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Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:32:18 PM

sweetnurseBBW

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Having been a slave for 13 years I have noticed there seems to be a war brewing between sub and slave. Why does it matter? Alot we know have different defintions on what a sub a slave is. None are wrong , but why the negative tone? I have seen statements such as " a slave is a mindless drone". "a slave has no rights" a slave is not a free thinker", " a slave is unmotivated" . None of these are true. Why is it a slave gets the negative defintion? I just would like others opinions on the subject.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:38:24 PM

cjenny

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I've seen those negative terms directed towards both slaves and submissives, each fighting to prove that they are the twue ones.
Personally while I see a difference between the two none of them have a negative difference, just a difference.
It is something too, that I don't think will ever really be agreed upon.
Slave is best.
No submissive is best.
Wabbit season!
Duck season!

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:42:22 PM

sweetnurseBBW

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I agree with you. No one is better , just different.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:47:35 PM

cjenny

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So do we agree it is wabbit season?

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:48:32 PM

bearincuffs

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It's possible that many people don't fully understand the full dynamics of a Master/slave relationship. In the beginning I didn't as I was equating being a slave to someone in this day and age exactly like human slavery in human history. As I gained knowledge and understanding I see this isn't so. It was my own ignorance and inexperience which caused me to feel in a negative way until I learned differently. As a result, my views had drastically changed and now find I have a great Master and am proud to be his slave.

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An it harm none, do as thou wilt
Do what you will, so long as it harms none
An it harm none, do what thou will
That it harm none, do as thou wilt
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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:49:48 PM

sweetnurseBBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

So do we agree it is wabbit season?

Yes its wabbit season.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:52:54 PM

juliaoceania

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This is one submissive that has no problemo at all with slaves.. but you knew this already if you have read my posts. I respect all who respect me.

I think that people tend to try to raise their label in relation to all others to be honest SNBBW, I mean I have read how submissives do not give as much, submit as deeply, are not as submissive.. and my pet peeve ... dom/sub is mental and master/slave is spiritual. The people who claim this are people I often admire in other ways so I do not say a word... but for anyone to claim that there is something more innately spiritual about their D/s dynamic kinda is a pet peeve of mine. I think that there are two sides to this elitism based upon labels that people claim for themselves.

In the last day or two there was someone who was highly insulting to all my slave sisters on another thread, it annoyed me because I do not want people insulting those of you who call yourselves "slave". I admire a good many of you on CM, and it offended me for you guys to read it.

So we should not tolerate that on either side of the equation.. whether it is someone claiming that their relationship is innately more spiritual, or that slaves lack self esteem and have no motivation.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 3/3/2007 5:54:45 PM >

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 5:59:47 PM

ownedgirlie

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It's an ongoing competitive thing which I'll never understand. If people are true to themselves in who they are, then whatever anyone else is shouldn't make a difference.

I always assume those who think negatively of slaves are those who either do not want to face similar qualities about themselves, or who are ignorant about what a slave is. I never really understood such emotional reactions to what other people are (unless of course they are harming the innocent).

So...slave, submissve, dominant, master, vanilla, orange sherbet, all of the above, none of the above - makes no difference to me. Are you a good person? Then odds are I like you, no matter your definition.

(in reply to sweetnurseBBW)

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:01:33 PM

sweetnurseBBW

Posts: 2464
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From: North Carolina
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quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

This is one submissive that has no problemo at all with slaves.. but you knew this already if you have read my posts. I respect all who respect me.

I think that people tend to try to raise their label in relation to all others to be honest SNBBW, I mean I have read how submissives do not give as much, submit as deeply, are not as submissive.. and my pet peeve ... dom/sub is mental and master/slave is spiritual. The people who claim this are people I often admire in other ways so I do not say a word... but for anyone to claim that there is something more innately spiritual about their D/s dynamic kinda is a pet peeve of mine. I think that there are two sides to this elitism based upon labels that people claim for themselves.

In the last day or two there was someone who was highly insulting to all my slave sisters on another thread, it annoyed me because I do not want people insulting those of you who call yourselves "slave". I admire a good many of you on CM, and it offended me for you guys to read it.

So we should not tolerate that on either side of the equation.. whether it is someone claiming that their relationship is innately more spiritual, or that slaves lack self esteem and have no motivation.

I know you aren't one of those that are negative. Maybe it has been the past few threads that have made me think this. Sub or slave , it doesn't matter, it is just what we call oursleves and how we do things. I am just curious why as to why some take a defensive tone against a slave.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:08:45 PM

litleone8620

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I think no matter where you go, you're going to find people who think their way of life is better than any other way of life. And i think it's worse in the lifestyle.

