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RE: Our Next President?? - 2/27/2005 1:25:34 PM   
Sissyslave71


Posts: 226
Joined: 2/20/2005
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quote:

Soldiers that had planned to stay in for 20 years are getting out....


I did.

Glad I did too.Now that I understand why these wars are fought. it has little or nothing to do with freedom.

I still gladly stand by my Constitutional oath.

If there is anything close to SACRED left in the United States..its the Constitution and the Bill
of Rights.

(in reply to MrThorns)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/1/2005 12:37:41 AM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrThorns
Maybe if all the people that blindly support the war enlisted! I think that would be a wonderful idea. Senators, radio talk show hosts, conservative chat room regulars...just all march down and sign a six year contract as an 11B (Infantry). Then we could support this war for many, many years to come... Or at least until we ran out of conservative talk show hosts.
~Thorns

Not only is this a great idea, I think it should be mandated! You believe this is trully what we need to do to protect selves, you ought to be able to profess that faith from the front lines, not on the backs of poor unsuspecting kids, most of which probably enlisted to get some money for college. M


_____________________________

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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to MrThorns)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:00:27 AM   
domtimothy46176


Posts: 670
Joined: 12/25/2004
From: Dayton, Ohio area
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BlkTallFullfig

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrThorns
Maybe if all the people that blindly support the war enlisted! I think that would be a wonderful idea. Senators, radio talk show hosts, conservative chat room regulars...just all march down and sign a six year contract as an 11B (Infantry). Then we could support this war for many, many years to come... Or at least until we ran out of conservative talk show hosts.
~Thorns

Not only is this a great idea, I think it should be mandated! You believe this is trully what we need to do to protect selves, you ought to be able to profess that faith from the front lines, not on the backs of poor unsuspecting kids, most of which probably enlisted to get some money for college. M



I would be more than happy to vote for that, provided citizenship,and therefore voting eligibility, was restricted to active-duty military and veterans. Who is better qualified to determine the course of the course of the nation than those who've put their lives on the line in defense of it? It seems a reasonable compromise, doesn't it?
Timothy

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:45:25 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
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quote:

provided citizenship,and therefore voting eligibility, was restricted to active-duty military and veterans.


Dom Tim,

I know this movie....STARSHIP TROOPERS!!

(in reply to domtimothy46176)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 10:57:40 AM   
Pavel


Posts: 308
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Washington
Status: offline 		In keeping with the mantra, the book was better.

As gung ho as I might be about military sorts being the ones that get the votes (speaking as somone who's takeing the long route to being in uniform), the Armed Forces have always been the guardians and servants of the people. The guys with the guns should never be the ones calling the shots.

Besides, you'd have to expand the military to some hugely silly size to accomidate all the people seeking citizenship, or whatever they seek to gain. Then you'd wind up with some small combat component (as "hey, I just wanted to vote, I didn't really think I had to kill anyone!"), with the rest being in MOS's like "latrine maintence expert" or "yogurt machine loader 1st class"

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
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RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 4:30:37 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: domtimothy46176
I would be more than happy to vote for that, provided citizenship,and therefore voting eligibility, was restricted to active-duty military and veterans. Who is better qualified to determine the course of the course of the nation than those who've put their lives on the line in defense of it? It seems a reasonable compromise, doesn't it?
Timothy

I can get with that... I would have no problem putting my life on the line if everyone was honest, benevolent and honorable enough to die in preserving the honor of his convictions. M

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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

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Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 5:17:30 PM   
MadameDahlia


Posts: 2021
Joined: 8/11/2004
From: SoCal aka Hell
Status: offline 		What if someone in the military is faced with a war that does not represent his/her convictions? Do people get to pick which wars they will fight in the name of freedom, liberty and the American way...

_____________________________

Insanity -- a perfectly rational adjustment to an insane world.
--R. D. Laing

"Oh, but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away."

