39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (Full Version)

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thetammyjo -> 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 8:45:35 AM)

Did anyone else see this gallup poll?

http://rawstory.com/showarticle.php?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.editorandpublisher.com%2Feandp%2Fnews%2Farticle_display.jsp%3Fvnu_content_id%3D1002984956

I'd link to the poll itself but you have to be a paying member of the Gallup Poll website to view it.

In short it says:
22% of those polled would not want to have a Muslim as a neighbor
34% think Muslims in American support al-Qaeda
49% think Muslim-Americans are loyal to America
39% think Muslims in American (Americans or not) should carry a special I.D.
39% say they have prejudiece against Muslims
44% think Muslims hold religious views that are too extreme

The I.D. thing is what is upsetting me -- the rest is people opinions, but an I.D. would be something you force on others.

I don't even know what to say to this. I'm just feeling a bit more like I'm in the 1930s in Germany that I did yesterday.

As a historian I am scared.
As an American I am afraid.
As a Christian I am horrified.




mnottertail -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 8:52:25 AM)

or like 1940s in Hawaii and California
or in the town of Heinola, Minnesota (but I'm norwegian, truely, my name is Hans, not Horst.......LOL) or all across this great country of ours.

Ron 




sub4hire -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 8:52:42 AM)

"In every case, Americans who actually know any Muslims are more sympathethic.The poll was taken at the end of July and surveyed 1,007 adult Americans."
 
The above was taken from your poll.  One thousand people is not an accurate cross segment of society as we know it.  Aside from the fact that could have been one small town in america.
 
I'm not sure 4 out of every ten americans would want to force an ID on muslims.
We really live in a country that hasn't been truly free for decades.  It is upsetting. 




Alumbrado -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 8:53:04 AM)

Even without reading the wording of the questions to see if this was a push poll (not that that would ever happen [8|] ), it shows that the majority of the people selected to participate do not agree with these things.

Or maybe it just wouldn't have the same scare tactic effect to say that 78% of Americans would want to have a Muslim as a neighbor.




MaidSlaveWANTED -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 8:56:53 AM)

Well its not surprising when in the buildup to the Iraqi occupation and slaughter the majority of Americans thought Saddam Hussain was involved in 9/11!

Such ignorance is why America is drowning in the ditch they've dug.




thetammyjo -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 9:16:52 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

Even without reading the wording of the questions to see if this was a push poll (not that that would ever happen [8|] ), it shows that the majority of the people selected to participate do not agree with these things.

Or maybe it just wouldn't have the same scare tactic effect to say that 78% of Americans would want to have a Muslim as a neighbor.


None of that was upsetting me.

It was the I.D. Thing.

As a historian this just really frightens me when I look at earlier societies who actually used such tactics.

It was rarely the majority of that society that supported it but it was enough to make it happen. Usually (in fact I can't think of a single case where this didn't happen) such identifications were the first step toward increased violence toward the identified group and an increase in militant political policies.

Remember it doesn't take the majority of Americans to decide political or social policy only a majority of those who actually bother to vote or speak up.




popeye1250 -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 9:30:30 AM)

I don't think there's a lot of muslims in this state. (South Carolina)
They're real big on Pork Barbeque here and you can often be driving down the road through smoke wafting across from a "Pig Pickin" in this area.
North Carolina is like that too.
"Carolina Barbeque!" MMMMMmmmM! Good!
If I ever had muslim neighbors I wouldn't have them for long.
I'd be stinking up this place cooking bacon everyday. ("AHHHH! Alah Akbar!")
I like the way Larry the Cable Guy explains it; "I got nothing against muslims, I hope everyone of them gets a wicker basket full of snakes for Christmas!" lol
"And it's against their "religion" to drink alchohol so I'd want to invite them to a pig barbeque and introduce them to my friend Jack Daniels!"
I love Larry the Cable Guy!




Rule -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 9:39:53 AM)

Yep, it sounds like a genocide against muslims is in the works.




Alumbrado -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 9:40:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

None of that was upsetting me.

It was the I.D. Thing.

As a historian this just really frightens me when I look at earlier societies who actually used such tactics.

