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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 7:59:57 PM

Smythe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

This poster can't resist pointing out that dear Queen Victoria (who was definitely not a sub) referred to herself in the third person in all her official correspondence. She would say "The Queen thinks . . ." or what have you. Miss Manners always uses the third person too; this poster is not sure why.

This poster recognizes that both these examples are irrelevant to the thread, but he couldn't resist sharing them.

We are not amused.
Smythe

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Post #: 21

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:02:37 PM

dcnovice

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it's never enough to keep up.

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Post #: 22

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:05:36 PM

junecleaver

Posts: 1145
Joined: 4/6/2005
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I've always guessed it had to do with giving up possession of self.

I think it would be fun and really humiliating for a weekend type of thing, but wouldn't want to try it outside of that.

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Post #: 23

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:06:22 PM

LuckyAlbatross

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http://www.collarchat.com/m_828455/mpage_1/key_third/tm.htm#828601
slaves referring to themselves as "this one"

http://www.collarchat.com/m_178943/mpage_4/key_third/tm.htm#181442
Y/you, A/all, U/us

A dom's got a penchant for it? That I get. He wants you to think before you speak? That I get. He wants you to view yourself as an object? That I get.

But speaking in third person doesn't take away a sense of self, it just redefines "self." Speaking in third person doesn't take away ego, it just restructures it.

You're still being possessive by saying "She" and "her." Those are still possessive words. SOMEONE is still doing those things, and that SOMEONE is you.

Oddly enough I have randomly spoken in third person for as long as I can remember. Usually it's in a humorous way, or an arrogant way (again, all third person does is REDEFINE possession, it can be used to ENHANCE one's position), and as I got older, people around me thought it was weird when I suddenly burst into a sentence that used third person.

Imagine my surprise when I discovered the "scene" and found out that talking in third person was a big deal and some symbol of ego or lack thereof.

I know SOME people who can speak in third person and do it gracefully and communicate in a very fluid way and you don't even notice. I also see some people who speak in third person and they might as well be a blinking neon sign saying "LOOK HOW AWESOMELY SUBMISSIVE I AM TALKING LIKE THIS, ISN'T THIS COOL?"
For whatever reason you use it for, talking in third person can accomplish a lot of things, but the idea that you're losing ego or losing self or not being possessive anymore, just doesn't hold water IMO.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:13:54 PM

zindyslave

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Thank you all for the replies, I just started thinking about it and was wondering why some used it. Very informative. Thank you LA for the links.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:16:56 PM

gabrielarya

Posts: 16
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i have used third person speech for so long that is comes natural to her to do this, to her it is a form of respect and it helps keep her mind in check knowing her place, for she is just an possession, does that mean she does not have a mind NO does it mean she does not speak her mind in a respectful way no, it just helps her to remember she is just an object to be owned and to obey at all times, yes many of you will get mad at this post and that is ok, for she does not expect people to understand the way her mind works, *smiles* this is just her way of thinking

she wishes everyone a wonderful time and play safe

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:28:30 PM

TopDragoninUT

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Joined: 3/28/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: junecleaver
"No one will ever win the battle of the sexes; there's too much fraternizing with the enemy. "
--Henry A. Kissinger

Thank you junecleaver. That was the belly laugh I needed to start my day off. You have a good eye.

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Post #: 27

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:29:07 PM

slavegirljoy

Posts: 1207
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From: North Carolina, USA
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i can only speak for this slave but, for me, i simply write how i feel. i tend to go back and forth between speaking in the 1st person & in the 3rd person, depending on how i'm feeling. Sometimes, i just feel more like a piece of my Master's property rather than an autonomous individual. That's a good feeling for me, which i truly love and would like to have more often. At those times, i often write in the 3rd person, because that's just how i'm feeling. When i am in "subspace" i tend to have a feeling that i am not in my own skin, something like a "near out-of-body" experience, and i tend to write in the 3rd person and i will speak about what this slave is feeling, experiencing, etc., not what "i" am feeling, etc.

