercials are more prominent on and around game day, as opposed to spread out through the week like so many other commercials are.

DaddySatyr -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/11/2017 11:48:43 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bounty44 i think another consideration is that papa john's is an "official sponsor" of the nfl, and no other companies advertising on tv have that designation. while I hold to a statement I made earlier in the thread, that less people are seeing the commercials because they aren't watching the games, I will still allow for the possibility that some people aren't buying the pizza simply because of its association with the league. on another hand, and id have to study this to speak more than speculatively, im going to guess that papa john's commercials are more prominent on and around game day, as opposed to spread out through the week like so many other commercials are. I think someone also specifically mentioned "Budweiser" earlier in the thread (I'm not going to go search it. I'm confident it happened). I am almost positive (although I could be wrong) the NFL has a set of standards for who (corporations) can be "official sponsors". I believe alcohol companies and certain "supplements" (those in which NFL players cannot partake) can *never* be deemed an "Official Sponsor of the NFL". Sure, they can buy advertising time, but I'm almost positive they can't use that moniker. Not only the timing of Papa John's commercials vís-à-vís game day/time, but also the fact that his commercials have been using one of the "great faces" of the NFL for a couple of years. Manning, J.J. Watts, Joe Montana ... I'm sure there have been a couple of others ... Papa John's threw in their lot with the NFL because, at the time, the NFL was on the rise. It seemed like a GREAT business move. Today, not so much. Peace, Michael

LadyPact -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/11/2017 11:48:48 PM)
It's actually rather interesting because anybody evaluating the situation has to look at multiple aspects. It's valid to say that NFL game viewership is down, which does lead to fewer people seeing commercials to spur people into wanting to order delivered food in the first place. The market is split because there really are more options now than there have been in the past, so consumers have more options. Other types of fast food are jumping on the delivery wagon, so people have more choices in practically every city. Some of the names to throw out there are establishments like Buffalo Wild Wings, sandwich franchises like Jimmy Johns and Panera Bread, and so on. Papa John's hasn't done a whole lot to keep up with expanding their menu. On the other hand, Domino's and Pizza Hut have. They've branched out to include pastas, wings, sandwiches and other food types that competitors offer.

DaddySatyr -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 12:07:58 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact Papa John's hasn't done a whole lot to keep up with expanding their menu. On the other hand, Domino's and Pizza Hut have. They've branched out to include pastas, wings, sandwiches and other food types that competitors offer. Gun-to-my-head, if I *had* to order pizza while watching a game and it *had* to be one of the big national chains, Papa John's was always my choice (when I lived in New Jersey. This place is destitute and very few national pizza companies can be found that are close enough to be delivered/brought home hot). However, I know many fans that have a "game day ritual". I understand some superstitions in sports. Some guys won't shave while they're on a winning streak, etc., but I have never understood fans doing that and thinking it affects the outcome of the game, but those fans do exist. Papa John's may not have changed much of their recipe because it was working. They were growing. Suddenly, when the multi-millionaire "oppressed" players started taking a knee, Papa John's menu was the issue. I know. I know. "Correlation doesn't mean causation", but sometimes, it does. Michael I feel like I also need to add (yet again) that my real issue isn't with the poor, "oppressed" man-babies on the sidelines. My *real* issue in all of this is with the NFL not bothering to enforce their own edicts. They CHOSE to ignore their own guidelines and pick a side and about 3.5 million people believe the NFL chose the wrong side. The trickle down affects can't (I don't think) be ignored. M.P.C.

bounty44 -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 3:41:32 AM)
what we're all talking about here essentially, in statistics, is called a regression analysis. we're wondering about and positing multiple variables and trying to determine which variables are contributory to a decline in sales and to what extent they are. regression analyses are still "correlation" in nature, but given enough information going in, one can make the qualitative argument that a change in x causes a change in y. what we really mean when we say "correlation doesn't mean causation" is, we either have not run the right statistical analysis, or more importantly, we havent examined and/or presented the listener with all the relevant and necessary information to "make the case." im hard pressed to believe a corporation like papa john's doesn't have people doing the appropriate market analyses---and so when the owner says "the nfl is hurting sales," again, im inclined to believe him, even taking into account that he might have a strong personal opinion that runs contrary to players "taking a knee" and the nfl doing nothing about it.