It was rarely the majority of that society that supported it but it was enough to make it happen. Usually (in fact I can't think of a single case where this didn't happen) such identifications were the first step toward increased violence toward the identified group and an increase in militant political policies.

Remember it doesn't take the majority of Americans to decide political or social policy only a majority of those who actually bother to vote or speak up.


It is still a media opinion poll that says almost 2/3 of the respondents don't want IDs.

Last week it was a different non-scientific poll that said that X% of those asked thought that something else should be done or not done a certain way.

Bread and circuses...you should get that historical reference.




MistressLorelei -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 9:49:28 AM)

If said tagging should ever happen... then we should also register and tag everyone who has proven themselves racist.  Racism is a bigger threat to society than most anything..... now, and historically.

Tagging could begin here at CM... I have seen plenty of racist remarks flying around .




thetammyjo -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 10:12:54 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alumbrado

quote:

ORIGINAL: thetammyjo

None of that was upsetting me.

It was the I.D. Thing.

As a historian this just really frightens me when I look at earlier societies who actually used such tactics.

It was rarely the majority of that society that supported it but it was enough to make it happen. Usually (in fact I can't think of a single case where this didn't happen) such identifications were the first step toward increased violence toward the identified group and an increase in militant political policies.

Remember it doesn't take the majority of Americans to decide political or social policy only a majority of those who actually bother to vote or speak up.


It is still a media opinion poll that says almost 2/3 of the respondents don't want IDs.

Last week it was a different non-scientific poll that said that X% of those asked thought that something else should be done or not done a certain way.

Bread and circuses...you should get that historical reference.


Thank you very much but my knowledge of history is partly why this offends me so.

This is what I posted on another website about this in my attempt to help calm myself down:

(below is my attempt to be sarcastic because I am utterly offended by this I.D. idea)

Come on, you 39%!
Only I.D.s?

Please, how could you possible be checking that all the time?

Why not have them sew something on all their clothes or get a tattoo on their heads.

Those are things you could see and it would make your prejudices so much easier to play out then.

I mean really, haven't you 39% learned anything at all from history? Get it together and really push for some strong fascism not this weak stuff. Embrace your fears fully!




SirKenin -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 10:30:46 AM)

I propose big brown (or red) dots to be sewn on the clothing.

Ridiculous.  People are so paranoid.

What sickens Me is how many in this forum are using all this terrorist news to take the opportunity to be so openly racist and bigotted.  And people had the nerve to call Me racist.  That is almost funny.




Kirei -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 10:32:03 AM)

  For one thing this poll like others is sided one way in its questions.   The biggest one you see is muslim-american, just like african-american.....every notice something wrong about this?  Why aren't they called american-muslims?  That is what they really are, and what they would feel better about being called I would hope.
  Phil Donahue talked with a large outdoor group of people in Miami.  Most called themselves cuban-americans....what you found out in the show is that these people were more concerned about cuba and changing it, then they were about living and being in the US.  When he asked why don't you just say your americans of cuban decent...they got angry at him and said things about being loyal to the homeland. 
People born here are not always aware that when someone imigrates to this country, and becomes a citizen they forgo all pervious loyalities to their homeland, and pledge their loyalty and allegence to the US. 
 
There also was another poll conducted not too long ago, and it showed that 20%-30% of the population of the US wanted an authoritarian government for the US.  Think about his carefully now...that means that about 25% 1in4 people, wants to follow a single authority or principal.  As an american this concerns me greatly, more so than the terror problem.  The reason being if all these people start voting and there is no one willing to say, counter, or try to find a balance or happy medium this country and all its fancy and great freedoms could end very quickly.

Koneko




justheather -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 10:54:09 AM)

I think that Mormons, Born-Again-Christians and Jehovah's Witnesses should have to wear I.D.'s so you know when it is unsafe to answer your door.

Oh, and people stupid enough to believe we are somehow "safer" without civil liberties should have to wear big red W's on their foreheads.





Mercnbeth -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 11:14:11 AM)

quote:

In short it says:
22% of those polled would not want to have a Muslim as a neighbor
34% think Muslims in American support al-Qaeda
49% think Muslim-Americans are loyal to America
39% think Muslims in American (Americans or not) should carry a special I.D.
39% say they have prejudiece against Muslims
44% think Muslims hold religious views that are too extreme


TammyJo, 

The US has very simple minded citizens. Ideally they want to live, work, love, have kids, and be left alone. They've live most of their life worrying about the price of gas. They hate that the price goes up, but they need to drive every day so as much as they complain they really can’t put a face to direct their anger. In this case they have a face, and they have practical pragmatic reason for their anger.

