quote:

ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

Oh damn...I killed my own thread!  Don't you hate it when that happens........?

quote:

Bitch Goddesses are very erotic to many people.
Many vanilla men are enchanted by Bitch Goddesses.
Look at the most popular women in the media at this time:
Paris Hilton, Angelina Jolie, Brittney Spears , Lindsay Lohen, Nicole Richie, etc.
THESE are the young women that many like and admire.
I don't see any goody 2 shoes in the bunch!
Evidently, someone enjoys Bitch Goddesses and you know why?
Because they are exciting, daring, bad, fun and sexy.
They are the female version of James Dean, dangerous and bad.

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ORIGINAL: MistressDoMe

Bitch Goddesses are very erotic to many people.
Many vanilla men are enchanted by Bitch Goddesses.
Look at the most popular women in the media at this time:
Paris Hilton, Angelina Jolie, Brittney Spears , Lindsay Lohen, Nicole Richie, etc.
THESE are the young women that many like and admire.
I don't see any goody 2 shoes in the bunch!
Evidently, someone enjoys Bitch Goddesses and you know why?
Because they are exciting, daring, bad, fun and sexy.
They are the female version of James Dean, dangerous and bad.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

quote:

ORIGINAL: foolishguy

Here is one idea:

  Many men are afraid of female sexuality. I know when I am near a really sexy woman, I feel overwhelmed, almost overpowered, by the feelings she generates within me… despite myself. I may not want to have those feelings, or even like the person who inspires them, but I do anyway. The power of these feelings creates a sense of the unknown, of not being in control of myself, or at least my own feelings. This leads to an attempt to inhibit my own responses to gain control over myself. I won’t let myself fully feel the sexual and sensual stimulation that is building inside of me.  

Enter BDSM and the bitch goddess. Everything she is doing and wearing is screaming sexuality. Her fearlessness is letting me know that inhibition is futile. There is no retreat from her sexuality. Her control let’s me know it’s safe for me to have these feelings. So, I can max out on all the wild stimulation and sensations she is sending me, and explore them with her, at her direction, without worry about what it all might mean. Although physically I am bound, emotionally I am more freer (liberated?)
FoolishGuy

foolishguy, that is a beautiful and incredibly clever insight in the psycho-sexuality of Femdom.  I love it when people post from their own emotional experience, not theory .  Thank you

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ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

What great replies.  They have thrown up so many issues.  My own opinions:


I asked why do some people find "nasty" behaviour by women sexy?  The real question I am asking is "why are you a sado masochist"?

Now of course, not everyone is a sado-masochist.  Plenty of people said they don't like "nasty" or cruel behaviour (even consensual) and it has no sex appeal for them.  Good for you: you are either "normal" or your kink does not encompass sado-masochism. 

I am however a sexual sado-masochist

IMO there's 2 kinds of "nastiness" (or sadism): (1) inflicting physical pain and (2) inflicting psychological/emotional  pain. 

Girls are especially good at the latter.  For example, look at research on female bullying in highschools compared to male.  This is not a gender stereotype, it is a fact.  Girls and women are far better at psychological torment.

But why do some men find it so sexy?  Mainstream society teaches us that inflicting pain of any kind on others is morally wrong (and in some instances a crime).  It is perceived as particularly wrong by women who are stereotyped as nurturers

Some masochists want one or the other kind of pain; others want both.  Some sadists do one or the other; some do both.,

As a sado-masochistic dominant, I inflict incredible physical pain on men, but I do so with a sweet smile and a soft voice.  Am I a sadist?  Yes.  Am I a bitch?  That's a matter of personal opinion.   

My own opinion is that:
1    any pain inflicted without consent makes the woman a "bitch" and not in a good way
2    psychological pain inflicted with consent (eg verbal abuse) makes the woman a "bitch" but in a  good way
3    physical pain inflicted with consent (eg good hard spanking) is probably not being a "bitch", although it might look so to others
4   pain of either kind inflicted by a woman who has lost emotional control of herself makes her a "bitch" and in a bad way, even if the male consents (even enjoys) the pain.

