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Too Polite? - 11/5/2006 10:13:53 PM   
MstrssScarlet


Posts: 633
Joined: 6/3/2005
From: Indianapolis, Indiana
Status: offline 		I became a pro domme about a year ago. (Not advertising - in fact I just updated my profile and it should be unavailable for a while)  Anyway.....I get a lot of comments about how "sweet" and "polite" I am when talking to people on the phone or when conducting initial interviews.  This seems to leave people with the impression that I'm just "too nice" to be a domme.  Of course, once we're in the dungeon all that changes very quickly.  In my opinion, there's only one place to be the "bitch" and that's in the dungeon.  Has anyone else come across this problem?  Are good manners somehow only associated with submissives in people's minds?  I'd be interested in getting some feedback on this. 
Mistress Scarlet

_____________________________

"Say, that hurts a little bit" "And you don't like to be hurt do ya?" "I don't know...kinda fun sometimes if it's done in the right spirit."
Jean Harlow in The Beast of the City
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RE: Too Polite? - 11/5/2006 10:18:24 PM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		It's a common problem- but nothing you have to be concerned with.  It just lets people self-select themselves out of compatibility with you.

I just wish more people knew how to kill someone with kindness- I find that can be a lot more cruel than killing them with bitchiness.

http://www.collarchat.com/m_505491/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#505668
Seeking consensus: dominant as gentleman?

http://www.collarchat.com/m_433779/mpage_1/key_gentleman/tm.htm#433966
Master...in slaves' eyes!

http://www.collarchat.com/m_380311/mpage_2/key_gentleman%252Cdom/tm.htm#384513
dom vs gentleman

http://www.collarchat.com/m_266268/mpage_1/key_gentleman%252Cdom/tm.htm#266288
the gentleman dom with feelings

Is the term gentleman dom an oxymoron?

Gentlemen vs nice guy


_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/5/2006 10:20:56 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
Joined: 6/22/2004
Status: offline 		Just be yourself.  That way you'll attract people you're apt to like.

(in reply to MstrssScarlet)
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RE: Too Polite? - 11/5/2006 10:59:17 PM   
sweetnurseBBW


Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		I was always attracted to the sweeter types. Bitchy, arrogant profiles always made me move on. Be yourself. Do not worry about others opinions.

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Sir Pain's pain slut

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/5/2006 11:05:26 PM   
DiurnalVampire


Posts: 8125
Joined: 1/19/2006
From: Nashville, TN
Status: offline 		Yeah, I get this alot.  Wow, your nice, are you sure your Domme.  Or my favorite was how can you control your boy when your so laid back and sweet.
I never thought manners should contradict being a Domme.  Those that are looking for the bitchy dmmes have their pick, they arent impossible to find.  It makes it easier to know which ones are looking for true dominance and which ones are playing to a bitchdomme fantasy.  If they cant necessarily understand how you can be a sweet domme, then they would never fit into your life anyhow.

DV

_____________________________

I will be your Dominate if you will be my submit - Fox

Snarko Ergo Sum
If you cannot change your mind, how are you so sure you still have one? -proverb

*Owner of Fox - collared 10/13/07*
VampiresLair

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 1:31:27 AM   
Focus50


Posts: 3962
Joined: 12/28/2004
From: Newcastle, Australia
Status: offline 		Within D/s, and with a bit of practice, good manners combined with an air of formality can be quite intimidating.  For eg, mostly I just address the girl as 'girl' but when she errs in some way, I'll summon her using her full christian name and in the form of a question - Catherine? (not Cathy or Cat etc).  And she'll instantly recognise the significance of name and tone and know she may be in strife.  For this very reason, I'm never the male equivalent of a bitch in the "dungeon"....
 
As for dealing with strangers, good manners still works the same way as long as they're coupled with confidence and a self-assuredness that every sub I've met identifies a Dom/me with.  By all means be your usual sweet self but learn to treat it not as a problem but an asset - esp when dealing with subs....  Almost everyone has heard the one about how you "catch more flies with honey than vinegar"....  Which cambines well with "come into my parlour, said the spider to the fly...."
 