Here are are sampling of events throughout the world from 2000 - 2003. What do they have in common? All were perpetrated by Muslims. 100% In most cases they were happy to take responsibility. 100%.

I didn't include 9/11 because some see that as a self inflicted US initiated event. I cut it off for 2003 because after all, we invaded Iraq in March and after that we and the rest of the world "deserved" it.

I don't support any movement to segregation or tag wearing. I don't believe in prejudice against any group. I think that we are at war with a religion. At the very least, they are at war with us. I can not find any broadly published evidence from any Muslim leader providing a contrary position. It's so against the nature of US citizens to see a religion as a threat they can't bring themselves to accept the evidence before them. I think our nature to believe that everyone wants freedom and liberty will be our doom. Our very civility and denial in the face of facts is counted on by our adversary and is being used against us.

This isn't about race, or nationality, or sovereignty. Read the position papers stated and published by Muslim leaders. Their followers believe! Why don't we?

I would love for the group to stand up and say this activity doesn't define them.

No other group, nationality, religion, has an active resume quite like this.

quote:


Attack on U.S.S. Cole, October 12, 2000: In Aden, Yemen, a small dingy carrying explosives rammed the destroyer U.S.S. Cole, killing 17 sailors and injuring 39 others. Supporters of Usama Bin Laden were suspected.

Manila Bombing, December 30, 2000: A bomb exploded in a plaza across the street from the U.S. Embassy in Manila, injuring nine persons. The Moro Islamic Liberation Front was likely responsible.

Suicide Bombing in Israel, March 4, 2001: A suicide bomb attack in Netanya killed 3 persons and wounded 65. HAMAS later claimed responsibility.
Bus Stop Bombing, April 22, 2001: A member of HAMAS detonated a bomb he was carrying near a bus stop in Kfar Siva, Israel, killing one person and injuring 60.
Tel-Aviv Nightclub Bombing, June 1, 2001: HAMAS claimed responsibility for the suicide bombing of a popular Israeli nightclub that caused over 140 casualties.

HAMAS Restaurant Bombing, August 9, 2001: A HAMAS-planted bomb detonated in a Jerusalem pizza restaurant, killing 15 people and wounding more than 90. The Israeli response included occupation of Orient House, the Palestine Liberation Organization’s political headquarters in East Jerusalem.

Suicide Bombing in Israel, September 9, 2001: The first suicide bombing carried out by an Israeli Arab killed 3 persons in Nahariya. HAMAS claimed responsibility

Attack on a Church in Pakistan, October 28, 2001: Six masked gunmen shot up a church in Bahawalpur, Pakistan, killing 15 Pakistani Christians. No group claimed responsibility, although various militant Muslim groups were suspected.

Suicide Bombings in Jerusalem, December 1, 2001: Two suicide bombers attacked a Jerusalem shopping mall, killing 10 persons and wounding 170.

Suicide Bombing in Haifa, December 2, 2001: A suicide bomb attack aboard a bus in Haifa, Israel, killed 15 persons and wounded 40. HAMAS claimed responsibility for both this attack and those on December 1 to avenge the death of a HAMAS member at the hands of Israeli forces a week earlier.

Attack on the Indian Parliament, December 13, 2001: Five gunmen attacked the Indian Parliament in New Delhi shortly after it had adjourned. Before security forces killed them, the attackers killed 6 security personnel and a gardener. Indian officials blamed Lashkar-e-Tayyiba and demanded that Pakistan crack down on it and on other Muslim separatist groups in Kashmir.

Kidnapping of Daniel Pearl, January 23, 2002: Armed militants kidnapped Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl in Karachi, Pakistan. Pakistani authorities received a videotape on February 20 depicting Pearl’s murder. His grave was found near Karachi on May 16. Pakistani authorities arrested four suspects. Ringleader Ahmad Omar Saeed Sheikh claimed to have organized Pearl’s kidnapping to protest Pakistan’s subservience to the United States, and had belonged to Jaish-e-Muhammad, an Islamic separatist group in Kashmir. All four suspects were convicted on July 15. Saeed Sheikh was sentenced to death, the others to life imprisonment.