IMO, a "Bitch Goddess" is being a bitch in a good way

I play with subs who want physical pain.  I am intrigued by subs that want humilation, verbal abuse and other psychological pain, but I am not good at inflicting that sort of pain on them.  At the end of the day, I am inherently too "nice". 

I really admire women who can be that kind of Bitch because I believe it is exhausting.  As many have pointed out in this thread, it is impossible to be a Bitch Goddess all the time.  Absolutely impossible.  The emotional energy pro-dommes put into Bitch Goddess scenes in their dungeons is immense and hence IMO a good pro-domme earns every penny She charges the masochist for the experience.

Which brings me to the heart of the question: why do submales find it erotic?

There are as many different answers as there are sub males.

Interesting perspectives were provided.

Now ask yourself: if a woman said she was really turned on by men who sexually abused her, snarled, swore, and spat at her and beat her up, what would we ask?  We would ask why had she sexualised such horrible mistreatment.  Self loathing? Previous abuse? Fear of real intimacy/sexual love? Confusing cruelty with strength or confidence? 

If the woman had no apparent emotional problems stemming from prior abuse, then what would we ask?

Does she actually hate men and therefore avoids any sexual or emtional bond with "Nice Guys".  Is she trying to change a man (a goal always doomed to fail, ladies).  Does she want all responsibility taken away from her ("that evil man made me do it" mental pretence). Is giving up control a way of giving away responsibility?

Is she projecting all her negative traits onto the male in order to own the role of being "the good one" and make him the baddie" in the relationship? Look hard at how she describes her parter.  Is she enjoying or staunchly enduring his control?

Are Nice Guys boring because there's no constant fear (of abandonment and worse)?  Not everyone likes a predictable, stable life and serenity.  Constant drama thankfully leaves no time for self-reflection.

I suggest we think about female masochism because it is much, much more common than male and the various reasons are a useful tool to understand possible causes of male masochism.

There's many reasons why some of us enjoy emotional and/or physical sado-masochism.  And most of us do not want to open the Pandora's Box and ask why.  We just know it makes us feel good.  Alive.  Sexy.  We would like to think we were just born this way.

The truth is, most of our underlying psychological reasons are not "good" and "healthy".  When I see people trying to defend their sado-masochism and convince others their way is perfectly fine, I feel sorry for them.  We need to admit that we are not "normal" and our reasons are not "nice" (otherwise we would be just like everyone else - YUCK NO WAY!!!!)

My sadism is not cruelty-free and frankly, I dont WANT it to be.  Lots of normal (non-sado masochistic) people are drawn to BDSM, buy some nice fetsishwear, go to a  few munches then presume to lecture the rest of us how to be "Loving" and "Responsible" (ie nice, kind, gentle, considerate). 

Look, I agree all those qualities are important in relationships but they miss the point: we are sado-masochists.  We cannot thrive in relationships that do not inflict pain.  We do not claim to be "right" or "healthy" and we realise most people do not approve of us, but we know what we need and what we fnd erotic.

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ORIGINAL: MistressDoMe

Paris Hilton, Angelina Jolie, Brittney Spears , Lindsay Lohen, Nicole Richie, etc.
THESE are the young women that many like and admire.

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ORIGINAL: jimbo747

Not all bitch goddesses are the same. Some are simple flakes who make it their mission to convince themselves they are a dom for the simple reason they have an attitude and a dollar store whip.

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ORIGINAL: jimbo747

A BG within our lifestyle in my opinion holds true the fundamental attributes which make up every slave's ultimate wishlist.

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ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne
I hope I dont sound bitter but there's a lot of reasons men imagine Dominant Women are sexy but could and should never partner with one.  I strongly suggest that you don't even try.  Just leave the fantasy where it belongs - in your head :)

Would that be the "big head" or the "little head" Ma'am?

