RE: Why are we so rare?

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LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 5:55:03 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bellaballanda quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong Rich.. your relationship is the example of the only way I see switches finding happiness... within their own preferences. But why is it that if they get spurned by someone they are interested in because they are a switch and the other party isn't.. then that is when they start talking about narrow mindedness or "little boxes". Can they not accept "not interested"? I would not reject them as a friend.. just a D/s alliance. Would you consider that a switch or just a sub who can top on occasion? I wouldn't consider them at all :) edited to add: You see- switches, to me, are not an "either/or" I see them as a "neither/nor" (don't get upset, I'm just answering the question)

bellaballanda -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 6:58:06 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong I wouldn't consider them at all :) edited to add: You see- switches, to me, are not an "either/or" I see them as a "neither/nor" (don't get upset, I'm just answering the question) Could you elaborate? I don't think I am understanding what you're saying about neither/nor...

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:17:37 PM)
Even if it's the wrong side!! PeggyDee~GW

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:24:24 PM)
Many switches do not switch with same partners. They either top or they bottom, or dominate or submit (and these are not mutually inclusive or exclusive). The biggest misconception that I have found is that folks think that ALL switches just change roles at whim. That is not the case usually. We are usually inspired to top or to bottom to a particular person. And if all goes well, then a relationship based on THAT interaction is formed. To say most switches are poly is probably valid. To say many switches subjicate one side or another of their personality so they can fit into someone's little boxed set of roles is a given. Something to think over, PeggyDee~GW

LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:27:33 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bellaballanda quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong I wouldn't consider them at all :) edited to add: You see- switches, to me, are not an "either/or" I see them as a "neither/nor" (don't get upset, I'm just answering the question) Could you elaborate? I don't think I am understanding what you're saying about neither/nor... Neither a dom nor a sub, not either a dom or a sub...simply a switch.

LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:30:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeggyDee Many switches do not switch with same partners. They either top or they bottom, or dominate or submit (and these are not mutually inclusive or exclusive). The biggest misconception that I have found is that folks think that ALL switches just change roles at whim. That is not the case usually. We are usually inspired to top or to bottom to a particular person. And if all goes well, then a relationship based on THAT interaction is formed. To say most switches are poly is probably valid. To say many switches subjicate one side or another of their personality so they can fit into someone's little boxed set of roles is a given. Something to think over, PeggyDee~GW So Peggy.. why even bother with those in their "little boxes"? Just stick with another switch.

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:39:13 PM)
I don't bother with the boxes. I am owned, property, slave. To ONE and one only. He is the only person who has ever inspired me to submit (not to be confused with bottoming). We have co-topped everyone else from day one. Seven years later we are still doing it. So, that makes me a switch, because I do have ones who come to bottom and OR submit to me personally. I don't switch with same partners. So, yes I do see other switches, as submissives or bottoms. They are not allowed to even think about trying to top or dominate me. Hope that clarifies it for you and helps you out of your little box. PeggyDee~GW

LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/18/2007 7:47:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: PeggyDee I don't bother with the boxes. I am owned, property, slave. To ONE and one only. He is the only person who has ever inspired me to submit (not to be confused with bottoming). We have co-topped everyone else from day one. Seven years later we are still doing it. So, that makes me a switch, because I do have ones who come to bottom and OR submit to me personally. I don't switch with same partners. So, yes I do see other switches, as submissives or bottoms. They are not allowed to even think about trying to top or dominate me. Hope that clarifies it for you and helps you out of your little box. PeggyDee~GW Why are you so sarcastic to those of us who have a specific preference? Are you trying to say switches are better than everyone who chooses one or the other? So, yes I do see other switches, as submissives or bottoms. They are not allowed to even think about trying to top or dominate me. So you are a switch who dictates to other switches when they can switch? LOL! Just be who you are and know you are not going to be everyones' cup of tea and leave others to enjoy THEIR choices. (This is getting downright ridiculous)

