RE: Britain and USA bad for children.

RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (Full Version)

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LadyEllen -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 2:14:13 AM)
Look, children are a pain in the arse, arent they? I mean, how can I possibly work a 60 hour week (80 hours with commuting), if I have kids hanging around? How can I take three foreign holidays every year with school holiday weeks being three times dearer than any other time? How am I expected to afford brand name clothes and a new car with having to feed and clothe kids? And what about my 4 bed detached house with double garage at nearly half a million pounds? How am I to demonstrate to all the world, that I am a respectable and successful human being without all these things? And lets face it, kids arent respectable are they? I mean, how much money do they bring in? Nothing. Well, apart from family allowance payments and tax credits, but that means theyre living on social benefits from the government - and that makes them no better than dole scroungers! Theyre hopeless at golf, and they never buy a round in the pub either. And then there's all the attention they want. "Play with me", "take me to", "can I have?" and so on. What is it with them? Theyre nothing but a bloody nuisance. And anytime you want to go out, you find that others have the same opinion of kids and the kids are banned from the place - quite rightly too; after all, I want to get blind drunk, swear a lot, possibly start a fight.... how can I do that with kids in tow? Kids, remember, who dont buy a round. This is my life, not theirs. Mine, mine, mine. Well, that part of my life, which is actually all of my life, which is stuck in a long hours culture just to pay a mortgage for a house that is overpriced, and to afford all the things that I think make me a good person in the eyes of others like me stuck in the same culture. Its not just for children that the UK is bad. E

NeedToUseYou -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 2:31:30 AM)
Sorry, just scanned the report. Now, of course the US and GB have some problems. But most of this report is computed based on "perception" of the respondents, and not a quantitive analysis of the reality of there living conditions or a measure of the socialist policies of the country. Question like how affluent do you feel relative to society, has no real basis in the actual poverty experienced by the person, compared to there actual poverty compared to other countries. Reviews of differences of average income don't measure quality of life, but merely measure the difference in wealth. A country where everyone made 10000 dollars would score perfect for example, but a country where the poverty line was 20000 thousand and the median was 50000 would score poorly. Obviously the 20000 is better than 10000. So, those "type" of categories are merely a measure of socialist policies, not a measure of quality of life. I don't see this report as being an honest evaluation. Some of the measurements are good, but you'd have to remove the purely subjective categories, and the categories measuring socialism as high ranking attributes, to make it a true evaluation of childrens actual quality of life. Basicly some of the questions in the report by default will rank socialist bending countries higher than others by that mere fact alone, not the quality of life of those living in the countries. My impression, UN wasting money for agenda based studies. Take the good quantified data from this report (there is some real information in it less than half It looks like), and disgard the opinion categories, and socialist measurements of quality of life.

meatcleaver -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 2:59:33 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: NeedToUseYou Sorry, just scanned the report. Now, of course the US and GB have some problems. But most of this report is computed based on "perception" of the respondents, and not a quantitive analysis of the reality of there living conditions or a measure of the socialist policies of the country. Question like how affluent do you feel relative to society, has no real basis in the actual poverty experienced by the person, compared to there actual poverty compared to other countries. Reviews of differences of average income don't measure quality of life, but merely measure the difference in wealth. A country where everyone made 10000 dollars would score perfect for example, but a country where the poverty line was 20000 thousand and the median was 50000 would score poorly. Obviously the 20000 is better than 10000. So, those "type" of categories are merely a measure of socialist policies, not a measure of quality of life. I don't see this report as being an honest evaluation. Some of the measurements are good, but you'd have to remove the purely subjective categories, and the categories measuring socialism as high ranking attributes, to make it a true evaluation of childrens actual quality of life. Basicly some of the questions in the report by default will rank socialist bending countries higher than others by that mere fact alone, not the quality of life of those living in the countries. My impression, UN wasting money for agenda based studies. Take the good quantified data from this report (there is some real information in it less than half It looks like), and disgard the opinion categories, and socialist measurements of quality of life. Poverty isn't just a question of money, it is ones social and economic relationship to the country one lives in. Remember this is a report on developed countries so poverty is going to be relative as is a sense of well being. However, when it comes to social alienation, Britain and the USA do have by far the biggest prison populations per capita, something that supports the report in that these two countries have serious problems of alienation. They do have some of the biggest drug use amongst teenagers and youngest sexual activity. At least some politicians are beginning to recognize (and about time) that a sense of well being is as important as money in the pocket for a successful society that is at peace with itself. Above a certain level of income, wealth alone provides diminishing returns for a sense of well being. Happiness and a sense of well being is subjective but can't be removed from the report without dismissing social problems as insoluable or at least only accepting solutions to social problems is money. The pursuit of money above all else has been part of the problem the report has highlighted because it is not only dealing with children from deprived families but children from middleclass and affluent families and that is why Britain and the US should be worried by this report.