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:03:45 PM   
MrThorns


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Joined: 6/4/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MadameDahlia

What if someone in the military is faced with a war that does not represent his/her convictions? Do people get to pick which wars they will fight in the name of freedom, liberty and the American way...


Easy answer: They do their duty and fulfill their committment.

I hate everything about this war. The way it was planned, the way it was funded, the distraction from finding those responsible for 9/11, and the way it is being executed, but I tell ya, when my number gets called...I go.

quote:



ORIGINAL: Pavel
Then you'd wind up with some small combat component (as "hey, I just wanted to vote, I didn't really think I had to kill anyone!"), with the rest being in MOS's like "latrine maintence expert" or "yogurt machine loader 1st class"


Heh...and this is different from now? I hear it all the time. "I'm here for the college money, I don't have time to go train to learn how to do my job." or "I thought this was only supposed to be one weekend a month, two weeks a year! I didn't sign up for this shit!".

I like the Starship Troopers model, but instead of the only option being military service, I think an option for civil service should also be an option. I know I wouldn't want to be in a firefight next to some guy who volunteered, just to get his benefits and go home. Hell...let them volunteer in a retirement home, serve soup in a homeless shelter, provide relief for disaster victims, etc.

~Thorns

_____________________________

~"Do you know what the chain of command is? Its the chain I beat ya with when ya don't follow my command."

"My inner child is a mean little fucker"

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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:22:36 PM   
MadameDahlia


Posts: 2021
Joined: 8/11/2004
From: SoCal aka Hell
Status: offline 		Mandatory soup kitchen duty for a year... two years... five... I can do that. I wouldn't mind doing that. I don't see anything wrong with it. I don't see private agendas... I don't see big money for fat cat companies. I don't see people getting rich off of twenty-something and vets coming back in bags or missing limbs and eyes because of that.

Telling me that I HAVE to go to Iraq for a cause I don't believe in... telling me I have to shoot people I think may very well be innocent... Tck. Not going to fly. I'll fight for what I believe in. I'll stand up when I'm rooting for the cause. I'll volunteer when I think my liberties or the liberties of those I care about are on the line... But I'll break my own knees before I get dragged into something I'm not willing to approve of.

Why should my freedom to say "Fuck off... if you think they're guilty SOBs YOU go shoot them and then look their parents in the eyes and tell them they were making weapons" be any less protected than someone's right to sacrifice themselves for THEIR causes.

Edited: Just as a precaution... I'm only responding. I'm not aiming this at anyone in particular. I'm venting because the issue pisses me off. I don't expect people to think like me. I'm not trying to change minds. I'm just trying to articulate the way mine works.

< Message edited by MadameDahlia -- 3/2/2005 9:24:55 PM >

_____________________________

Insanity -- a perfectly rational adjustment to an insane world.
--R. D. Laing

"Oh, but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away."

(in reply to MrThorns)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:46:33 PM   
Pavel


Posts: 308
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Washington
Status: offline 		I never got the signing on just for the bennies. Even if I could comprehend being willing to go into the military just for the education money etc, I think I'd get a clue I could be going some place nasty and getting shot at when they started handing out the rifles. You have to be responsible when you sign the dotted line in all things in life.

Then again I was just a dumb MIDN 3/c.

I can agree with mando-service for voteing rights in princple, it shows you're willing to put out that effort to help build this nation. However, I'm not sure we can support legions of extra federal workers . Perhaps if you just had to obligate yourself to a certain level of service for x number of years (working in a soup kitchen every saturday for 3 years or somthing), without the extra pay factor, it would be enough.

To address what I was getting at with the yogurt loader comment, I was thinking along a military as detailed by Vonnegart in Player Piano, where there's no real combat ability (save for the automated portions), and it's just a place to put people not fit for other things.


