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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:35:38 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Would you be so kind as to inform us just who are these people who repeatedly put forth these bills?

Firstly, I suggest YOU re-read my previous posts, not waste time and space re-posting them.

Secondly, I believe the following link can answer all of your questions:

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_lang.html

If that does not, I'm sure typing in "English as an official language" into google will more than satisfy you.

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Post #: 341

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:36:54 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: calamitysandra

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
...
, but when you see speeches on CNN, when you see them at the UN....they....speak.....ENGLISH. Why should mexicans who intend to be in this country be any different?

You do realize that the headphones you see the politicians wearing in the plenum are not because they listen to their playlist, right? They get translation. Into their native tongue. So do the English speaking ones if somebody has the gall to say something in an other language.

Funny, most speeches I see have the foreign ambassadors speaking for themselves....and I don't recall being given any headphones, yet I can understand them perfectly.

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Post #: 342

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:39:44 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: cjan

Smith, I want to apologize to you for a post I made earlier in this thread regarding you. It was a flame and in violation of TOS and Mod11 rightly removed it. No matter how heated an exange becomes, there is no excuse for personal attacks. Please accept my apology, sir.

No apology is necessary, cjan. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion, beit a personal attack or otherwise. I never take offense from attacks as I feel they speak more to the attacker than the target. But then an apology does speak to a person's nature far more than an attack does, so in that spirit, thank you.

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Post #: 343

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:41:11 PM

Hippiekinkster

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: calamitysandra

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
...
, but when you see speeches on CNN, when you see them at the UN....they....speak.....ENGLISH. Why should mexicans who intend to be in this country be any different?

You do realize that the headphones you see the politicians wearing in the plenum are not because they listen to their playlist, right? They get translation. Into their native tongue. So do the English speaking ones if somebody has the gall to say something in an other language.

Funny, most speeches I see have the foreign ambassadors speaking for themselves....and I don't recall being given any headphones, yet I can understand them perfectly.

I have. Many times. Might be something to do with that TV you watch over there in Dallas.

So, who told you an English speaker couldn't get served in foreign countries? What countries were those?

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Post #: 344

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:45:01 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: philosophy

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

Because, while you think there is no official language, there is an unofficial, official language.

...you're kidding right? i mean, what sane individual tries to assert that there is a such a thing as an 'unofficial official' anything? Law is law, what is not law is not law. There are no grey areas here.
You appear to be trying to suggest that just because a thing is done one way by a lot of people who have political power then we all ought to treat it as if it had the force of law. Such a slavish attitude seems to me incompatible with a nation that prides itself on its celebration of the individuals right to live as they choose.

The subtext of my point was that if so many politicians throughout history (every session of congress, according to the link I posted four posts ago), then many already consider it the official language, they just can't seem to get it on the books.

And I'm not talking about infringing on others' rights to live as they choose. In your home, speak whatever language floats your boat. I have a mexican friend who gets kicks out of talking to me in italian.....whatever makes you happy. However, everyone should know english as a baseline. According to the research I have done, 54 countries around the world have english as their official language. I find it odd, that a nation founded by english-speaking people would not have it as well.

< Message edited by Smith117 -- 4/1/2008 2:47:49 PM >

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Post #: 345

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:46:25 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic

ok, I came across this and it just struck me as funny, ironic, stoopid, I dunno, but thought I would throw it up, if just to lighten the mood
http://www.lucylasticslair.com/fun/engrishonly.jpg
Lucy

Now that's just funny. I saw a pick on break.com's picture gallery of a guy holding a sign protesting Obama's candidacy here in Texas (the pic didn't say where it was taken exactly) but nearly EVERY word in the sign was misspelled. It was sad and funny all at once.

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Post #: 346

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:47:25 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: boytoy4female

I can think of many more reasons that learning English in the US should be a requirement, than I can think of against it.

America is a melting pot. What makes us great is our ability to share thoughts, ideas, experiences and our culture. Without a common language, this can not be done.

Very well said.

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Post #: 347

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 2:49:25 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

I have. Many times. Might be something to do with that TV you watch over there in Dallas.

You have what? Seen the same english-speaking speeches I have? And I think the CNN I get here in Dallas is the same CNN they get everywhere else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
So, who told you an English speaker couldn't get served in foreign countries? What countries were those?

You already asked this once before, and I've already answered it once before.

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Post #: 348

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 3:21:12 PM

calamitysandra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: calamitysandra

quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117
...
, but when you see speeches on CNN, when you see them at the UN....they....speak.....ENGLISH. Why should mexicans who intend to be in this country be any different?

You do realize that the headphones you see the politicians wearing in the plenum are not because they listen to their playlist, right? They get translation. Into their native tongue. So do the English speaking ones if somebody has the gall to say something in an other language.

Funny, most speeches I see have the foreign ambassadors speaking for themselves....and I don't recall being given any headphones, yet I can understand them perfectly.

I have. Many times. Might be something to do with that TV you watch over there in Dallas.

So, who told you an English speaker couldn't get served in foreign countries? What countries were those?

