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Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/13/2004 1:29:58 PM

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Oral sex lessons to cut rates of teenage pregnancy

Mark Townsend
Sunday May 9, 2004
The Observer

Encouraging schoolchildren to experiment with oral sex could prove the most effective way of curbing teenage pregnancy rates, a government study has found.
Pupils under 16 who were taught to consider other forms of 'intimacy' such as oral sex were significantly less likely to engage in full intercourse, it was revealed.

Britain's teenage pregnancy rate is the highest in Europe. In 2002 there were 39,286 teen pregnancies recorded. The government has spent more than £60 million to tackle the problem but so far failed to halt the rise.

A sex education course developed by Exeter University trains teachers to talk to teenagers about 'stopping points' before full sex.

Now an unpublished government-backed report reveals that a trial of the course has been a success. Schoolchildren, particularly girls, who received such training developed a 'more mature' response to sex.

The study by the National Foundation for Educational Research found youngsters were 'less likely to be sexually active' than peers who received traditional forms of sex education, dispelling the fears of family campaigners who believe such methods actually arouse the sexual interest of teenagers.

Now the government will recommend the scheme, called A Pause, to schools throughout England and Wales following the success of the trial in 104 schools where sexual intercourse among 16-year-olds fell by up to 20 per cent, according to Dr John Tripp of the Department of Child Health at the University of Exeter, who helped to design the course.

Teachers who sign up to the course are primed to deal with queries from pupils on all kinds of sexual experience. Those behind the course stress the scheme does not suggest teenagers experiment with oral sex. Instead they say A Pause promotes the message that other forms of physical intimacy are safer than full intercourse.

'It teaches people assertiveness skills and that they should be only as intimate as they feel comfortable with,' said Tripp.

A Department for Education and Skills spokesman said the report's verdict would be made available to all schools. 'All teachers respect peer-reviewed material, and this will help influence their decision,' he said.

RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/13/2004 3:50:03 PM

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Gloria-

Believe it or not, when I was in middle school (around '77 or so....) we had a 'Health and Human Sexuality teacher who promoted the same idea. She also sugestted anal sex as a form or birth control, If you couldn't lay hands on a condom (this _was '77- Herpes wasn't well know, never mind HIV).

I was always amazed that it never blew up into a scandal.

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Lawrence

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/13/2004 11:37:27 PM

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While we're at it, let's teach kids about anal sex too. You can't get pregnant from that either. I have read that kids nowadays don't think that anal or oral sex are any big deal. And last I looked, teenage pregnancy is still a huge problem. Seems like we are pouring gasoline on a raging fire.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 12:03:26 AM

perverseangelic

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how about we have classes that provide acurate information on birth control?

how about we stop making student believe that condoms aren't really that effective, adn that the birth control isn't really that good?

how about we teach our children about their bodies, and about sexual maturation?

how about we stop the scare tactics that imply that no form of sexual protection will even -halt- the spread of STDS?

i came through abstience-only education. my class's saltuatorian was pregant. she thought that birth controll and condoms weren't really that effective, she was bascially going to get pregant or sick if she had sex, and she wanted to have sex, so why bother with protection?
-far- too many of my classmates thought this way. i found myself giving out -accurate- information , because my parents cared enough to teach me about my body and how to be safe with it.

i dont know if teaching about oral sex is the answer. i'd start with giving kids accurate information and showing them how to take care of themselves. abstience might work for some people, but it's not going to work for all of them. abstenance IS the only 100% safe method of sex. but for those kids who WILL have sex, it seems we should teach them how to -not- get pregant or evil diseases

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 12:58:09 AM

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Where are kids being taught that condoms aren't effective at stopping pregnancy? It's drummed into their heads constantly to use them. They don't use them because they choose not to in the heat of passion. And kids always think they are invincible. Then they are proven wrong.
I do agree that much misinformation is spread purposely these days to scare kids. Especially that AIDS is an equal opportunity disease.
And hats off to your parents perverse. They were doing their job.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 8:59:19 AM

perverseangelic

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

Where are kids being taught that condoms aren't effective at stopping pregnancy? It's drummed into their heads constantly to use them.

