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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/22/2006 10:42:45 PM   
Lordandmaster


Posts: 10943
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Because there's a world of difference between female supremacy as a kink that happens to appeal to you (and your partner or partners) and female supremacy as the belief that women are superior to men.  I don't think there has been too much clarity about that distinction.  The OP herself does not believe that women are superior to men, but plenty of people who have contributed to this thread DO--and that's bound to annoy other people, doncha think?

Edited to add: After all, Elise Sutton, whom the OP was so proud to have been interviewed by, does seem to believe that women are naturally superior to men.  This is from her own website:

quote:

Once I learned about the natures of both men and women and once I learned about the natural dominance and supremacy of women over men, it became the key to unlocking and understanding all submissive desires within men.

 
http://www.elisesutton.homestead.com/FemDom.html

You know, you people love to cast stones at the Gorean forum, but it's remarkable how similar this debate is to what the Goreans were putting us through when their forum was first added.  At first most people thought, Sure, why not let the Goreans have their own forum--it's a kink like anyone else's.  Then, once the board was up and running, certain Goreans tried to argue that only they were living according to nature's true principles, and everyone else was some kind of hypocrite.  Obviously that pissed off a lot of people--myself included.  Several people left the site over it, and have never returned.

Anyway, the whole persecution posture is getting tiresome.  If you KNOW that your kink is controversial, why act so surprised and disappointed when people express their disapproval?  People are going to think whatever the hell they want to think.  Just lead your own life and find your own happiness.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MzMia

I have read many/most of the posts here.  Dianna, LdyHugs and so many have made my point so eloquently.
 I am a Black Female Supremacist, I share many/most of Elise's and Dianna's views.
I am always fascinated by the LACK of tolerance for diverging points of view in this community.
It is really amazing the amount of intolerance and small mindedness of many people.
Are people not allowed to live this lifestyle the way THEY see fit?
Who is in charge of all acts BDSM?
Many here are into many things that I find repulsive.
BUT, I do not judge them nor do I see the need to put them down.
At what point does this community just say, LIVE AND LET LIVE?


< Message edited by Lordandmaster -- 11/22/2006 10:48:44 PM >

(in reply to MzMia)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/22/2006 11:15:14 PM   
sissifytoserve


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quote:



Once I learned about the natures of both men and women and once I learned about the natural dominance and supremacy of women over men, it became the key to unlocking and understanding all submissive desires within men.


Its total crap.

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

(in reply to Lordandmaster)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 12:37:47 AM   
Mikal


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C'mon sissify.. tell us how you really feel!

_____________________________

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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 12:58:16 AM   
chastityboyinOzz


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Paintballs can be pretty dangerous, and could permanently damage a naked male depending on range and accuracy. Personally, i wouldn't trust a Woman to aim straight......She aim for my leg and hit my eye. Cattle prods less so, cause she would know where the shock would go.




(in reply to MissyRane)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 1:38:42 AM   
MissyRane


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heeeeeeyheeeeeeeyheeeeeeeeeey this was so unneccessary, actually I'm pretty good at aiming though I say so myself not that I've ever fired a gun but I've aimed with other things,
but well if ya like cattle prods then sure!! ..after all you gotta give people the option to pick their pain

(in reply to chastityboyinOzz)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 1:40:52 AM   
MissyRane


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mikal

C'mon sissify.. tell us how you really feel!


I think it's against his rules to tell us, he's one of those who's against everything no matter what it is, it's just the I-have-to-be-against-you-obsession

(in reply to Mikal)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 1:54:34 AM   
LadyEllen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: sissifytoserve

How boring.

Didn't Hitler try to do this with his belief in the "superior species"?

So much for diversity.

Soundslike you want a Ken Doll....not a partner with his own soul.






Hi sissify

You will note what I said about my recent experience of hanging around with an alcoholic guy? That is not diversity, that is not a guy with character- that is a broken down, ruined, soon to be dead guy suffering from a pernicious disease and so many psychological problems you wouldnt believe it.

He is actually the most wonderful man I ever knew; so damned bright, so damned talented as an artist, so damned knowledgeable, so damned nice, so good looking, so charming, so protective - pretty much ideal. Except that he drinks all day, every day because he's alcoholic and will never stop.

Why doesnt he stop? Well, aside from the physical addiction, one has to look at why he got into that spiral in the first place, which basically amounts to who he is, as compared to the model of manhood he was brought up with in our society. The drink helped him to be the perfection of macho insensitivity and avoid accusations of being gay - which was and still is an insult here where I live. It also blocked out the "unmanly" feelings he had and has, to be submissive towards women.