Now, first off, there is a distinct difference between an ambassador, and the UN plenum, which was what you were reffering to.
And as for an ambassador in the US speaking english? Well, that is just good buisness practise, no? They are in the US as contact persons, send from their government to keep relations with the US government.
Many ambassadors, and other diplomats make a point of learning the language of the country they are staying in.
It is good public relations. "Ich bin ein Berliner" anyone?

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Post #: 349

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 4:17:42 PM

Hippiekinkster

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

I have. Many times. Might be something to do with that TV you watch over there in Dallas.

You have what? Seen the same english-speaking speeches I have? And I think the CNN I get here in Dallas is the same CNN they get everywhere else.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
So, who told you an English speaker couldn't get served in foreign countries? What countries were those?

You already asked this once before, and I've already answered it once before.

I have seen Ambassadors on TV using headphones. Even on CNN.

And, yup, saw your answer. You initially said "countries", and when I called you on it, gave the example of your father in some bar in the Prefecture of Okinawa, which is hardly all of Japan, and which was promptly contradicted by Thompson, who has personally been to Okinawa. Maybe the Okinawans just don't like drunken Texans, who knows?

I'd say "nice try" but it was mediocre.

If you got your list of 54 countries from Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_English_is_an_official_language
You might note that, in many of them, English is not a legally declared official language. You might also note that, in most of them, English is AN official language (meaning co-official). Finally, an astute researcher would note that many of these sovereign nations are former British Colonies, most of which are small islands with very small populations, and English is :official" becasuse the natives were either wiped out or forced to speak it.

Not even a mediocre effort. Sad.

< Message edited by Hippiekinkster -- 4/1/2008 4:36:43 PM >

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 4:38:26 PM

domiguy

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I wonder if a sub is able to suck cock in Mexican? It really is the only language that she be required to speak.

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Post #: 351

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 4:48:30 PM

calamitysandra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

I wonder if a sub is able to suck cock in Mexican? It really is the only language that she be required to speak.

Nope. But she is going to be fluent in French fast if you teach her just right.

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Post #: 352

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 5:16:45 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: calamitysandra

Now, first off, there is a distinct difference between an ambassador, and the UN plenum, which was what you were reffering to.
And as for an ambassador in the US speaking english? Well, that is just good buisness practise, no? They are in the US as contact persons, send from their government to keep relations with the US government.
Many ambassadors, and other diplomats make a point of learning the language of the country they are staying in.
It is good public relations. "Ich bin ein Berliner" anyone?

Exactly. It's good public relations when dealing with the US....to speak ENGLISH. Notice the ambassadors to the US don't speak spanish.....hmmmmmmm. Most curious.

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 5:30:55 PM

Smith117

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

And, yup, saw your answer. You initially said "countries", and when I called you on it, gave the example of your father in some bar in the Prefecture of Okinawa, which is hardly all of Japan, and which was promptly contradicted by Thompson, who has personally been to Okinawa. Maybe the Okinawans just don't like drunken Texans, who knows?

Actually I didn't feel like giving a full run down of place, so I listed one example. And I said my dad was STATIONED in Okinawa. You don't think......he just *might* have traveled to Japan while stationed there.....do you?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
I'd say "nice try" but it was mediocre.

You know the saying about opinions....

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

If you got your list of 54 countries from Wikipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_where_English_is_an_official_language
You might note that, in many of them, English is not a legally declared official language. You might also note that, in most of them, English is AN official language (meaning co-official). Finally, an astute researcher would note that many of these sovereign nations are former British Colonies, most of which are small islands with very small populations, and English is :official" becasuse the natives were either wiped out or forced to speak it.

Actually, I purposely did *not* use wikipedia as my source, I made sure to find others, others which are easily found by typing what I suggested into google.

It doesn't matter what *most* are, they are countries none the less. I don't think it's relavant which are islands and which are not, especially when you consider which ones are not......such as Nigeria.....Singapore (that's near China, ain't it? and yet they speak English)....hmmmm....a chinese neighbor can speak english as an official language, but we can't declare it one here and our own neighbor doesn't speak it. Strange.....

Let's see...who else is on that list......well it appears, a significant portion of the African continent speaks it, as well as many parts of South America ahhh but what the heck, they're only "two little islands," right?

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Post #: 354

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 5:37:24 PM

calamitysandra

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: calamitysandra

Now, first off, there is a distinct difference between an ambassador, and the UN plenum, which was what you were reffering to.
And as for an ambassador in the US speaking english? Well, that is just good buisness practise, no? They are in the US as contact persons, send from their government to keep relations with the US government.
Many ambassadors, and other diplomats make a point of learning the language of the country they are staying in.
It is good public relations. "Ich bin ein Berliner" anyone?

Exactly. It's good public relations when dealing with the US....to speak ENGLISH. Notice the ambassadors to the US don't speak spanish.....hmmmmmmm. Most curious.

See, I did state earlier that I would think it wise for immigrants into the US to learn English, as it is the language of the majority. But I also said that it would not be amiss for the people in the US states that face a shift in culture and the proportions of language towards the hispanic to learn Spanish.
And I would not be so sure about those ambassadors not speaking Spanish. And if the majorities shift, they most assuredly will.