at my high school in our "sex ed" classes, as well as in all high schools in my district.

we were told,literally, that condoms are basically useless in halting the spread of STDS and that even WITH a condom, you have a 40% chance of getting pregnant. were were told that the birth control failure rate is over 30%

i remember the numbers because they were pretty much drilled into my head. i know that condoms aren't 100% effective, especially in the prevention of stds as some viruses (noteable, AIDS) are small enough to penetrate the condom itself. however, the class failed to mention that a huge number (the majority) of condom failures come from someone misusing, miswearing, or mistreating a condom because they either don't know how to put it on or have one that is simply too old. we weren't told that birthcontrol failure are 90% of the time, due to human error in not following instructions on how to take them.

now, i know my district might have been a bit more....militant...than most, but since coming to univeristy, i've met a surprising number of people who still think condoms just plain aren't effective.

quote:

And hats off to your parents perverse. They were doing their job.

amen. i'm lucky to have them, and i realize it :)

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 11:00:34 AM

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quote:

know that condoms aren't 100% effective, especially in the prevention of stds as some viruses (noteable, AIDS) are small enough to penetrate the condom itself.

Also HPV is spread by skin to skin contact and a condom does little to prevent that. To top it off most people, esepcially men have no idea they carry the HPV virus because there are no symptoms in men unless it is the variety that causes warts.(many varieties of HPV do not cause warts) The non wart varieties do no harm to men except for the fact they can spread it to women. In women HPV can cause cervical cancer (in about 10% of the cases) if not caught in a routine pap test and then treated. I find that very scary. From what i've read about 75% of sexaully active persons carry HPV and most don't know it so it is spread like wild fires. I would guess that many of you who have had multiple partners carry HPV and don't know it. The other problem is that there is no easy test for it in men from what i've read.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 11:46:57 AM

perverseangelic

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*nodnod* yeah, HPV's pretty damn insidious. they're working on a vacine at my school right now, actualy. it's interesting to watch the progress.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 1:49:40 PM

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I believe when children hit puberty they should be educated by parents or teachers. Many children now a days are learning from each other witch can be misleading. I'm not talking about just intercourse, but all forms of sex. About pros & cons, and how to be safe. I was educated early on and it kept me safe, disease free and alive. I plan to do the same with my children.

As far as kids being educated on oral sex to stop teenage pregnancies, I think it would be more effective to have parenting classes. Then they can get some type of feel for the responsibilities that parents have.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 5:25:31 PM

rain

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring
I do agree that much misinformation is spread purposely these days to scare kids. Especially that AIDS is an equal opportunity disease.

As a social worker who has worked with people living with HIV/AIDS for almost 4 years, i have to say that HIV/AIDS IS AN EQUAL OPPORTUNITY DISEASE!

The people i work with are: white, black, latino, asian, burmese, nigerian, straight, gay, bi-sexual, transgendered, IV drug users, people with NO addictions, varying in age from as young 17 (born with HIV), and as old as 60 something years old, they are Christians, Catholics, Methodists, Baptists, Jews, Muslims, and atheists. No one is immune from contracting HIV, no one.

On Wednesday afternoon, i took a group of my clients to hear Magic Johnson speak. Magic has been living with HIV for 12 years! 12 years! He was NOT an IV drug user, nor was he gay; he contracted HIV through uprotected HETEROSEXUAL sex.

Condoms, if used properly, are very effective against the transmission of HIV, (and other STD's) and pregnancy.

The problem, as i see it, is this: many people still believe that b/c they are white, Christian, educated, heterosexual- that these things will protect them from HIV- well, they are wrong. The attitude needs to change: if children and adults are educated, then they can make the best decisions for themselves.

i've had clients who contracted the virus through blood transfusions, or wives who contracted HIV from their husbands- who had unprotected sex with other WOMEN.

Also, i feel it is naive for lawmakers to say that if you hand out condoms to teenagers, that will encourage them to have sex. Guess what, whether the school hands out condoms or not, teenagers will have sex. In fact, kids are becoming sexually active at a much younger age.

