RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave?

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RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 1:06:58 PM

Posts: 8070
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jm2k4
My question is now how do I look for local?

You simply have to do a search. If you are American, you will be able to search by state. If you are anything else, you will have to search by country.

- LA

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 1:27:04 PM

jm2k4

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Joined: 7/25/2004
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um...just a little more specfic. I have found sites of communities yet I can't find a local one.

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 1:41:13 PM

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From: Washington
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quote:

Took your advice about nick change, and I've deactived the profile for now and both of them. My question is now how do I look for local?

I like your name change jm. It might work to search munches your state.
When i searched munches WA i got a lot of info.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 1:51:19 PM

jm2k4

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I'm not american.

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 1:59:20 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jm2k4
I'm not american.

Neither am I jm2k4. But all Americans will assume you are. I think its part of their hard wiring ;)

I'm Canadian. And that is why I told you in the post above that if you are from anywhere other then the US, you will have to search by country, and then weed out what is at the other end of the country from you, unfortunately.

Please let us know where you are from. I can't tell what you are as you profile is deactivated. Some of us have friends all over the world.

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 7/25/2004 2:00:17 PM >

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

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RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:09:01 PM

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From: Washington
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quote:

I'm not american.

Sorry for the false assumption. Try searching munches closest big city to you.

_____________________________

proudsub

"Without goals you become what you were. With goals you become what you wish." .

"You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts"--Alan Greenspan

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:19:08 PM

jm2k4

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Joined: 7/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: proudsub

quote:

I'm not american.

Sorry for the false assumption. Try searching munches closest big city to you.

Not prob, I am canadian too and I can only find sites from either alberta or ontario. I would be very happy if someone(canadian or non) help me find more then just those two provinces

(in reply to proudsub)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:29:16 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jm2k4
I am canadian too and I can only find sites from either alberta or ontario. I would be very happy if someone(canadian or non) help me find more then just those two provinces

I can give you contacts in MB, if that's where you're from (It's where I'm from originally, so it's where I"m most familiar with the scene). Manitoba has a very active scene, with several groups, regular munches, educational events, a regular fetish/play party, and even a weekend long event every year. Or if you'll be a little more specific about where you are, I can likely ask friends back home about contacts in other provinces. I know there's a very active community in BC and I believe in Quebec as well. I'm not as familiar with the Atlantic provinces, and last I heard the community in SK was fairly limited, though there were munches on a fairly regular basis when I was in Canada.

< Message edited by SherriA -- 7/25/2004 2:30:11 PM >

_____________________________

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Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:31:32 PM

jm2k4

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geez, why do I have to live in the fairly limited province?

(in reply to SherriA)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:41:42 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jm2k4
geez, why do I have to live in the fairly limited province?

You still have not mentioned which one. I'm guessing either PEI or Saskatchewan. ;)

Btw, there is tons of stuff in Québec as well.

Look here - http://www.kaylasniche.com/linkscan.html

- LA

< Message edited by LadyAngelika -- 7/25/2004 2:44:38 PM >

_____________________________

Une main de fer dans un gant de velours ~ An iron hand in a velvet glove

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 2:47:07 PM

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I'd suggest joining the Saskatchewan Alternative Lifestyle mailing list. It looks to be a fairly active list. Folks there are likely most familiar with the groups/events in your area. You can find it here: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SaskAlternativeLifestyles/

Here is the info from their introduction:

SALSA Who Are We?

A pansexual/pan-fetish organization established and maintained,to promote, establish, maintain, encourage and provide the safest possible environment. We place the highest emphasis on being Safe, Sane and Consensual and "RACK" Risk Aware Consentual Kink through which consenting adults may explore their kink/fetish interests with other like-minded people.

Whatever your level of experience in the lifestyle, beginner, novice or experienced, you are welcome to browse our RULES and determine if you would like to join and see for yourself, what we are all about.

While we are an association of open minded adults who recognize and make an effort to provide opportunities for people to get together and make connections within the lifestyle, we are not a "meat market." If you are simply looking for a place to pick up your latest conquest, then perhaps this is not your best option.

Many people from SK also attend events in Winnipeg, so that might be another option for you. Check out www.dssm.org for more information on the Manitoba scene.

