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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:32:10 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lockit

Those same business's are payig taxes of which you admit abusing... oh sorry... taking advantage of. You claim it is greed and because you can. Nice. Well I am sure some handicapped who pay taxes like to go out and use bathrooms and spend money just as most people do. You prove my points even more with everything you say... keep talking.

first off, you can call it abusing if you wish. it's not going to bother me.

but you are missing the point. I'm only abusing a system which is abusing me. I'm forced to buy into public education so I'm going to get as much out of it as I can. I am not, however, forced to buy into American Airlines, so I can't really have the same 'you fucked me over first' motivations for my actions. American Airlines hasn't done anything to me, so I'm not going to try and abuse their system. but also, the handicapped's tax money doesn't go into the reconstruction of private places of business. so they also can't claim the 'you fucked me over first' motivations.

quote:

Oh... and I would not wish harm upon anyone... but maybe when you are older, you will see a different world from which you view things now and you better pray you are not limited by your own just world of me... me... user me... because darlin if you ever have an accident or get sick, you might be greedy for a lil potty break in a place that didn't have to give access. Where oh where would your youthful pride be then?

I didn't really understand the first few sentences, but I think I got what you were trying to say. My youthful pride will be where it is. if I were in that situation, I may bitch and complain, but I'm an objective enough thinker to understand that trying to force people to do things they don't want to do (such as accomodate my wishes for a bigger bathroom) is still qutie illegitimate.

my opinions don't float around in the wind...I don't support whatever happens to be in my favour at a particular moment in time.

< Message edited by variation30 -- 11/23/2008 1:55:22 AM >

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:38:27 AM

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What, no smooches for me?:P

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:40:16 AM

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ROFL...

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:41:34 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

I then went back to alabama and currently reside at the university of alabama

*Hex sign* - Ok people, not *everyone* who went to UA is like this....

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:42:11 AM

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Smooches moonvine... lol Next time don't come late to the party... or leave early... (smile)

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:46:53 AM

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I had to feed the cats..they took precedence over an argument...not over smooches though!

(in reply to Lockit)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:51:22 AM

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quote:

I wouldn't mandate that such information to be required (do you really think I haven't stumbled upon such simplistic observations?). however, good companies who want to reassure their customers could release that information on their own.

And without any regulations insuring that such infomation is accurate, again... how would you know? Because "good companies" won't lie to their customers to save a buck? LMAO. I'll ask again about the local eateries. Do you do inspections before eating at each one? Trust them to tell you the truth? Or look for the health rating posted near the door?

quote:

Ah yes, this is obviously and argument held out of my youthful inexperience...

Q.E.D. Your "crowbar" post in response to Lockit says it all.

On topic, lest I get modspanked- I'm not a small person by any means, being nearly 6 feet tall and a bit under 200lbs (decently proportioned). I do not need more than one seat... although my opinion on that might be different if you asked me right after a 16 hour flight to Australia a couple of years ago, but it is a near thing as most airline seats are certainly tiny in coach. That said, I will happily pay a few dollars more per flight if it means that I won't be squished up against someone else who is even more uncomfortable than I am.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:51:23 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

That's how we remain in a civil society.

I wouldn't call a society who remained civil only through coercion and aggression very civil...

quote:

Laws are in place so that members of society can all enjoy opportunities for work, recreation, shopping, etc.

I'm confused, why should all members of society enjoy equal opportunities for work, recreation, shopping, etc. I've never taken well to the litany of egalitarianism...

Rothbard has an excellent quote on the subject which I feel is somewhat relevent since you are making a plea to your subjective notion of 'fairness'.

"The diversity of mankind is a basic postulate of our knowledge of human beings. But if mankind is diverse and individuated, then how can anyone propose equality as an ideal? Every year, scholars hold Conferences on Equality and call for greater equality, and no one challenges the basic tenet. But what justification can equality find in the nature of man? If each individual is unique, how else can he be made 'equal' to others than by destroying most of what is human in him and reducing human society to the mindless uniformity of the ant heap?"

