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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/17/2017 8:40:41 AM   
ResidentSadist


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And therein lies the answer to the question I asked. Does sexual preference (straight/gay/etc) apply before or after taking gender identity/transition into account... because it would mean something completely different otherwise. So a "straight trans" bio male that identifies as female likes men.

Thank you for your answer.
quote:

ORIGINAL: need2serve69

Wow, the world so desperately needs to be educated about transgender folks! I am a trans male. That means I was "assigned female at birth" and transitioned to live as the male I have always been in my mind. Trans female = assigned male at birth and transitioned to look like and live as female. (You can be trans and NOT transition as well.) So if a transmale is straight, he prefers females. He was born female but was always a male in his mind. Transgender is a catch-all term. It includes transsexuals, cross-dressers (transvestites) and anyone who identifies other than their birth gender. When searcing on dating sites they usually only include Male to female trans people. I guess people forget or don't know there are also trans men, female to male. People need to distinguish between the two and include both. Does this help??



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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/17/2017 1:26:25 PM   
NookieNotes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist

So a "straight trans" bio male that identifies as female likes men.



Yes. Best to forget what they "started" as, and just focus on how they identify.

Females who like men are straight. Females who like women are lesbians. Males who like men are gay. Men who like women are straight.

And so on... Identified gender IS their gender, regardless of genitalia.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 4:15:48 PM   
longwayhome


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I know it's a gross over-simplification of a complex thread but I tend to just ask people what they mean.

It's about respecting someone's own identity, experience and life views. I'd rather look ignorant or uncool and get it right than make an assumption and get it wrong.

Better to look gauche than risk unnecessary or unintended offence.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 4:23:22 PM   
ResidentSadist


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Profile listing "Orientation: Bisexual"
First two words in Profile Text, "Pansexual queer."

Okie dokie... when I grew up queer meant homosexual, not bisexual or pansexual.

I think people just don't understand the definitions of the words they use.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 5:05:30 PM   
longwayhome


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Not my profile of course RS!

I have to admit that keeping up with all the definitions people use at different times in different countries (or even towns) becomes a more difficult task you more you try to do it. That's even before you get to whether people know the definitions (or even normal English usage) and use them properly.

That's why I just ask. People are either sincere and talk about themselves (never really a problem for most) or they think less of you for not getting the label and everything they mean by it immediately.

If it's the second option, I never feel that I have lost anything.

(in reply to ResidentSadist)
Profile   Post #: 65
RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 7:03:32 PM   
ResidentSadist


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quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome

Not my profile of course RS!

I have to admit that keeping up with all the definitions people use at different times in different countries (or even towns) becomes a more difficult task you more you try to do it. That's even before you get to whether people know the definitions (or even normal English usage) and use them properly.

That's why I just ask. People are either sincere and talk about themselves (never really a problem for most) or they think less of you for not getting the label and everything they mean by it immediately.

If it's the second option, I never feel that I have lost anything.

No, not your profile. I was just making a fast reply, not actually directed at you.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 7:28:53 PM   
vincentML


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist

Profile listing "Orientation: Bisexual"
First two words in Profile Text, "Pansexual queer."

Okie dokie... when I grew up queer meant homosexual, not bisexual or pansexual.

I think people just don't understand the definitions of the words they use.

Definitions change with social changes, RS. A digital dictionary is far superior to one printed on paper and bound with cloth.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/18/2017 7:59:15 PM   
ReMakeYou


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Doubly so when subcultures will quickly appear and rapidly change, playing merry hell with vocabulary to find words that mean what they want them to mean.

In this particular case, though, I can't really fault the person behind the profile. Among the hip kids nowadays, "queer" basically means "indeterminate/none of the above". Since orientation on this site boils down to straight/gay/bi, and since it'd be a major hassle to change that without losing a lot of functionality, picking the closest item on the list and then clarifying in text is the best way to go about it.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/19/2017 6:06:29 AM   
NookieNotes


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist

Profile listing "Orientation: Bisexual"
First two words in Profile Text, "Pansexual queer."

Okie dokie... when I grew up queer meant homosexual, not bisexual or pansexual.

I think people just don't understand the definitions of the words they use.


The meaning has changed to mean "other than usual."

http://www.hrc.org/blog/hrc-officially-adopts-use-of-lgbtq-to-reflect-diversity-of-own-community

quote:

ORIGINAL: ReMakeYou

Doubly so when subcultures will quickly appear and rapidly change, playing merry hell with vocabulary to find words that mean what they want them to mean.


Like we do in BDSM? *grins* Poking fun. Figure you mean that, too.

quote:

In this particular case, though, I can't really fault the person behind the profile. Among the hip kids nowadays, "queer" basically means "indeterminate/none of the above". Since orientation on this site boils down to straight/gay/bi, and since it'd be a major hassle to change that without losing a lot of functionality, picking the closest item on the list and then clarifying in text is the best way to go about it.


