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slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:11:30 AM

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Joined: 4/18/2004
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My question is this,
I have a beautiful slave who serves me with every ounce of her soul but she there is one part of her personality that I detest and that is jealousy! I need suggestions of how to break this particular spirit that consumes her.

Master Jack

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:19:57 AM

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The first solution to any problem is to understand it. Why is she jealous? Does she have a "right" to be jealous? Of course, at its most innocent levels, jealousy is a form of flattery - she cares about you or loves you, and therefore is protective of the relationship, expressed with jealous feelings. However, it can grow to become all consuming, too.

Communicate (new word...laughs) with her and have an honest discussion as to why she has these feelings. If they are valid, discuss what would make her feel more comfortable about the situation. Are you pouncing on any of her hard limits, as far as play with others is concerned, or do you flirt?

I don't wish to sound as if her jealousy is your fault. It may well not be. However, there is usually some basis to jealous feelings. Something is not going right. That could be that she has deep issues from past relationships that she is projecting onto you. Either way, communication is the key to the solution. Once you have talked it over with her and determined the issues, you can develop discipline to overcome this trait in her, possibly. Some people have a jealous nature and it's hard to overcome.

Best wishes.

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"I assure you, Your Honor, I don't have to practice...I'm very good at them..."
(The Marquis de Sade at one of his trials for the sexual perversities he practiced)

(in reply to Jtry4470)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:25:58 AM

Posts: 1675
Joined: 1/31/2004
From: Tidewater, VA
Status: offline

M. Jack-

Jealousy isn't your problem- it's her's, and she alone can solve it. From your side, I would _not_ allow it to alter my behavior, and when she verbally expresses it, I would offer verbal reassurance.

It's a great passive agreesive tool for flipping the dynamic (topping from the bottom), and as such, the less you play into it, the better off you are. It's also a prime indictor of an abusive partner- especially if they you to solve the probelm by altering your behavior.

Due to the intensly intimate nature of this stuff, I expect a certain amount of jealousy and possiveness, but I also expect the SIQ to acknowlege that it's their problem, and to deal with it in a responsible adult fashion.

Stay Warm,
Lawrence

_____________________________

-there is no remission without blood-

(in reply to Jtry4470)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:42:04 AM

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Kiss!

You always are such a wonderful voice of reason. <smile>

My experience with jealous submissives is posted in a number of other threads here in the boards and I don't want to repeat myself overmuch (hate for folks to have to read it again).

My experience is that jealousy almost always is founded in some insecurity or another. Sometimes it's born of a misunderstanding (as you suggest) but often it's born simply from a neurotic manifestation of low self-esteem.

For the former your approach should work fine. But it presupposes that both parties are functional enough, and know themselves well enough, to be able to clearly define their emotions and clearly trace them to behaviors that can be modified. Unfortunately, the latter is usually so often accompanied with other sorts of neurosis that one could drive themself insane chasing an elusive "if you do this I will feel better" thread of avoidance, manipulation and denial of personal responsibility (which is often accompanied by lots of blame to the other party).

I've always found that listening until it becomes repetitive is a good indication that you've tried to 'hear and understand' to a reasonable degree. Questions such as "What do you need?" which hold the person experiencing the jealousy responsible for participating in the solution are recommended and is a good place from which to communicate. Always being very clear and forthright about your own position, and being willing to look for solutions that address BOTH of your needs (as opposed to the top changing to suit the bottom, against their original commitments and clearly stated preferences/boundaries) is important, at least to me it is.

If you find the person trying to make you change who you are and who you have always presented yourself to be just to 'reassure' them, or if you find that the solutions you've tried never seem to work and the issue always returns, I'd say the red flags would indicate that you're dealing with jealousy from low self-esteem and the D/s dynamic is probably not the optimum place to address that topic.

< Message edited by MizSuz -- 4/24/2004 10:48:47 AM >

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to MistressKiss)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:48:11 AM

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HA! We posted at nearly the same time and said pretty much the same thing!

Who'da thunk it?

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to topcat)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 7:54:53 AM

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From: Tidewater, VA
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Madame-

quote:

We posted at nearly the same time and said pretty much the same thing!

