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RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 7:48:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

Is there such intelligence?...if so i really consider it the higher ground as it's a mind-fuck of a mind-fuck if that's the game........

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 7:51:05 AM

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

Is there such intelligence?...if so i really consider it the higher ground as it's a mind-fuck of a mind-fuck if that's the game........

Sociopaths are often drawn to this as a way to get thier needs met.

On either side of the slash.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 7:52:33 AM

Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

Does not a collar represent the same magnitude? Or could it ?

It could, and for many it certainly does. The point I want to make is that it is important for people to communicate what they want it to mean to THEM.

Let's make some examples, vanilla and M/s. .........

blimey somebody should give you a Hollywood scriptwriter's job. Too sad but too true...rareity makes any commodity priceless......

I shall refer the people that read what I write, for that potential, to you. I've yet to see any fruit ($$) from my labours. As for here, what I type is only based upon my observance of human behaviour and basic common sense. My biggest challenge here is to try and word my thoughts in a manner that is less offensive to those with a more sensitive nature than my own, and more helpful rather than hurtful.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 7:59:45 AM

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Joined: 8/27/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Usually the sub ends up whining and begging for the "collar" thinking it means a commitment-and she won't get tossed out if she has one. Then thinks she has the Dom all sewn up-like a spider that has the bug wrapped for dinner.

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

If he does than he proves himself no better than her. Wouldn't it make more sense to walk away? Why would a dominant of any integrity take the lead from a submissive like that.

Because neither has any. They simply expect the other to.

But it's like who has the integrity anyway? Who is the keyholder? What is integrity if it isn't learned within the dynamic? Again: show me the person that has a default to integrity? In some people's eyes i have integrity. In some people's eyes i am a needy whiny needy drama queen. So whose right?
i didn't come with an in-built sense of integrity and i admit to sensing the lack of it it more readily in others than myself. But with regard to most things i self-analyse and retrospect and fragment even the flashbacks to re-capture what, when and where the communication process went wrong.
But a sudden and unprecedented drop of any kind, a broken promise, a change of heart, call it what you will.....if it means the physical bonds, or the metaphysical bonds just suddenly snap.....well wherein lays the integrity?
It's learned long and hard.....?

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:03:54 AM

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Joined: 12/11/2007
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Shrugs,when you come with a dynamic where the objectification of the "pleasure toy" comes as a pre loaded expectation-what do you expect when it turns out to be a lemon?

Most men into that will just look for another toy. Talking shit about being on the up and up is just part of the game.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:04:27 AM

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

Is there such intelligence?...if so i really consider it the higher ground as it's a mind-fuck of a mind-fuck if that's the game........

Sociopaths are often drawn to this as a way to get thier needs met.

On either side of the slash.

I'm not understanding sociopathic yet....not from within at least. and i am NOT repeat not saying you are a sociopath merely because you just seemed to write up what the core of sociopathology is. Could you say it another way perhaps? Just fascinated to understanf how sociopathy works its way into a bdsm dynamic or any other dynamic come to think of it from a play on power.......

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:12:12 AM

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
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Think of selfishness-and it's only conscience is the challenge of seeing what it can get away with.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:14:36 AM

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Joined: 12/11/2007
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And in that context-think of the collar as the carrot dangled before the mule.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:22:04 AM

Posts: 589
Joined: 11/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Usually the sub ends up whining and begging for the "collar" thinking it means a commitment-and she won't get tossed out if she has one. Then thinks she has the Dom all sewn up-like a spider that has the bug wrapped for dinner.

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

If he does than he proves himself no better than her. Wouldn't it make more sense to walk away? Why would a dominant of any integrity take the lead from a submissive like that.

Because neither has any. They simply expect the other to.

But it's like who has the integrity anyway? Who is the keyholder? What is integrity if it isn't learned within the dynamic? Again: show me the person that has a default to integrity? In some people's eyes i have integrity. In some people's eyes i am a needy whiny needy drama queen. So whose right?
i didn't come with an in-built sense of integrity and i admit to sensing the lack of it it more readily in others than myself. But with regard to most things i self-analyse and retrospect and fragment even the flashbacks to re-capture what, when and where the communication process went wrong.
But a sudden and unprecedented drop of any kind, a broken promise, a change of heart, call it what you will.....if it means the physical bonds, or the metaphysical bonds just suddenly snap.....well wherein lays the integrity?
It's learned long and hard.....?

I might be missing your point but
Whether or not I have integrity is not because you or anyone else (including myself) says I do or do not. I possess it because of my actions and reactions. Other peoples experience of ME might disagree but that is their perspective not mine. I am a person of integrity because I know I am, feel I am and my actions that have supported that is time tested and shown to be true.....according to my perception of me and what makes me proud of myself . And at the end of the day that is what matters to me and in my life. I cannot account, nor am responsible, for other peoples tastes or requirements/definition of "integrity" .

If I am allowing someone elses "lack of" to alter the way I uphold mine ...than it is ME I need to focus the responsiblity on and not the other person. I cannot make them something they are not....or given them title/definition/ or a sense of responsiblity/loyalty/integrity/honesty/character that they do not already possess within themselves..
BUT
I can do something about whether or not I allow them to effect MINE.

_____________________________

galilah

.."There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. " Edith Wharton

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:25:06 AM

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Joined: 12/11/2007
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In other words-you get what you put up with.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to TysGalilah)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:29:10 AM

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Joined: 6/19/2006
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i don't think shes implying that i think shes saying you stick to your own and don't follw suit or let others lack of integrity - how you see it - affect you.

_____________________________

Religion is for people who are scared of hell, Spirituality is for people who have been there

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:32:05 AM

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

i don't think shes implying that i think shes saying you stick to your own and don't follw suit or let others lack of integrity - how you see it - affect you.