Agreed.

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Profile   Post #: 69
RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 4/20/2017 1:59:41 PM   
longwayhome


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist


quote:

ORIGINAL: longwayhome

Not my profile of course RS!

I have to admit that keeping up with all the definitions people use at different times in different countries (or even towns) becomes a more difficult task you more you try to do it. That's even before you get to whether people know the definitions (or even normal English usage) and use them properly.

That's why I just ask. People are either sincere and talk about themselves (never really a problem for most) or they think less of you for not getting the label and everything they mean by it immediately.

If it's the second option, I never feel that I have lost anything.

No, not your profile. I was just making a fast reply, not actually directed at you.


I know.

(in reply to ResidentSadist)
Profile   Post #: 70
RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 5/30/2017 10:24:25 PM   
ResidentSadist


Posts: 12580
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From: a mean old Daddy, but I like you - Joni Mitchell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NookieNotes
quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist

So a "straight trans" bio male that identifies as female likes men.



Yes. Best to forget what they "started" as, and just focus on how they identify.

Females who like men are straight. Females who like women are lesbians. Males who like men are gay. Men who like women are straight.

And so on... Identified gender IS their gender, regardless of genitalia.

"just focus on how they identify"... That was how I thought it was too. But that didn't seem to work because a trans woman that lists as "gay" likes men, not women. So they don't identify as a gay woman. Very confusing, which is why I started the thread.

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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 5/30/2017 11:21:56 PM   
Greta75


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Okay class, here is how ridiculous it is now, happy studying:


Agender -
Someone who does not identify with any sort of gender identity. This term may also be used by someone who intentionally has no recognizable gender presentation. Some people use similar terms such as “genderless” and “gender neutral”.

Androgyne/Androgynous - someone who neither identifies with, nor presents as, a man or woman. Being “androgynous” can refer to having both masculine and feminine qualities. This term has Latin roots: Andro- meaning “man” and -gyne, meaning “woman.” Some androgynes may identity as “gender benders”, meaning that they are intentionally “bending” (or challenging/transgressing) societal gender roles.

Bigender- someone who identifies as both a man and a woman. A Bigender identity is a combination of these two genders, but not necessarily a 50/50 combination, as these genders are often felt – and expressed - fully. Similar to individuals who identify as gender fluid, bigender people may present as men, as women, or as gender-neutral ways on different days.

Cis- all of these terms capture that a person is not trans or does not have a gender diverse identity or presentation.

Cis Female- a female who identifies as a woman/has a feminine gender identity.

Cis Male - a male who identifies as a man/has a masculine gender identity.

Cisgender- A person who has the gender identity commonly associated with their biological sex (e.g., someone who is assigned as a female at birth and who lives as a woman).

Female to Male/ FTM- a trans person who was assigned female sex, and now lives as a man and has a masculine gender identity. This person may or may not have altered his physical body with surgery, hormones, or other modifications (e.g., voice training to develop a deeper spoken voice). FTM is an abbreviation of female to male. Generally uses masculine pronouns (e.g., “he” or “his”) or gender neutral pronouns.

Gender Fluid- someone whose gender identity and presentation are not confined to only one gender category. Gender fluid people may have dynamic or fluctuating understandings of their gender, moving between categories as feels right. For example, a gender fluid person might feel more like a man one day and more like a woman on another day, or that neither term is a good fit.

Gender Nonconforming- Someone who looks and/or behaves in ways that don’t conform to, or are atypical of, society’s expectations of how a person of that gender should look or behave. (See also this excellent article by Dr. Eric Grollman about gender conformity & gender non-conformity).

Gender Questioning- Someone who may be questioning their gender or gender identity, and/or considering other ways of experiencing or expressing their gender or gender presentation.

Gender Variant- an umbrella term that refers to anyone who, for any reason, does not have a cisgender identity (which includes the trans* umbrella). Others acknowledge issues with this term as it implies that such genders are “deviations” from a standard gender, and reinforces the “naturalness” of the two-gender system. Some prefer the terms “gender diverse” or “gender-nonconforming.”

Genderqueer- Someone who identifies outside of, or wishes to challenge, the two-gender (i.e., man/woman) system; may identify as multiple genders, a combination of genders, or “between” genders. People who use this term may feel that they are reclaiming the word “queer”, which has historically been used as a slur against gay men and women. This term is used more often by younger generations doing the “reclaiming” and less often by slightly older generations who may have personally experienced the term “queer” as a slur.