And we both got 'promoted'! Congrats- of course, I've known you were 'super' all along..

Stay warm,
Lawrence

_____________________________

-there is no remission without blood-

(in reply to MizSuz)

One linerish response. - 4/24/2004 8:01:40 AM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: topcat

Madame-

And we both got 'promoted'! Congrats- of course, I've known you were 'super' all along..

Ya know, I didn't notice until you pointed it out! So the magic number is 251. Kewl!

Congratulations to you, Senior Sir. <smile> We'll wait for your post count to catch up with your superness.

< Message edited by MizSuz -- 4/24/2004 11:03:13 AM >

_____________________________

“The more you love, the more you can love—and the more intensely you love. Nor is there any limit on how many you can love. If a person had time enough, he could love all of that majority who are decent and just.”
- Robert Heinlein

(in reply to topcat)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 8:02:58 AM

stormiKnightBEAR

Posts: 306
Joined: 3/14/2004
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Msts Kiss,
You are right on the mark in your words. They do offer alot. The only thing that might be thrown in and questioned is this...... a slave that is known to have a jealousy problem and tries or wants to talk to the Master about it but feels that it is not possible because in the Master's reaction to such talks evokes ..... not anger but maybe upset is the better word.
Giving the slave the impression that is NOT all right to talk about things that are felt.

The advise this girl would offer is to figure a way thru it yourself or figure if it is worth hanging in for.

What do you suggest?

In Leather,
stormi
property of Master Bear

_____________________________

owned white silk slave of TEMJI aka Master Bear

PROUD TO BE TEXAN AND AMERICAN BY BIRTH~
GOD BLESS TEXAS AND THE U.S.A !!!!

(in reply to MistressKiss)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 11:02:34 AM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
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As usual, I agree with MizSuz - so much depends on the people involved and where they are in the lifestyle and their relationships.

I'm not sure that all submissives realize that they have issues with jealousy. And I think too, that sometimes it depends on who the jealousy is expressed toward. I am not sure that I worded that so that it could be understood. For example, I had very jealous feelings about one former dominant, but not any others. The reason was that he was a total flirt with other women in the room. I found, by coming in under a different screen name, that he did not do this with me out of the room, only when I was in the room. I'm not sure if he was trying to show how popular he was or make me crazy, but either way, it was not for me. I didn't think myself as "jealous" until after I looked back on the situation.

I agree that for the communication to work, both must be functioning at a healthy relationship level.

_____________________________

"I assure you, Your Honor, I don't have to practice...I'm very good at them..."
(The Marquis de Sade at one of his trials for the sexual perversities he practiced)

(in reply to stormiKnightBEAR)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 11:06:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jtry4470

My question is this,
I have a beautiful slave who serves me with every ounce of her soul but she there is one part of her personality that I detest and that is jealousy! I need suggestions of how to break this particular spirit that consumes her.

Master Jack

How about communicating with her so she isn't so insecure? Showing her that she means enough to you that the jealousy dissolves?
Usually jealousy is because someone is insecure. How do we become insecure in the first place? Because our partner says or does something to make us feel that way. We don't always communicate that to our partners. Some of us do. Just depends on the relationship.
You should be happy she cares about you enough to feel threatened? She could care less and just not be jealous.

(in reply to Jtry4470)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 2:28:51 PM

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From: Washington
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quote:

The reason was that he was a total flirt with other women in the room. I found, by coming in under a different screen name, that he did not do this with me out of the room, only when I was in the room. I'm not sure if he was trying to show how popular he was or make me crazy, but either way, it was not for me. I didn't think myself as "jealous" until after I looked back on the situation.

I have always been a big "flirt" online and my first real life Master was the King of jealousy. He often would come into a chat room under a new name just to see with whom i was flirting or to try to get me to flirt with him (me not knowing it was him of course). He was not a happy camper if he caught me flirting with other guys, innocent as it was. At the cam site that we used to frequent his mutliple names got him kicked out of some of the rooms. I felt he was spying on me but i guess that was his right. When our relationship ended he stalked me online for months, it was not fun.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to MistressKiss)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/24/2004 8:11:18 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

quote:

The reason was that he was a total flirt with other women in the room. I found, by coming in under a different screen name, that he did not do this with me out of the room, only when I was in the room. I'm not sure if he was trying to show how popular he was or make me crazy, but either way, it was not for me. I didn't think myself as "jealous" until after I looked back on the situation.