(in reply to MadameDahlia)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/2/2005 9:50:18 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: MadameDahlia
Telling me that I HAVE to go to Iraq for a cause I don't believe in... telling me I have to shoot people I think may very well be innocent... Tck. Not going to fly. I'll fight for what I believe in. I'll stand up when I'm rooting for the cause. I'll volunteer when I think my liberties or the liberties of those I care about are on the line... But I'll break my own knees before I get dragged into something I'm not willing to approve of.

I agree completely; I thought you were contradiction my position in response to DomTimothy: he gave me an extreme position and I replied that I would stand for my convictions if we're all fighting for the same thing, and this war is not about me... Finding the culprits of sept 11, I understand and support.

quote:

Why should my freedom to say "Fuck off... if you think they're guilty SOBs YOU go shoot them and then look their parents in the eyes and tell them they were making weapons" be any less protected than someone's right to sacrifice themselves for THEIR causes.

I think all of us should have that freedom, and just as I would place my life on the line (if all things were truthful and equal), so too I would if my moral stance was strongly against an endeavor.
I agree that what has gone terribly wrong in the world is our inability to see beyond our front yard, and understand that everyone has rights as we do to live and pursue life and happiness on their terms, as long as they are not behaving in a predatory way towards us. M


_____________________________

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""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to MadameDahlia)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/3/2005 8:31:22 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline 		After elected in '08, running on the 25 plank platform contructed in the "Grey Storm decides to run for President" thread, this will be my innaugrial speech...

My Fellow Americans:
As you all know, the defeat of Iraq regime has been completed.

Since congress, the american public, and I do not want to spend any more money on this war, our mission in Iraq is complete.

This morning I gave the order for a complete removal of all American forces from Iraq. This action will be complete within 30 days. It is now to begin the reckoning.

Before me, I have two lists. One list contains the names of countries which have stood by our side during the Iraq conflict. This list is short. The United Kingdom, Bulgaria, Australia, and Poland are some of the countries listed there.

The other list contains everyone not on the first list. Most of the world's nations are on that list. My press secretary will be distributing copies of both lists later this evening.

Let me start by saying that effective immediately, foreign aid to those nations on List 2 ceases immediately and indefinitely. The money saved during the first year alone will pretty much pay for the costs of the Iraqi war.

The American people are no longer going to pour money into third world Hell-holes and watch those government leaders grow fat on corruption.

Need help with a famine? Wrestling with an epidemic? Call France.

In the future, together with Congress, I will work to redirect this money toward solving the vexing social problems we still have at home. On that note, a word to terrorist organizations. Screw with us and we will hunt you down and eliminate you and all your friends from the face of the earth.

Thirsting for a gutsy country to terrorize? Try France, or maybe China.

To Israel and the Palestinian Authority. Yo, boys. Work out a peace deal now. Just note that Camp David is closed. Maybe all of you can go to Russia for negotiations. They have some great palaces there. Big tables, too. I am ordering the immediate severing of diplomatic relations with France, Germany, and Russia. Thanks for all your help, comrades. We are retiring from NATO as well. Bon chance, mes amis.

I have instructed the Mayor of New York City to begin towing the many UN diplomatic vehicles located in Manhattan with more than two unpaid parking tickets to sites where those vehicles will be stripped, shredded and crushed. I don't care about whatever treaty pertains to this. You creeps have tens of thousands of unpaid tickets. Pay those tickets tomorrow or watch your precious Benzes, Beamers, and limos be turned over to some of the finest chop shops in the world. I love New York .

A special note to our neighbors. Canada is on List 2. Since we are likely to be seeing a lot more of each other, you folks might want to try not pissing us off for a change.

Mexico is also on List 2. President Fox and his entire corrupt government really need an attitude adjustment. I will have a couple extra tank and infantry divisions sitting around. Guess where I am going to put em? Yep, border security. So start doing something with your oil.

Oh, by the way, the United States is abrogating the NAFTA treaty - starting now.

We are tired of the one-way highway.

