RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't people just control eating an exorcise?

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:07:28 AM

sambamanslilgirl

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it's call - choice.

with the way medical science keeps advancing, more people will always look for the quick and easy way to lose weight from the latest magic pill to GP.

though i'm not really dieting but i've cut back on my eating habits to drinking more water. so far i have lost weight naturally especially since most of my exercise comes from moving around the stage.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:19:34 AM

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nm.

< Message edited by christine1 -- 7/31/2008 10:27:51 AM >

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:29:54 AM

divi

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damn you Christine lol ! Was just gonna quote you..

But seriously YHMA as a person who is trying to lose weight yourself you are being a little negative.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:37:27 AM

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lol divi. ok yhma...you do seem a bit negative for someone who is trying to lose weight. it just seems a bit odd to me that you're criticisizing those who need the surgery because of self control. isnt' everyone who needs to lose weight, whether they need to lose 10 to 100 lbs, guilty of a self control issue? i'm counting myself in that group by the way, i have a bit of weight to lose myself.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:38:17 AM

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I have two friends who did the stomach stapling back in the early 90's, and they ate themselves back to their pre-surgical weight. It is entirely possible to do. If the person has issues with food, they are going to eat. Just saying "surgery will fix it" is being naive. Once the surgery is done, the person's entire relationship with food has to change.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:38:42 AM

divi

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ty Christine !!lol

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:40:58 AM

divi

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I have two friends who did the stomach stapling back in the early 90's, and they ate themselves back to their pre-surgical weight. It is entirely possible to do. If the person has issues with food, they are going to eat. Just saying "surgery will fix it" is being naive. Once the surgery is done, the person's entire relationship with food has to change.

I agree I do know a few people who did GB and Lapband. All were successful. Like any diet you do need to use self control and nothing is a quick fix. But it does take disipline.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:45:18 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I have two friends who did the stomach stapling back in the early 90's, and they ate themselves back to their pre-surgical weight. It is entirely possible to do. If the person has issues with food, they are going to eat. Just saying "surgery will fix it" is being naive. Once the surgery is done, the person's entire relationship with food has to change.

this is a classic example of why i think GP is a quick fix for a long term issue that will not be going away after the surgery.
It is a compulsion that makes most overeat to the point they have over 100 pounds to lose. So...after the surgery the appetite is gone...the compulsion stays and will eventually take over.

And before i am flamed...i totally agree that GP sx can be a life saver for those suffering with the effects of obesity, but there needs to be counseling that goes with it.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:45:34 AM

faerytattoodgirl

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quote:

isnt' everyone who needs to lose weight, whether they need to lose 10 to 100 lbs, guilty of a self control issue?

NEVER deny your CRAVINGS.... mmm.... it might not be good for you..but you'll feel much more full after eating what you crave...

so if you want a pizza...go get a slice....if you need chocolate...go get it....chips...nachos...ice cream...etc.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 10:46:50 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

Well right now I don't eat much at all over a course of a day, maybe like one meal an that;s it for 24 hour period, But I've been told I can do that because I've jacked my body up by doing that and my body has now learned to get by with and not even recognize hunger

Unfortunately that's a pretty good recipe for making your body desperately hold on to all those calories since it is metabolically being set to "famine mode" to conserve energy in a time of food scarcity. If you intake small amounts spread out over that same 24 hours, 5 or 6 small meals instead of one large one or even three large ones, different hormones kick in that encourage burning calories instead of storing them as fat.

Impaired appetite is one of the external signs that your body has made the adjustment to "famine mode" due to your way of eating. And that may seem like a good way to lose weight. But what's happening to your metabolism is the absolute reverse; you are not just teaching your body to want less food, but you're biochemically setting it up to store as many calories as possible for long term survival, as fat, and to partition any losses that do occur to muscle tissue rather than life saving fat. Optimal for survival in a famine period, as our species has evolved to adapt, but not at all optimal for conscious dieters in the modern world.