It's not anything that my Master requires of me, but He recognizes why i do it. It's just something that happens and, since i am writing in an expressive style, when i write in my journal or in these forums, i just let whatever i'm feeling express itself as it will. That's all.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: zindyslave

Why do submissives speak in the third person? Is it something their Master/Mistresses want? If so then why? If not for their Dom/Domme, why do it?

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Post #: 28

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:32:26 PM

velvetears

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Why would a person using third speech use "her" to refer to themselves? Her would mean someone else, not oneself. i have heard them say "this one" "this girl" "this slave" or just their own name.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:45:14 PM

adoracat

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i have irregular capitolization because of nerve damage, i simply cannot tell if i am hitting the shift key or not. so i gave it up for lent sometime back, and never picked it up again. i try to remember Sir and Daddy, but i have to look at the keyboard for that.

i think Sir would probably laugh his arse off should i begin speaking in third person....but then again he expects me to be a person of intelligence, and to act accordingly. and unless one is using the Royal We, its simply not done in casual circles.

kitten, who quite rightly assumes that naked in the bedroom is plenty casual enough......

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 8:48:04 PM

slavegirljoy

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From: North Carolina, USA
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my basic training course didn't include any instruction in speaking in the third person to my superiors. i went through the Women's Army Corps (WAC) basic training, so maybe it was different for the males, but we never used "this recruit" or anything like that, other than when reporting, then it was always "Private ______ reporting for duty" or "Sergeant _______ reporting for duty" and that was throughout my army career, not just in basic. There was nothing "dehuminzing" about my military training.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinergy

I imagine the reasoning behind doing it is similar to what recruits experience in boot camp, when they are taught to speak entirely in third person to their superiors. There is a demeaning quality and a dehumanization associated with the loss of the "I" experience, as well as an elevation of their superior officer. To whit, the officer is a person, the recruit is simply "the recruit."

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Post #: 31

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 9:08:51 PM

Teachme59

Posts: 47
Joined: 5/10/2006
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Hi slavegirljoy

Many years ago in Marine Corps boot camp... the only way we addressed the Drill Instructor was…”Sir private Butch service number ******* requests permission to speak to the drill instructor Sir!” in which case if he liked he would say” Speak whale puke.
Or some other endearment…lol

Oh I remember it well…I’ll bet today they still use the same protocol or something like it… tradition is everything in the Corps…Semper Fidelis!!!

Butch

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Post #: 32

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 9:35:47 PM

slavegirljoy

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From: North Carolina, USA
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Well, like i said, i went through WAC basic training. i have no doubt that things were different, in many ways, in the men's basic training. Also, i joined when it was the "new" All Volunteer Force, no more draftees, so there was a change in the general attitude in the Army and DIs had to adjust to a "kinder and gentler" way of doing things. After all, we weren't draftees and during basic and even AIT, we could decide to quit, without any penalty, if we didn't like it. They really didn't want anyone to quit. The only thing hard about basic, for me, was having to wake up before the sun. The rest was fun, just like being at an all-girls summer camp.

slave joy
Owned property of Master David

quote:

ORIGINAL: Teachme59

Hi slavegirljoy

Many years ago in Marine Corps boot camp... the only way we addressed the Drill Instructor was…”Sir private Butch service number ******* requests permission to speak to the drill instructor Sir!” in which case if he liked he would say” Speak whale puke.
Or some other endearment…lol

Oh I remember it well…I’ll bet today they still use the same protocol or something like it… tradition is everything in the Corps…Semper Fidelis!!!

Butch

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Post #: 33

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 9:49:18 PM

CitizenCane

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Joined: 3/11/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: livenlearn

quote:

ORIGINAL: zindyslave

Why do submissives speak in the third person? Is it something their Master/Mistresses want? If so then why? If not for their Dom/Domme, why do it?