It is time for America to focus on its own welfare and its own citizens. Some will accuse us of isolationism. I answer them by saying, "darn tootin."

Nearly a century of trying to help folks live a decent life around the world has only earned us the undying enmity of just about everyone on the planet. It is time to eliminate hunger in America. It is time to eliminate homelessness in America. It is time to eliminate World Cup Soccer from America. To the nations on List 1, a final thought. Thanks guys. We owe you and we won't forget.

To the nations on List 2, a final thought. Drop dead.

God bless America.
Thank you and good day.

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/3/2005 12:51:43 PM   
MadameDahlia


Posts: 2021
Joined: 8/11/2004
From: SoCal aka Hell
Status: offline 		Much of that I applaud. However isolationism is something America tried before. And if America had not shaken that off we all might have been viewing a Europe that spoke nothing but German.

Stop flooding other countries with money. Use that money for solving problems here. Stop feeding the rest of the world.

We've got homeless folks dying on the streets because the last bit of food they saw was a scrap someone threw away the other night. Mandate soup kitchen duty for a year or six. Call it personal growth. Call it whatever you want. Just get something nourishing into these people so they don't flood our coroner's offices.

We've got people shooting up with dirty needles close to schools. Make the needles affordable. Encourage users to A) get help or B) throw their used needles away in a place where kids or animals aren't going to find them and walk off with them.

We've got people too poor to come in and get treated in the hospital. Nation wide health care anyone?

We've got teenagers smoking PCP laced Mary Jane. Grow good stuff. Tax the shit out of it. Make it available to those eighteen or up. Make it available to those diagnosed with untreatable and/or pain causing diseases.

Prostitutes are beaten to death by overzealous Johns or their greedy pimps. They have unsafe sex and wind up with STDs which they then pass to others. They get cervical cancer and go untreated. Legalize it. Tax it like any other business. Mandate use of condoms. Mandate biweekly or monthly physicals/exams. Get rid of pimps. Make them obsolete.

I don't see why you shouldn't be able to sell that particular muscle. You can give away sex. Why not charge for it? You can sell every other part of your body. You can sell your arms, your brain, your legs. Why not your vagina or penis? I'm of the opinion (and you may or may not be) that everyone is a whore in one fashion or another. You're all using a part of your body no matter what job you're doing.

I work as a fitness trainer. I'm being paid to use my body. Sure it's a more "socially/morally acceptable" way of using my body. But why shouldn't someone else be able to use THEIR body in a way that they are comfortable with? Why do we force them into dingy, disgusting motels? Why do we force them into unsafe places?

"We" call it a consensual crime. I call it absurd. If you feel the same way I urge you to take a look and perhaps read through "Ain't Nobody's Business If You Do" by Peter McWilliams. For those of you who are online readers you can find it here: http://www.mcwilliams.com/books/aint/toc.htm

< Message edited by MadameDahlia -- 3/3/2005 12:53:12 PM >

_____________________________

Insanity -- a perfectly rational adjustment to an insane world.
--R. D. Laing

"Oh, but if I went 'round sayin' I was Emperor, just because some moistened bint lobbed a scimitar at me, they'd put me away."

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/3/2005 10:05:04 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
my innaugrial speech...
My Fellow Americans:
As you all know, the defeat of Iraq regime has been completed.

This morning I gave the order for a complete removal of all American forces from Iraq. This action will be complete within 30 days. It is now to begin the reckoning.

Before me, I have two lists. One list contains the names of countries which have stood by our side during the Iraq conflict. This list is short. The United Kingdom, Bulgaria, Australia, and Poland are some of the countries listed there.

The other list contains everyone not on the first list. Most of the world's nations are on that list. My press secretary will be distributing copies of both lists later this evening.
A special note to our neighbors. Canada is on List 2. Since we are likely to be seeing a lot more of each other, you folks might want to try not pissing us off for a change.

Mexico is also on List 2. President Fox and his entire corrupt government really need an attitude adjustment.

