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Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 5:51:43 AM

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When the Madoff fraud became known, Jews in the US (likely elsewhere) felt ugly that "one of our own" was unethical. We don't feel any better about Weinergate.

Similarly, when the Virginia Tech massacre occurred, Korean-Americans were afraid that they might be held accountable in some way.

How about you? Do you feel chagrin at what those in your ethnic group do?

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 6:54:06 AM

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My great grandfather was Choctaw.

Besides the Choctaw there are pieces of this and that. I would have no idea which ethnic group I should feel responsible for.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 6:57:41 AM

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You mean white male?

I'm not coping to the supremacy crap, that's for sure.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:01:17 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery
You mean white male?

pfffttt

That covers way to large a group of assholes for me to concern myself with.

I'll stick with the Choctaw and Cherokee

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:01:47 AM

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Nope. In fact I hadn't realized Weiner was jewish until just now. And it still doesn't matter. His actions do not reflect the whole community. I have enough problems taking care of my own shit without worrying about what everyone else is doing.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:02:51 AM

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no and don't understand people who do. It never even occurred to me that Madoff is Jewish or the Tech Massacre was done by a Korean. Never even thought it mattered, never even wondered what ethnicity they are.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:26:45 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

Nope. In fact I hadn't realized Weiner was jewish until just now. And it still doesn't matter. His actions do not reflect the whole community. I have enough problems taking care of my own shit without worrying about what everyone else is doing.

dito

There are enough folks who try to get to me down on such a line but I am not having any of it...I don't care what others in the past did or future do, I am only responsible about what "I" do...and thats quite frankly more than enough already

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:42:37 AM

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quote:

no and don't understand people who do

The problem, more accurately, is the fear within the communities that outsiders will judge the ethnicity, not the person.

Hence the sensitivity to "one of their one" perpetrating a crime.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:52:29 AM

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honestly, yes i do. =p when i see other brown people fucking up, it flat out pisses me off.
like you don't have enough problems, or the WORLD doesn't have enough problems, you figure you need to make more? shooting people in your own neighborhood? and usually shooting the people who are actually trying to make things better?
the god damn "stop snitching" campaigns? SERIOUSLY?

and don't even get me started on the nonsensical "culture" created through rap -- rap and hip-hop are not the same, and i really wish rap would just go away. misogyny, drug use, gang violence, these are all somehow good things? what?

UGH.
discrimination and racism are still very real, but when you are doing nothing to prove people wrong, what can you expect?

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:53:34 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

The problem, more accurately, is the fear within the communities that outsiders will judge the ethnicity, not the person.

the truth is that they usually do. =p

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 7:59:06 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

When the Madoff fraud became known, Jews in the US (likely elsewhere) felt ugly that "one of our own" was unethical. We don't feel any better about Weinergate.

Similarly, when the Virginia Tech massacre occurred, Korean-Americans were afraid that they might be held accountable in some way.

How about you? Do you feel chagrin at what those in your ethnic group do?

All I can say is I do not understand some people's proclivities towards collective guilt, but if it turns you on to feel responsible for people you do not know and have no power over, well that's your thing I suppose

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:00:41 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LillyBoPeep

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

The problem, more accurately, is the fear within the communities that outsiders will judge the ethnicity, not the person.

the truth is that they usually do. =p

That is a different statement than the people should actually feel responsible for... worrying about being held accountable is a lot different thing

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:03:43 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

no and don't understand people who do

The problem, more accurately, is the fear within the communities that outsiders will judge the ethnicity, not the person.

Hence the sensitivity to "one of their one" perpetrating a crime.

Unfortunately, outsiders do judge the ethnicity all too often. Cases in point: Japanese interment camps after Pearl Harbor; the treatment of Middle Easterners since 9/11; and the general treatment of Mexicans and African Americans due to the actions of a very small percentage of their population.

So while people really don't have a reason to feel guilt, they do have a good reason to fear that some (many?) narrow-minded people may hold them accountable simply because of their ethnicity.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:06:09 AM

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quote:

Similarly, when the Virginia Tech massacre occurred, Korean-Americans were afraid that they might be held accountable in some way.

Not only that, but they actually DID feel accountable. They felt they should have done better, taken better care of one of their own. *I talked with one of the professors there just after it happened. It hit a serious nerve in that community where any kind of disability (like schizophrenia) is hidden away, and they pretend it doesn't exist.

quote:

How about you? Do you feel chagrin at what those in your ethnic group do?

Yes, I do. I never realized that I'm a US citizen, an "American" until I left. I didn't realize all the devastation my country has caused, and I am always a little nervous about telling people where I'm from. I often say, "please don't hold it against me." On the other hand, I've become MUCH more patriotic - I love the principles my country was founded upon. I love that so many brilliant people are "my" people.

My darling niece is now traveling internationally, and she is having a fairly similar experience. She tells me, "you're right, aunty sunshine. You DON'T know who you are until you know who you aren't."

Chagrin at my people? Yes. Pride? Yep, that too.

best,
sunshine

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:07:05 AM

Kana

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Nah, I'm responsible for me and mine. That's it...and Thank God. I don't wanna be responsible for all the wing-nut FUBAR crap the Irish have pulled over my life. Fuck, then I'd have to take ownership of the Kennedy's, Nixon, and (according to him) Clinton.
Ayeeeyah. I'd rather chew my own nuts off.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:18:25 AM

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No and I do not hold entire groups responsible for the actions of one or a few. In the end we are all human, which comes with all the possibility of psychopathic behavior.

Psychopathic being used in a more general sense, I just read an article on non-violent psychopaths and how they make it easily into the corporate and political environments.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DarkSteven

When the Madoff fraud became known, Jews in the US (likely elsewhere) felt ugly that "one of our own" was unethical. We don't feel any better about Weinergate.

Similarly, when the Virginia Tech massacre occurred, Korean-Americans were afraid that they might be held accountable in some way.

How about you? Do you feel chagrin at what those in your ethnic group do?

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 8:39:49 AM

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fast reply

This topic always makes me think of the Palestinians.... can't help it, it just does. I do not think it is fair that collective guilt is applied there. I never have. It has always deeply bothered me.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 9:11:51 AM

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I have a lot of international students. It really opens my eyes when I hear the stories and the passion describing the wonders and troubles of their homeland from real people from Palestine, Persia (not "Iran"), Jordan, Bosnia, Russia, China, Pakistan, Ghana, Turkey...and many more from Europe, Japan, and Latin America. We just have no idea, and there's probably no way we realistically can.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 9:20:03 AM

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The only thing my heritage (Welsh) has been accused of is too many damn "L's" in our words, and I dont feel the least bit guilty about that.

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RE: Do you feel responsible? - 6/12/2011 9:26:00 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I have a lot of international students. It really opens my eyes when I hear the stories and the passion describing the wonders and troubles of their homeland from real people from Palestine, Persia (not "Iran"), Jordan, Bosnia, Russia, China, Pakistan, Ghana, Turkey...and many more from Europe, Japan, and Latin America. We just have no idea, and there's probably no way we realistically can.

My friend teaches high school in Atlanta Georgia, and there was a national pride week where people were encouraged to bring flags of their homelands to school to celebrate their heritage. There is a large Bosnian/Serbian population, as well as Middle Eastern countries (Iran, Iraq, etc...) there.

She said that she put aside a couple of periods that week so the kids could talk about how they came to the United States. She said she was unprepared for the candor of some of the students who talked quite graphically about their experiences, some of which are reminiscent of stories of Nazi occupied Europe. She said even though it was hard to hear, she is going to do it again and again, because she thinks it has value to help students understand each other's experiences.

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