is it possible...? (Full Version)

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michaelOfGeorgia -> is it possible...? (11/22/2006 10:40:54 PM)

is it possible to become immune to meds after repeated OD attempts?




JerseyKrissi72 -> RE: is it possible...? (11/22/2006 11:52:05 PM)

That is a good question...I use to over take my Prozac back in the day when I use to be on it because I thought it would actually work if I did...perhaps you do become immune, i'm not sure...it had no affect on me..I would NEVER recommend you taking more than the dosage your doctor has instructed you to do so because it may do damage to your liver, kidneys or other organs.




SweetBobbie -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 5:37:22 AM)

michael, by "OD attempts" are you referring to suicidal attempts or gestures or merely self medicating by increasing the dose of your meds? 

Some medications do develop tolerance over time that is more drug is required to achieve the same effect.  The classic drugs among this are the narcotiocs and sedatives and it is part of their addictiveness as well.  Most other drugs exhibit little tendency to develop tolerance.  I would discuss this matter in detail with your health care provider to determine if such a situation is possible in your specific case with your speciofic drugs.




michaelOfGeorgia -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 9:47:36 AM)

quote:

michael, by "OD attempts" are you referring to suicidal attempts


yes




diamonddreamlove -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 9:53:46 AM)

I also suggest discussing such issues with a therapist.  Just a good mental checkup helps.  Tolerance can develop with many drugs as SweetBobbie has stated.  Sometimes the tolerance increases in drugs that do not have dependency issues so please do talk to the physician in charge of your medications.




michaelOfGeorgia -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 9:56:19 AM)

when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything
2. drugs don't change anything
3. life still sucks after all these years.




stef -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 10:58:35 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelOfGeorgia

when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything

No one knows everything, but good therapists can help a great deal if you're truly willing to put in the effort to make the necessary changes in your life.  If you see one with the expectation that they'll be able to magically solve all your problems without having to actually work on them yourself, as far too many people do, prepare to be disappointed.

quote:

2. drugs don't change anything

Millions of people would disagree with you on that point.  I guess they're just all wrong.

quote:

3. life still sucks after all these years.

You get out of life what you put into it.  The world doesn't owe you a goddamn thing, so get off your ass and start putting in the work if you want to change your sucky life.  In case you're confused on the subject, whining endlessly to strangers on the net does not qualify as work.

Happy Thanksgiving,

~stef




MagiksSlave -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 11:00:42 AM)

Yes it is possable to become immune to medication very possable in fact if you use it to often or in your case an OD attempt (which you really should avertise on the boards dear you'll get eaten alive)

Magik's slave




LadyEllen -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 11:08:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelOfGeorgia

when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything
2. drugs don't change anything
3. life still sucks after all these years.



I have to agree to an extent with this analysis.

Therapy - seems to be about getting you to accept that your life sucks
Drugs - seem to be about blocking out that your life sucks
Life - generally sucks. But there is only one person in this whole world who cares enough about that, to make their life suck less. No one, and I mean no one, cares as much as you about it, because no one but no one feels how much it sucks.

E




slavejali -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 11:32:12 AM)

quote:

quote:
when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything
2. drugs don't change anything
3. life still sucks after all these years.

 
Since you've got nothing to lose and have tried other avenues, take a look at this:
 
http://www.4truths.com  (its a cool page)

(start at number one...then click on the 8 links on the top of the page once you get to the 4th noble truth)

The foundational teaching behind Buddhism can be understood by just about anyone (you don't have to be spiritual or religious to understand and get benefit), it also doesn't involved a whole bunch of beliefs being shoved down your throat, its all common sense really...but just might trigger something that helps.




CalliopePurple -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 5:19:18 PM)

Speaking from experience, the very worst depressed sort, yes. That or you just become really sensitive to it, like I now am to Benedryl and aspirin.




michaelOfGeorgia -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 5:41:34 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: stef

quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelOfGeorgia

when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything

quote:

No one knows everything, but good therapists can help a great deal if you're truly willing to put in the effort to make the necessary changes in your life.  If you see one with the expectation that they'll be able to magically solve all your problems without having to actually work on them yourself, as far too many people do, prepare to be disappointed.


i've heard the same thing from therapists over the years and could write a book on the subject, that doesn't change how i feel.

quote:

2. drugs don't change anything

quote:

Millions of people would disagree with you on that point.  I guess they're just all wrong.


i have taken every pill (and combination thereof) over the past 30+ years that they are like placebos to me now.

quote:

3. life still sucks after all these years.

quote:

You get out of life what you put into it.  The world doesn't owe you a goddamn thing, so get off your ass and start putting in the work if you want to change your sucky life.  In case you're confused on the subject, whining endlessly to strangers on the net does not qualify as work.


i NEVER said anyone owed me anything, did i? it is hard to get anything out of life with the way humanity continues as it is. nothing i, or any therapist or drug, will ever change that. if you don't like what i have to say...stop reading my posts. i'm not the only one here that expresses an opinion and have that opinion labelled "whining".

Happy Thanksgiving,

~stef




michaelOfGeorgia -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 5:45:54 PM)

quote:

Since you've got nothing to lose and have tried other avenues, take a look at this:

http://www.4truths.com (its a cool page)

(start at number one...then click on the 8 links on the top of the page once you get to the 4th noble truth)


ok...that was depressing. thanks jali




slavejali -> RE: is it possible...? (11/23/2006 6:28:27 PM)

michael, aww sorry, it was worth a shot :)




jblack -> RE: is it possible...? (11/24/2006 2:14:27 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: michaelOfGeorgia

when you've been to therapy as often as i have, you learn a few things

1. therapists don't know everything
2. drugs don't change anything
3. life still sucks after all these years.