To the nations on List 2, a final thought. Drop dead.

Very Funny Merc,
We'll have to have a face to face talk about you're placing removal of EEOC/AA laws on your agenda/while mentioning nothing about reparations (if you're going to be fair), and mention absolutely nothing about illegal immigrants, and America's second language (some parts of the country, 1st). I do hope to meet you some you someday. M

< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 3/3/2005 10:06:30 PM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/4/2005 1:41:11 AM   
onceburned


Posts: 2117
Joined: 1/4/2005
From: Iowa
Status: offline
quote:

It is time for America to focus on its own welfare and its own citizens. Some will accuse us of isolationism. I answer them by saying, "darn tootin."


How is this any different from our invasion of Iraq? Isn't unilateralism the flip side of isolationism? We decided to invade Iraq - the facts and international relations be damned. And then we pout and stamp our feet like an angry child when we found that others won't roll over and do as we demand.

Isolationism is what got us into this mess in the first place.

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/4/2005 7:21:33 AM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

EEOC/AA laws on your agenda/while mentioning nothing about reparations,illegal immigrants, and America's second language


M,
I'm prepared to pay reparations to anyone alive today held as a slave against their will.

The military will be used to addressed the illegal immigrant issue. Any person found to be in the country illegally will be repatriated back to their county of origin within 48 hours of arrest.

English will be the official language of the US. Government publications will only be printed in English.

Reasons behind those positions.

People who are told their history or the experience of their ancestors makes them inferior sometimes actually believe it even though the basic premise is false. And worse, successful people coming from these cultures have to overcome the public perception of only achieving the success because of EEO/AA programs. Race, age, gender, ethic background, and even the person's name would be eliminated from all job and school applications. The person's Social Security number would be the tracking number. Success or acceptance would be based solely on merit.

There is a way to immigrate to the US legally. No one here illegally should benefit from any social or economic program of the US or any of the States. This takes away from the services we provide to our own citizens. My position is pragmatic. Illegal aliens are illegal. Arrest and deport. People and/or business found to have hired illegals would face manditory prison terms and pay all costs involved with the arrest and deportation of the illegal employees.

The success of the US is based upon homogenous language. Again though, by saying that people are not as intelligent as immigrants in the past who assimilated and learned English is prejudicial. You can achieve a limited success in the US isolating yourself in a community. But ultimate personal and community growth comes from expansion beyond the neighborhood. To accomplish that, at least at this point in US history, you need to speak English. At least the US version of English. Of course if we go back in the time of writing the original Constitution German was contemplated, but it never caught on.

Looking forward to see you too!

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/4/2005 5:22:05 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth
M,
I'm prepared to pay reparations to anyone alive today held as a slave against their will.

This is funny...
Only on these boards can you say this with a straight face

Anyway, the reason we have to do this face to face is that I'd like for you to explain your justification for knowing you (not YOU) had a 500year head start, and understanding the fact that as late as 1960s blacks were being turned away from universities, how we can possibly be expected to be caught up on the american dream, without even 1 acre for previously free labor (you know how gorgeous some cities are like DC and Newport RI from slaves' backs), never mind 50 acres and a mule. I hope we agree that none of us just happened to show up here and now; we're children of families, and in white case, children of white priviledge. Whereas most white parents worked hard and built something to leave to their children, most black parents could not do that in the past; whereas white parents could have gone to school and teach their children how to speak properly and read, black parents could not. Don't get me wrong, I'm not okay with excuses for not doing well, and I fully support each person being held accountable, in a fair and just system. My point is that you should not assume that the playing field is level, and a lot more communication with black scholars/black folk and the powers that be is needed in order to ensure the future of our(all races) America.

Add to all of the above discrepancies our support of Israel for their suffering at the hand of Germans, when we didn't even have anything to do with their suffering... So I would love to hear you "Merc the Just" reconcile these stances of yours for me.

