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RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lefties are Coming!


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RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/27/2017 7:31:47 PM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: Awareness
ORIGINAL: thompsonx

There is no greater collectivist construction than the idea of the State as enforcer of equality.

That is pretty much the sum and substance of the declaration of independence and the constitution.
If you are not happy with that then stay out of amerika.




[/quote] No, you fucking moron, that's the State as the guarantor of liberty.


This from the declaration of independence:



We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

In as much as you are a foriegner and are ignorant of our founding your foolishness would be understandable in a prepubescent whistle-punk.
Perhaps if you were to get a grown up to give you a hand with the big words it would be helpful.
Jesus you are phoquing stupid.





(in reply to Awareness)
Profile   Post #: 141
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 2:50:29 AM   
heavyblinker


Posts: 3623
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka
Thanks for such a thoughtful response. So what are people's primary motivations for such things as innovation in a socialist society?


They would do it because it's worth doing and because it means you're contributing to a community that you value because it values you in return. People will innovate and people will do the dirty jobs because you want your community and your society to look nice and be good because it belongs to you. A shorter work day would give everyone enough time to do their part to make their local community great, and ideally communities would compete with each other out of a strong sense of community pride. They wouldn't do it for money or any sort of reward other than the knowledge that they are the best and they are making the world a better place. I don't know how any amount of money could compete with that.

The problem is that in capitalist society we're constantly being conditioned to chase money, leisure, entertainment, recreational travel, status, casual sex, etc. We are taught to isolate ourselves in cocoons made of things, and we relate to each other through possessions, pop culture, and class as opposed to our values, ideas or human qualities. A lot of people don't see anything wrong with basing their entire identities on these things and it's not something that can be undone overnight... but the argument that undoing this would interfere with someone's 'freedom' is totally backwards-- it's not freedom, it's just a different kind of conditioning.

< Message edited by heavyblinker -- 2/28/2017 2:51:47 AM >

(in reply to tamaka)
Profile   Post #: 142
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 4:05:02 AM   
WickedsDesire


Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline
and that is why I do not like ~50% of the Englandshire jackals and ~20ish% of my own lands HB..the English are getting worse surely you see this, or have noticed this...and i say that without knowing which side of the wall you reside on...not that it bothers me :P

America is this least free nation on earth, or thereabouts, and they do not even know it....A land of programmed zombies (sheople is too good a word to use on those dim fukwits)

Those more familiar with my archaic rambles everywhere x time itself, know i am long on the record as saying none of those two systems work. Certainly not the extremities. And, America is as about as extreme as you get capitalism wise.

Hows the Russian probe going anyway Americashire jackals?

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 143
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 8:07:45 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Awareness

Oh no. You're wrong. I'm amazed you can't see it yourself.

Is that your answer to everything? WTF are you raging on about?



_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to Awareness)
Profile   Post #: 144
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 8:42:53 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: Awareness
ORIGINAL: thompsonx

There is no greater collectivist construction than the idea of the State as enforcer of equality.

That is pretty much the sum and substance of the declaration of independence and the constitution.
If you are not happy with that then stay out of amerika.




No, you fucking moron, that's the State as the guarantor of liberty.


This from the declaration of independence:



We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed,

In as much as you are a foriegner and are ignorant of our founding your foolishness would be understandable in a prepubescent whistle-punk.
Perhaps if you were to get a grown up to give you a hand with the big words it would be helpful.
Jesus you are phoquing stupid.



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

State as the enforcer of equality . . . . means equality under the Law; it means everyone is entitled to fairness, not only privileged white male property owners. A'ness pretends it means some other fuckall. One only need look at the wording of the Fourteenth Amendment to comprehend the true meaning of "equality."

Unalienable rights . . . what a joke. The state and the propertied elites have used inordinate brutality to exploit black chattel and wage slaves. A'ness will try to claim I am speaking the "party line" but only because he is ignorant of or has blinders against the history of labor in America. The Declaration was a joke, a lie when it was published and up until the passage of the 13th, 14th, and 15th Amendments. Even after their publication they were not enough to gain the promised benefits of liberty and legal equality. Men and women had to endure ridicule and physical persecution in the streets. People were bloodied in Birmingham and Selma. Three young men were murdered in Mississippi. And there were many other uncountable assaults. Today those rights are under assault as they have been since 1964/65 Civil Rights Law and Voter Rights Law. So, really, we do not need the lies that A'ness promotes about unalienable rights. They are historic bullshit.