seeksfemslave -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 3:41:54 AM)
The UK has a ridiculously high level of Welfare Expenditure which has created a dependency culture at both ends of the Social Spectrum The overeducated totally useless "experts", commentaters, reporters, administrators bean counters etc etc at the top end and feckless irresponsible violent fecund totally useless underclass at the bottom. These academic experts have allowed, indeed encouraged, a climate of value to develop such that nobody is held accountable for anything they do. In fact the wickeder the act the more certain it is that a "stupid" expert will be found to explain it away. Only last night on Brit TV one of these experts, discussing this report, said that <lack of expenditure on education was a major problem>, no one on the panel pointed out the astronomical increases in real terms that have been lavished on our education system, a consequence being we now have about 30/40% of school leavers who can barely read or write. I say, bring back Hard Labour prison sentences backed up by corporal punishment applied early in a crims. burgeoning career and see the problems vanish. Shift a ton of stones around for 8 hours a day for three months....that'll learn em!! Get the academic experts to support themselves financially, should be simple seeing as how clever they are, and everybody benefits. What children NEED to develop into mature adults is guidance, control and loving discipline in a stable heterosexual family, what they want is of very little consequence since they are not experienced enough to have developed a view. What they get from the authorities in the UK is a mixture of indifference, over indulgence and wasteful ineffective welfare support with a PC non judgemental approach to the difficulties that deviant children create because they, the children, have been misled, by a deviant PC agenda.

Aubre -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:03:52 AM)
I could make a report say whatever you want it to say, I can find the numbers to support whatever position you want. UN has no moral high ground to make these pronouncements anyway, after all it is their troops in places like the Congo who are paying for child prostitutes. My biggest problem with society today is that people are not taught to accept responsibility for their actions.

meatcleaver -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:18:00 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aubre UN has no moral high ground to make these pronouncements anyway, after all it is their troops in places like the Congo who are paying for child prostitutes. The UN doesn't have any troops, they are troops from member countries of the UN which is an organisation that is only as good as its members. Actually, one can dismiss this report but most serious commentators are taking it seriously in Europe from what I can tell. It is easy to sweep ones problems under the carpet but Britain and the US definitely have similar problems ie. large prison populations, young single mothers, gang culture and drug use by the young. The report doesn't say these problems are unique to Britain and the USA but the overall conclusions are they are worse in these two countries than other countries. If your children are saying they aren't happy, live in fear of their peers and are taking part in activities that seriously jeopardizes their futures, then putting ones head in the sand is only repeating the mistake as to why there is a problem in the first place.

boytoyroy -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:25:48 AM)
not to mention how many of U.N. members were ignoring its sanctions and dealing illegally with iraq.. and other similar scandals which sufaced around the time of the invasion debate .

meatcleaver -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:28:50 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: boytoyroy not to mention how many of U.N. members were ignoring its sanctions and dealing illegally with iraq.. and other similar scandals which sufaced around the time of the invasion debate . When has the USA taken any notice of the UN? Kettle, pot, black springs to mind.

thompsonx -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:40:20 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 I'm really not interested in any "report" the "U.N." puts out. Does anyone still listen to them anymore? popeye: Only those with a three digit IQ. thompson

thompsonx -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 6:47:49 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LadyEllen Look, children are a pain in the arse, arent they? I mean, how can I possibly work a 60 hour week (80 hours with commuting), if I have kids hanging around? How can I take three foreign holidays every year with school holiday weeks being three times dearer than any other time? How am I expected to afford brand name clothes and a new car with having to feed and clothe kids? And what about my 4 bed detached house with double garage at nearly half a million pounds? How am I to demonstrate to all the world, that I am a respectable and successful human being without all these things? And lets face it, kids arent respectable are they? I mean, how much money do they bring in? Nothing. Well, apart from family allowance payments and tax credits, but that means theyre living on social benefits from the government - and that makes them no better than dole scroungers! Theyre hopeless at golf, and they never buy a round in the pub either. And then there's all the attention they want. "Play with me", "take me to", "can I have?" and so on. What is it with them? Theyre nothing but a bloody nuisance. And anytime you want to go out, you find that others have the same opinion of kids and the kids are banned from the place - quite rightly too; after all, I want to get blind drunk, swear a lot, possibly start a fight.... how can I do that with kids in tow? Kids, remember, who dont buy a round. This is my life, not theirs. Mine, mine, mine. Well, that part of my life, which is actually all of my life, which is stuck in a long hours culture just to pay a mortgage for a house that is overpriced, and to afford all the things that I think make me a good person in the eyes of others like me stuck in the same culture. Its not just for children that the UK is bad. E LadyEllen: This reminds me of the adult cartoon tv series called "Dinosaurs" in which the daddy dinosaur when being assailed by the trials and tribulations you mention would close his eyes and lean back and reminisce "ah the good old days when we could eat our young" thompson

popeye1250 -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 7:07:59 AM)
Any mention of the $22-$24 Billion dollars that's "missing" in the Oil for Food scandal in that report? You'd think that they'd have every available manjack looking for it 24/7! That amount of money doesn't just "dissapear!" Do they have suspects? NAMES? I mean WHO has the money? Wouldn't you think that that subject is far more important than some useless report on children in the U.K. and the U.S.? Again, WHO HAS ALL THAT MONEY?