I agree on illegal immigration, though that is never going to happen...
I also agree that eternal AA is inappropriate, but I assure you EEOC is not useless, because at the very least, it embarrasses employers into acting semi fair at the threat of being exposed. M

P.S. You'll be even more shocked to learn that I personally would not benefit from reparations, and I entered college under "normal" admissions, and am paying my student loans.


< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 3/4/2005 6:14:25 PM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/4/2005 6:02:16 PM   
Mercnbeth


Posts: 11766
Status: offline
quote:

Add to all of the above discrepancies our support of Israel for their suffering at the hand of Germans, when we didn't even have anything to do with their suffering... So I would love to hear you "Merc the Just" reconcile these stances of yours for me.


"Our" support of Israel? You mean the US support. I'd eliminate that the first day! US support of Israel is the #1 reason for our overall failure in the middle east. To Israel's credit they use the blind support of the US as it suits their country. Rightfully so, the US should be so self concerned. But the support of Israel is not analogous to reparations for slavery. I'd be more supportive of repatriations, but in that case do the enslaved Irish, English, Spanish, Native American, get in on the loot? Remember I'm commited to reducing taxes!

On your other point, reconciliation is easy. I was, a long time ago in a live very far away, one of the compliance officers at a National Bank assigned in the Training Dept (Go Figure!) to train managers in AA/EEOC. I thought I was the most literate and knowledgeable person. Almost like at the same time in my 20's I knew I knew everything there was to know about being a Master. But I digress.

Anyway, on a long drive back from a training seminar from Harrisburg to Philly, the person I was training as a division manager asked me what I thought was a silly question. He asked if I promoted him because he was black or because he was qualified? I forgot to mention that this man was black, still is for that matter. I thought the question bazaar, but he was very sincere. His issue was that he didn't want the position if he got it because of his color.

During that whole ride he gave me a completely different perspective about being a successful black businessman. He felt that because of the perception that the entitlement programs caused in society he never received credit for his achievements. Society's perception was he obtained his position as a result of fulfilling a quota. I didn't appreciate this position until it was pointed out to me.

Interestingly enough when I received my performance evaluation that year I was commended for my promotion of a minority. I called Jim and thanked him for being black, but reminded him I hired him because I knew he would be an effective person to have working for me. Jim remains my friend. He now has his own business and we chat a few times a year. If I was still on the right coast I'd say that we saw each other more frequently because he was a golf buddy too.

He still abhors liberal minority programs. He argues that the liberals should stop perceiving the black race as too weak to meet competitive challenges on equal footing. I agree that when it was created the AA/EEOC programs were needed and companies were embarrassed into removing race barriers for promotion. But I don't see it happening today. There is only one color in business today - GREEN.

That said I still don't believe there is equal footing. But today the inequality is in the economics of the equation. The middle class is shrinking to the point of non-existence. My father was factory worker, able to provide an environment to allow me to succeed. I don't see that same environment today in the US. There are no middle class jobs being created. As society polarizes it will lead to an unsatisfied youth seeing no hope in their future. It is that generation that has to be satiated with real potential for success. Without it we WILL breed another Hitler.

Why anticipate shock on my part that you didn't benefit from repatriations or entitlement programs?

And unlike the comment about paying reparations to anyone alive. My anticipation about meeting you in person was not ensconced in sarcasm. I would love the opportunity.

(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/4/2005 6:30:12 PM   
BlkTallFullfig


Posts: 5585
Joined: 6/25/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

Add to all of the above discrepancies our support of Israel for their suffering at the hand of Germans, when we didn't even have anything to do with their suffering... So I would love to hear you "Merc the Just" reconcile these stances of yours for me.