So, in what are most likely the last years of his life, (he's 40 in the same week as I'm 39), I have tried and am still trying to help him with his thoughts and feelings, to try to make him understand that they dont mean he's gay or he's effeminate, with the hope ultimately being to make him see that its OK and that hopefully the need for booze can be overcome. Not an easy task, given that until he met me, he had repressed it all and played the opposite role though booze for 35 years.

That doesnt mean that all men, or all men with addiction problems are closet submissives of course, and it doesnt mean I am on some sort of crusade to spread submissiveness throughout the male population. What it does mean, is that in fact I like men - and believe me, if one can grow to love an alcoholic, then any other man can be loved too, and want them each to be happy in their own way.

Please dont interpret the fun thats been going on in this thread as being anything else.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to sissifytoserve)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 2:11:01 AM   
LadyEllen


Posts: 10931
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From: Stourport-England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Renorei

As far as female supremacy goes, I don't really know where I stand on it.  In my organizational behavior class, we had to read this study about how women in leadership positions in business consistently performed better than men.  Are we inherently superior, or were these women merely trying harder, because they've had to overcome glass ceilings in the past?  Or maybe both?  I don't know.  Women are rapidly surpassing or catching up to men in almost all academic areas, and there are now more female college students than male.  But how much of this is society and how much is inherent?  The world may never know. 

I've always considered myself to be a rather openminded person.  And part of that openmindedness is accepting that supremacy of one gender over another or one race over another might be possible.  I mean, if there are clear and obvious physical differences, why do we consider it such a massive stretch that there might be mental differences as well?  Society has placed a taboo on the mere suggestion that some people might be naturally "better" than others, but personally I think it's an area worth exploring.  *prepares for imminent flames*



Its impossible to say, that all females are superior to all males; also ridiculous to be honest, if we are to apply such an idea to society at large, rather than as part of a FemDom fantasy.

To test such a hypothesis, one has to consider the lower end of the female spectrum vs the higher end of the male spectrum. A subjective judgement perhaps, but to my mind at least, superiority is determined by a number of measures, such as intelligence, education, societal functioning and psychological functioning.

Taking those measures, then I believe no one would propose that a below average intelligence female who lacks education and neither functions well in society nor enjoys mental health, could be adjudged superior to an above average intelligence male who holds a PhD and functions well enough in society and psychologically to have achieved a reasonable status.

One could argue that it is a society biased towards such a state which might result in such instances, but this is poppycock, since both males and females fall to the depths and both females and males rise to the top in our society.

The fact is, each of us is born with certain traits and each of us develop certain traits according to our environment. We are thus, all different, and therefore not all equal, just as one race, sex or whatever is not all equally superior or inferior to others. However, that is not to say that we are not all entitled to equitable treatment.

Some women are superior to all other women and to some men. Some men are superior to all other men and to some women. That is just how it is.
E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

(in reply to Renorei)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 8:45:54 AM   
MissyRane


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Joined: 5/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: MissyRane

uh oh I gotta lick your domly shoes now?


Of course not! Its winter time here, so I'm wearing boots LOL!

I have a male for that sort of thing anyway. There has to be some use for them, after all.

E


uhoh sorry, forgot that tiny detail but I started wondering..wouldn't we need also those elegant-gentleman dudes? The butler types ohh I love men in suits...especially penguin suits omygawwwwwwwwwwwwwd *drool*

(in reply to LadyEllen)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 9:56:56 AM   
skiesel93


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In my humble, unsolicited opinion, Elise Sutton has done a fantastic thing for all men to whom this "alternate reality" appeals. And all women, although I haven't had the fortune to meet one into it. I can't believe how retarded the Gor people got, but, seriously, if women were in charge, instead of men, do you really think they would do anything remotely resembling what they did? I mean, because if they did it would completely invalidate the entire premise, case closed. However, I bet they wouldn't, and it would totally rock. Perhaps.

(in reply to MissyRane)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:10:03 AM   
sissifytoserve


Posts: 1016
Joined: 8/30/2006
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Well I think Patriarchy sucks...but at the same time I seewomen exhibiting all the worst behaviors of patriarchy so in conclusion...
A world run by women (and where men were "inferior") wouldn't be much different (the way that we are all treated) than what we have now.

We'd still have criminal politicians and people in a struggle for money and power....stepping on others in order to get there.