To create absolute equality, you're going to have to knock everyone on the right side of the bellcurve down a few notches. taken to it's ends, you'd have the wonderful world of harrison bergeron. to be perfectly honest, people don't deserve equal 'opportunities' because people aren't equal. The Mozart's, the Szasz's, the Mises', the Sagan's, the Rockefeller's, the Rostropovich's, and the Cummings' of the world put out products and ideas that are unquantifiably more impressive than anything I could produce. they deserve more. likewise, any individual who produces something deserves more than the lumpenproletariate. I dont' see why we should have rights to education, healthcare, maseratis, foie gras, or two seats on an air plane just because we are a human.

quote:

I don't want to live in a society that forces people to stay out of movie theaters and restaurants and certain buildings, just because businesses won't put up a ramp (hey, isn't keeping people out of those places forcing people to do something they don't want to do?). Try living your life in a wheelchair for awhile, and see if your perspective changes. Otherwise, maybe being forced to stay home is OK with you, since you wouldn't be able to get around very much.

I find this quite funny. you don't want to live in a society where people are forced to stay out of movie theaters and restaurants because they dont' want to build a ramp...but you are more than happy to live in a society where people are forced to build ramps, larger bathrooms, regulate smoking, etc. on their private property.

*sigh*

and no, keeping people out of those places is not forcing people to do something they want to do. what a silly argument. denying someone a trade or transaction is not the same forcing someone to commit an action. if you can't figure out why, I'd be more than happy to hold your hand through the argument.

you know what, if I lived in a wheelchair, I wouldn't have a different perspective. sorry.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:53:40 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BbwCanaDomme

really? Everyone I know who uses the arguments you use are all about objectivism. Which is weird because I always thought that was about knowing yourself but they're all completely delusional.

dont' take this the wrong way, but people who don't know much about my position often confuse me for a Randite. I actually just got done saying something similar.

though I agree with Rand much more than I agree with keynes or krugman or friedman...I'm not an objectivist (though I get along with them better than I do most people). I'm curious as to how these people are delusional?

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all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:55:51 AM

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From: Alabama
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quote:

ORIGINAL: moonvine

*Hex sign* - Ok people, not *everyone* who went to UA is like this....

that's very true.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 1:57:55 AM

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quote:

What, no smooches for me?:P

Negative points for lateness, excused for feeding kittehs...
*Smooch!*

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:00:43 AM

deliciousmorsel

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First- of course the dairy industry is paying to brainwash you about cow milk! The only thing humans need cow milk for is to cook, and to process into other things like yoghurt and ice cream. But farmers are in business to make money, just like airlines.
Second- I'm fat. The Law has no business making a human rights issue out of a private industry service like airline flights. In Canada there's great train service- take that. If I HAVE to fly and need two seats, well I guess I pay per pound.

And yes the airlines are squeezing more tinier seats into planes. It's miserable. We need good train service in the US, because it can be electric, therefore green (jets are carbon monsters) and I could get a decent size seat. We all could. Even as a skinny woman 5 years ago planes were awful.

I grow corn and sugar cane. Know some science on each from being an athlete before pharmaceuticals plumped me up. And being in the biz... Corn sweeteners are disastrous. Cow milk is not fit for humans to consume at the rates the dairy industry wants us to force it on our kids. Eat yogurt, it's been processed into something else by bacteria digesting it. A tiny bit of real sugar- TINY- is the best way to go. And our big fat people problem is about no exercise.
Every fat person I know won't move their asses. Half of them were thin, but had car wrecks. I'd like to see stats on a shift to a fat populace compared with wrecks from cell phones and big SUVs that crush cars up. Bicycle commuting hit a wall at that time, mid 1990's, that the SUV/ cell thing really got out of hand.
My big butt isn't moving either. Post Katrina I'm stuck in a city with no sidewalks at all! What the hell? No sidewalks, no bike safe roads or parks, no gyms even. And officially the most obese city in America. I hate it here! Such modern American idiocy.