While I should probably try to offer some "optimistic" advice, I'd have to say that I tend to think those three points are probably accurate.

So, it sounds like you're either asking for information on how to kill yourself or you are offering a "cry for help." If it is the latter, I would say that online message boards may not be the best places to "cry for help." After all, no one really knows you or understands your problems here, and, while there might be some mental health professionals who are also members, it's not like we have any particular training to deal with a "cry for help."

If it is the former, however, there is a book called Suicide: Methods and Consequences by Geo Stone that you might look at. Many people claim that this book is "irresponsible" (and I'm sure many will think that my response to you is "irresponsible" as well) because it describes various methods of committing suicide in detail. However, it also explains that most methods don't work. Life after a suicide attempt sounds pretty alarming, so it's worth it to consider what might happen if things don't go as planned.

I've also heard that it is actually rather hard to kill oneself by overdosing on prescription medicine (i.e., sleeping pills, tranquillizers) or on over-the-counter drugs (i.e., benadryl, sominex). It isn't so much because the doses aren't high enough or because someone is "immune." My understanding is that it is because your body does not want to be destroyed, even if your mind feels like ending it all; the survival instinct will come through, even if you don't want it to.

But I don't speak from personal experience. Although I've been suicidal on more than one occasion, I never acted upon any impulses because I did my research: I learned that suicide is a bad option not because life is so grand but because death is so hard. I can't offer platitudes about how life will get better or spout the standard rhetoric about how suicide is a permanent solution to a temporary problem. All I can say is that suicide probably sucks about as much as life does; the process of committing suicide is much more arduous than you'd like to believe. There's nothing easy about it.

Consider this poem by the ever so witty Dorothy Parker:

Resumé
Razors pain you; Rivers are damp;
Acids stain you; And drugs cause cramp.
Guns aren't lawful; Nooses give;
Gas smells awful; Might as well live.

The line breaks may be off here (the version I found on the Internet doesn't look quite right when compared to the image I have of this poem in my mind's eye); forgive me if they are wrong.

Anyway, the point is that killing yourself will not be easy, just like living won't be easy. Wish I could tell you something different. Wish there was a magic pill, both for living and for dying. But there isn't one. Various Internet sites, message boards, essays by suicide attempters, and Stone's book all led to the conclusion that suicide is much harder than it might appear. I recommend doing your own research on the subject; it is the most important decision you'll make, so you better be well-informed.

In the end, perhaps, you'll reach the same conclusion articulated by Ms. Parker and espoused by myself: Might as well live. I have to say that I hope you do, too.








DommeChains -> RE: is it possible...? (11/24/2006 9:37:46 AM)

I hear your pain and hopelessness and I feel for you.  I agree not everyone is helped by medications and not everyone has a good outcome from counseling.  I have had a fair amount of counseling for dealing with some deeply traumatic events in my life and most of it was not helpful.  However I did find one marvelous therapist who told me something that has stuck with me throughout the years.

He said try looking at it a different way.  An amazingly simplistic thing but also amazingly powerful and empowering.  He also told me to stop looking outside myself for worth, validation or meaning.  Now I totally resisted these statements and recommendations when he gave them to me.  Then, as my situation continued to deteriorate I kept hearing those pieces of advice in my minds voice.  I explored them and found answers and a way to deal with things that relieved my emotional pain and made me feel good about myself.  I still use this advice to this day because I have a tendency to backslide when life throws me curveballs.

The way you might use this advice is up to you.  It might not work too well the first few times you try it out until you are comfortable with the idea that you don't have to be in emotional pain but what do you have to lose by trying?

Be well, be at peace with yourself.




Lieren -> RE: is it possible...? (11/24/2006 10:29:13 AM)

Having suffered with bouts of depression, I know that I've suspected that the three things that you said were true.  Other than a therapist giving me similar information to DommeChains, I read a book called Learned Optimism by Martin Seligman at the suggestion of a friend, and it really helped me a lot.  There's so much information on human nature and the studies that have been done, and it ends with ideas for how to become more optimistic.  I really like the fact that he says in plain English that sometimes optimism is fooling yourself, but if it makes the world a happier place who's to say that's wrong?

*hugs* if you want them [sm=dance.gif]




LadyEllen -> RE: is it possible...? (11/24/2006 4:34:37 PM)

As jblack said - its actually not easy to kill yourself by overdose.

Overdoses often dont work - because as jblack implied, the body will reject the overdose through vomiting. Many successful overdoses result in death by suffocation from vomiting, rather than the drug itself. And you dont want to survive an overdose either.

There are tips and tricks to prevent vomiting, but even then, an overdose can take weeks, in constant pain, to succeed. Again there are tips and tricks to speed things up significantly, but still its not a good way to go.

I also know the most pleasant and effective way to go; no mess, no guns. (Guns by the way, are not as reliable a means as they might seem either).

How do I know all these things? Because I researched them for personal use. Needless to say though, I'm still here and I'm not going to divulge any of it.

E




jblack -> RE: is it possible...? (11/24/2006 9:14:10 PM)

LadyEllen,

I'm glad I'm not the only one who did my research. And I'm glad I'm not the only whose research made a difference. [:)]




JerseyKrissi72 -> RE: is it possible...? (11/25/2006 3:34:20 AM)

I know how difficult things can be and I KNOW all about the fact that drugs do nothing but hide the pain...but hang in there hon...you are a dear friend to me (hugs)...I'm always here for you...I advise you to get into some counseling, it helps more than drugs.




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