RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 4:51:28 AM

BlackPhx

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Links to the Actual articles maybe found here http://www.collarchat.com/m_1823119/tm.htm if anyone has not already seen them. They give a great deal of information and photos as well of the actual dungeon. I placed them there as it was News not just a subject opened for discussion.

poenkitten

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 4:57:01 AM

BlackPhx

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No you don't read about women committing this kind of crime very often..but then again a whole lot of us WANT our sons to move out once they are of age to do so, the rest of us having them living in the basement or still couched in their rooms, often with "visitors" from time to time. My mantra for many years while ridig herd on a son that slept 2 hours a night and sped through life at Warp 6..18 college, 18 military..18 OUT!

poenkitten (snickering since her grandson is just like his father)

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 5:54:16 AM

BlackPhx

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quote:

ORIGINAL: subtee

I find it disturbing too. In fact, I'm really not loving that it's even on CM as a post and it is also mentioned in "Alternative Lifestyles" Forum. What that "man" did is not a lifestyle, it seems to me. I don't know, maybe I'm just too wacked by this. Hate it.

SubTee;

Since I was the one that posted the links in Alternate Lifestyle in the News, I will happily explain my reasoning.
1) Knowledge. If something is going to be discussed, having as much information possible helps in understanding and intelligent discussion.

2) Many of us have family who dont' know what we do precisely and will see something like this and equate it with wiitwd. Unless we have taken time to explain or do a lot of hiding of marks etc, the symbols in our flesh of our pleasure looks an awful lot like abuse to most people. They hear the word dungeon and easily equate it with our clubs. Note 'Lilabbots' first response (later explained) that is the response of the average person, the eqaution between what we do and this.

Frankly I think that what MissSCD and others were far too kind with thier proposed punishment, but he will be convivted under their laws and be treated far more humanely than he treated his daughter and grandchildren/children. It is possible that he may only serve 15 years for his crime against her, but he may also serve time for each child he not only sired, but kept captive within that dungeon, as well as time for the incest. I suspect he will not leave jail alive or indeed survive it long once he is placed in general population. It may indeed be a long painful death.

Children are resilient, far moreso than we know. A great many children were rescued from the concentration camps where they suffered as greatly as any adult prisoner, and while they had many physcial and emotional problems, they over came them with help to become useful productive citizens for the most part. As well there are more than a few of us here who have survived childhoods that were less than ideal for whom all the socialization in the world (school, church, availability of cops and hospitals) meant not a blessed thing save that no one was going to believe us or interfere, yet for the most part we have come to terms with that past and move forward with our lives in healthy ways.

I suspect that with aid and care that the doctors caring for them are correct and these children will do well in a few years and move beyond their birthrite and involuntary captivity especially since there does not seem to be any mention of torture or abuse other than the captivity and lack of socialization and sunlight.

poenkitten

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 6:51:47 AM

subtee

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Thank you for your post and thoughts. As I said, it was probably just a too sensitive reaction because it's all just so horrible. I don't like to think anyone would align WIITWD with what this monster has done. You're right, edification and information is important to unblur the lines for anyone who might suggest a correlation.

I'm sorry if I was bitchy.

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 10:10:40 AM

BlackPhx

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Not a problem and yes it is horrible and I am really hoping that his shorter life will hold much torment for him. As for Bitchy, having one of those days myself...

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 3:54:59 PM

SeeksOnlyOne

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lilabbotsfordgrl

Daddy/daughter sex, cages, rape, torture....... all the stuff we crave and emulate daily.
But when it happens, oh dear, they should be shot! Angry angry angry! Sick sick sick!

Oh yeah, and the "men are the bad gender, women are the good gender" idiocy some people feel the need to bring into it.

theres a big difference between a fantasy between 2 CONSENTING adults and this......

gawd i hope youre being sarcastic and im too dumb to see it

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 4:31:37 PM

Usako

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quote:

ORIGINAL: lilabbotsfordgrl

Daddy/daughter sex, cages, rape, torture....... all the stuff we crave and emulate daily.
But when it happens, oh dear, they should be shot! Angry angry angry! Sick sick sick!