For you, I think it's only a matter of learning not to be.... errrr.... embarrassed (?) at being "too nice" when all it needs is the appropriate Dom/me confidence to give it a touch of subtle menace in your manner.  You sound fine other than a touch of polish to what should really be an asset.
 
Focus.

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 2:15:00 AM   
MasterNdorei


Posts: 658
Joined: 10/8/2005
Status: offline 		It is not just good manners being associated with submissives (which i am sure is true), but it is when people consider good manners as a weakness. As a submissive i ran into this all the time before Master found me, and it is a real irritant! i imagine as a Domme you are less likely to be pawed and such though because of good manners. So their is a bright side...

i think you can definately use this to your advantage right from the beginning, in letting the interested party know you will hold them to the same high standard you hold yourself..... when the time comes.

i loved reading that you have no problems once you move into the dungeon! :D   i also applaud you for continuing to use the good manners you have and that your question is not asking if you should let your manners aside.

Wishing You Well~*
Master's dorei

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 6:15:08 AM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		lol yes that always happens....but i work it to my advantage by saying something along the lines of "yes i am very nice, which makes it all the more of a thrill when you are down on your knees... licking my boots "
 
 

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Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 6:54:46 AM   
happypervert


Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline
quote:

In my opinion, there's only one place to be the "bitch" and that's in the dungeon.

Your opinion is being proven wrong by those responses which are, in effect, marketing research. What you need to do is determine is if it is more profitable to cater to the expectations of that market or to the market that is just fine with your normally polite self.

If you determine the larger market isn't expecting (or doesn't want) such politeness, then you should consider how to redefine your "packaging". I think it could be easy to go over the top and cater to only the ones who expect extreme bitchiness and therefore turn off the larger "middle" market. You can also experiment by varying your initial presentation (sales pitch) and the results will be measurable in dollars. Furthermore, as a product you have a unique ability to adapt on the fly -- perhaps you can prescreen potential customers to determine their expectations and then adapt your level of initial politeness based on that; however, you also want to be careful avoid trying to be all things to all people, because products that try to appeal to everyone usually appeal to nobody because their image just isn't clear.

Just remember: this is a business decision and you are a performance artist. Play the part. You may call all the shots in personal relationships, but it is exactly the opposite with customers.

< Message edited by happypervert -- 11/6/2006 6:59:44 AM >

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 6:59:29 AM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		what an interesting perspective happy....i love market research...but it never occured to me to use it when i was a pro....awesome idea.

_____________________________


Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




(in reply to happypervert)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 7:01:30 AM   
canupleaseme


Posts: 775
Joined: 7/9/2006
Status: offline 		i am so glad i saw this thread. Its something that has worried me too i have also had comments in the past that im not bitchy enough, however i have learnt that i dont need to be like that at all.
Im not a shouty person its not in my nature and i make that quite clear to people before hand when searching for subs.  My partner now knows i find it hard to be like that but also knows that i can still deliver what i need to by tone of voice and a certain look and loves me for being sweet and kind and caring. Its so nice to  see that others are like that too, after spending so long questioning my dommelyness (i have no idea how to spell that correctly) because of my personality i have decided sod it i can still be nice as pie while im crushing his balls

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Proud mistress

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 7:10:32 AM   
Lashra


Posts: 4900
Joined: 2/9/2006
Status: offline 		I have heard this as well  "Your so nice, your so laid back, your so polite" yes I am so DEAL with it. That is until someone rubs me the wrong way then I'm a bitch to deal with. In the dungeon I am polite, sadistic, I smile sweetly as I knock the clothespins off his balls with my crop telling him what a fucking wuss he is for crying out in pain (the good kind not the bad).

When my sub and I first started he would often comment that I wasn't mean enough. I said are you basing this on YOUR style of Domming from when you were a Master? Because everyone has their own style and if you felt comfortable playing the rude bastard then that was your style, my style is much different. And BTW he doesn't say that anymore because he has found out you can be one nasty bitch and still be polite about it.