Suicide Bombing in Jerusalem, January 27, 2002: A suicide bomb attack in Jerusalem killed one other person and wounded 100. The incident was the first suicide bombing made by a Palestinian woman.

Suicide Bombing in the West Bank, February 16, 2002: A suicide bombing in an outdoor food court in Karmei Shomron killed 4 persons and wounded 27. Two of the dead and two of the wounded were U.S. citizens. The Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in the West Bank, March 7, 2002: A suicide bombing in a supermarket in the settlement of Ariel wounded 10 persons, one of whom was a U.S. citizen. The PFLP claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in Israel, March 27, 2002: A suicide bombing in a noted restaurant in Netanya, Israel, killed 22 persons and wounded 140. One of the dead was a U.S. citizen. The Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) claimed responsibility.

Temple Bombing in Kashmir, March 30, 2002: A bomb explosion at a Hindu temple in Jammu, Kashmir, killed 10 persons. The Islamic Front claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in the West Bank, March 31, 2002: A suicide bombing near an ambulance station in Efrat wounded four persons, including a U.S. citizen. The al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades claimed responsibility.

Armed attack on Kashmir, April 10, 2002: Armed militants attacked a residence in Gando, Kashmir, killing five persons and wounding four. No group claimed responsibility.

Synagogue Bombing in Tunisia, April 11, 2002: A suicide bomber detonated a truck loaded with propane gas outside a historic synagogue in Djerba, Tunisia. The 16 dead included 11 Germans, one French citizen, and three Tunisians. Twenty-six German tourists were injured. The Islamic Army for the Liberation of the Holy Sites claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in Jerusalem, April 12, 2002: A female suicide bomber killed 6 persons in Jerusalem and wounded 90 others. The al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades claimed responsibility.

Car Bombing in Pakistan, May 8, 2002: A car bomb exploded near a Pakistani navy shuttle bus in Karachi, killing 12 persons and wounding 19. Eleven of the dead and 11 of the wounded were French nationals. Al-Qaida was suspected of the attack.

Parade Bombing in Russia, May 9, 2002: A remotely-controlled bomb exploded near a May Day parade in Kaspiisk, Dagestan, killing 42 persons and wounding 150. Fourteen of the dead and 50 of the wounded were soldiers. Islamists linked to al-Qaida were suspected.

Attack on a Bus in India, May 14, 2002: Militants fired on a passenger bus in Kaluchak, Jammu, killing 7 persons. They then entered a military housing complex and killed 3 soldiers and 7 military dependents before they were killed. The al-Mansooran and Jamiat ul-Mujahedin claimed responsibility.
Car Bombing in Pakistan, June 14, 2002: A car bomb exploded near the U.S. Consulate and the Marriott Hotel in Karachi, Pakistan. Eleven persons were killed and 51 were sounded, including one U.S. and one Japanese citizen. Al Qaida and al-Qanin were suspected.

Suicide Bombing in Jerusalem, June 19, 2002: A suicide bombing at a bus stop in Jerusalem killed 6 persons and wounded 43, including 2 U.S. citizens. The al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in Tel Aviv, July 17, 2002: Two suicide bombers attacked the old bus station in Tel Aviv, Israel, killing 5 persons and wounding 38. The dead included one Romanian and two Chinese; another Romanian was wounded. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility.

Bombing at the Hebrew University, July 31, 2002: A bomb hidden in a bag in the Frank Sinatra International Student Center of Jerusalem’s Hebrew University killed 9 persons and wounded 87. The dead included 5 U.S. citizens and 4 Israelis. The wounded included 4 U.S. citizens, 2 Japanese, and 3 South Koreans. The Islamic Resistance Movement (HAMAS) claimed responsibility.

Suicide Bombing in Israel, August 4, 2002: A suicide bomb attack on a bus in Safed, Israel, killed 9 persons and wounded 50. Two of the dead were Philippine citizens; many of the wounded were soldiers returning from leave. HAMAS claimed responsibility.