I can't say for sure, why it's like this. Though, personally, i have never been given negative comments about being a slave. It could be the fear of the unknown; it could just be old fashioned competition. You'll have to ask those who think their way of life is better than others'.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:09:10 PM

slavegirljoy

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From: North Carolina, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetnurseBBW
Why is it a slave gets the negative defintion? I just would like others opinions on the subject.

As far as this slave can tell, i think it might be because so much in our country's history regarding slavery has been taught as being something that is totally negative and, since there is no consensus or clear understanding of what it means to be a "Consensual slave", in the context of a BDSM relationship today, a lot of people still look at slavery in those old negative terms. i think a lot of people can't understand why anyone would choose to be a slave and so they condemn it and condemn those who do choose to be a slave.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:17:40 PM

BRNaughtyAngel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ownedgirlie

It's an ongoing competitive thing which I'll never understand. If people are true to themselves in who they are, then whatever anyone else is shouldn't make a difference.

I always assume those who think negatively of slaves are those who either do not want to face similar qualities about themselves, or who are ignorant about what a slave is. I never really understood such emotional reactions to what other people are (unless of course they are harming the innocent).

So...slave, submissve, dominant, master, vanilla, orange sherbet, all of the above, none of the above - makes no difference to me. Are you a good person? Then odds are I like you, no matter your definition.

I agree with you owned. Sometimes I think a persons own insecurities cause them to lash out at those who have a different relationship dynamic than their own. And some just get so full of themselves and their own relationship that they feel anyone who doesn't submit the way they do is somehow 'broken' or 'less'.

I'll be the first to admit that I don't always understand some of the dynamics folks are involved in here, but if it works for them, who am I to cast aspersions or doubts on them as individuals or on their relationship?

(in reply to ownedgirlie)

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:27:14 PM

FukinTroll

Posts: 6277
Joined: 2/6/2007
From: Under a bridge
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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetnurseBBW

Having been a slave for 13 years I have noticed there seems to be a war brewing between sub and slave. Why does it matter? Alot we know have different defintions on what a sub a slave is. None are wrong , but why the negative tone? I have seen statements such as " a slave is a mindless drone". "a slave has no rights" a slave is not a free thinker", " a slave is unmotivated" . None of these are true. Why is it a slave gets the negative defintion? I just would like others opinions on the subject.

Funny thing is I posted along the same lines a bit ago. So i will give my opinion again...

It is ego. The submissive has the freedom of an agenda, independence, blah blah blah. The fact of the matter is there are a lot of submissive’s here that would put some of the best slaves to shame.

The thought of slavery squicks some people because the feel their identity is somehow jeopardized by the label. Again you can toss a rock at the list of users and hit a sub that is a better slave, more slave than most can hope for, but he/she fights the label because she/he feels that it devalues them.

Now I would happily take any 10 subs off here or one good slave.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 6:28:17 PM

sleazybutterfly

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I know that my relationship as Masters slave is a spiritual one, but I can just as easily seem many D/s ones that are also.

I am not sure why we find it in ourselves to put down the way others do things. I think perhaps subs lash out as slaves because they think that we think we are better...and I think that slaves lash out at subs because so many seem to think that slaves are mindless creatures. I don't feel either is true, it depends on the person in any situation. I am sure there are mindless slaves, but I know a few mindless subs also.. along with slaves that don't have a submissive bone in their body compared to some subs.

I think that a lot of people just look for ways to put others down, I don't fully understand it, but my mind doesn't work that way. I have given up trying to figure others out and just decided let others do as they may.

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Life is not a popularity contest, it's better to be hated for what you believe, than loved for a lie.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:21:40 PM

myobedience

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sweetnurseBBW

Having been a slave for 13 years I have noticed there seems to be a war brewing between sub and slave. Why does it matter? Alot we know have different defintions on what a sub a slave is. None are wrong , but why the negative tone? I have seen statements such as " a slave is a mindless drone". "a slave has no rights" a slave is not a free thinker", " a slave is unmotivated" . None of these are true. Why is it a slave gets the negative defintion? I just would like others opinions on the subject.

These are my thoughts…..
You said, “having been a slave for 13 years;” so not to confuse the issues,
I will ask YOU ~~
What is your definition of slave?
What rights do you have?
How motivated are you?
What motivates you?
Are you caged, restrained and feed out of a bowl?
Do you sleep in the basement on a pallet with no blanket?
Do you dress naked?
Are you allowed to be a normal woman 24/7/365, wearing your own clothes, thinking your own thoughts?
What services do you perform daily?
Do you have a job that brings in income into your relationship?
If not what do you do all day long?
Are you a slave in private and a slave in public?
Are you a submissive AND slave or just a slave?
Why are you a slave?
How did you become a slave?
Do you like being a slave?
If your master/dom didn’t want you anymore~
         Would he release you?
         Sell you?
         Would it be a discussion before a release?
Are you allowed to cook for dinner what you choose?
Does your master/dom share you? Why or why not?
Is there love in the relationship?
Is love important in a M/s relationship?
Are you a sexual slave?
Are you a domestic slave?