< Message edited by Najakcharmer -- 7/31/2008 10:50:12 AM >

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 11:01:08 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

As far as I understand gastric bypass only cuts your stomach to a tiny little pouch so you can't eat very much, So if it's all about not eating very much, why can't you do that with out the surgury. I guess aside from not feeling full from normal size stomach and eating tiny amounts.

The old version of this surgery (Vertical Banded Gastroplasty) and the current Lap Band surgery are just ways of making the stomach smaller.

The most effective weight surgery, though, is called 'duodenal switch', and includes making a smaller stomach pouch, but also actually redirects food entering the intestines, so that it skips all but about a foot of the small intestine, which is the major absorptive portion of the intestines. The major risk with this surgery, beyond the operative time and recovery, is that so much of the small intestine is bypassed that there are risks of severe (even deadly) nutritional deficiencies.

The next most effective version of the surgery (and one that doesn't have the dangers of malnutrition that come with the duodenal switch) is the gastric bypass. This surgery makes a small pouch in the stomach, and separates the remaining stomach completely. Then, the stomach is separated from the intestines above the duodenum, and attached further down the small intestine, but it leaves several feet of small intestine, so there is a much lower risk of absorptive issues and nutritional deficiencies.

Being fat (fat enough to get one of these surgeries) may become a vicious cycle for some people -- especially people entering middle age. Because they are very large, it is difficult to exercise without damaging themselves. Without more exercise, they can't get their metabolism up high enough to lose weight, or they damage themselves trying to exercise. Damage causes them to be able to exercise less, so their weight increases OR dieting without exercising slows their metabolism even more, so they end up needing to eat less to maintain their current weight, and eating their normal amount causes them to actually gain even more weight.

The trick is not to get on the treadmill of starving oneself to lose weight in the first place -- but unfortunately, 2-3 generations have been given crappy advice already, so slowing the freight train down until people get the message is going to result in a lot more people doing stupid stuff to try to contain their weight.

CFB

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 11:05:07 AM

CallaFirestormBW

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirsholly

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHibiscus

I have two friends who did the stomach stapling back in the early 90's, and they ate themselves back to their pre-surgical weight. It is entirely possible to do. If the person has issues with food, they are going to eat. Just saying "surgery will fix it" is being naive. Once the surgery is done, the person's entire relationship with food has to change.

this is a classic example of why i think GP is a quick fix for a long term issue that will not be going away after the surgery.
It is a compulsion that makes most overeat to the point they have over 100 pounds to lose. So...after the surgery the appetite is gone...the compulsion stays and will eventually take over.

And before i am flamed...i totally agree that GP sx can be a life saver for those suffering with the effects of obesity, but there needs to be counseling that goes with it.

The surgery done in the early 90s isn't the same surgery being done today (Vertical banded gastroplasty, vs. Roux en Y Gastric Bypass or RGB). That being said, most places that do the surgery now also require visits with their psychologist and a licensed nutritionist as part of the long-term follow-up for the surgery.

CFB

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 12:27:49 PM

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"The surgery done in the early 90s isn't the same surgery being done today (Vertical banded gastroplasty, vs. Roux en Y Gastric Bypass or RGB). That being said, most places that do the surgery now also require visits with their psychologist and a licensed nutritionist as part of the long-term follow-up for the surgery. "

Thank you for pointing this out CFB. Almost all surgeons who do these procedures require these visits PRIOR to the patient even being approved to have the surgery done. Also, most insurance companies are even stricter than the surgeons. Very, VERY few people pay for these procedures out of pocket (they cost upwards of 20K and that is if there are no complications or any need for a longer hospital stay), and insurance companies are famous for digging their heels in and dragging their feet about approving people. You have to be closely followed by a doctor, usually by a dietician, and have a detailed history that chronicals your struggle with obesisty.

And for the record, bariatric surgery is NOT a 'quick fix' and it's most certainly not the 'easy way out' - ask any banding patient who has suffered a gastric erosion or any byspass patient who has suffered from a leak (that is if that person is still even alive).

Once again, I repeat and emphasize, the success of these surgeries is 100% dependent upon the patient working through their own issues and being totally committed to reshaping their relationship with food. This surgery is a TOOL to help control the addiction. It is not a cure.