~Lashra


_____________________________

“We can never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own pain and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.”






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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 7:38:27 AM   
happypervert


Posts: 2203
Joined: 5/11/2004
From: Scranton, PA
Status: offline
quote:

what an interesting perspective happy....i love market research...but it never occured to me to use it when i was a pro....awesome idea

Why thanks!

Now after all that babbling about the using the feedback as market research, I realized that it could be misleading. Right now she may be occupying a unique niche that could be most profitable for her, and by adapting to that feedback and acting bitchier she may move into a position in the market where there is more competition that could end up being less profitable.

Or she could simply incorporate her personality into promotions (ads) by stating that she is a bitch from hell in a dungeon and polite, refined and genteel outside of it. Then potential customers won't make false assumptions based simply on a phone or personal interview.

Anyway, I'm just tossing out ideas and issues to consider from a marketing perspective. I wouldn't recommend any of this stuff if the discussion was about looking for long term personal relationships.

< Message edited by happypervert -- 11/6/2006 7:40:49 AM >

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"Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live." . . . Mark Twain

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 7:40:34 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MstrssScarlet

I became a pro domme about a year ago. (Not advertising - in fact I just updated my profile and it should be unavailable for a while)  Anyway.....I get a lot of comments about how "sweet" and "polite" I am when talking to people on the phone or when conducting initial interviews.  This seems to leave people with the impression that I'm just "too nice" to be a domme.  Of course, once we're in the dungeon all that changes very quickly.  In my opinion, there's only one place to be the "bitch" and that's in the dungeon.  Has anyone else come across this problem?  Are good manners somehow only associated with submissives in people's minds?  I'd be interested in getting some feedback on this. 
Mistress Scarlet


When I first started exploring dominance, I went the whole "cold, heartless bastard" route in not only my play but in conversation with submissives.  Worked with some but not with others...got told what a "RUDE" bastard I was.  So then I went to the "very polite, always quiet in manner, courtly" type of behavior and used this with submissives.  Then I was told by some...interestingly, more than in the first case...that I was "too nice".  Finally, I decided I would be the gentleman I had been raised to be along with the "sadistic, twisted bastard" I'd found in myself.  The politeness is backed up by a wall which won't be knocked down when pushed...those trying to challenge the politeness to see if there is anything behind it.  This seems to appeal the most to others...at least, in MPOV...and is most comfortable to me.

However, happy brings up a good point.  As a pro, you might need to set aside whatever you are comfortable with in PERSONAL relationships and find a personna that is most effective for BUSINESS D/s BDSM interactions.  Those approaching a pro might well have their own ideas in mind as to what they want and, depending on how far you've decided to go in business...do anything that makes the client happy, do what makes them happy while maintaining your own attitude, do what makes the client happy while "putting on" one of several carefully-crafted personnas to fit that particular client's taste in dominatrixes...you will be best-served by catering to those ideas somewhat.


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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 7:42:50 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		My Daddy is polite to everyone he encounters, I have never seen him be rude to people

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 8:07:59 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		Just be yourself! I am by nature a postive happy person. I like to laugh, I believe in manners, I like to thank people. I can be very generous with my time and I love giving gifts. If all of that leads someone to believe I am a pushover, all the better !!! It means I get the upper hand, the surprise on their face when they do/say something, that flips my switch. Even after the switch has been flipped I maintain control, I don't throw temper tantrums, I don't treat the whole world like dirt. I won't be nearly as cheerful (understatement there), especially to the switch flipper, but I focus on the issue, deal with it and move on. I admit I can be a cold hearted sadistic bitch, sometimes selfish, sometimes downright icy and cruel. Fortunately I have learned to embrace all the facets of me.

Don't let anyone tell you that you have to fit their preconcieved idea of what a Domina should be. Just be the woman you want to be.