Speaking in third person is a way of making sure that a submissive/slave remembers their place. It's a way of forcing them to acknowledge that they are 'subservient'.

quote:

It's usually a Gor thing. I personally can't stand it when anyone does it. It serves to show me a lack of intelligence and too much bravado.

Actually, it really has nothing at all to do with being Gorean; it started in chat rooms as a way of identifying who was slave and who was not.

To be more specific regarding the first point, it has to do with objectification, whether the speaker is a submissive or the Queen of England. In both cases, the speaker is calling attention to their status as opposed to their individuality.

As for the second point, this pattern goes back far beyond chatrooms. Since at least the mid 19th century referring to oneself in the third person has been used as a representation of the 'courtly' humility of other cultures, especially Chinese. Charlie Chan movies and Judge Dee books offer prime examples of this.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 10:13:39 PM

sweetnurseBBW

Posts: 2464
Joined: 1/26/2006
From: North Carolina
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I know ones that are Gor that do it and ones that are not that do it. Whatever floats your boat I say. Master does not require me to speak that way. It is a way to make them remember their place. It is a control thing. Works for some and not for others. I don't care one way or the other. It isn't for me to judge what works for others.

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Post #: 35

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 11:12:47 PM

aldompdx

Posts: 538
Joined: 10/24/2004
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Fortunately in an alternative lifestyle, partners can establish whatever communication protocol suits them. I prefer the protocol of proper English, rather than any BDSM jargon.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 11:30:47 PM

LadyPaige

Posts: 187
Joined: 5/7/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: CitizenCane

quote:

ORIGINAL: livenlearn

quote:

ORIGINAL: zindyslave

Why do submissives speak in the third person? Is it something their Master/Mistresses want? If so then why? If not for their Dom/Domme, why do it?

Speaking in third person is a way of making sure that a submissive/slave remembers their place. It's a way of forcing them to acknowledge that they are 'subservient'.

quote:

It's usually a Gor thing. I personally can't stand it when anyone does it. It serves to show me a lack of intelligence and too much bravado.

Actually, it really has nothing at all to do with being Gorean; it started in chat rooms as a way of identifying who was slave and who was not.

To be more specific regarding the first point, it has to do with objectification, whether the speaker is a submissive or the Queen of England. In both cases, the speaker is calling attention to their status as opposed to their individuality.

As for the second point, this pattern goes back far beyond chatrooms. Since at least the mid 19th century referring to oneself in the third person has been used as a representation of the 'courtly' humility of other cultures, especially Chinese. Charlie Chan movies and Judge Dee books offer prime examples of this.

Well said

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Post #: 37

RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 11:35:12 PM

Lordandmaster

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Some slaves need it, but it's certainly not appropriate for all slaves. Everyone is different. If you own a slave who needs to refer to himself or herself in the third person, and you DON'T enforce it because you think it's silly, you're not being the best owner you can be.

Oh, and it is by no means exclusive to Gor.

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 11:37:39 PM

ennaozzie

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I can not stand it when someone refers to themselves as the third person, it may not be their view, but to me it’s like they are feeling like they are not worthy of saying I or me because they are nothing or think they are nothing.

Now many probably don’t think that, but that is how I see it, mind you the only ones I have heard talk like that are on line, and on line is not a good place to make a judgment when you have only seen that sort of thing in one area and not as a general thing.

But I don’t care what anyone says to me it’s horrible to talk like that and it really gets up my nose when a Dom types a message to me saying how is this girl today or words to that affect I always type back what girl? Who are you talking about?

Anyway my two cents worth

beanie

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RE: Third speak... - 5/28/2007 11:49:01 PM

WhiplashSmile

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When I first encountered slaves speaking in the third person, it made me dizzy. However, It has grown on me after chatting with a few really wonderful slaves. I do not demand this, however I do not discourage it and encourage it for those that speak in this manner. Psssstt.. Don't tell anybody, but there have been times when I found myself enjoying it.

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Post #: 40