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ORIGINAL: Politesub53

Maybe to make it work it just takes the right two people. i would think some guys dont realise just exactly what they are asking for, long term speaking. What happens when the intitial excitement wears thin and reality takes over. There is a need to remember that while you are with a Domina you are also still with a human being.

I agree.  It goes both ways in terms of expectations needing to be realistic.  The same could be said when it comes to a sub still being a human being as well.

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ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

Oh GREAT point!  Of course masochistic men are attracted to emotionally withholding women.  No matter how good one's mother was, being ignored hurts.  Some men keep chasing mummy's approval (from other female authority figures) the rest of their lives

But why do Femdoms enjoy hurting men?  Still wondering about that myself.  Being cruel to be kind?

quote:

There's many reasons why some of us enjoy emotional and/or physical sado-masochism. And most of us do not want to open the Pandora's Box and ask why. We just know it makes us feel good. Alive. Sexy. We would like to think we were just born this way.

The truth is, most of our underlying psychological reasons are not "good" and "healthy". When I see people trying to defend their sado-masochism and convince others their way is perfectly fine, I feel sorry for them. We need to admit that we are not "normal" and our reasons are not "nice" (otherwise we would be just like everyone else - YUCK NO WAY!!!!)

My sadism is not cruelty-free and frankly, I dont WANT it to be. Lots of normal (non-sado masochistic) people are drawn to BDSM, buy some nice fetsishwear, go to a few munches then presume to lecture the rest of us how to be "Loving" and "Responsible" (ie nice, kind, gentle, considerate).

Look, I agree all those qualities are important in relationships but they miss the point: we are sado-masochists. We cannot thrive in relationships that do not inflict pain. We do not claim to be "right" or "healthy" and we realise most people do not approve of us, but we know what we need and what we fnd erotic.

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ORIGINAL: LadyPact

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ORIGINAL: MsCfromMelbourne

Oh GREAT point!  Of course masochistic men are attracted to emotionally withholding women.  No matter how good one's mother was, being ignored hurts.  Some men keep chasing mummy's approval (from other female authority figures) the rest of their lives

But why do Femdoms enjoy hurting men?  Still wondering about that myself.  Being cruel to be kind?

No, you didn't kill your own thread.  Actually, I was wondering which one of your follow up posts would be best to quote to respond.  This last statement, for Me, is closest to the truth.
 
At this point in My journey, I would have to say that I identify with you regarding dispensing pain.  I do enjoy inflicting physical pain to one who receives it.  I would hazzard to guess that some of My prior statements would have led many to already know that.  The key to this is that both elements have to be there.  The giver enjoys it.  The receiver enjoys it.  This becomes a win/win. 
 
Also, like you, I tread very carefully in the waters of emotional pain, humiliation, etc.  One of the biggest reasons for this is one is much easier than the other, and in ways, simpler.  When I put a physical mark on a boy, I know exactly how severe it was.  I know how long it takes to heal.  I know when it has disappeared.  These things are not the case when inflicting emotional damage.  It takes a long time to establish the connection for Me to be comfortable with these areas.  I have to be very secure in the fact that it will be enjoyed by both parties so that another win/win will exist.
 
When paired with a masochist, one of the ways I reward is dispensing pain.  Remember, he is enjoying it.  So, spot on, yes.  I am actually being cruel to be kind.  When he likes the sensations, fondly talks about the marks, or is excited by the way he is "reminded" of our time together during his drive home because he has to sit, I'm very happy about it.  I get My own little rush.  I'm thrilled with toys that have different effects because I know of the pleasures they are going to bring.
 
Dispensing physical pain doesn't mean I do not care about My boys.  In fact, I'm usually quite fierce in protecting them.  It's a style that works for Me, so I really don't consider Myself a bitch.