Attack on a School in Pakistan, August 5, 2002: Gunmen attacked a Christian school attended by children of missionaries from around the world. Six persons (two security guards, a cook, a carpenter, a receptionist, and a private citizen) were killed and a Philippine citizen was wounded. A group called al-Intigami al-Pakistani claimed responsibility.

Attack on Pilgrims in Kashmir, August 6, 2002: Armed militants attacked a group of Hindu pilgrims with guns and grenades in Pahalgam, Kashmir. Nine persons were killed and 32 were wounded. The Lashkar-e-Tayyiba claimed responsibility.
Car Bomb Explosion in Bali, October 12, 2002: A car bomb exploded outside the Sari Club Discotheque in Denpasar, Bali, Indonesia, killing 202 persons and wounding 300 more. Most of the casualties, including 88 of the dead, were Australian tourists. Seven Americans were among the dead. Al-Qaida claimed responsibility. Two suspects were later arrested and convicted. Iman Samudra, who had trained in Afghanistan with al-Qaeda and was suspected of belonging to Jemaah Islamiya, was sentenced to death on September 10, 2003.
Suicide Bombings in Tel Aviv, January 5, 2003: Two suicide bomb attacks killed 22 and wounded at least 100 persons in Tel Aviv, Israel. Six of the victims were foreign workers. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades claimed responsibility.
Suicide Bomb Attacks in Morocco, May 16, 2003: A team of 12 suicide bombers attacked five targets in Casablanca, Morocco, killing 43 persons and wounding 100. The targets were a Spanish restaurant, a Jewish community, a Jewish cemetery, a hotel, and the Belgian Consulate. The Moroccan Government blamed the Islamist al-Assirat al-Moustaquim (The Righteous Path), but foreign commentators suspected an al-Qaida connection.

Suicide Bomb Attack in Jerusalem, May 18, 2003: A suicide bomb attack on a bus in Jerusalem’s French Hill district killed 7 persons and wounded 20. The bomber was disguised as a religious Jew. HAMAS claimed responsibility.
Suicide Bombing in Afula, May 19, 2003: A suicide bomb attack by a female Palestinian student killed 3 persons and wounded 52 at a shopping mall in Afula, Israel. Both Islamic Jihad and the al-Aqsa Martyrs’ Brigades claimed responsibility.
Suicide Bombing in Jerusalem, June 11, 2003: A suicide bombing aboard a bus in Jerusalem killed 16 persons and wounded at least 70, one of whom died later. HAMAS claimed responsibility, calling it revenge for an Israeli helicopter attack on HAMAS leader Abdelaziz al-Rantisi in Gaza City the day before.
Suicide Bombing in Jerusalem, August 19, 2003: A suicide bombing aboard a bus in Jerusalem killed 20 persons and injured at least 100, one of whom died later. Five of the dead were American citizens. HAMAS and Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility, although HAMAS leader al-Rantisi said that his organization remained committed to the truce while reserving the right to respond to Israeli military actions.
Synagogue Bombings in Istanbul, November 15, 2003: Two suicide truck bombs exploded outside the Neve Shalom and Beth Israel synagogues in Istanbul, killing 25 persons and wounding at least 300 more. The initial claim of responsibility came from a Turkish militant group, the Great Eastern Islamic Raiders’ Front, but Turkish authorities suspected an al-Qaeda connection. The next day, the London-based newspaper al-Quds al-Arabi received an e-mail in which an al-Qaeda branch called the Brigades of the Martyr Abu Hafz al-Masri claimed responsibility for the Istanbul synagogue bombings.




Moloch -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 11:19:49 AM)

quote:

horrified.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

Yep, it sounds like a genocide against muslims is in the works.


While they are chanting "push the jews back in the seas" and "hitler didnt finish the job".




meatcleaver -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 11:43:19 AM)

You could counter all those incidents and stats with comparable American and Israeli atrocities and claim muslim reaction is rational by fighting terror with terror. However, the problem you have Merc is that you are defining the violence in a very narrow way and one that is unrecognizable to your apparent enemy who see this perceived war as much wider and far more violently perpetrated by the west. In the perameters of your enemy, they have been counting their dead for at least 30 years before the Americans and westerners have been counting their dead.




thetammyjo -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 11:46:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

Here are are sampling of events throughout the world from 2000 - 2003. What do they have in common? All were perpetrated by Muslims. 100% In most cases they were happy to take responsibility. 100%.

