quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji
Yep, pointing out the grand plan is technically impossible is nit picking because

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

It doesn't. All the energy goes to the grid, and the homeowner is given credit for that energy, and can draw up to it for free.

And if non-solar energy picks up some slack, it's still cleaner energy (less non-clean energy produced).

I mean, obviously. But by all means, nit-pick away. Meanwhile, we'll enjoy our missing electric bill.

Yep, pointing out the grand plan is technically impossible is nit picking

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

The market-driven switch to renewables is happening here in Australia too. This is especially significant as Australa's export economy is heavily reliant on mining. Now major banks are refusing to finance new coal projects unless they meet stringent, often impossibly tight requirements.

The Indian conglomerate Adani is seeking to develop a huge new coal mine at the Galilee Basin in Northern Queensland. Despite support from both the Federal and State Govts, and Queensland's long history of being a Big Mining friendly State, all of Australians 'Big 4" banks have declined to advance finance for the project, citing economic and environmental reservations. The project has met fierce opposition from the environmental lobbies - with some groups opposing any new coal mines and others concerned about possible damage to the world famous Great Barrier Reef, through which any exports from the Adani project must travel.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2017/04/28/political-fury-as-australias-second-largest-bank-refuses-to-fun_a_22059145/

These developments suggest that any future financing of new coal mining projects in Australia will be difficult to secure, and of course without finance the projects cannot go ahead. The reluctance of financial institutions to finance energy projects doesn't extend to renewable projects, which are enjoying the kind of financial support coal miners can now only dream of after enjoying it for decades.

It seems that even in Australia's resource dependent economy, the market has decided that coal is finished and renewables are the way forward ... much to chagrin of our right- and looney-right wingers who are still insisting that coal is the future, further consolidating their reputation as political Neanderthals

quote:

ORIGINAL: WhoreMods

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji
Yep, pointing out the grand plan is technically impossible is nit picking because

Do you have any idea how utterly pathetic that sounds coming from somebody who's still making excuses for failed republican grand plans like trickle down economics and unregulated banking being good for the business economy, in 2017?

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nnanji

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

It doesn't. All the energy goes to the grid, and the homeowner is given credit for that energy, and can draw up to it for free.

And if non-solar energy picks up some slack, it's still cleaner energy (less non-clean energy produced).

I mean, obviously. But by all means, nit-pick away. Meanwhile, we'll enjoy our missing electric bill.

Yep, pointing out the grand plan is technically impossible is nit picking

What is "technically impossible" about the scheme that MM has outlined? The technology to convert solar energy into electricity has been around for decades, and is both improving and becoming cheaper with each passing year. There is no problem about individual householders converting to solar and selling their surplus to the grid. This already happens on a large scale across the West.

The big drawback with solar has always been storing surplus energy generated during the day for use during the night. Recent innovations in battery storage are widely seen as game changers giving individual householders the ability to story any surplus energy for drawing down when needed during non-solar periods. Individual houses may thus become totally independent of the grid or become net sellers of power to the grid.

There are no "technical difficulties" in any of the above. All the technology is freely available, cheap to install and safe to use. The issue of scale doesn't affect this in the least. Nor does any of this involve any state secrets.

It is individual householders acting in "enlightened self interest", which I was under the impression was something that you approved of strongly. It seems my impression was incorrect and you aren't in favour of individuals acting in their own enlightened self interest in this matter at all.

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Quite a few people don't seem to get that it's impossible, apparently:


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_power_by_country

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ORIGINAL: PonyGroom

China Is About to Bury Elon Musk in Batteries
Factories are adding enough capacity to power the equivalent of nearly 1.5 million Model S vehicles
By Joe Ryan
June 28, 2017,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china-is-about-to-bury-elon-musk-in-batteries

As Elon Musk races to finish building the world’s biggest battery factory in the Nevada desert, China is poised to leave him in the dust.

Chinese companies have plans for additional factories with the capacity to pump out more than 120 gigawatt-hours a year by 2021, according to a report published this week by Bloomberg Intelligence. That’s enough to supply batteries for around 1.5 million Tesla Model S vehicles or 13.7 million Toyota Prius Plug-in Hybrids per year, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

By comparison, when completed in 2018, Tesla Inc.’s Gigafactory will crank out up to 35 gigawatt-hours of battery cells annually.

====
But Bloomberg is fake news, right? Damned commie bastards.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: PonyGroom

China Is About to Bury Elon Musk in Batteries
Factories are adding enough capacity to power the equivalent of nearly 1.5 million Model S vehicles
By Joe Ryan
June 28, 2017,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china-is-about-to-bury-elon-musk-in-batteries

As Elon Musk races to finish building the world’s biggest battery factory in the Nevada desert, China is poised to leave him in the dust.