"Our" support of Israel? You mean the US support. I'd eliminate that the first day! US support of Israel is the #1 reason for our overall failure in the middle east. To Israel's credit they use the blind support of the US as it suits their country. Rightfully so, the US should be so self concerned. But the support of Israel is not analogous to reparations for slavery. I'd be more supportive of repatriations, but in that case do the enslaved Irish, English, Spanish, Native American, get in on the loot? Remember I'm commited to reducing taxes!

Ooh, you're good, I knew there was a reason I liked exchanges with you!
It's not so much my desire to not support Israel, it just seems unfair that we're unable to find it within our hearts to do charity at home where we owe it to some, and are fairly indiscriminatory in our aid to others.

quote:

On your other point, reconciliation is easy.
he didn't want the position if he got it because of his color.

Only people in powerful positions, or positions that allow for their basic survival can make this argument; I may feel strongly on a lot of things, but food/clothing and shelter are a must, before I can take a political stance, and a lot of black folk cannot afford to take that stance.

quote:

He still abhors liberal minority programs. He argues that the liberals should stop perceiving the black race as too weak to meet competitive challenges on equal footing. I agree that when it was created the AA/EEOC programs were needed and companies were embarrassed into removing race barriers for promotion. But I don't see it happening today.

I'm glad he abhors it; I too agree that given equal chance/circumstance everyone will come out winning; accepting that some of us were make to be historians, others medical doctors, others hospitality workers,etc...
The fact of the matter is AA and EEOC are still needed because we've not All had similar/equal beginnings, so why should we be expected to finish the same; I think the only thing that should matter is each person's capacity to fullfill the task, than either select the minority, or do it blindly if you want to be absolutely fair in choosing, because of the tendency to flock toward people who are more like us, people in positions to hire, tend to hire those who are more like them.
There's so much more to say!!!
You don't see it happening now? Are you monitoring it? Are you asking employers and blacks?

quote:

That said I still don't believe there is equal footing. But today the inequality is in the economics of the equation.

Thanks
quote:

As society polarizes it will lead to an unsatisfied youth seeing no hope in their future. It is that generation that has to be satiated with real potential for success. Without it we WILL breed another Hitler.

I agree completely that unfair treatment and maldistribution of resources will ensure extremists are born/made, and wars will continue to happen.

quote:

And unlike the comment about paying reparations to anyone alive. My anticipation about meeting you in person was not ensconced in sarcasm. I would love the opportunity.

I believe your sincerity there, and I too mean it; I'd love to talk to you and Beth in person some day... To talk Social issues, and get to learn M/s rituals and practices (can I watch), how exciting that would be for me! M

P.S. Generally speaking, I'm not extreme on most issues, but I will agree with an extreme point of view in protection of the US if it is dealt fairly/equally/justly.
My personal favorite President of all time (minus the oral office faux pas) is the Brilliant (and slightly horny) William J. Clinton; I don't believe America was ever on better footing and wonder if it will ever be again.



< Message edited by BlkTallFullfig -- 3/4/2005 9:16:17 PM >

_____________________________

a.k.a. SexyBossyBBW
""Touching was, and still is, and will always be, the true revolution" Nikki Giovanni

(in reply to Mercnbeth)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Our Next President?? - 3/5/2005 3:48:34 AM   
pantera


Posts: 210
Joined: 1/7/2005
Status: offline
quote:

It's not so much my desire to not support Israel, it just seems unfair that we're unable to find it within our hearts to do charity at home where we owe it to some, and are fairly indiscriminatory in our aid to others.



pardon my intrusion, but these are 2 different things.

One thing is foreign aid, which is typically government (taxpayer) funded.

Charity at home is something different: this means private citizens voluntarily giving their money or time to the charity of their choice. Government handouts is not charity, is income/ wealth re-distribution.

and about affirmative action/ reparations, etc... I think it cheapens the achievments of those blacks that really worked hard and have talent. My favorite columnist (Walter Williams) is black, he is absolutely brilliant and has a lot to say on that topic-


(in reply to BlkTallFullfig)
Profile   Post #: 60
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