RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY?

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 11:31:49 AM

Wheldrake

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

It may be fantastic but in my opinion is misdirected. The goal seems to be to elicit a response, which in my opinion is wrong. My goal is to give my cmailee a quick glimpse of what I'm like. If she responds to that, cool. But I'm not going to play games to boost reply rates if it results in an incorrect impression of me.

This I see as noble but largely futile. As is evidenced by many responses here, both irl and online, women typically still enjoy the age old idea of being pursued and romanced. Which means the wittily constructed quick-message that focuses on them (or shows in some form or another that you have honed in on something unique to them) will habitually be favored to a message that's self-descriptive and objectively honest (some may even take that to seem like a "he talks about himself" thing).

Except in rare cases, being human and desiring to meet a prospective partner involves the need to play games because we've psychologically validated them and continue to do so.

Okay, but not all women are identical. Some are going to be a lot more invested in the idea of being "pursued and romanced" than others. And equally, we may all play games now and then, but the extent of game-playing varies quite widely from person to person. The problem with analysing human behaviour in terms of game theory is that people are complicated, not to mention heterogeneous in their motivations. And anyway, you seem to be agreeing that reading profiles is worth the bother, if you're recommending wittily constructed messages that focus on something "unique to" the recipient. If you're going to invest that much time, it seems only logical (as well as respectful) to consider whether you approximately meet whatever criteria are mentioned in the profile before firing off that wittily constructed message.

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 11:55:41 AM

sexyred1

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And then there are some women, me for example, who are not interested in games, who don't need a wittily constructed message, but simply a message that is not completely idiotic.

When you take the time to clearly state who you are and what you are seeking in your profile and you get some moron who writes, "ur into lactating?" that is far different than someone who just says "hi, liked your profile, please check mine out and let me know."

The first is neither wittily constructed or salient and the second is not necessarily wittily constructed, but simple and reasonable, thereby likely to receive a response.

< Message edited by sexyred1 -- 2/21/2011 11:56:10 AM >

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 11:55:55 AM

NihilusZero

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

Okay, but not all women are identical. Some are going to be a lot more invested in the idea of being "pursued and romanced" than others. And equally, we may all play games now and then, but the extent of game-playing varies quite widely from person to person.

This is correct, but I'm also not confining the "game" aspect of courtship to just the more simple, silly, and deliberate examples (like 'playing hard to get'). I'm also talking about the subtle psychological footwork at play nearly always in relevance to people being wooed enough to "feel" something in someone they want to connect with. People tend to widely disavow themselves of game-playing without realizing how pervasive and subtle the entire process actually is.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

The problem with analysing human behaviour in terms of game theory is that people are complicated, not to mention heterogeneous in their motivations.

I think we tend to imagine such is the case, but the neurological motivators for companionship are much baser. The complication arises as part of the game, I think, where the self-concept creates intentional difficulties in the connection process in order to cater to the emotional allure (a classic example is the 'playing hard to get' system, which has numerous permutations, and where the pursuee heightens their own value by being difficult to attain and the pursuer heightens their own value by choosing to pursue something of greater difficulty).

And, I'd like to think people generally use personal criteria as an objective list for who they will test-drive relationships with, but I don't tend to see that as being the overwhelming case. People still use those lists to determine who they might want , but the act of actually making the leap to date/meet/whatever that person based solely on those elements seems rarely to happen without some other emotional wooing going on. Granted, the desire for emotional wooing itself becomes a prerequisite through this process...

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

And anyway, you seem to be agreeing that reading profiles is worth the bother, if you're recommending wittily constructed messages that focus on something "unique to" the recipient. If you're going to invest that much time, it seems only logical (as well as respectful) to consider whether you approximately meet whatever criteria are mentioned in the profile before firing off that wittily constructed message.

Not necessarily because people, as I went on about above, are not really as strict about their pure bullet points. Emotional teasing can trump a soft limit most of the time and, even more empowering, is the chance that we could prove to be the exception to someone's specific wishes (another variation of the 'playing hard to get' game).

How many people would we say have entered into a relationship with someone who didn't meet their standard requirements because of an emotional piquing of interest?

< Message edited by NihilusZero -- 2/21/2011 12:01:30 PM >

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I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 12:03:07 PM

porcelaine

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

And then there are some women, me for example, who are not interested in games, who don't need a wittily constructed message, but simply a message that is not completely idiotic.

Greetings,

You're such much nicer than I am. :)

quote:

When you take the time to clearly state who you are and what you are seeking in your profile and you get some moron who writes, "ur into lactating?" that is far different than someone who just says "hi, liked your profile, please check mine out and let me know."

Now for me that equals epic fail. I can read and reiterating all of that would be a little infuriating. Talk to me instead.

quote:

The first is neither wittily constructed or salient and the second is not necessarily wittily constructed, but simple and reasonable, thereby likely to receive a response.

I prefer the gentleman that has the gumption to step outside the box and simply be himself. He's comfortable, conversant, and isn't interested in selling an image because he understands I'll take or leave it.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 12:22:26 PM

Wheldrake

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
The complication arises as part of the game, I think, where the self-concept creates intentional difficulties in the connection process in order to cater to the emotional allure (a classic example is the 'playing hard to get' system, which has numerous permutations, and where the pursuee heightens their own value by being difficult to attain and the pursuer heightens their own value by choosing to pursue something of greater difficulty).