I would ask these questions of you because these are some of the differences floating around, the misconceptions, the ideas, the convoluted thinking of what a slave vs a submissive might, should or would be.

I can tell you from what I read, slaves do not like to be called submissives and submissives do not like to be called slaves, not always, not sometimes, but many times. (Not a generalization, so take it for one)

Why do submissives become slaves and how? What changes?
Why do some submissives say they have a slave heart?
What is a slave heart vs a submissive heart?
Is one really any better than the other?
Why must we argue about titles and labels?
Why can’t we just agree that a dom uses a label for his purposes and a woman uses the same label to identify herself?
Why do women who have never served as a slave consider themselves a slave? Why do they use that title?
Why does a newbie in this lifestyle consider herself a slave and really doesn’t have the foggiest notion of what it means and all she may have done is read some online site?
Why do some slaves think they are superior to submissives?

So IMHO, sub or slave, doesn’t matter the title, it matters what is in your heart and what your other half finds in you.
Also, masters are many times not real masters. Why? They cannot master themselves.
Also dominants are not always dominants, they domineer rather than dominate.
Many times weak woman and men do not know the difference between control, authority, dominate and domineering? (Notice I said men and women, I didn’t say dom/me, mistress/master, sub/slave.)

On another thought ~~
Are all masters doms?
Does a master ever identify himself as a dom?
And the questions would go on.

I, as a woman, want to find a man who compels me to be strong, yet finds me willing to give up authority and control to him, because I find him worthy to give my all to him…mentally, spiritually, psychologically and physically. But never my soul, for my soul belongs to another far greater than any man or woman.
Where do you find labels in that context? Yet a D/s dynamic lies embedded in that paragraph.

Is D/s M/s? Is M/s D/s? Is D/s BDSM? Is M/s BDSM? Is BDSM D/s? Is BDSM M/s?

_____________________________

With grace and gratitude, I am owned.
A Man who always seeks to be the best He can be for you is the only Man truly worthy of being called Master.

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:24:43 PM

KatyLied

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~fr~
For me, it's about the connotation of a slave and how many in the lifestyle view it. Words that come to mind: contractual, no limits, sold/traded, chattel. I'm not up for any of this, therefore, I would not want to be considered a "slave". I want to be more than property, I want to have, I guess, for lack of a better word, more of a "traditional" relationship. I'm happy with being a submissive and feel that it fits what I am about.

spelling edit

< Message edited by KatyLied -- 3/3/2007 7:25:33 PM >

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:31:06 PM

KeirasSecret

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From: central NH
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quote:

Why is it a slave gets the negative defintion?

I think it goes both ways, depending on who is doing the defining.

Personally I don’t see how either can be defined when it really comes down to the individual or their owner. If we could learn to only describe ourselves/situations, perhaps this would no longer be a problem.

Alas, we are all only human, (I think) and some aren’t happy unless they are causing problems.

Be well,

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It apears to me, the practice of "an eye for an eye" has finally taken it's toll; the majority are now walking around blind.

Bitching; whining in a louder voice.

If the truth hurts, change it!

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:52:12 PM

swtrayn

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjenny

So do we agree it is wabbit season?

No it is duck season

*couldn't help myself*

rayn

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"I tried to contain myself -- I escaped..."

"Make sure brain is engaged before SEND key is released"

"Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead."--Lucille Ball

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:54:59 PM

sublizzie

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I don't know that the word slave is so negative, there's just too many definitions of it for it to truly be negative. I have friends who would see being a submissive as being negative, not because they are slaves but because they believe in complete equality all of the time for all people.

Whether one is labeled slave or submissive doesn't really matter unless you understand the definition that label has according to the person doing the labeling. I have friends who have said I could be a slave. Since I understand *their* definition of that label, and agree with them, I don't argue the point. Others would look at me and see me as only marginally submissive. Just depends on the labeller more than the labellee.

Just my thoughts....

(in reply to sweetnurseBBW)

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RE: Why is the word slave so negative? - 3/3/2007 7:59:18 PM

swtrayn

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Joined: 2/21/2007
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I will be looking forward to seeing some your questions answered.

To me.. it is a label.. what one might consider me is not what someone else might.

I am just me.. I am not big on lables, never have been.

I don't really feel like I fit into a label.

rayn

_____________________________

"I tried to contain myself -- I escaped..."

"Make sure brain is engaged before SEND key is released"

"Once in his life, every man is entitled to fall madly in love with a gorgeous redhead."--Lucille Ball

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Post #: 20

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