Knowledge is power. Educate yourselves so that you can educate your children.

Cheers,

~rain~

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 6:16:48 PM

rain

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Hello again:

i've posted some useful links: the first one has an update from the CDC (Center for Disease Control) regarding the myth that oral sex = safe sex.

ftp://ftp.cdcnpin.org/Updates/oralsex.pdf

The second link is a another website with HIV/AIDS general statistical info:

http://www.niaid.nih.gov/factsheets/aidsstat.htm

~rain~

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/14/2004 8:46:46 PM

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One of these days I am going to make a post here and use the word "communication" and someone is going to throw rocks at me as I'm leaving, lol.

Talking to children about sex is uncomfortable and feels awkward to most parents. I may be wrong, but my guess is that just maybe it was awkward for their parents to talk to them about it too. I talked to my children about sex. I talk to my grand daughter about sex. I also talk to them about demonstrating personal value and demonstrating respect for the personal value of others. My daughter will be 16 soon, and she is not sexually active. She is aware of her options, the dangers/risks, and I have taught her language. The other thing I did was leave the door of communication wide open.

My way may not be the right way for everyone, but I do know that it is important for parents to know their children and tailor the communication to that. It isn't about what is or isn't causing pregnancy in teenagers. It's about the rise of STD's being passed around and affecting these children for life! It's about these children acting/reacting out of ignorance and fear.

We are their teachers, and we are teaching by demonstration. They are watching us, and listening to us.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 1:00:57 AM

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Sorry rain you are wrong. Aids can be contracted by anyone, but the overwhelming majority of cases in the US are gay men and or intraveneous drug users. The numbers back that up.
Now worldwide is a different story. But living in the US, the chances of me getting AIDS is the same as a plane crashing on my head as I walk down the street. I don't worry about that.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 7:07:00 AM

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Well, I personally don't know what should be taught to our children in school about sex. I have my nephews with me. The past few years I have taught them about sex. Purchased condoms for them. Taught them how to use them.
I started teaching them when they were 7-6 years old actually. I did that because my parents didn't teach me.
I highly doubt my brother taught them anything. Kids want knowledge usually. My neice lived with my brother she was sexually active at 12. I didn't want the boys doing the same thing under my roof.
If you learn from your friends you are learning from idiots. I know I was young once. If they did a poll on how many parents educate their kids on sex I bet it would be very low.

So, what do we do to change it? Take sex ed in school? I never took it myself. The ones who did teach it..I taught them. Although in the 20 years or so I've been out of school I am quite sure things have changed. Teaching them about oral sex may not be that bad. It may be bad as well. This is why teaching was not my chosen profession. I feel our children are too important to screw up their lives. I am not sure...I could take hoards of them and make the right decisions.

When I was a child and some of the stories of pregnancies and stuff were coming back to me. I always felt there should be some sort of test you have to have before ever contemplating sex. Could you imagine if there were? Sex would be so much more fun for everyone involved. There would be no bad sex. Everyone would know their entire body was an erogenous zone. There would be no sexually frustrated people.

I don't know what is the right answer but I like hearing the opinions.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 8:47:06 AM

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quote:

Talking to children about sex is uncomfortable and feels awkward to most parents.

Talking to children about many things is uncomfortable and feels awkward to many parents. It is part of what being a parent is. Choosing to have a child is also choosing to be bound inextricably with another person as they experience the bittersweetness of life.

The question is responsibility for one's choices. I suspect talking to one's child about their disease, the horror of dying of a disease like HIV, pregnancy, etc., would be quite a bit more uncomfortable than talking to them about sex.

I gave my children my take on the whole thing, told them the ultimate decision was theirs, and told them both that I would support the decision they made in whatever way I could.

In the case of teenage pregnancy, I told them that while I would drive them and pay for an abortion, if that was what they chose, I also said that I would support them in raising the child if they decided to keep it.

Sinergy

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 9:12:21 AM

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Hand Jobs 101
Oral Sex 101
Anal Sex 101

Hmm... school sure has changed, I used to hate it!