KingDomUK -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 7:11:56 AM)
Having made the effort to read the overview (only 50+ pages) carefully, I am really pleased to see how dumb many people are on these boards. And what is doubly encouraging is that most are from the USA & UK. Enough said?

julietsierra -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 7:13:06 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: popeye1250 Any mention of the $22-$24 Billion dollars that's "missing" in the Oil for Food scandal in that report? You'd think that they'd have every available manjack looking for it 24/7! Well, I for one, hope they NEVER find that money!! Cause I'm telling my creditors that my payments to them were part of the funds sent to Iraq. SURELY since no one seems too upset about losing the billions, they won't even miss my tiny contribution. juliet

Aubre -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:27:33 AM)
Good idea julietsierra. I'd be happy though if we quit sending money to the UN. It might as well be the League of Nations.

Aubre -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:29:08 AM)
Oh sorry, my mistake. Those baby blue helmets and white armbands with UN on them are misleading.

meatcleaver -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:33:09 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Aubre Good idea julietsierra. I'd be happy though if we quit sending money to the UN. It might as well be the League of Nations. The US wanted the UN over there so you have got it. Why keep belly aching about it? For all the crap anti-UN people have to say about the UN and I put Bush in there too, he'd gladly give up an oil well or two to have UN troops in Iraq and American troops back home. Perhaps next time he talks about a country having WMD, he'll respect the UN a little more.

Aubre -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:37:01 AM)
Just because they are here now doesn't mean they have to stay.

julietsierra -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:45:30 AM)
ROFL>>> I'm a firm supporter of the UN and the presence of them in efforts to find solutions when the leaders of individual countries can't seem to manage. It was a good idea when it was suggested as the League of Nations and it's a good idea now. All I want is to be able to tell my creditors that I paid them, but that the money was diverted to some unnamed and so far, unfounded recipient in the middle east. You know... "the check's in the mail." I do find it strange though that the IRS seems to know exactly where I am to find their money, when it's a mere pittance compared to what was sent in cash form to the middle east and lost. I tell ya... I need to declare myself as a foreign country...then they'll forget where I put money that belonged to them. Or maybe.... yea... that's the ticket... instead of trying to rely on military and diplomatic means to recover the funds, all they have to do is sic the IRS on the trail... Those funds will be found in no time whatsoever. But until then...think anyone would buy the fact that I sent my credit card payments (in full of course) to Iraq? juliet

meatcleaver -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 8:57:56 AM)
Its easier for the IRS to get the money off you, you respond to thumb screws and you probably won't send your partner to their office as a suicide bomber. (Hmm, maybe I'm now giving you ideas)

cyberdude611 -> RE: Britain and USA bad for children. (2/14/2007 9:49:04 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: meatcleaver quote: ORIGINAL: Aubre Good idea julietsierra. I'd be happy though if we quit sending money to the UN. It might as well be the League of Nations. The US wanted the UN over there so you have got it. Why keep belly aching about it? For all the crap anti-UN people have to say about the UN and I put Bush in there too, he'd gladly give up an oil well or two to have UN troops in Iraq and American troops back home. Perhaps next time he talks about a country having WMD, he'll respect the UN a little more. Opinion polls show as much has 2/3rds of Americans no longer trust the United Nations. And the anger Americans have for the UN has very little to do with Bush. In the US, the UN starting diving in opinion polls starting with Rwanda. And ever since the favorability of the UN has been declining. And the UN didnt learn anything from that. They stood and watched genocide in Darfur. So what exactly is the purpose of the UN??? Because they have done jack crap to prevent genocide for fear a war might break out. If murder of millions of innocent people is not reason enough for a war, what is a good enough reason? The genocides in Rwanda and Darfur could have been prevented if the civilized world had enough balls to stop it. And don't forget about how UN soldiers in Congo were raping little girls. Nothing was ever done about this scandal either. Just more evidence that the UN lacks the ability to even police themselves. The UN has turned into a corrupt, pacifist organization being ran by the 3rd world. It needs radical reform to avoid being cast into irrelevancy. The UN is still operating on a system designed in the 1940s. The world has changed very much since then. The system needs to be redesigned to handle the threats and problems of today's post-cold war world.

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