Oh yeah, and the "men are the bad gender, women are the good gender" idiocy some people feel the need to bring into it.

I do find it amusing. So many on this site have their own lil "dungeons" and such and whine and complain that the "vanilla world" doesn't understand them when they call them sick or twisted for being in the "lifestyle" and being "24/7 slaves" or whatever. But then there is that fine line between consenting and a crime that makes it a-ok.

Not saying I condone what this man did, I think it's down right insane and frankly don't understand why he'd do it, let alone to his own daughter...and yet keep some of her kids to raise? Mind baffling. I also fail to see how he got away with it for so many years and no one even wondered at all? Magical kids were dropped on his doorstep and the wife never wondered? Well, she probably did but old world women probably have a mindset to not question or rock the boat and be a "good wife."

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 4:43:46 PM

adoracat

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~fast reply~

commenting on the "the wife MUST have known!" remarks...

how many times a year does a story hit the news about some man living a double life? serial killers with homes and jobs and wives and families? and the wife has NO clue because he hid his outside activities so well?

my father molested me in our home. in my bedroom, right next door to where he and my mother slept. no, she never had a clue other than seeing me get more and more depressed, but hey! teenaged girls get moody, right?

if a few letters were sent, and the children being "dropped off" were timed well, no, it wouldnt be obvious to the mother. and she may have been thankful to have SOME piece of her daughter home with her. plus, who knows how the husband/father was, if he were domineering and harsh, she might not have dared to question him.

kitten, disturbed

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 4:44:10 PM

RealityLicks

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Usako

...but old world women probably have a mindset to not question or rock the boat and be a "good wife."

There are probably quite a few Austrian women on this site, you might try asking them if that is their mindset.

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 5:22:55 PM

angelikaJ

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Usako

I do find it amusing. So many on this site have their own lil "dungeons" and such and whine and complain that the "vanilla world" doesn't understand them when they call them sick or twisted for being in the "lifestyle" and being "24/7 slaves" or whatever. But then there is that fine line between consenting and a crime that makes it a-ok.

It is (or should be) more than a fine line.

It is a matter of full informed consent...
Not unlawful imprisonment.

And once again; that someone can draw remote comparisons disturbs me.

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 5:35:09 PM

LadyEllen

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RealityLicks

quote:

ORIGINAL: Usako

...but old world women probably have a mindset to not question or rock the boat and be a "good wife."

There are probably quite a few Austrian women on this site, you might try asking them if that is their mindset.

There was an interview on BBC Newsnight this evening with the woman who was kidnapped and imprisoned in Vienna (the case from two years ago). She attributed the rash of such cases (there was one in 2000/01 in Austria too) to the misogynistic, traditionalist treatment of women present in Austria since naziism (and presumably before that too), where indeed women are expected to be the good wife and not rock the boat.

Its a funny old country Austria. Very formal, very proper, very old fashioned in social and cultural attitudes and absolutely convinced that it was a victim of the nazis not a willing collaborator (despite obvious historical record). Honest to goodness, once when I was over there a guy and his wife turned up on the car park outside the company I was with - him in lederhosen and the little hat with the feather in, and her in traditional dress too. I asked if there was a festival on or something, but no, this was how the older generation in rural parts lived.

E

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RE: Austrian Man Holds Daughter Captive For 24 Years - 4/30/2008 11:50:23 PM

Uniform

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As almost everyone else living in Austria I have been deeply shocked by the terrible crime that has happened in Amstetten. And as I know the Austrians, the discussion why and how that could happen will be intensive and go on for many years.

BUT: Please do not take that crime as something specifically Austrian, an expression of a special national character, or as a chance to belittle the Austrians as outlandish and backward people (Sound of music - style). Crimes like this one have happened in many places all over the so-called civilized world (even on a larger scale: think of some US sects and what they have done to kids). This line of argument is no better than the one we are experiencing here, connecting both the Kampusch- and the Amstetten-case to the SM-scene and declaring all being involved with SM as being sickos, criminals, and a potential danger to kids (as done in a tv-report here the other night).

Uniform

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