Back to flying- yeah fat people should pay for both seats. Get your huge butt into a pool and start back to fitness and that will change your metabolism to wanting those veggies. Any body still eating toxic fast food is just slow suiciding. Been there, have the T shirt, stop whining and go to the YMCA. Best aqua programs.

(in reply to variation30)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:03:09 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: variation30

quote:

ORIGINAL: BbwCanaDomme

really? Everyone I know who uses the arguments you use are all about objectivism. Which is weird because I always thought that was about knowing yourself but they're all completely delusional.

dont' take this the wrong way, but people who don't know much about my position often confuse me for a Randite. I actually just got done saying something similar.

though I agree with Rand much more than I agree with keynes or krugman or friedman...I'm not an objectivist (though I get along with them better than I do most people). I'm curious as to how these people are delusional?

They tend to be the ones who talk about how other people/the system are broken, when in reality they're just socially retarded. Generally very intelligent, but socially retarded. They can't function in regular society, so they project. They never realize that they might be the problem. Also, delusionals of grandeur are popular with them, they're always the first to talk about how they're smarter/more attractive/faster/funnier than the general population. They have ridiculous expectations when it comes to relationships (and that's not coming from a place of bitterness, I have turned down many a randite haha). They feel entitled to things, while complaining about how people they don't feel are entitled are taking things that should rightfully belong to them (scholarships/grants/women/etc).

I have no idea if that made sense. I think I need to go to bed, I'll check this out in the morning.

(in reply to variation30)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:03:09 AM

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From: Alabama
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

And without any regulations insuring that such infomation is accurate, again... how would you know? Because "good companies" won't lie to their customers to save a buck? LMAO. I'll ask again about the local eateries. Do you do inspections before eating at each one? Trust them to tell you the truth? Or look for the health rating posted near the door?

I wouldn't know the information is accurate just as I don't know the information on the little health scoresheet I see on the counter is accurate. I've worked in foodservice before and I know that when the time window for health inspections is over...things go downhill. and no, I won't inspect each resaurant before I eat there. I also don't really care about the health rating on the door either. I also do not feel much safer because the government health inspector has given the kitchen a glance. people who work for the government usually do so because they aren't good enough to work in the private sector...so I'm not trusting these industrious individuals with catching too many details.

quote:

Q.E.D. Your "crowbar" post in response to Lockit says it all.

I'm curious, at what age does making fun arguments become outdated? perhaps I should increase my tobacco intake to ensure I never hit that mark.

but if you really would prefer, I could give you an aprioristic argument for natural rights, self-ownership, acquiring property, and self-defense.

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all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:05:05 AM

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quote:

but you are missing the point. I'm only abusing a system which is abusing me. I'm forced to buy into public education so I'm going to get as much out of it as I can.

... and HOW is this exactly??? You were "forced" to go to high school for free because you couldn't/didn't want to pay for private school, and for whatever reason could not be home schooled, boo hoo.
That said, I really don't remember anyone dragging me off to Uni against my will, and I certainly don't remember being forced to choose a public school over a private one, although I did.

How exactly are you being forced to do jack shit here?

_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:10:29 AM

Posts: 1190
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From: Alabama
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BbwCanaDomme

They tend to be the ones who talk about how other people/the system are broken, when in reality they're just socially retarded. Generally very intelligent, but socially retarded. They can't function in regular society, so they project. They never realize that they might be the problem. Also, delusionals of grandeur are popular with them, they're always the first to talk about how they're smarter/more attractive/faster/funnier than the general population. They have ridiculous expectations when it comes to relationships (and that's not coming from a place of bitterness, I have turned down many a randite haha). They feel entitled to things, while complaining about how people they don't feel are entitled are taking things that should rightfully belong to them (scholarships/grants/women/etc).