Edwird -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 5:37:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyPact quote: ORIGINAL: JVoV I think the most disappointing things for the franchise has been that the taking a knee controversy has completely overshadowed what the Cowboys and Jimmy Jones himself have done to raise & contribute money towards Hurricane Harvey relief. They certainly didn't get enough 'feel good press' time from that before the Anthem thing hit. And I think that kind of stuff (the good news stuff) is what people need to see from the NFL to get viewership back to where they want it. I think it's always important to see the sports teams do community outreach whenever possible, but especially when your community is hurting like that. I agree with you on this, completely. They could absolutely do better in the 'feel good press' area. Not just disaster relief, but go back to spotlighting players visiting schools to promote literacy and stuff like participating in the Make a Wish Foundation. quote: I think all of this was an attack by an irresponsible Twitterer-In-Chief that had nothing to bitch about at 3am that night because Rosie O'Donnell was quietly shooting a TV show, SNL was on hiatus for the summer still, and nobody had bothered to tell him that he was President of Puerto Rico & the Virgin Islands yet. Trump made the conversation far more public than it ever should have been, purposefully sabotaging the league because they wouldn't sell his ever-bankrupting ass a team however long ago. If nobody else mentions it, I found this amusing. [;)] The easiest way to distract the American public from actual issues is to make something out of nothing. I'll give credit where it's due. Trump's good at that. <Trimmed some.> quote: I don't watch much TV, so TV advertising doesn't impact my decisions on buying food. I do use coupons that are mailed out from time to time and I don't get any of those for Papa John's. But I tend to order pizza from Domino's because they're the only ones that will deliver to my house. If Pizza Hut has a better deal or a good rice on specialty pizzas, then I'll pick that up on the way home. And if I ever got fliers from Papa John's, I'd probably order from them too. That puts you in a market that is rather obscure and coming really close to being obsolete. The 'offer only good when presenting coupon' thing isn't what most chains are going for, so except for that reminder deal that you get in the mail, they are pretty much useless. Every coupon that you're using is already in every fast food chain's system. All you ever have to do is ask. For a while there, the Papa Johns thing was smart because their advertising spots during games offered promo codes that would only be accepted during the televised event. It helped to make Sundays and Mondays bigger sales nights when off season, those nights languished. (I can't say much about the change since Thursday night football became a thing.) quote: To my knowledge, there is currently no boycott against NFL advertisers. We aren't seeing McDonald's, Geico, or any beer or car company claiming the NFL is hurting their business. So I think it's safe to say that other factors are a bigger issue for Papa John's, but Papa & Jimmy don't want to see it that way. There's a key element that you're not really presenting. McDonald's, Geico, Doritos, and Budwiser don't have the same type of sales spikes during televised play. The stuff that you buy prior to the game (food, alcohol, etc.) is spread out in sales during the week. As trivia, SuperBowl Sunday is still in the top five highest sales day of the entire year. The others are Halloween, New Year's Eve, the day before Thanksgiving, and New Year's Day. Excellent analysis Lady Pact, and JVoV too. Both you guys left out the Viagra adverts in the discussion. Fine by me.

Edwird -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 6:07:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bounty44 what we're all talking about here essentially, in statistics, is called a regression analysis. we're wondering about and positing multiple variables and trying to determine which variables are contributory to a decline in sales and to what extent they are. Regression analysis involves ONE variable. quote: regression analyses are still "correlation" in nature, but given enough information going in, one can make the qualitative argument that a change in x causes a change in y. So, is it x or is it y being the "multi-variable," here? Either situation would be a first re any math or statistics class I ever took. quote: what we really mean when we say "correlation doesn't mean causation" is, we either have not run the right statistical analysis, or more importantly, we havent examined and/or presented the listener with all the relevant and necessary information to "make the case." Right. So this is why 40 QBs have been signed on to NFL teams since Colin Kaepernik was released, at least 35 of whom aren't nearly as good; he hasn't played in the NFL for a year and a half, but Papa John wants to cry, and idiots like you listen to him. Crybabys of like mind. quote: im hard pressed to believe a corporation like papa john's doesn't have people doing the appropriate market analyses- Lady Pact and JVoV's contibutions above explain all that, not that you could understand, apparently. But they aren't here for you. No thinking person is here for you. It's up to you to dig yourself out of your own ignorance. They probably don't know anything about least-squares regression, but they don't need to for this discussion. Their input indicates ten X more understanding of the situation than yours (more than mine, too), by a long shot.

