quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

Someone please tell me, where is all this space for embassies and consuls is gonna come from ..... in Jerusalem"
what land is going to be used?

quote:

ORIGINAL: RottenJohnny

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
LOL... the majority of world leaders openly condemned Trump's incompetence, but now because Guatemala has decided to jeopardize their international reputation as a drug lab and join Trump. suddenly the rest of the world is going to move their embassies as well.

I'm posing a question, not making a prediction.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
The peace process has been stalled for many years now, with no hope of restarting it under the current Israeli PM. Israel can try again when Bibi calls for elections (probably 2019) to get some competent leadership. I hope Tzivi Lipni runs again as leader of Zionist Union. They have 24 seats in the Knesset now.

What our President has just done, is disqualify the US as a broker in this deal. The world increasingly is seeing the US as irrelevant under this administration, and this is just another example It will take the next President years to repair this mess.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Maybe he will be the last US president.
think on that!!!
LOL

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Maybe he will be the last US president.
think on that!!!
LOL

I know you're just poking fun, but how would that happen?

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

LOL... the majority of world leaders openly condemned Trump's incompetence, but now because Guatemala has decided to jeopardize their international reputation as a drug lab and join Trump. suddenly the rest of the world is going to move their embassies as well.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
The peace process has been stalled for many years now, with no hope of restarting it under the current Israeli PM. Israel can try again when Bibi calls for elections (probably 2019) to get some competent leadership. I hope Tzivi Lipni runs again as leader of Zionist Union. They have 24 seats in the Knesset now.

What our President has just done, is disqualify the US as a broker in this deal. The world increasingly is seeing the US as irrelevant under this administration, and this is just another example It will take the next President years to repair this mess.

Hold on a sec... why the fuck does the US have to have any hand in "brokering in" any peace deal there?

How about this 'hand': Everyone leave Israel alone or we'll come to it's aid. Israel, stick to your borders and stop poking the bear; if you don't, we'll let you get your comeuppance, but we'll make sure you're not destroyed.

We're big enough, and strong enough to follow through with both parts of that "deal." The borders have been set by the UN. Any Israeli settlements outside of those borders are not Israeli territory and Israel has no real right to defend those territories. Israeli foreign policy might decide it has the authority to "rescue" Israeli citizens outside of Israel, but the rules of the land outside of Israel are not up to Israel to decide.

There will have to be a 3-state solution, not a 2-state. Whoever the fuck thinks that the Giza Strip, completely separated from the rest of Palestinian lands, is going to be part of Palestine, is fucked in the head. 3 States: Israel, "Giza," and "Palestine." The quotation marks around the two are only there to signify what they are called currently, with acknowledgement that they will get to decide what they are called themselves All 3 states get to decide their own policies, separate from each other. If elections put Hamas in power in Giza, as the State government, then whoever is leading Hamas will be the leader of "Giza." Same with "Palestine" and Israel.

Israel decide (in 1980) that it's portion of Jerusalem is it's capital. Who is allowed to change that, other than Israel and the Israelis?

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Maybe he will be the last US president.
think on that!!!
LOL

I know you're just poking fun, but how would that happen?

I would say a series of 9/11 scale attacks.
The first would see a return to the creeping fascism of the Bush era, but of course made worse by the already present racism, sexism, alt-rightism.
The second, coming a year or so later, would take it even further... Bannon's 'holy war' versus all of Islam would be a given.
After the third, fourth, fifth, etc... pretty much everyone would be looking for a solution, and their desperation would lead them straight into the arms of the wannabe strongman, whose already openly stated willingness to commit atrocities and genocides would suddenly hold a lot of appeal.

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Maybe he will be the last US president.
think on that!!!
LOL

I know you're just poking fun, but how would that happen?

I would say a series of 9/11 scale attacks.
The first would see a return to the creeping fascism of the Bush era, but of course made worse by the already present racism, sexism, alt-rightism.
The second, coming a year or so later, would take it even further... Bannon's 'holy war' versus all of Islam would be a given.
After the third, fourth, fifth, etc... pretty much everyone would be looking for a solution, and their desperation would lead them straight into the arms of the wannabe strongman, whose already openly stated willingness to commit atrocities and genocides would suddenly hold a lot of appeal.

You have an incredibly shitty view of US citizens. Won't happen.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
The peace process has been stalled for many years now, with no hope of restarting it under the current Israeli PM. Israel can try again when Bibi calls for elections (probably 2019) to get some competent leadership. I hope Tzivi Lipni runs again as leader of Zionist Union. They have 24 seats in the Knesset now.
What our President has just done, is disqualify the US as a broker in this deal. The world increasingly is seeing the US as irrelevant under this administration, and this is just another example It will take the next President years to repair this mess.

Hold on a sec... why the fuck does the US have to have any hand in "brokering in" any peace deal there?
How about this 'hand': Everyone leave Israel alone or we'll come to it's aid. Israel, stick to your borders and stop poking the bear; if you don't, we'll let you get your comeuppance, but we'll make sure you're not destroyed.
We're big enough, and strong enough to follow through with both parts of that "deal." The borders have been set by the UN. Any Israeli settlements outside of those borders are not Israeli territory and Israel has no real right to defend those territories. Israeli foreign policy might decide it has the authority to "rescue" Israeli citizens outside of Israel, but the rules of the land outside of Israel are not up to Israel to decide.
There will have to be a 3-state solution, not a 2-state. Whoever the fuck thinks that the Giza Strip, completely separated from the rest of Palestinian lands, is going to be part of Palestine, is fucked in the head. 3 States: Israel, "Giza," and "Palestine." The quotation marks around the two are only there to signify what they are called currently, with acknowledgement that they will get to decide what they are called themselves All 3 states get to decide their own policies, separate from each other. If elections put Hamas in power in Giza, as the State government, then whoever is leading Hamas will be the leader of "Giza." Same with "Palestine" and Israel.
Israel decide (in 1980) that it's portion of Jerusalem is it's capital. Who is allowed to change that, other than Israel and the Israelis?