I have no idea if that made sense. I think I need to go to bed, I'll check this out in the morning.

first off, drop the ad hominem attacks. you may not know this, as it's so popular nowadays, but the impotent attempt to invalidate your friends' opinions by claiming that they are 'socially retarded', 'projecting', or have 'delusions of grandeur' is not an actual argument. it's avoiding an argument and trying to write off someone's beliefs due to behavior that you feel is untoward. this was developed by freud (in his character assassination of Karl Krauss) and this ad hominem has been refined in the past century (it even passes as diagnoses in the larger population). but since we're using this tactic, I'm goign to guess that some of these statements do come from a place of bitterness.

what things do they feel entitled to? if they feel entitled to other people's property, then they are not Randites. if they feel they are entitled to be free from the tresspasses of other individuals, then I'm curious what is so delusional about that? I'm curious as to what is so incorrect about their philosophy and I'll wait for an actual critique in your next post (and not slights on their character and behavior).

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all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:10:38 AM

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quote:

but if you really would prefer, I could give you an aprioristic argument for natural rights, self-ownership, acquiring property, and self-defense.

I'd really rather you didn't, because that would be just too much to resist and *looks at clock- SHIT* I have to be to work in about 6 hours.

_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

Resident "Hypnotic Eyes", "Cleavage" and "Toy Whore"
Subby Mafia, VAA Posse & Team Troll!

(in reply to variation30)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:15:30 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

... and HOW is this exactly??? You were "forced" to go to high school for free because you couldn't/didn't want to pay for private school, and for whatever reason could not be home schooled, boo hoo.
That said, I really don't remember anyone dragging me off to Uni against my will, and I certainly don't remember being forced to choose a public school over a private one, although I did.

How exactly are you being forced to do jack shit here?

well...for starters let me clear up your misconceptions. TANSTAAFL. that is to say, nothing is free. I didn't go to public high school for free, as it cost money. and my parents were forced to pay for that through property taxes/vice taxes. so my parents paid for my education, and every other snot-nosed brat's education as well. every owner of property (even if they don't have children) pay for public schools...it's not free. I was forced because of something called truancy laws. you may want to look them up. and yes, my parents didn't want to send their five year old son to a boarding school. boo hoo.

as far as being 'forced' to go to college, no, I wasn't forced. but my family had been forced to pay for these college's existence (state taxes fund state universities) for almost two decades so I might as well get th eir money out of it. whether or not I went to college, I still would have to pay for it through taxes...so I might as well go and profit as much as possible. what is more, I might as well try and dick them over as hard as I can as well.

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all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

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RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:24:37 AM

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Oh please. I don't have kids, and don't own property. If you think I don't pay for the education of other people's kids through my taxes, you are wrong.
Even leaving aside everything up to high school, you are making excuses which you have already rather vividly illuminated.
I stand by my earlier opinon.

_____________________________

"MotherFUCKER!" is NOT a safeword!!"- Steel
"We've had complaints about 'orgy noises'. This is not the neighborhood for that kind of thing"- PVE Cop

Resident "Hypnotic Eyes", "Cleavage" and "Toy Whore"
Subby Mafia, VAA Posse & Team Troll!

(in reply to variation30)

RE: Obese has right to 2 airline seats- - 11/23/2008 2:27:12 AM

Posts: 1190
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: Alabama
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quote:

ORIGINAL: WyldHrt

Oh please. I don't have kids, and don't own property. If you think I don't pay for the education of other people's kids through my taxes, you are wrong.
Even leaving aside everything up to high school, you are making excuses which you have already rather vividly illuminated.
I stand by my earlier opinon.

I know you pay for education. even if you rent, your cost is going to be affected by how you/your landlord get hit with property taxes. depending on your state (if you're an american) you'll pay for schools through sales taxes and vice taxes and the like.

and what excuses am I making exactly?

_____________________________

all the good ones are collared or lesbians.

or old.

(in reply to WyldHrt)

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