But seriously folks, isn't the education system stepping in to teach your kids about sex stepping on the role of the parents. Mommy and Daddy should be teaching little Johnny and Suzie that the genders are different from an early age, and these teachings include respect, modesty, vanity, physical strength, sexual reproduction, etc over the youth's span of years at home. The schedule and breakdown is relative to the parents and the home, but the target timeframe would be to encompass sexual reproduction and pregnancy by the time the youths reach an age to be able to partake in sex. The age will of course vary with the parent, as has been mentioned some girls are sexually active at 12, when the parents possibly have no idea.

Ideally, a systemmatic approach to standardize the parental teaching process would de difficult at best... I can hear it now, "Nobody tells me how or when to teach my brat kids about fucking!". Therefore it will be impossible to apply a standard within the parental realm.

Taking the teaching standardization concept to the classroom is an idea which has it's merits in many respects. Unfortunately, many parents would stove-up and choke if little Johnny or Suzie came home from school, and asked them during dinner if cumming in a girl's ass or mouth definitely would not get her pregnant!

If organized teaching is involved (education system), what are the rules of engagement, how is the lesson(s) standardized and palatteable across moral, religious, personal, and many other lines? How do you handle the mounting statistical spread of pregnancies and STD's when most religions consider sex out of wedlock to be a sin, regardless if aged 12, or 100? The moral majority and every bible-thumper you could envision will be on their soapboxes screaming at the top of their lungs, "All sinners Go To Hell!!! - Schools have NO Right to teach my kids how to sin!!!"... what a bucket full of worms that will be.

We have zealots within our own borders that will "kill & maim" in their own protests of a cause. For instance abortion clinic bombers, and abortion doctor shooters. Who will be the first Oral Sex 101 teacher to be shot by an outraged parent? What a dubious distinction that will be, eh?

On the other hand, institutionalizing the teaching would document the youth's education, and then hold them accountable. A teen pregnancy would be punishable by making the lustful pair live together for the term. What a cruel and unusual punishment!

It seems that accountability is an issue in todays world. My little Johnny knocks up your little Betty and I make sure Johnny stays the hell away from her from now on, right? She gets to have the baby and Mom takes care of it for her, right? Where is the accountability in that I ask... why does my little Johnny NOT have to be responsible, or your little Betty? No penalty/punishment, no accountability... so maybe the big answer is to do as Gloria mentioned, take a test and recieve a handjob, blowjob, fucking, and/or buttfucking permit/license... and be held accountable. No more school little Johnny, you fucked that up... get your ass to work and support your family, that's the flip-side of reproduction, and the real world.

Imagine the impact if insurance companies refused to pay medical expenses for teenage pregnancies, and the load fell on my little Johnny and your little Betty. Then the parents would really have to step in...

What's the old saying, "better nate than lever, right?"

Inyouagain

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 9:21:57 AM

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I agree with LadyBeckett: A parent has to communicate.

I have three kids. Two of them are teenage daughters. Before my two girls became teens, they'd had sex ed in school (more about biology and body parts than anything else, but it is a start). I also spoke to them throughout the years about sex (not a one-time talk). Also I took them to an afternoon "teen girl plus parent workshop thingy" at the hospital, in case I'd forgotten anything.

At the teen workshop for my oldest daughter, the kids and parents were separated, so the kids could speak freely and ask questions. While they were off, the parents were asked by the facilitator what they wanted out of communication with their teen, and what form it should take. One mother said, "honesty", another said, "to hear the important stuff," and "when I'm not busy," and so on.

I said, "I don't care when, where or how, just that she does." I was the ONLY parent that had no additional demands regarding communication!

Okay. So that was five years ago. My oldest daughter is seventeen now. Not sexually active. Ambitious and passionate. Self-disciplined and hard-working. (Yes, she can be snotty, too.) And she's one of the few of her friends who does still confide in her parents.

One of the biggest things I've learned in parenting teens is that you have to start to communicate from the beginning. (With the baby!) Listen EARLY. You cannot start listening or mentoring when they are thirteen (as if adolesence started that late, anyway). And you have deal with way more than sex. Everything. Human relationships. Morals. Responsibility. Self-respect.