Or you act like an adult and dump the creep.

_____________________________

My shop is currently segueing into production mode.

I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to velvetears)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:34:45 AM

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
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In the end, like it or not, we are all responsible for our own actions.

Jeff

(in reply to Leatherist)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:35:35 AM

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Joined: 5/10/2007
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... and the consequences of those actions.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to Jeffff)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:39:30 AM

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: TysGalilah

quote:

ORIGINAL: Prinsexx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

Usually the sub ends up whining and begging for the "collar" thinking it means a commitment-and she won't get tossed out if she has one. Then thinks she has the Dom all sewn up-like a spider that has the bug wrapped for dinner.

Imagine her surpise when it doesnt mean the same thing to him that it did to her-and he was just using her own manipulation against her.

If he does than he proves himself no better than her. Wouldn't it make more sense to walk away?   Why would a dominant of any integrity take the lead from a submissive like that.

Because neither has any. They simply expect the other to.

But it's like who has the integrity anyway? Who is the keyholder? What is integrity if it isn't learned within the dynamic? Again: show me the person that has a default to integrity? In some people's eyes i have integrity. In some people's eyes i am a needy whiny needy drama queen. So whose right?
i didn't come with an in-built sense of integrity and i admit to sensing the lack of it it more readily in others than myself. But with regard to most things i self-analyse and retrospect and fragment even the flashbacks to re-capture what, when and where the communication process went wrong.
But a sudden and unprecedented drop of any kind, a broken promise, a change of heart, call it what you will.....if it means the physical bonds, or the metaphysical bonds just suddenly snap.....well wherein lays the integrity?
It's learned long and hard.....?

I might be missing your point but
  Whether or not I have integrity is not because you or anyone else (including myself) says I do or do not.   I possess it because of my actions and reactions. Other peoples experience of ME might disagree but that is their perspective not mine. I am a person of integrity because I know I am, feel I am and my actions that have supported that is time tested and shown to be true.....according to my perception of me and what makes me proud of myself .   And at the end of the day that is what matters to me and in my life. I cannot account, nor am responsible, for other peoples tastes or requirements/definition of "integrity" .

If I am allowing someone elses "lack of" to alter the way I uphold mine ...than it is ME I need to focus the responsiblity on and not the other person.   I cannot make them something they are not....or given them title/definition/ or a sense of responsiblity/loyalty/integrity/honesty/character that they do not already possess within themselves..
BUT
I can do something about whether or not I allow them to effect MINE.

Tysgalilah
You never miss the point; you always hit the nail right on the head.

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to TysGalilah)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:41:26 AM

Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline

quote:

.. and the consequences of those actions.

I agree. And this is why it irks me when people talk about a "slave mindset" as if the slave has no sense to deal with reality and her decision-making. It's a weak excuse for being unable to act like an adult. I don't buy it.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to Prinsexx)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:46:20 AM

Posts: 4584
Joined: 8/27/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffff

In the end, like it or not, we are all responsible for our own actions.

Jeff

i'm not wanting to be contentious here but NO, by definition in law (at the end of the day) some folks are not deemed responsible for their own actions. Be it by some permanent state of mental disease, or temporary or permanent psychosis....and i am sure any legal persons here can conjer up more examples.....there are those who in law who are not held responsibile for their actions. It's how long they can get away with it wherein lays the damage. If built into the system there is a total lack of compassion, and in its place there is simply the pathology, i am pretty certain many get away with doing damage and serious damage for a very long time. Compartmentalised liars adept at saying exactly the perfect right thing to get what they want from each and every person they interact with. Triangulate them and call them on it and that's when they seriously fire up the embers of their own lack of responsibility.

_____________________________

Owner of asterion

Metawhore.... the sound of a metaphore when gagged
Free woman
Resident thread finisher
To my stalker:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LN2lP_7J7GI&feature=fvwrel

(in reply to Jeffff)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:48:54 AM

Posts: 506
Joined: 2/3/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied

I agree. And this is why it irks me when people talk about a "slave mindset" as if the slave has no sense to deal with reality and her decision-making. It's a weak excuse for being unable to act like an adult. I don't buy it.

Katy,
I'll say it again, and I've said it before: Your rational and responsible approach to life is truly bizarre! ;o)

_____________________________

A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way
Mark Twain

(in reply to KatyLied)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:51:11 AM

Posts: 589
Joined: 11/21/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: velvetears

i don't think shes implying that i think shes saying you stick to your own and don't follw suit or let others lack of integrity - how you see it - affect you.

nodding yes Velvet
affect you and/or effect your reaction towards someone elses actions.

When I am showing my own personal integrity is
when I am healthy enough ( emotionally ) to define my emotions, express my feelings , say what I think and feel BUT I do not let my emotions define me.

I may not always been in control of how I internalize my reactions to someone elses actions..sometimes others crap just freekin sucks and hurts my feelings yanno? .......But I am in control of how I choose to react to it.
I can rise above it..or I can roll around in the muk and mire some people create around them or leave behind them ....

but Leatherist...I also do beleive we teach people how to treat us..... Which, I guess, is another way of saying ' you get what you put up with'

I accept that I will attract back to me the same kind of energy that I put out there.

_____________________________

galilah

.."There are two ways of spreading light: to be the candle or the mirror that reflects it. " Edith Wharton

(in reply to velvetears)

RE: in it for what they can get out of it and out of it... - 8/10/2008 8:52:12 AM

Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline

I am assuming a basic level of intelligence. Given that, there is no absolution. I will stand by that statement.

Jeff

(in reply to Prinsexx)

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