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

(in reply to skiesel93)
Profile   Post #: 451
RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:11:50 AM   
Renorei


Posts: 75
Joined: 11/21/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyEllen

quote:

ORIGINAL: Renorei

As far as female supremacy goes, I don't really know where I stand on it.  In my organizational behavior class, we had to read this study about how women in leadership positions in business consistently performed better than men.  Are we inherently superior, or were these women merely trying harder, because they've had to overcome glass ceilings in the past?  Or maybe both?  I don't know.  Women are rapidly surpassing or catching up to men in almost all academic areas, and there are now more female college students than male.  But how much of this is society and how much is inherent?  The world may never know. 

I've always considered myself to be a rather openminded person.  And part of that openmindedness is accepting that supremacy of one gender over another or one race over another might be possible.  I mean, if there are clear and obvious physical differences, why do we consider it such a massive stretch that there might be mental differences as well?  Society has placed a taboo on the mere suggestion that some people might be naturally "better" than others, but personally I think it's an area worth exploring.  *prepares for imminent flames*



Its impossible to say, that all females are superior to all males; also ridiculous to be honest, if we are to apply such an idea to society at large, rather than as part of a FemDom fantasy.

To test such a hypothesis, one has to consider the lower end of the female spectrum vs the higher end of the male spectrum. A subjective judgement perhaps, but to my mind at least, superiority is determined by a number of measures, such as intelligence, education, societal functioning and psychological functioning.

Taking those measures, then I believe no one would propose that a below average intelligence female who lacks education and neither functions well in society nor enjoys mental health, could be adjudged superior to an above average intelligence male who holds a PhD and functions well enough in society and psychologically to have achieved a reasonable status.

One could argue that it is a society biased towards such a state which might result in such instances, but this is poppycock, since both males and females fall to the depths and both females and males rise to the top in our society.

The fact is, each of us is born with certain traits and each of us develop certain traits according to our environment. We are thus, all different, and therefore not all equal, just as one race, sex or whatever is not all equally superior or inferior to others. However, that is not to say that we are not all entitled to equitable treatment.

Some women are superior to all other women and to some men. Some men are superior to all other men and to some women. That is just how it is.
E


I was mainly referring to averages of potential in the two genders.  You're right, no one in their right mind would suggest that a dumb, uneducated woman is superior to an intelligent, educated and successful man.  But do women, on average, have a greater potential to be successful than men do?  Or is it the other way around?  Or, perhaps it is neither and there is no difference whatsoever in what each gender is capable of succeeding.  I don't know, but it's fun to think about.  I'm referring more to inherent supriority or supremacy, rather than actual, realized superiority.  The influence of society and the way individuals are nurtured plays to great a role to ever really know for sure, but it's still something that has always interested me. 

As a sidenote, I'd like to mention that I don't believe that natural, inherent supremacy exists in any form.  But despite that I still find it interesting and would be open to accepting the results of studies that might prove otherwise. 

(in reply to LadyEllen)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:14:06 AM   
MissyRane


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ok sissify we do get what you're trying to state here. We simply disagree and it will be endless debate.

(in reply to Renorei)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:20:37 AM   
sissifytoserve


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Disagree that you think women are superior to men?

You bet.

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:24:45 AM   
cindyhypno


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An endless discussion at the very least. I think we let the facts speak for themselves. Maybe I should count up the men that would grovel at My feet if I allowed them to, during a week's time.

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(in reply to sissifytoserve)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:27:16 AM   
sissifytoserve


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cindyhypno

An endless discussion at the very least. I think we let the facts speak for themselves. Maybe I should count up the men that would grovel at My feet if I allowed them to, during a week's time.


Doesn't make the male gender inferior to you...sorry.

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:33:21 AM   
MissyRane


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sissify, you are so BORING

(in reply to sissifytoserve)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:37:54 AM   
sissifytoserve


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That's fine.

To others I am not so I am not going to lose any sleep over your cheap shots.

_____________________________

A great mind must be androgynous
Samuel Coleridge

The uniting of the feminine and the masculine is the highest form of human development Carl Jung

(in reply to MissyRane)
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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 10:56:10 AM   
LadyEllen


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From: Stourport-England
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What I cant work out sissify, is why you cant let what had become a fun thread just continue in the same vein?

So many posts you make are anti and angry, whether this subject or another, and we all already heard what you have to say. As MissyRane said, its getting boring.

I wish you would concentrate on the good posts you make - not the ones I agree with necessarily, but the positive contributions that you have made here (and there have been a lot), and if there is a thread whose theme you disagree with, just tell us once.

E

_____________________________

In a test against the leading brand, 9 out of 10 participants couldnt tell the difference. Dumbasses.

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RE: Elise Sutton Interviews ME - Female Supremacy - 11/23/2006 11:37:34 AM   
DiannaVesta


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It just seems to go around and around. It turned fun now it's back to shit again. 

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