January

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 9:23:55 AM

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Teaching kids about sex at age 6-7? Why? Why do people insist on making kids grow up so fast? Let kids be kids. I begin to talk to my son about sex when he was 14. Before that he was allowed to be a kid. To only have to deal with kid's stuff. I see no reason to be talking to young children about sex. Let them enjoy their childhood.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 11:09:10 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Estring

Teaching kids about sex at age 6-7? Why? Why do people insist on making kids grow up so fast? Let kids be kids. I begin to talk to my son about sex when he was 14. Before that he was allowed to be a kid. To only have to deal with kid's stuff. I see no reason to be talking to young children about sex. Let them enjoy their childhood.

I started talking to them. I didn't say I told them everything. You start out that way. As they age and mature a bit you move on to bigger things. My neice was 13 when she had her first abortion. If they had waited...well they did wait. Too late to wait that long. The bottom line is the generation growing up is not any of our generation. I realize we are all different ages here. But, none of us experienced what these kids experience in school today.

I do feel people should be accountable for their own actions as Inyou said. However, he sort of missed the point of what I was saying.
I've met 60 year old women in the past year who never had an orgasm. Married before. Now alone..and no orgasms. Imagine if we knew about our own bodies. Imagine how much better those 40 or so years would have been?
Maybe they never would have gotten divorced in the first place.
That is the point I was trying to make. People just don't know enough about their bodies. They go out and make mistakes.
When I was 17, I had a friend who was 16. She ran away from home and was living in some apartment. Regardless a friend of mine and I were visiting her one day. When we left I looked to my friend and said..man Jaimie looks like she is pregnant doesn't she?
About 3 months later Jaimie went to the doctor and found out yes...intercourse can get you pregnant. She did the right thing for her at the time and gave up the child to adoption.
However she was 16 years old sexually active and didn't have the first clue about anything sexual.
We need to talk to our children. Can they learn what they need in school? I don't really know that answer. The point has been made you can get Std's from oral sex. How many people know that if we took a poll right now?
I guess we should commend the UK school system at least they are trying. Whether it really affects the kids or not at least they are trying.

Let's see other polls. If female do you pee out of your vagina?
Does size matter?
Where are your erogenous zones?

The list could go on and on. If I was a betting person I think you'd be amazed at the responses you got.

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RE: Oral sex Lessons for our kids? - 5/15/2004 11:28:02 AM

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You have to talk to kids about it when they are ready to talk, no matter what the age is. If that is six, then answer their questions. Be age appropriate, but even at that age, they have some idea of sex. Hopefully, it's still gross to them.

I was listening to a conversation between my 8 year old daughter and her two best friends yesterday as we drove past Hooters. My daughter mentioned that we had eaten there before, and they had good hot wings. (Mind you - this was her concept of the place because I didn't make a big deal about the boob thing). Her friend said, "That place is not appropriate for kids our age." I said, "why is that, hun?" She said, "I don't know, that's just what my mom said."

Now I have issues with that. You can't tell your kids something is bad for you and not explain it. My daughter would not have even thought about it, had her friend not said something. And while we were in the restaurant, her comment was that the girls in there were pretty - not that they all had huge tits (which they didn't). I wouldn't choose it as my first preference as a family restaurant, but it so happened that we were in a strip getting my car fixed and it was the only choice.

Kids can deal with the truth. I was always open to answering my son's questions (he's now 22), and I was the first person he told when he lost his virginity. It was not a forbidden thing in our household. It's sort of like how my mom handled liquor in our house when I was growing up. When I was curious about the scotch and soda my dad drank every day, she said, "do you want one?" and I said "Yes!". One sip turned me off to liquor and I have never drank much more than margaritas (required in Texas) or a glass of wine, and the occassional Grand Marnier, which I was turned on to a few years ago. Had she made a big deal out of it, I am convinced that I would have become a drinker like many of my classmates, sneaking it out of the house, etc.

Communication is just as important with kids as within the BDSM relationship. And something else...when you are finishing a conversation, always say "do you have any more questions?" If not, assure the child that they can ask you any time.

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