_____________________________

-- Sherri

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/25/2004 11:28:19 PM

jm2k4

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hmm...I'll think about the yahoo group, not much but I guess I'll take what I can find, thanks for the help.

(in reply to SherriA)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 12:38:23 AM

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Joined: 7/3/2004
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Jim-
I hope you don't mind me butting in here, but I am also a newbie to the 'scene'. I want to recommend that you read as much as you can about the lifestyle. The three that I have devoured are "Different Loving" by Gloria Brame, "Screw the Roses, Send me the Thorns" and SM101. There are tons of others, as well as tons of informative websites. I am making an assumption here, and if I am I apologize in advance, but it doesn't look like you have much knowledge about the intricacies of BDSM. It's a very serious thing. You are engaging in play that is psychosexual and can be very physical. The play differs, the fact that both players need to be INFORMED and able to COMMUNICATE effectively is of the utmost importance.
Please mail me with any questions you have.
As Always-
Berlin

(in reply to LadyAngelika)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 1:02:20 AM

jm2k4

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Joined: 7/25/2004
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I'm very new to actual sites, but I've about it a few months ago from some people(haven't seen them since then) and got interested in knowing more in the last month or so.

(in reply to MzBerlin)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 1:26:42 AM

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Joined: 7/3/2004
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Jim-
I belong to both collarme.com (c.com) and bondage.com (c.com). They both have things that appeal to me. I'm sure there are a gazillion others, too, but these are the ones I have chosen. I am going to strongly suggest that you read the forum threads, that you scope out some profiles to see how they're presented, that you educate yourself as much as you can about BDSM and the subculture that surrounds it. I am also going to suggest (and this is a personal suggestion and some may disagree) that you hold off on looking for someone until you fully understand the scope of what you 'want.'
As Always-
Berlin

I gently suggest that you adress the person that you are posting back to. It's polite and helps avoid confusion when reading threads.
-B

(in reply to jm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 2:04:04 AM

jm2k4

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Joined: 7/25/2004
Status: offline

Sorry MzBerlin, I know what you are saying and am currently trying to find out more about BDSM. As for the scoping of profiles, yeah I deactived mine till I figure out what should/can go in it.

P.S to all who see my nick it JM not jim.

(in reply to MzBerlin)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 5:26:00 AM

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Joined: 2/12/2004
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You have to ask the person what it means for them.
If you go by some preset definition then you will always be wrong.

Yes, you can make assumptions, but even that gets you into erroneous waters.

Who says a slave has to be submissive or a submissive has to be a slave?
There are aggressive slaves that will attempt to top if given the slightest toe hold.

I think you need to define the terms with your intended audience, otherwise they are one in the same yet also completely different.

We can't actually own human beings. This is sexuality known as role playing. Sexuality is the tree. Everyone is unique in their sexuality. Role Playing is the main branch. BDSM is the branch of the tree we are talking about. And you getinto the same semantic arguments when asking what is the difference between D/s and SM or BD? What do you call a Master that likes to get spanked? What do you call a Mistress that like to be raped? Fact is this is not black and white.

Typically submissive denoted personality, or aspects of a personality. The CEO might very well be aggressive, assertive, calculating, controlling, even ruthless, yet he may be sexually submissive and perhaps is a dog at home? Then you may have a person that is submissive in everything that they are and do. Still they may not be a slave.

Typically slave denotes property. A person that wishes to become another's property, and this may be associated with giving up one's humanity, and if not to that degree, accepting a lower status. Some people want to be comlete equals, except during the expression of their sexuality.

Some people want to live the roles they choose to play. This is choosing an alternative lifestyle. To live in an adult world of pretend and come to beleive it is reality. Others want a balance of role play and normality. And then others limit dominance and submission just to their sexual experiences. So many people, and just as many twists and takes.

If you do assume, I think it is usually safe to assume that a submissive would or could do anything a slave would or could do. And with that being the situation I don't think you can judge seriousness, depth, degree or extremity by a person identifying themselves as a sub or slave. But I do think people identify themselves one way or another because of basic fundamentals to their make-up as a person.

I think subs are more of the mind set of here, this is what I am willing to give to you, use it wisely and with care and you may get more. While they will give up, surrender, submit, they reserve the right to do as they please, when they please.
Still there is no depth or limit a sub cannot go, if she/he chooses.

I think slaves are more of the mindset that they choose to give their choice to another within their own set of limits.