< Message edited by LaTigresse -- 11/6/2006 8:20:24 AM >

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 8:10:38 AM   
PainDaddy


Posts: 6
Joined: 4/3/2005
Status: offline 		Nice to see that so many have found common courtesy & Dominance are not imcompatible.  For myself, I endeavor to treat everyone (D&s) with the courtesy I'd like to receive.  Arrogance, bitchiness, snottiness, being a jerk or asshole isn't necessary at all.  I can be guilty of impatience with stupidity & fools ... but that's only after they've proven themselves as such ... I don't make that assumption at the outset.  But even then, there are civil ways of dealing with even the most obtuse individuals. 

Courtesy is, afterall, the essential foundation of D/s ... if one can't generally show common courtesy, then one can't be much of a Dom/me.  It's a matter of integrity.  A Dom/me w/o integrity ain't worth a bucket of warm spit.

I think the concern is being overly nice?  I don't think there's anything wrong (or unexpected) at being strict & direct.  And none of us get everything we want all the time ... so a modicum of compromise goes a long way towards harmony.  I'd rather have a sub or slave serve me out of respect than keep 'em chained & defiant in the basement. 

Just my 2 cents



< Message edited by PainDaddy -- 11/6/2006 8:12:53 AM >

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 8:40:17 AM   
MasterFireMaam


Posts: 5587
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Charleston, WV
Status: offline 		Clients should realize that what you do is fantasy fulfillment. In a lot of ways, you are an actress, sometimes pretending to be what you are naturally not in order to fulfill a contract made.

Now, if you're looking for a personal slave, simply explain that they've watched too much porn. The Bitch Goddess image is not always appropriate for healthy relationships and it is not who you naturally are. If they don't like that, they can move on. Be true to yourself and be who you are.

Master Fire


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The power of who we are can be intoxicating. The power of who we could be is humbling.
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Ms Relationship Books
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BDSM How-To Books

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RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 8:46:13 AM   
crouchingtigress


Posts: 4387
Joined: 3/19/2006
From: Maui
Status: offline 		wow you are good...want a job in hawaii???

quote:

ORIGINAL: happypervert

quote:

what an interesting perspective happy....i love market research...but it never occured to me to use it when i was a pro....awesome idea

Why thanks!

Now after all that babbling about the using the feedback as market research, I realized that it could be misleading. Right now she may be occupying a unique niche that could be most profitable for her, and by adapting to that feedback and acting bitchier she may move into a position in the market where there is more competition that could end up being less profitable.

Or she could simply incorporate her personality into promotions (ads) by stating that she is a bitch from hell in a dungeon and polite, refined and genteel outside of it. Then potential customers won't make false assumptions based simply on a phone or personal interview.

Anyway, I'm just tossing out ideas and issues to consider from a marketing perspective. I wouldn't recommend any of this stuff if the discussion was about looking for long term personal relationships.


_____________________________


Service slut, durable plaything, and ponypenquincatdogpig, to Lee Harrington

This is him

"Its none of my buisness what other people think of me."




(in reply to happypervert)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Too Polite? - 11/6/2006 9:09:58 AM   
toservez


Posts: 1733
Joined: 9/7/2006
From: All over now in Minnesota
Status: offline 		There are going to be some people who enjoy the fantasy of the Domme being bitchy to them. I am not a man or paid to be dominated so I do not know if putting on an act will get you the number and quality of clients you are looking for or just being yourself will but I am hoping for human kind that just being yourself does.

Now I do think there is a difference to being nice and polite and showing someone your dominant nature. Personally both can be done at the same time and that combination is truly a strong and preferred attraction for me. I do know that in my experience that some people whether online or in real time sometimes get these two things mixed up to the point where they are so nice and polite that they act totally submissive in the I can give what ever you want type talk and there are also some that think they need to be rude and demanding to show they are dominant. So to me, I would be attracted to you if your were nice and polite but at the same time showing control and a feel of power while doing so.




_____________________________

I am sorry I do not fit Webster's defintion of a slave but thankfully my Master is not Webster.

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned." - H.H. The 14th Dalai Lama

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