DaddySatyr -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 9:11:16 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bounty44 regression analyses are still "correlation" in nature, but given enough information going in, one can make the qualitative argument that a change in x causes a change in y. what we really mean when we say "correlation doesn't mean causation" is, we either have not run the right statistical analysis, or more importantly, we havent examined and/or presented the listener with all the relevant and necessary information to "make the case." im hard pressed to believe a corporation like papa john's doesn't have people doing the appropriate market analyses---and so when the owner says "the nfl is hurting sales," again, im inclined to believe him, even taking into account that he might have a strong personal opinion that runs contrary to players "taking a knee" and the nfl doing nothing about it. That's kind of where I was, about the level of "professionalism" when running a large corporation. A company CAN'T get to be that big unless they do it the "right way". Papa was doing it the "right way"; right up until the NFL protests. At that point, he decided to make his menu shittier. The man who some of his earliest commercials was: "Better Ingredients. Better Pizza. Papa John's" decided to change up that whole business model and go with less than quality ingredients. He brought in inferior ovens. He changed his "recipe" (which would really be ingredients, for the most part. Baking a pizza ain't rocket science) and he changed his advertising (the whole world HATES Payton Manning and Joe Montana) all around the same time that baby-men in the NFL decided to join in with Kaepernik's "I-Need-A-Job" protest. That makes PERFECT sense (if you're a lefty that supports disrespect of the flag and anthem) [:D] Peace, Michael

bounty44 -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 9:21:02 AM)
its all a total coincidence!

DaddySatyr -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/12/2017 9:28:30 AM)
Not "coincidence", bounty. An evil plot by John to set up his business for a loss so he could blame the NFL and show his true white supremacist colors by not supporting poor Kaepernik (who couldn't QB a football game better than some high schoolers, at the end), the man who is half black and raised by two oppressive white people (who adopted him because they are racists, also). It is a vast Anti-NFL conspiracy that dates back to ... well, we know when it dates back to. Peace, Michael

MasterDrakk -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/13/2017 4:34:38 AM)
To the OP where people kneeling has brought down a disgusting pizza chain. We have the exact time and date of where this dates to.

MercTech -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/14/2017 10:03:16 AM)
I'm not a NFL fan. I think the last time I watched a professional football game all the way through was the Superbowl in 1986 and that was because I knew the score before the delayed broadcast at the enlisted club in Japan and had a large bet going with a drunk serviceman that thought I was insane when I mentioned who would win. <evil grin> What comes to mind when I see any professional football controversy is the words of the author Ed Howdershelt. I can think of nothing more irrelevant to my life than a bunch of burley guys dressed in spandex Capris pants trying to insert what looks like a leather suppository into an opponent's "end zone".

Danemora -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/15/2017 7:00:53 AM)
~FRing it~ Well, lookie lookie.... Sounds like Papa John realizes he bit off way more than he could chew after all. Papa John’s apologizes for CEO’s ‘divisive’ NFL anthem remarks, supports player’s ‘right to protest’

WhoreMods -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/15/2017 7:08:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Danemora ~FRing it~ Well, lookie lookie.... Sounds like Papa John realizes he bit off way more than he could chew after all. Papa John’s apologizes for CEO’s ‘divisive’ NFL anthem remarks, supports player’s ‘right to protest’ What a surprise.

Danemora -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/15/2017 7:14:14 AM)
Im betting the ol' profit margin just couldnt take another day of getting beat down like Ike did Tina [:)]

WhoreMods -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/15/2017 7:15:19 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Danemora Im betting the ol' profit margin just couldnt take another day of getting beat down like Ike did Tina anymore [:)] Stranger things have happened.

sloguy02246 -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/16/2017 11:35:56 AM)
FR - Even better - the last sentence in the AP reporting of the company's "apology": "Company stock has fallen by nearly 13 percent since Schnatter's comments."

bounty44 -> RE: Papa John's Loses Dough (11/27/2017 7:33:40 AM)
"Failing NFL Ratings Slump Continues" quote: Well, who would have thought that putting out a bad product and spitting on the American flag would be bad for ratings. The National Football League has seen its week eleven ratings and they’re not good: one million fewer viewers from last year. The NY Post reported that the ongoing battle between Jerry Jones, owner of the Dallas Cowboys, and NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell has been the center of NFL coverage. Goodell has put up insane contract demands of a $50 million salary, along with free flights, and health care for his family—for life. This coming from a man who has failed miserably to handle the national anthem protests that has engulfed the league in controversy: The TV audience for NFL games steepened its slide in Week 11, losing 1 million viewers versus last year’s season-to-date average. The 6.3 percent slump — worsening from comparable declines of 5.6 to 5.7 percent during the previous three weeks... Most thought Donald Trump picked a cultural battle he couldn't win when he trashed NFL players who took a knee during the Star-Spangled Banner back in September. Well, that just wasn’t the case, as the overwhelming majority thought taking a knee during the anthem was unpatriotic and disrespectful. Also, former 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick, not Trump, fired the first salvo... https://townhall.com/tipsheet/mattvespa/2017/11/26/failing-nfl-ratings-slump-continues-n2413489 watched part of the bills/chiefs game yesterday and noticed a lot of empty seats at arrowhead.

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