Chinese companies have plans for additional factories with the capacity to pump out more than 120 gigawatt-hours a year by 2021, according to a report published this week by Bloomberg Intelligence. That’s enough to supply batteries for around 1.5 million Tesla Model S vehicles or 13.7 million Toyota Prius Plug-in Hybrids per year, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

By comparison, when completed in 2018, Tesla Inc.’s Gigafactory will crank out up to 35 gigawatt-hours of battery cells annually.

====
But Bloomberg is fake news, right? Damned commie bastards.

Nnanji, the poor thingy, just doesn't realise how much of a game changer the new battery storage technology is. For some reason, it doesn't seem to mesh with his looney Right ideological take on the world. It might be he is just blinded by hate for greenies or anyone/anything he perceives as green ...

Perhaps someone ought to explain it to him using very small words and simple steps. Anything complex seems to confound the poor soul utterly.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PonyGroom

China Is About to Bury Elon Musk in Batteries
Factories are adding enough capacity to power the equivalent of nearly 1.5 million Model S vehicles
By Joe Ryan
June 28, 2017,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china-is-about-to-bury-elon-musk-in-batteries

As Elon Musk races to finish building the world’s biggest battery factory in the Nevada desert, China is poised to leave him in the dust.

Chinese companies have plans for additional factories with the capacity to pump out more than 120 gigawatt-hours a year by 2021, according to a report published this week by Bloomberg Intelligence. That’s enough to supply batteries for around 1.5 million Tesla Model S vehicles or 13.7 million Toyota Prius Plug-in Hybrids per year, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

By comparison, when completed in 2018, Tesla Inc.’s Gigafactory will crank out up to 35 gigawatt-hours of battery cells annually.

====
But Bloomberg is fake news, right? Damned commie bastards.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

quote:

ORIGINAL: PonyGroom

China Is About to Bury Elon Musk in Batteries
Factories are adding enough capacity to power the equivalent of nearly 1.5 million Model S vehicles
By Joe Ryan
June 28, 2017,
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-28/china-is-about-to-bury-elon-musk-in-batteries

As Elon Musk races to finish building the world’s biggest battery factory in the Nevada desert, China is poised to leave him in the dust.

Chinese companies have plans for additional factories with the capacity to pump out more than 120 gigawatt-hours a year by 2021, according to a report published this week by Bloomberg Intelligence. That’s enough to supply batteries for around 1.5 million Tesla Model S vehicles or 13.7 million Toyota Prius Plug-in Hybrids per year, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance.

By comparison, when completed in 2018, Tesla Inc.’s Gigafactory will crank out up to 35 gigawatt-hours of battery cells annually.

====
But Bloomberg is fake news, right? Damned commie bastards.

Nnanji, the poor thingy, just doesn't realise how much of a game changer the new battery storage technology is. For some reason, it doesn't seem to mesh with his looney Right ideological take on the world. It might be he is just blinded by hate for greenies or anyone/anything he perceives as green ...

Perhaps someone ought to explain it to him using very small words and simple steps. Anything complex seems to confound the poor soul utterly.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

You keep muttering as if obstacles always remain forever, as if no one ever discovers new ways around them. Yet they do.

To you, the entire idea of horseless carriages would be ridiculous. For starters, no one will ever build a successful single piece cast iron engine. Until, following Ford's insistence (and he wasn't even a leftie), his engineers did it.

Things change. People experiment. New ways of doing things emerge.

Time was when an electric car as cheap as $68 grand was a fantasy--and wasn't as good.

Things will continue to change. The tech will get better, new ways will be discovered, the cost will keep dropping.

As it is, Tesla is pre-sold for quite a while. Not a bad position for a company to be in.

Apple, for instance (yes, they are working on a car too), has (usually) worked continually to make its own products obsolete. Why? "What do you think our competitors are doing? We have to get there first."

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

And speaking of reading comprehension, I've said more than once that if you want to eliminate all the subsidies, I'm cool with that, starting with all the subsidies we send to petroleum companies.

If you want a free market, you can't be selective about which parts are free.

Infrastructure maintenance is overdue. But Congress keeps blocking it. We're going to pay dearly.

I'm also in favor of high-speed electric trains, but i don't think that's ever going to happen in the US with our political climate.

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

I acknowledge their cost is a valid point of contention.

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ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

AND we're right back to the today's challenges will never be solved with new approaches horseless carriage argument.