My fundamental point, I guess, is that not everyone is this calculating and egotistical (in the sense of being deeply concerned with their own "value") in their interactions with others. This is all a bit academic for me, since I'm not using this site to look for a partner - but if I were, my approach would simply be to try to establish connections with women who seemed like they might be compatible with me. I wouldn't bother the ones who made it clear that they were looking for something I couldn't provide (or wasn't interested in providing), and the messages I did send would be intended to catch the recipient's interest and give her some substantive information that would help her decide whether or not to respond. I really wouldn't worry about whether she was a sufficiently "difficult" target to enhance my own "value", and equally I would probably just break off the interaction if I got a persistent sense that she was creating obstacles in order to enhance hers. The point would be to determine whether there was enough common ground for further interaction to be worthwhile, and hopefully have a little fun in the process.

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 1:01:40 PM

NihilusZero

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From: Nashville, TN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
The complication arises as part of the game, I think, where the self-concept creates intentional difficulties in the connection process in order to cater to the emotional allure (a classic example is the 'playing hard to get' system, which has numerous permutations, and where the pursuee heightens their own value by being difficult to attain and the pursuer heightens their own value by choosing to pursue something of greater difficulty).

My fundamental point, I guess, is that not everyone is this calculating and egotistical (in the sense of being deeply concerned with their own "value") in their interactions with others.

I'm actually not trying to demonize the process at all, though. And it's rarely a conscious act, but the mechanisms are still their. We're all still effectively trying to get the best "value" for our "money".

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

This is all a bit academic for me, since I'm not using this site to look for a partner - but if I were, my approach would simply be to try to establish connections with women who seemed like they might be compatible with me.

That would make sense, yes. The catch, though, is that not only the assessment but that mentality has to be echoed by the other person as well (and you have to hope there isn't a desire to be wooed or at least that their interest in being wooed is a match for the way in which you do it). Also, I'm still speaking of much of this in a very latent way...not a lot of people actively think about these things as they're doing them...it's just what's moving their motivations under the surface.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wheldrake

The point would be to determine whether there was enough common ground for further interaction to be worthwhile, and hopefully have a little fun in the process.

True, but this is the second phase, once something has already happened to elicit mutual interaction.

_____________________________

"I know it's all a game
I know they're all insane
I know it's all in vain
I know that I'm to blame."
~Siouxsie & the Banshees

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 1:13:50 PM

leadership527

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NihilusZero
Agreed. Yet, supply and demand will also dictate which games one may have to play if they're going to play at all (unless a person has other lures in their favor), and the measuring stick everyone, including ourselves, always defaults to is currently having a partner versus not having one.

Sort of. I have two different inputs on that.

For starters, never in my life have I been single for very long. There has always been one or more women floating around who were already "interested". So the whole supply & demand argument, while I acknowledge it, isn't a part of my thinking. Actually, it's more the other way around for me. "You don't happen to have a single brother?" is a comment I hear fairly regularly.

Secondly, it is always a choice to play the game or not. Don't get me wrong. I am a HIGHLY intimate person. I thrive in a committed relationship and suffer without one. But the game players don't have what I'm looking for. It's pointless for me to fish in that pond because no matter what I come up with it's not what I want or need. I see no purpose in a "conquest" that is useless. It seems like just a waste of time. I'd probably just throw myself into work & hobbies as a distraction.

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 1:20:10 PM

poise

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quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

"You don't happen to have a single brother?" is a comment I hear fairly regularly.

Well, do you?

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 2:20:59 PM

sexyred1

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quote:

ORIGINAL: porcelaine

quote:

ORIGINAL: sexyred1

And then there are some women, me for example, who are not interested in games, who don't need a wittily constructed message, but simply a message that is not completely idiotic.

Greetings,

You're such much nicer than I am. :)

Actually, I am not that much nicer. :)
quote:

When you take the time to clearly state who you are and what you are seeking in your profile and you get some moron who writes, "ur into lactating?" that is far different than someone who just says "hi, liked your profile, please check mine out and let me know."

Now for me that equals epic fail. I can read and reiterating all of that would be a little infuriating. Talk to me instead.

I agree, but then that would entail having some expectations that cannot be fulfilled. I went for the lowest common denominator in my example. Talking to me would be far too lofty of a goal to expect.
quote:

The first is neither wittily constructed or salient and the second is not necessarily wittily constructed, but simple and reasonable, thereby likely to receive a response.

I prefer the gentleman that has the gumption to step outside the box and simply be himself. He's comfortable, conversant, and isn't interested in selling an image because he understands I'll take or leave it.

I agree and if that ever happens, I will respond in kind.

Namaste,

~porcelaine

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RE: Why don't men read a female's profile CAREFULLY? - 2/21/2011 3:48:48 PM

porcelaine

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Greetings red,

quote:

Actually, I am not that much nicer. :)

Did I mention I was grinning when I wrote it?

quote:

I agree, but then that would entail having some expectations that cannot be fulfilled. I went for the lowest common denominator in my example. Talking to me would be far too lofty of a goal to expect.

That's precisely why I got rid of my profile. I'm amazed how many people have difficulty striking up a conversation without a cheat sheet. It's been a significant improvement.