I have always been a big "flirt" online and my first real life Master was the King of jealousy. He often would come into a chat room under a new name just to see with whom i was flirting or to try to get me to flirt with him (me not knowing it was him of course). He was not a happy camper if he caught me flirting with other guys, innocent as it was. At the cam site that we used to frequent his mutliple names got him kicked out of some of the rooms. I felt he was spying on me but i guess that was his right. When our relationship ended he stalked me online for months, it was not fun.

It may not have been fun but you just proved my point. You gave him ample reasons to be jealous? He always thought you were out searching for someone else. No matter how much you claimed you were'nt. You were still playing the game.
Although, he should have been mature enough to say goodbye when it was time.

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/25/2004 11:56:38 AM

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From: Tidewater, VA
Status: offline

quote:

Usually jealousy is because someone is insecure. How do we become insecure in the first place? Because our partner says or does something to make us feel that way. We don't always communicate that to our partners. Some of us do. Just depends on the relationship.

Midear Gloria-

I'd have to argue this to some extent. A person who is insecure may not need their partner to do something or say something to make them feel that way.

I would respond to their jealousy with reassurances that they have no reason to fear, But for many, the only way they will feel secure is to see that they can control my behavior, and that makes for a spiral of distrust and reassurance that there is no way to win.

IMX, in fact, the root cause of their suspions is that they themselves are cheating, or looking to. Not always, but it has been a common enough situation that it is the first thing I consider when a partner is acting jealously with no cause.

Stay warm,
Lawrence

_____________________________

-there is no remission without blood-

(in reply to sub4hire)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/25/2004 12:40:30 PM

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From: Scotland/Tennessee
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quote:

But for many, the only way they will feel secure is to see that they can control my behavior, and that makes for a spiral of distrust and reassurance that there is no way to win.

This is such an accurate description of jealousy, Lawrence!! It is so incredibly destructive and ugly!!

Kiss spoke the majick word "Communicate" (oh I get excited every time I even think it! lol) Communicate, Communicate, Communicate!!!

< Message edited by LadyBeckett -- 4/25/2004 12:41:08 PM >

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_______________________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to topcat)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/25/2004 8:43:21 PM

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I lost a treasured submissive to jealousy, plain and simple. I loved her and was *in* love with her, but her inability to see past her own position in my life and her worrying about someone else "stealing" me from her slowly eroded our relationship. I won't say that in that relationship that I did (or didn't do) things that did make could have made a difference (and believe me, I have spent more then enough time wondering and asking "what if?"), but her jealousy of others was the main factor.

To me, its by turns sad and amusing how some think that they can handle being with a poly Dominant, only to see that when it comes down to it, they cannot.

(in reply to LadyBeckett)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/26/2004 3:31:49 PM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
From: Los Angeles
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For me, it's a matter of accountability. Accountability in my relationship runs one way only: she answers to me. In turn, I am responsible for her. That's the way that a chain of command works. With authority comes responsibility. With guidance comes accountability to the guide. These are the roles that we accepted when we became master and slave.

What is required for this dynamic is honesty, pure and simple. Set up the parameters. Make certain that all involved understand and acknowledge the boundaries. Once that's done, stick within those boundaries. Make no assumptions. Maintain your honor. Maintain your self-respect. Make sure that you can look yourself in the mirror at the end of the day. Make your bed. Eat your veggies. Now quit slouching.

There, that's better.

_____________________________

Schno
ErusVI
Los Angeles
Owner of dahanala
www.esenem.net
[image]http://www.esenem.net/Gallery/albums/2005_08_Savage/SM_1.thumb.jpg[/image]

(in reply to Rendclaw)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/26/2004 3:55:09 PM

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Very well written Sir. Can I use it for a similiar discussion elsewhere? ::laughing:: 'cept the vegatable part, I don't want to give Master more idea's of things I hate :)

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Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to Erusvi)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/26/2004 4:07:07 PM

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From: Los Angeles
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Certainly, cherub.