I didn't include 9/11 because some see that as a self inflicted US initiated event. I cut it off for 2003 because after all, we invaded Iraq in March and after that we and the rest of the world "deserved" it.

I don't support any movement to segregation or tag wearing. I don't believe in prejudice against any group. I think that we are at war with a religion. At the very least, they are at war with us. I can not find any broadly published evidence from any Muslim leader providing a contrary position. It's so against the nature of US citizens to see a religion as a threat they can't bring themselves to accept the evidence before them. I think our nature to believe that everyone wants freedom and liberty will be our doom. Our very civility and denial in the face of facts is counted on by our adversary and is being used against us.

This isn't about race, or nationality, or sovereignty. Read the position papers stated and published by Muslim leaders. Their followers believe! Why don't we?

I would love for the group to stand up and say this activity doesn't define them.

No other group, nationality, religion, has an active resume quite like this.



Actually I could quote as many things for the Catholic Church if we spread it out over more history.

We could cite lots of things that white people have done or communists or men or almost any other group you can think of.

You could add a lot more in there for Muslims, too, by the way, since the religion was partly founded on the sword. That's a historical fact.

It is not a fact that all (100%) of Muslims support violence today.

None of that, absolutely none of that, excuses any prejudices that I see directed toward any group.

Direct your anger where it belongs, on those who claim they are reasonable for acts of violence and terror and hatred AND on those for whom there is solid evidence of their violence.

Being afraid, while understandable, achieves nothing unless it is wisely directed and not simply used as a justification. Such blind fear only opens oneself up to being manipulated by people who do not have the nations or anyone other than their best interest at heart.




Mercnbeth -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 11:51:55 AM)

quote:

You could counter all those incidents and stats with comparable American and Israeli atrocities and claim muslim reaction is rational by fighting terror with terror.


No MC, you can. But you can find condemnation for any/all of whatever acts you find comparable from US and Israeli leaders. It speaks to the freedom of dialog and the acceptance of opposing views.

I think this is a key distinction. Neither the US or Israel, or any of the other countries who were subject to attacks by Muslims have this religious mandate behind their actions:

Direct from the Qur'an:
quote:

"not to make friends with Jews and Christians" (5:51), fight them "until they pay the Jizya (a penalty tax for the non-Muslims living under Islamic rules) with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" ( 9:29). "kill the disbelievers wherever we find them" (2:191), "murder them and treat them harshly" (9:123), "fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem" ( 9:5).


The Quran view of all those who disbelieve in Islam:
quote:

(5:10), they are najis (filthy, untouchable, impure) (9:28), and orders us to fight the unbelievers until no other religion except Islam is left (2:193). It prohibits a Muslim to befriend a non-believer even if that non-believer is the father or the brother of that Muslim (9:23), (3:28).


btw - by quoting from this book as an 'infidel', I'm subjecting myself to a death sentence.

Edited to add response to Tammyjo:

quote:

Actually I could quote as many things for the Catholic Church if we spread it out over more history.

Tammy, I find the Catholic Church most hypocritical of ALL religions. But in current times, they are only a terrorist threat in their position regarding condoms, the spread of AIDS and birth control.

I'm not afraid of anything in history, and I'm not afraid of what is occurring in the world today. My fear is that people don't want to recognize today's reality for what it is. If you want to speak of history only 14% supported Hitler, yet all Germans went to war. Only 11% of the colonists supported Independence, yet 100% of the colonies became the United States. Without a vocal and in control leadership, it could be only 2% of Muslims who are violent, but they are the ones being used to identify the other 98%. If there is a a majority not being represented why are they in the background and so silent?




fullofgrace -> RE: 39% of American want special IDs for Muslims?!? (8/11/2006 12:06:02 PM)

there are comparable passages in the bible, yet no one feels the need to start quoting from it.

it's funny...i'm white and i was born into a protestant family, but i don't have to spend all my time proving i'm not the kkk. yet people who are of arabic descent and born into a muslim family have to spend all their time proving they're not al qaeda to make everybody happy.




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