ok... Lots to unpack.
First of all... Yes I agree. The unspoken "3rd state". What to do about Gaza. If there were ever to be a 2-state solution with Israel and the West Bank, Hamas would be isolated and would disintegrate (IMO) in Gaza, but they have been, and will continue to be elected there.
As for all of these people who, in your estimation, have been the recipient of cranial intercourse, that would be every Arab in the region. But, yes, theoretically, Gaza could be a 3rd state, run by a terrorist organization.

quote:

NOW... As for the UN borders.... Israel has expanded well beyond them dozens of times in all directions (except for West (that whole Mediterranean Sea thing)). To be fair, in some instances they seized land when they were attacked (e.g. Golan Heights, Gaza (Syria, and Egypt respectively)). In other instances (e.g. the West Bank), they just built homes and claimed the land.
There is no way Israel will ever go back to the 1947 UN borders, even under a competent government.

quote:

There is no way the US will ever enforce any rules on Israel, so long as politicians here have AIPAC in their pockets, and of course the current administration in Israel has gone even farther, by meddling in US politics, and appearing on Hannity. (That was painful to see)

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
How could you possibly think that a country willing to make TRUMP its leader is incapable of turning to fascism??
There wasn't even an actual crisis and they fell for his strongman bullshit... so in the aftermath of a real crisis they would suddenly become rational?

• A Conservative interpretation of the US Constitution
  
• Personal Responsibility
  
• Help for the truly needy
  
• Limited Government
  
• Consumption Tax (non-profit charities and food exempt)
  

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker
How could you possibly think that a country willing to make TRUMP its leader is incapable of turning to fascism??
There wasn't even an actual crisis and they fell for his strongman bullshit... so in the aftermath of a real crisis they would suddenly become rational?

I do believe more people would be involved and we do now have some evidence of what Trump at the helm would look like. Didn't have that last year.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri

quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterJaguar01
The peace process has been stalled for many years now, with no hope of restarting it under the current Israeli PM. Israel can try again when Bibi calls for elections (probably 2019) to get some competent leadership. I hope Tzivi Lipni runs again as leader of Zionist Union. They have 24 seats in the Knesset now.
What our President has just done, is disqualify the US as a broker in this deal. The world increasingly is seeing the US as irrelevant under this administration, and this is just another example It will take the next President years to repair this mess.

Hold on a sec... why the fuck does the US have to have any hand in "brokering in" any peace deal there?
How about this 'hand': Everyone leave Israel alone or we'll come to it's aid. Israel, stick to your borders and stop poking the bear; if you don't, we'll let you get your comeuppance, but we'll make sure you're not destroyed.
We're big enough, and strong enough to follow through with both parts of that "deal." The borders have been set by the UN. Any Israeli settlements outside of those borders are not Israeli territory and Israel has no real right to defend those territories. Israeli foreign policy might decide it has the authority to "rescue" Israeli citizens outside of Israel, but the rules of the land outside of Israel are not up to Israel to decide.
There will have to be a 3-state solution, not a 2-state. Whoever the fuck thinks that the Giza Strip, completely separated from the rest of Palestinian lands, is going to be part of Palestine, is fucked in the head. 3 States: Israel, "Giza," and "Palestine." The quotation marks around the two are only there to signify what they are called currently, with acknowledgement that they will get to decide what they are called themselves All 3 states get to decide their own policies, separate from each other. If elections put Hamas in power in Giza, as the State government, then whoever is leading Hamas will be the leader of "Giza." Same with "Palestine" and Israel.
Israel decide (in 1980) that it's portion of Jerusalem is it's capital. Who is allowed to change that, other than Israel and the Israelis?

ok... Lots to unpack.
First of all... Yes I agree. The unspoken "3rd state". What to do about Gaza. If there were ever to be a 2-state solution with Israel and the West Bank, Hamas would be isolated and would disintegrate (IMO) in Gaza, but they have been, and will continue to be elected there.
As for all of these people who, in your estimation, have been the recipient of cranial intercourse, that would be every Arab in the region. But, yes, theoretically, Gaza could be a 3rd state, run by a terrorist organization.

Fuuuuck! I forgot about the Golan Heights. Soooo, 4 state approach, since there are 4 distinct territories? "Gaza," "Palestine," the "Golan Heights," and Israel.

From what I understand, there are two "arms" of Hamas; one that governs, one that fights. Whether or not that's true, I can't say for sure. But, Hamas has already been elected to govern Gaza, hasn't it?

quote:

NOW... As for the UN borders.... Israel has expanded well beyond them dozens of times in all directions (except for West (that whole Mediterranean Sea thing)). To be fair, in some instances they seized land when they were attacked (e.g. Golan Heights, Gaza (Syria, and Egypt respectively)). In other instances (e.g. the West Bank), they just built homes and claimed the land.
There is no way Israel will ever go back to the 1947 UN borders, even under a competent government.

The 1947 borders didn't include Jerusalem, but the 1949 Armistice Line essentially granted West Jerusalem to Israel. That's where the borders "should be," imo.

quote:

There is no way the US will ever enforce any rules on Israel, so long as politicians here have AIPAC in their pockets, and of course the current administration in Israel has gone even farther, by meddling in US politics, and appearing on Hannity. (That was painful to see)

You watch more Hannity than I do. lol That being said, why is it international government officials can't be on US news/opinion shows?

Your comment about AIPAC isn't disagreed on, but I would also have to add that, in general, Congress and the President are too bought, which is a consistent critique and complaint of mine.