You really should eat your veggies, though.

_____________________________

Schno
ErusVI
Los Angeles
Owner of dahanala
www.esenem.net
[image]http://www.esenem.net/Gallery/albums/2005_08_Savage/SM_1.thumb.jpg[/image]

(in reply to EStrict)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/26/2004 4:20:59 PM

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From: Washington
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quote:

You really should eat your veggies, though.

Oh no, not another veggie nazi lol, there's one on the South Beach Diet board that i go to.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to Erusvi)

RE: slaves jealousy - 4/27/2004 7:48:04 PM

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greetings E/everyone.. this girl is the one Master Jack speaks of... what was to be advice to my Master became more of a laughing/joke session from most of you.... this girl is jealous because her Master is new to the lifestyle as this slave has many years.. but she loves her Master greatly...her Master enjoys flirting with many other slaves/subs and enjoys participating witin their play... this girl is a pain slut/slave and waits patiently for her Master to perhaps learn the bdsm ways.. she wishes to nothing but serve him on her knees.. to be a 24/7 slave.. to be told what to do.. how to do it... anything and everything for his desires... but right now her Master only allows her to (mild scene) every other weekend for a 2hr period... she craves his power and will.. .when her Master does use his strength and control she is in total heaven.. this evening this girl asked if he cared is she chatted with other Dom's... his response was "He didn't care and couldn't stop me if he wanted too".. that response hurt this girl terribly because she wants NO ONE else but him... its been a year and 1/2 and she still waits patiently for him... this girls Master craves red head females.. this girl has tried to be read headed but she doesn't look desirable... everytime W/we go out in public since W/we live together her Master searchs for all that catches his eyes... Master says He doesn't wish to share his slave so instead leaves her hanging...

please give this girls Master advice if you have real advice to give... eating his veggies is not the answer...

slave cherry

I am a submissive woman ~ as such, i find fulfillment, and true joy,
in the care and nurturing of those i love. i am not weak, nor am i
ignorant, nor is my spirit lazy. i am a strong woman ~ in no way
passive. i have firm views and a clear understanding of who i am and
of what i want out of life, as well as what i bring to a loving
relationship.
~*~
i do not serve out of any shame or weakness, real or perceived ...
nor do i submit to everyone. i surrender to the One who has proven
worthy of my submission. i serve out of love, respect, inspiration,
pride and strength. my submission is inspired by the strength of
true Dominance, and it will not be taken from me by one who is
merely domineering.
~*~
As a submissive, i depend on and need the love and attention of a
Dominant; the loving guidance and protection, for i am never more
complete than when He is with me nor feel more alone and empty when
He is absent. We are two halfs of a whole, complementing and making
each other complete. A submissive is submissive even when there is
no Dominant present in her life. This does not mean i am unable to
function in Your abscence, for i can, and i do.
~*~
i was fashioned by my Higher Power, from the bone that protects Your
heart and Your lungs and supports You Sir, as i am meant to do.
Around this one bone i was shaped and molded. i was created for You,
perfectly and beautifully in every way. The light in my eyes came
from Him and shines for You. i see the gentleness in You yet feel
your strength; and cherish your weaknesses for all are parts of You.
~*~
my characteristics are as the rib, strong yet delicate and fragile.
If allowed i will provide protection for the most delicate organ in
You, Your heart. Your heart is the center of Your being; Your lungs
hold the breath of life. The rib cage will allow itself to be broken
before it will allow damage to the heart ... so it is with me.
~*~
i will support you as the rib cage supports the body. i was not
taken from Your feet, to be under You or tread on Sir, nor was i
taken from Your head, to be above You. i was taken from Your side,
to stand with You and be held close to Your side, protected and
cherished.
~*~
Treat me well, love me, respect me, for i am fragile in many ways.
In hurting me, You hurt Your creator. What You do to me, You do to
Him. In crushing me, You only damage Your own heart Sir, the heart
of Your Father, and the heart of my Father.
~*~
If allowed, i will support You. In humility, i will show You the
power of emotion i have been given. In gentle quietness i will show
You my strength. In love, i will show i am the rib that protects
Your inner self.

(in reply to proudsub)

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