TigerNINTails -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 4:20:55 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong Neither a dom nor a sub, not either a dom or a sub...simply a switch. When one is a switch (I know for a fact from where I speak, I've been one my entire life), as it pertains to the D/s and M/s dynamics (and it DOES pertain to both) and the BDSM activities, and interrelations of individuals in this community, this statement is absolutely diametrically opposed to the reality. Switch = An individual in the alternative lifestyles community which partakes in both Dominant and submissive roles, exhibiting both Dominant and submissive traits dependent on context, situation and relation. In order to be a switch, we must have both Dominant and submissive qualities within. If we did not have either... We would be dysfunctional. I believe your view point to be completely and maliciously twisted by your previous experience. Just my opinion here. quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong So you are a switch who dictates to other switches when they can switch? LOL! Just be who you are and know you are not going to be everyones' cup of tea and leave others to enjoy THEIR choices. (This is getting downright ridiculous) What's ridiculous is that you obviously truly don't understand an M/s dynamic involving switches to switches (How could you, you aren't a switch?) What she is saying is that in regards to her as a switch, and being slave to ONE chosen Master, (and I implore you to stop fighting to "Be right" about this) is that when she's dealing with switches that bottom to and slave to and submit to HER, THOSE switches are not allowed to TOP her... There is no "Topping from the bottom" in her relationship on any level, either with her to her Owner, or those whom service her towards her. In addition, and this was plain as day to me, I don't see how you could be confused about it, is that she only submits to one man. So being a switch, and a bit Toppy with other switches and slaves, she can choose NOT to allow anyone to Top or Dominate her BUT her Owner... After all, can't you make that choice? Of course you can. Don't begrudge her ability to make her own decisions. I see something here that reminds me of an envious neighbor that sees everything as greener on the other side of a fence they can't get over. quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong So what is you big beef then? I don't mean a switch is a bad person.. I just see their focus more on "role play" for whatever fits at the moment. Not too wide a brush as you accuse me of. This is absolutely too broad a brush... You're shotgun marketing with your definition of switches and at the same time, you're pigeonholing us into a rather unsavoury definition of being "RolePlayers"... I enjoy role playing, sure... But I live my M/s TPE relationship. Am I a switch? Yes. Do I switch with my slaves? No. Do I partner up with some people, on occasion at play parties, to bottom, and explore my bottom side? Absolutely. Do I submit to these people? No. You see, it's not about what fits the moment. It's about how it applies to your life. Switches are not empty, greedy, dishonest and manipulative individuals that simply are out to fulfill whatever "fantasy" that they see fit for the moment. We, on the contrary, have so much depth, and curiosity, it spills into different aspects of the lifestyles. There is no wrong way to do something in D/s, M/s and BDSM, unless you are doing something harmful to another, physically, mentally or spiritually. Note there is a difference between hurt and harm. Hurt serves a purpose. In some cases, sometimes it's senseless, but that's beside the point. Switches are fluid, compatible in many more situations, with many more individuals on a personal and lifestyle level, simply by being true to their fluid and dynamic nature. And that is the key point. We are fluid. You asked "Why can't they accept "I'm not interested?"..." I put to you another question... Why are you so hurt, due to the choices that a switch (or anyone else for that matter) has a right to make? Further, switches don't try to be everything to everyone. We do however, have an ability to flow, and become that which is needed or wanted by any one specific individual at that time, or even permanently, should we align well enough. I hope that you understand better now, what it is that you seem to be inclined to flame. Have a great day. Peace. Tora

TigerNINTails -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 4:37:31 AM)
To answer the OP: I don't believe that we are rare perse either. But there certainly are a far cry more people that for some reason don't understand their own natures enough to allow themselves to be fluid and flow from one aspect to another as we do, simply due to a lack of understanding of the self. They view being able to "change sides" or "switch hit" as something that betrays what they feel to be the way they want to be, and sometimes, they are scared to do it, afraid they might like it more, maybe. I don't know. I know that there are wholly dominant and wholly submissive folks out there. As to whether anyone way is better or not, I couldnt tell you. I do know that I glean a ton more information from one bottoming scene for use in my training and development of slaves than most "wholly Dominant" will glean in 10 years. It gives me insight. So am I better in that sense? Maybe. Am I rare? Maybe. Am I rare because I'm a switch? No. Why? Because whether anyone wants to believe it or not, out of all the billions of people on this planet, they all have that capacity to defer to someone elses dominance, it just might not be in a kink sense. So I agree that nearly everyone has that capacity to switch, it just depends on the circumstances that they choose or feel inclined to do so. I have to agree that to be a switch is to be honest. At the very least, with yourself. This should shine out to others as well. After all, honesty is the best policy. <G> Peace. Tora

TheHeretic -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 7:31:36 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong You see- switches, to me, are not an "either/or" I see them as a "neither/nor" (don't get upset, I'm just answering the question) I just had a little memory flashback to my Grandmother explaining how she wasn't a bit predjudiced against 'the colored's,' it would just be better if they all stayed in their little part of town or went back to Africa.

LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 8:46:22 AM)
Tiger, My typewriter does not have the capability to "type between the lines". So please stop saying things I have never said! I keep my posts brief and to the point. We have so many of the posts here about switches and why they are unpopular..the constant lament of why they can't find a partner.. so I responded from a viewpoint that tried to answer it. I haven't had just one experience with one switch that formed my opinions on it all. Don't see a flame where there is none intended. If you keep asking and prodding me.. I will try to clarify why I feel the way I do about it. It really seems to be a big issue. If you prefer that I not contribute to the thread with a different perspective and experience.. then I'll leave you all to yourselves. If you guys don't want a discussion from DIFFERENT view points.. then don't ask the question. This same question arises here in different forms..this time I decided to contribute from one of those you find so confined in their box :) Otherwise, I'll leave you all to huddle and point fingers as you commiserate. If it's so fulfilling.. then why are all so miserable? And Rych.. I have NO DOUBT you came from such a background. (re: you grandmother's attitude)

Kitte9 -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 10:10:22 AM)
I didn't realize we were. Apparently most people here would agree with that.

bellaballanda -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 11:32:05 AM)
I think we all just need to agree to disagree. People are entitled to their own opinons about switches. They're most likely well formed and have basis in real life. I appreciate hearing different sides on the debate. It doesn't mean I have to agree with them, just that hearing other sides is good. No need for people to take others' opinons personally. There is no one way to do any of these things and no one answer.

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 11:54:53 AM)
quote:Why are you so sarcastic to those of us who have a specific preference? Are you trying to say switches are better than everyone who chooses one or the other? So, yes I do see other switches, as submissives or bottoms. They are not allowed to even think about trying to top or dominate me. So you are a switch who dictates to other switches when they can switch? LOL! Just be who you are and know you are not going to be everyones' cup of tea and leave others to enjoy THEIR choices. (This is getting downright ridiculous) I dictate my relationship preferences yes, don't you??? I don't understand why you lightly veil your distaste for switches, and I feel it's because you truly don't understand us. We are not "neither dom or sub" or top or bottom....we are BOTH, just not simultaneously. At least most us aren't both simultaneoulsy or within a set relationship. We have varied tastes, varied needs, and omg, yup I'm bisexual too and poly to boot. I think that makes me flexible, open minded, and non conformist. I don't understand why you're reading sarcasm into my posts. I tend to be blunt...sorry if it offends you. PeggyDee~GW

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 12:00:04 PM)
Tora, THANK YOU!! You said it all so much better than I could have. I'm trying very hard not to be driven crazy by someone who obviouldy doesn't understand switches, doesn't want to understand switches, and really really wants to make us feel wrong somehow. Thanks again for a Great Post! PeggyDee~GW

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 12:02:33 PM)
TheHeretic, My grandmother used to say something similar....she had nothing against negroes, she just didn't want one on her porch!!! Have a great day, PeggyDee~GW

PeggyDee -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 12:07:34 PM)
You keep saying we're all so miserable....I'm not miserable....I haven't met any switches who are miserable, and I haven't read the entire ask a switch board or the entire archive of CM. I have yet to see any misery in any of the posting in this thread. You're entitled to your opinion, I can respect that much. PeggyDee~GW

TheHeretic -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 12:11:53 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: LotusSong And Rych.. I have NO DOUBT you came from such a background. (re: you grandmother's attitude) Lotus, my background is so diverse, I doubt you could conceive a fraction of it. I had to decide at a very young age that sometimes very good people could be totally wrong on things they believed, and still be good people. Go ahead and make your little noise of dismissal now. She did a little 'clicking' thing with her tongue.

LotusSong -> RE: Why are we so rare? (4/19/2007 12:39:26 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: bellaballanda I think we all just need to agree to disagree. People are entitled to their own opinons about switches. They're most likely well formed and have basis in real life. I appreciate hearing different sides on the debate. It doesn't mean I have to agree with them, just that hearing other sides is good. No need for people to take others' opinons personally. There is no one way to do any of these things and no one answer. Exactly! Thank you Shelly :)

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