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RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:21:34 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Joenextdoor
I don't know where to draw the line at where the 2nd amendment stops, but banning a semi automatic rifle because you dont like the name or the way it looks is where I personally draw the line.


So, can I have one of those great big massive tanks thrown in as well, please? I'm sick of pushy SUV drivers :-) .

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Profile   Post #: 41
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:21:35 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		It really doesn't matter due to the intent of the amendment, which was to allow private citizens to be adequately armed to stand up to their own government.  Care should be taken in the decision to own such weapons and how one uses them, but putting legalities on it negates the purpose of having such a liberty.  The government cannot, logically, exert control over something that was designed to be a safeguard against said government.

I think many gunowners have no business owning and bb gun much less automatic weapons and such, but the better solution is education and awareness than legislation which restricts a constitutional right.

lovingpet   

(in reply to AlwaysLisa)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:23:57 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

due to the intent of the amendment


Fortunately, the country is full of mind readers---especially the minds of dead people.

(in reply to lovingpet)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:24:59 PM   
Joenextdoor


Posts: 145
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		Well, back when the founding fathers drafted it, it is true that people had muzzle loaders, but so did the government.  They gave us the right to have firearms so as to be a check on government.  Today, the government has more powerful rifles, and we have more powerful guns as well, albeit, semi auto versions.

(in reply to lovingpet)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:25:17 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		No, it is as simple as looking at the historical context and reviewing the other writings of those who penned the document.

lovingpet

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:26:20 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joenextdoor

Right.  semi autos have two positions, safe and fire, with fire being semi-auto.  Guns like the military use, have three positions...safe, semi, and full auto.


Yep, and experience of those things is the reason why I don't want a gun, in fact, I hate the bloody things. I can use them, strip, clean and assemble in the field, but that experience taught me the almost phallic fascination for guns just perpetuates the problems involving guns. Where would we be, if private citizens did not have guns, would we be better off or worse off ?


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Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to Joenextdoor)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:26:21 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline 		Hence the complete lack of controversy.

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Profile   Post #: 47
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:26:37 PM   
AlwaysLisa


Posts: 1088
Joined: 10/6/2006
From: Washington State
Status: offline 		Wow.   I don't know where you live, but the deer must be positively frightening. 



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Profile   Post #: 48
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:28:53 PM   
Joenextdoor


Posts: 145
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		  The Supreme Court took care of the mind reading for us with the Heller case.  Its why DC's handgun ban has to go.  The second amendment is an individual right, hence the feeling that now the left will seek to do with taxes, what they have been able to do with legislation or the courts.

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Profile   Post #: 49
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:31:26 PM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: AlwaysLisa
Wow.   I don't know where you live, but the deer must be positively frightening. 


And this type of answer is exactly what makes gun threads so frustrating. How do you try to intelligently debate such a comment?

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~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

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"I did it! I admit it and I'm gonna do it again!"

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Profile   Post #: 50
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:32:00 PM   
SilverMark


Posts: 3457
Joined: 5/9/2007
Status: offline 		Never quite understood the fascination myself but, have friends who are really into shooting and they are all VERY responsible owners. They tease me because the few times I tried to shoot I wasn't very good, and I take their money and laugh at them on the golf course. I guess I am protected as long as I have a driver and the bad guy is 300 yards away.

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:32:41 PM   
Joenextdoor


Posts: 145
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		Well, in the case of Great Britain and Australia, they are worse off.  The law abiding citizens, or subjects, dutifully turned in their guns, and now only the criminals and the cops have them.  I do know that crime rose afterwards in those countries in general.  Guns crime is still a problem, surprise surprise.  The only difference now is that law abiding people do not have the means to protect themselves.

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:32:46 PM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

How do you try to intelligently debate such a comment?


Begin with intelligent comments?

Just guessing here.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:32:52 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kittinSol

quote:

ORIGINAL: Joenextdoor
I don't know where to draw the line at where the 2nd amendment stops, but banning a semi automatic rifle because you dont like the name or the way it looks is where I personally draw the line.

So, can I have one of those great big massive tanks thrown in as well, please? I'm sick of pushy SUV drivers :-) .



Shawn Nelson had one of those ;

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6TIun536HFo





< Message edited by Aneirin -- 11/11/2008 6:34:09 PM >

_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to kittinSol)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:33:26 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		The controversy stems from a pathetically undernourished general public.  Some think own guns is their right because they are pretty and shiny.  Some think those mean things are only used for killing poor innocent children while they jump rope in the yard and should be banned without a thought to any other issue. 

Of course this is only my view, but I am entitled to it.  I have studied long and hard in the area of social and political uprisings, including our own.  I am not unaware of the longer view on the matter.  Controversy arises in two basic forms:  ignorance (on both sides) or different interpretations of world events and historical records.  It has nothing to do with claravoyence.

lovingpet 

(in reply to AlwaysLisa)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:34:35 PM   
Joenextdoor


Posts: 145
Joined: 9/8/2004
Status: offline 		No, you just ignore those posts, as they aren't worth your time.

(in reply to mistoferin)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:34:51 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline 		Back to seriousness  . Two things:

1. Obama has never indicated he would take away anybody's gun, so everybody calm down and get those rifles back in the vaults where they belong: he ain't takin' them away anytime soon.

2. If people have been indulging in a little bout of gun buying recently, I have an inkling that it has nothing to do with our future new president, and rather that it is due to growing social insecurity, thanks to the financial fuckup that is affecting everybody. In short: when people get paranoid, they get frightened, and so, naturally... they hop to the gun shop.

3. Only in America...

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Profile   Post #: 57
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:35:21 PM   
ThatDaveGuy69


Posts: 978
Joined: 6/22/2007
Status: offline 		Guns sales tend to rise whenever the economy falters.  Granted, there may be a few more nutball survivalists crawling out of the brush due the president elect being a (gasp!) black man.  This is old news. 

~Dave


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He said I'd blown a seal. I said fix the damn thing and leave my private life out of this!
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I have zero tolerance for Zero Tolerance

(in reply to Joenextdoor)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:38:57 PM   
lovingpet


Posts: 4270
Joined: 6/19/2005
Status: offline 		It really doesn't matter why the folks are running to the gun shop.  What matters is how we choose to react to it.

lovingpet

(in reply to ThatDaveGuy69)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: Gun Sales Up Since Obama Election Victory - 11/11/2008 6:41:07 PM   
kittinSol


Posts: 16926
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: lovingpet
What matters is how we choose to react to it.


Do you mean we have a choice in how we react to it?!

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Profile   Post #: 60
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