< Message edited by vincentML -- 2/28/2017 9:30:33 AM >


_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 9:40:04 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: vincentML


I am not unaware, that the d.e. , the constitution and all the rest of the 'sacred" documents, that equality, liberty, and justice were restricted to white males. The founders could not (with a straight face) say that it was restricted. The documents would on their face have been dismissed out of hand if except for native amerikans, blacks, women , mexicans, catholics, baptist,jews, athiest etc. had been added.
The way it is written it all sounds so noble and honorable...the history of that time gives lie to the fancy words. The 'fancy words' have come back to bit them in the ass,
Too keweel.

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 146
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 2/28/2017 11:59:19 AM   
vincentML


Posts: 9980
Joined: 10/31/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx


ORIGINAL: vincentML


I am not unaware, that the d.e. , the constitution and all the rest of the 'sacred" documents, that equality, liberty, and justice were restricted to white males. The founders could not (with a straight face) say that it was restricted. The documents would on their face have been dismissed out of hand if except for native amerikans, blacks, women , mexicans, catholics, baptist,jews, athiest etc. had been added.
The way it is written it all sounds so noble and honorable...the history of that time gives lie to the fancy words. The 'fancy words' have come back to bit them in the ass,
Too keweel.


Agreed. Basically, only about 3% of the 1789 population were allowed to vote for the Congress and the Constitution.

_____________________________

vML

Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. ~ MLK Jr.

(in reply to thompsonx)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 3/5/2017 7:16:49 AM   
thompsonx


Posts: 23322
Joined: 10/1/2006
Status: offline

ORIGINAL: vincentML
ORIGINAL: thompsonx

I am not unaware, that the d.e. , the constitution and all the rest of the 'sacred" documents, that equality, liberty, and justice were restricted to white males. The founders could not (with a straight face) say that it was restricted. The documents would on their face have been dismissed out of hand if except for native amerikans, blacks, women , mexicans, catholics, baptist,jews, athiest etc. had been added.
The way it is written it all sounds so noble and honorable...the history of that time gives lie to the fancy words. The 'fancy words' have come back to bit them in the ass,
Too keweel.



Agreed. Basically, only about 3% of the 1789 population were allowed to vote for the Congress and the Constitution.


Yup

(in reply to vincentML)
Profile   Post #: 148
RE: The Lefties are Coming! The Lefties are Coming! Lef... - 3/6/2017 8:50:49 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: heavyblinker

quote:

ORIGINAL: tamaka
Thanks for such a thoughtful response. So what are people's primary motivations for such things as innovation in a socialist society?


They would do it because it's worth doing and because it means you're contributing to a community that you value because it values you in return. People will innovate and people will do the dirty jobs because you want your community and your society to look nice and be good because it belongs to you. A shorter work day would give everyone enough time to do their part to make their local community great, and ideally communities would compete with each other out of a strong sense of community pride. They wouldn't do it for money or any sort of reward other than the knowledge that they are the best and they are making the world a better place. I don't know how any amount of money could compete with that.

The problem is that in capitalist society we're constantly being conditioned to chase money, leisure, entertainment, recreational travel, status, casual sex, etc. We are taught to isolate ourselves in cocoons made of things, and we relate to each other through possessions, pop culture, and class as opposed to our values, ideas or human qualities. A lot of people don't see anything wrong with basing their entire identities on these things and it's not something that can be undone overnight... but the argument that undoing this would interfere with someone's 'freedom' is totally backwards-- it's not freedom, it's just a different kind of conditioning.

From a psychology perspective, Maslow places community in the center of the hierarchy of needs, following food and safety, and before self-esteem or actualization. We are a species that values belonging.

(in reply to heavyblinker)
Profile   Post #: 149
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