< Message edited by calamitysandra -- 4/1/2008 5:38:52 PM >

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 6:33:53 PM

thompsonx

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Singapore (that's near China, ain't it? and yet they speak English)....hmmmm....a chinese neighbor can speak english as an official language,
Smith:
There are three countries and about 1200 miles between the island of Singapore and China.
thompson

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Post #: 356

RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 6:49:54 PM

Hippiekinkster

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Uh-huh. Here's what you said, Smith.

Smith: "When I was growing up, I heard stories of OTHER COUNTRIES where if you walked into a bar and tried to order a drink, you'd not even be looked at unless you spoke their language."
First you said your father was in Okinawa, now it's all over Japan. Convenient. Someone who's been to Okinawa can question Thompson as to his veracity, but no such opportunity exists to question someone whom YOU claim has been there. (won't even visit his ever-wider travels)

Later you say: "According to the research I have done, 54 COUNTRIES AROUND THE WORLD HAVE ENGLISH AS THEIR OFFICIAL LANGUAGE."
I dispute this statement, giving my source. You come back with "Actually, I purposely did *not* use wikipedia as my source, I made sure to find others, others which are easily found by typing what I suggested into google." For all I know, you made it up, just as it appears you have made others up.

This is what I said in rebuttal: "You might note that, in many of them, English is not a legally declared official language. You also might note that, in most of them, English is AN official language (meaning co-official). Finally, an astute researcher would note that many of these sovereign nations are former British Colonies, most of which are small islands with very small populations, and English is :official" becasuse the natives were either wiped out or forced to speak it."

You come back with this babble, which evades all but the Island part of my post: "It doesn't matter what *most* are, they are countries none the less. I don't think it's relavant which are islands and which are not, especially when you consider which ones are not......such as Nigeria.....Singapore (that's near China, ain't it? and yet they speak English)....hmmmm....a chinese neighbor can speak english as an official language, but we can't declare it one here and our own neighbor doesn't speak it. Strange....." (BTW, three ellipses are standard)

So, where is your list? We can go down it and find which have English as "their official language". (your words; I note the singular)

"Because, while you think there is no official language, there is an unofficial, official language." I had to quote this again, just because it is so utterly goofy.

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 6:49:58 PM

thompsonx

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Let's see...who else is on that list...... many parts of South America ahhh but what the heck,
Smith:
In South America only the former British Guiana,now called Guyana has English as a national language.
thompson

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 7:08:00 PM

thompsonx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Smith117

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Would you be so kind as to inform us just who are these people who repeatedly put forth these bills?

Firstly, I suggest YOU re-read my previous posts, not waste time and space re-posting them.

Secondly, I believe the following link can answer all of your questions:

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_lang.html

If that does not, I'm sure typing in "English as an official language" into google will more than satisfy you.

Smith:
I went to your link and it does not say who it is who constantly puts these bills up.
Maybe you would like to tell us.
You mentioned in your post that only someone who was ready to not be in congress anymore would do it. Yet your link states quite clearly that almost every year it is put up. That would seem to indicate that these people keep getting reelected.
Your link also had this curious item in it
Often these bills are in response to legislation recognizing non-English languages in public discourse of some kind. H.R. 3333, for example, also explicitly repealed the Bilingual Education Act which authorized funds to educate American students if their native tongue as well as to provide specialized training in the learning of English.
This would seem to be at odds with your claim that Spanish is mandatory in Texas.
Perhaps you might want to bring this to the attention of the authorities.
thompson

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RE: Learn english or go to jail - 4/1/2008 7:20:50 PM

Smith117

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My my, you are entertaining. For the moment anyway.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster

First you said your father was in Okinawa, now it's all over Japan. Convenient. Someone who's been to Okinawa can question Thompson as to his veracity, but no such opportunity exists to question someone whom YOU claim has been there. (won't even visit his ever-wider travels)

I said my dad was stationed in Okinawa. I never said that's where the bar was. I also never said it was "all of japan." Military members OFTEN travel to Japan on weekend passes when stationed in Okinawa. (If you dispute this, then you've obviously never been there. Both my brother and my father as well as several coworkers have and they all have told me about traveling to Japan on their time off.)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hippiekinkster
I dispute this statement, giving my source. You come back with "Actually, I purposely did *not* use wikipedia as my source, I made sure to find others, others which are easily found by typing what I suggested into google." For all I know, you made it up, just as it appears you have made others up.

So, where is your list?

Dispute the truth all you like. I've told you where my list is and how to find it. I'm not going to waste space here repasting it and doing your research for you. I've done my research and I am satisfied. You clearly have not. I told you to type "countries with english as an official language" into google. Sure, the first link is wikipedia, but you just might have to scroll down.

Also, I don't care what you consider goofy. That's up to you. I only call it like I see it. If you wish to spin it, by all means, spin it. I don't. I find it too time-comsuming. I prefer the truth.

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