*edited for emphasis*

< Message edited by porcelain26 -- 7/31/2008 12:30:37 PM >

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 6:13:18 PM

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quote:

The same reason that heroin addicts don't usually quit cold turkey or alcoholics have a problem staying on the wagon. It's an addiction.

What he said.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 6:45:48 PM

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i am going to try and answer the questions and comments on this thread as calmmly and rationally as possible.

MistressPav,
Calories in needing to be lower than calories out is great in theory. However, the reality of the situation is it's not that simple in real life.
To say it angers me when people assume because i'm over-weight that i must have some addiction to food, must have no self will, or any of the other mundane bullshit armchair psychologist reasons would be a mild understatement.
Here's my reality in this lovely little hateful and judgemental world of ours...
My 'dad' used to tell me everyday on a daily basis how fat, ugly, stupid, and repulsive looking i was. After 19 or so years, yeah, it's pretty difficult to deny. 13 years ago i had my thyroid surgically removed. At the wonderful decisions of the lovely medical professionals i was seeing at that time, i gained about 165 pounds because no one thought to put me on any replacement medication. That combined with my ill-held belief that i was fat, ugly, stupid, repulsive looking made me so deathly afraid of food it was not funny. My personal 'best' for going without food is 3 weeks and 2 days. i no longer say that with such pride......
A couple of things that have happened for me recently...
About 5 months ago or so i was at my mom's house and i was going through these pictures of me growing up...i was really startled and confused....Actually, i was so confused i left all of them there.. 2 months ago i finally decided to ask my sister about those pictures... i started out by saying something about how i was 'fat when we were growing up'. She stopped me and said, "WHAT are you talking about?" i explained to her my belief. Then she asked me about this picture we had taken for my mom one Christmas when i was 14. She said, do you not remember how thin you looked in that picture? My response to her (which made perfect logical sense up until the point when it came out of my mouth) was, well yeah, but i figured they did some kind of trick with the camera!!??
Where i'm at now with this is: Some days i literally have to force myself to eat 3 times a day...Some days i must have Him help me become motivated to do it. Most days i believe i am still (and am always going to be) fat, ugly, and repulsive looking.......
By the way, i do work out every morning.
Kali

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 6:51:07 PM

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What's up with kinkster websites, can't people just control desire to communicate?

What's up with psychotherapy, can't people just control thinking and mood?

What's up with plaid pants, can't people just control sartorial expression?

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 7:14:54 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: christine1

lol divi. ok yhma...you do seem a bit negative for someone who is trying to lose weight. it just seems a bit odd to me that you're criticisizing those who need the surgery because of self control. isnt' everyone who needs to lose weight, whether they need to lose 10 to 100 lbs, guilty of a self control issue? i'm counting myself in that group by the way, i have a bit of weight to lose myself.

Thank goodness you posted again, christine - and divi, too. I was thinking I was going to have a stroke here, reading all the negative stuff the OP was writing. I mean geez.....

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 7:31:34 PM

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I was just appalled to find that my dear friend had gained so much weight back! She had that surgery before all the modern modifications, for whatever they are worth, but now she is back to something near 400 pounds, and suffers terribly from arthritis that is made worse by her size. She eats to feel better, evidently, and as a clinically depressed person, I can understand going for whatever works.

I have no idea what I can do to help her. She did that Seattle Sutton thing, and did well on it, but it IS expensive and inconvenient. When we go out, she does eat more than me---one thing I notice with my obese friends is that they rarely leave anything on their plates---but it's the other eating that nails her. I guess if there is food in the house, she eats it, hungry or not. This is just a radically different way of thinking and living, and I can't leap in there with advice, all I can do is be supportive and encouraging.

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 7:38:23 PM

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Well, exorcising only works when the cause of your obesity is a demon.

quote:

ORIGINAL: YourhandMyAss

What's wrong with eating right and exorcising?

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RE: what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't peop... - 7/31/2008 7:45:01 PM

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what's up with gastric bypass surguries, can't people just control eating an exorcise

What's up with bad spelling, can't people just control their use of Spellcheck and buy a dickshunairy?

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