And yes, you can definitiely be a submissive slave. Some people are not slave and are not submissive. Yet they want to be dominated, made to be submissive, even forced into slavery.

Keeping in mind that everyone is consentual to the adult roles and games they play. A lot of people like to play. Some are very experienced, skillful, serious players that have forgotten that they are engaged in play. Others don't even play, but enjoy the titallation of BDSM flirtations.

So it comes down to you still have to talk to the person and find out what they are into and all about. It doesn't mean that the lifestyler and the dabbler can't have some fun. You never know who is right for you, and if not right, just good for you, in one way or the other. But how do you know if you never talk to people that might not be expressing the same interests, or have the same knowledge or wisdoms that you possess, unless you try and get a volley of e-mail messages going?

Maybe that 19 year old slave is the best thing for the 57 year old divorced woman just discovering BDSM?
Perhaps that chubby, bald funny looking 48 year old sub will make that 28 hot psycho bitch from hell content and stable?

Maybe the role is Mommy/Daddy Son/Daughter and while their very well maybe corporal discipline and power exchange, it may have no real elements of BDSM?

Of couse we have all heard of switches. Well both kinds, birch and those that are both submiisve and Dominant.

A slave and a sub can mean so many different things. A sub can mean so many differnet things. A slave can mean so many diffeent things. They can be to any degree. So how can we ask what the differences are in general terms and hope to even be right in specific instances?

(in reply to masterjm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 5:53:54 AM

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Joined: 1/1/2004
From: North West UK
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i think if sub or slave or whatever depends on the individuals and the relationship they are in. my master sometimes calls me sub and sometimes slave, sometimes i fell like saying i am slave, usually i say i am me. everyone defines it differently and i think the name isn't important at all. in january i went to a munch wihtout master, i met a woman there i have seen in chat before, she claimed to be a gorean slave, althought she used to play with a guy form the munch who thinks nothing of gor (same as me thinking gor is a fantasy). in chat she ignored him as she kept saying she is a goren slave hence she needs a gorean master and all the others are jsut bratty subs. she used to quite upset me, tried to domme me and other sub/slaves btu then goes and claims she is the perfect slave. that dom stopped meeting her as she pissed him off and from what i knew abotu her she had no r/l experience whatso ever, played a lot lately as she thought she has to to learn to be a better slave but then kept complaining about it. she seems to fit the perfect goren slave for chat. that seems to be her domain but don't try to fit that version of slave into r/l and you don't understand yourself anymore

the reason i liek to think slave of me is that i like the idea of SN deciding what happens and not me.

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view my slave certificate and
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(in reply to Bumbum)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 10:52:41 AM

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Most of the responses I've read are based on individual circumstances and don't really clarify a fundamental distinction bettween submissive and slave. The one below is one I think is an excellent take on things.

A submissive sets limits, and therfore makes choices. Ultimately, the sub has the power. Though we hate to admit it, Doms do not have control but only the illusion of it. Our job is to continually seduce consent within the limits. The dance is to seduce consent well, and to create the illusion of total control and allow the sub permission and safety to let go completely and submit.

A slave makes ONE choice: to obey. Once this choice is made and the slave contract entered, to chose anything but obedience breaks the contract. This is a whole different level of trust, submission, and letting go. Though real slavery is illegal and a human being can't be owned, the consent to act as if can be just as powerful.

Obviously, the difference is huge and the vast majority are submissive, not slaves. I see the careless use of the term, especially online, as a sign of inexperience or lack of sophistication in the subtleties of their own passions, or both. Not judging, just think it's true.

Hunter in West LA

(in reply to masterjm2k4)

RE: What is the real difference between a sub and a slave? - 7/26/2004 11:52:24 AM

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Nice post, Hunter.

I agree with you, except for the contract part. IMO slavery doesn't require a contract.

Because of the supposed connection between contract and slavery, too many people decide they are a slave, or have a slave--simply because there's a contract between them.

On a related note, I've never been able to understand the concept of a "play slave". Or a "TPE weekend".

Welcome to the boards,

January

_____________________________

[link: http://www.bookstrand.com/miss-you-sir] Miss You, Sir by January Rowe is available from Siren now! It's my latest smokin' hot bdsm romance.[/link]

(in reply to HunterLA)

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