Intersex- Generally refers to someone whose chromosomes, gonads (i.e., ovaries or testes), hormonal profiles, and anatomy do not conform to the expected configurations of either male typical or female typical bodies. Some intersex conditions are apparent at birth, while others are noticed around puberty or later (if ever). Some individuals no longer use the term “intersex conditions” and instead prefer “disorders of sex development.” (See ISNA.org.)

Male to Female/MTF- a trans person who was assigned male sex (likely at birth), and now lives as a woman and has a feminine gender identity. This person may or may not have altered her physical body with surgery, hormones, or other modification (e.g., voice training, electrolysis, etc). MTF is an abbreviation of “Male To Female”. Generally uses female pronouns (e.g., “she” or “her”) or gender neutral pronouns.

Neither- Not putting a label on one’s gender.

Neutrois- An umbrella term within the bigger umbrella terms of transgender or genderqueer. Includes people who do not identify within the binary gender system (i.e., man/woman). According to Neutrois.com, some common Neutrois identities include agender neither-gender, and gender-less.

Non-binary- Similar to genderqueer, this is a way of describing one’s gender as outside the two-gender (i.e., man/woman) system and/or challenging that system.

Other- Choosing to not provide a commonly recognized label to one’s gender. When used by someone to describe themselves, this may feel like a freeing way of describing (or not specifically describing) their gender. The term “other” should not be used to refer to people whose gender you can’t quite understand or place.

Pangender- “Pan” means every, or all, and this is another identity label such like genderqueer or neutrois that challenges binary gender and is inclusive of gender diverse people.

Transgender- an umbrella term that includes all people who have genders not traditionally associated with their assigned sex. People who identify as transgender may or may not have altered their bodies through surgery and/or hormones. Some examples:

Trans Man - (see FTM above); Although some people write the term as “transman” (no space between trans and man) or trans-man (note the hyphen), some advocate for a space to be included between “trans” and “man” in order to indicate that the person is a man and that the “trans” part may not be a defining characteristic or central to his identity.

Trans Woman - (see MTF above) Although some people write the term as “transwoman” (no space between trans and woman) or trans-woman (note the hyphen), some advocate for a space to be included between “trans” and “woman” in order to indicate that the person is a woman and that the “trans” part may not be a defining characteristic or central to her identity.

Trans Person - another way of saying someone is a transgender person. (Note that “transgender” tends to be preferred over “transgendered”).

Trans - is an inclusive term, referring to the many ways one can transcend or even transgress gender or gender norms (e.g., it includes individuals who may identify as transgender, transsexual, gender diverse, etc). In many cases the asterisk (*) is not followed by a sex or gender term – it’s just written as Trans* - to indicate that not all trans people identify with an established sex or gender label.

Transsexual person - For many people this term indicates that a person has made lasting changes to their physical body, specifically their sexual anatomy (e.g., genitals and/or breasts or chest), through surgery. For some, the term “transsexual” is a problematic term because of its history of pathology or association with a psychological disorder. In order to get the operations necessary for sexual reassignment surgeries or gender confirming surgeries, people long needed a psychiatric diagnosis (historically, that diagnosis was “transsexualism”) and recommendations from mental health professionals. The term “transsexual” tends to be used less often by younger generations of trans persons.

Transsexual Woman – Someone who was assigned male sex at birth who has most likely transitioned (such as through surgery and/or hormones) to living as a woman.

Transsexual Man- Someone who was assigned female at birth who has most likely transitioned (such as through surgery and/or hormones) to living as a man.

Transgender- is an umbrella term which includes all people who have genders not traditionally associated with their sex at birth. Transgender person can also be used.

Transmasculine- Someone assigned a female sex at birth and who identifies as masculine, but may not identify wholly as a man. Often, you’ll encounter the phrase “masculine of center” to indicate where people who identify as transmasculine see themselves in relation to other genders.

Transfeminine- Someone assigned a male sex at birth who identifies as feminine, but may not identify wholly as a woman. Often, you’ll encounter the phrase “feminine of center” to indicate where people who identify as transfeminine see themselves in relation to other genders.

Two-spirit- This term likely originated with the Zuni tribe of North America, though two-spirit persons have been documented in numerous tribes. Native Americans, who have both masculine and feminine characteristics and presentations, have distinct roles in their tribes, and they are seen as a third gender.


Okay, I am having a headache now! But this is what the Modern world of humans have become! Gender has became sooooo damn complicated!

(in reply to ResidentSadist)
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RE: -= What in the world is a straight trans? =- - 5/30/2017 11:43:54 PM   
ResidentSadist


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^ Holy jebus, so complicated. I remember when there was straight, gay, lesbians and bi. They were either butch, fem, top, bottom or trans.

Thanks for posting that. Wow... just wow.

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-=BDSM Book List=- Reading is Fundamental !!!
I give good thread.


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Profile   Post #: 73
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