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RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 6:56:51 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

The problem is usually expecting those characteristics without any real reason to do so.

Honor and integrity are alive and well, thank you. However, the education to identify and emulate it is difficult to come by.

I came by my education the hard way. Ethics seems to be something based on money these days, and what you can get away with. It's got little to do with the concept of honor and integrity.

HOWEVER, integrity seems to mean different things between men and women, thus the gender wars. :)

_____________________________

Thou art fertile ground and I will plant a garden in thee.

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 7:53:50 PM

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All I know is the day after I was born, people just started going down hill, Socrates, 380 BC.

Everything was always better "then" and is never as good "now". The reality is, let assholes into your life, your life is going to be full of assholes.

(in reply to scottjk)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 7:55:50 PM

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I'll have to get back to you on that.

(in reply to SimplyMichael)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 7:55:57 PM

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Just a general reply to the thread concerning integrity: dom/ domme , or what ever the case may be, leads into the conversation about trust, about loyalty, about devotion. If you are sub or slave, such things are what we all want, what we all desire and yet betrayal is not something a sub or slave is expecting, then it comes, sure they are interested, but only as an object, property to be used at their convenience, discarded or even dismissed. The sub or slave's heart sinks, their spirit lessens, all that they are or what to become comes into question. Where do they go from where the individual put them, a future shattered, the sub or slave looks in the mirror, tears in their eyes. What now? Who do they trust now? seek the fiction or seek what is real. They think or they believed that something they most wanted was in fact only an illusion. Someone enjoyed themselves. The sub or slave is now standing in front of the mirror trying to pick up the pieces of their heart and spirit because they believed that the dom/domme wanted them. Integrity.....not! Honorable....hell no! worthy of a sub or slaves admiration and respect....never! Do they care...probably not. Pick up the pieces and start over. Has to be a dom/domme out there that sub or slave can believe in.
To have such values is an investment of self, of identity, for the dom/domme and for the sub/slave.
It's not an illusion, it's a lifestyle, a life choice.
Some would use and abuse, discard and dismiss and continue. Sell the illusion, when the illusion loses its glamour, move on.
Is not the values of this thread what should be emulated if not define the relaltionship between dom/domme and their sub/slave?
Or such values only written in novels, dreamed about, written in poetry and verse, reflected upon within music. Is having such values a falsehood?

(in reply to scottjk)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 8:09:10 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rover

quote:

ORIGINAL: leadership527

I figure that about the same percentage of honorable people (not masters, people) exist today as yesterday as 200 years ago as 10,000 years ago. So the real question I think is why are YOU attracting dishonorable people?

Please, chisel this in granite and place it above the doorway to every building in America as a constant reminder to those who need it.

John

Good point!

i certainly believe we attract individuals in our life for a reason - it is certainly worth examining why you are attracting this type OP~

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to Rover)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/21/2008 8:12:52 PM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: GreedyTop

I've not had much problem with finding people who do not have honor, integrity, etc...

maybe I use different screening / vetting procedures, though.

Hey Greedy,

Aside from a variant or two, i agree.

i have met amazing people from here and in the social scene. Perhaps there is truth in the saying "we recieve what we give?"

i also think the search for the One can be taken too seriously...friends are wonderful to have~

_____________________________

It is choice - not chance - that determines our destiny~
Jean Nidetch

There is a war going on for your mind...if you are thinking, you are winning~
Flobots

(in reply to GreedyTop)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 1:01:41 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
If you pick partners without integrity, that says that your judgment in picking partners is no good. You chose this guy. He was who he was from the beginning. Assuming that just because he calls himself a master meant that he would be a knight in shining armor was your fault. Next time see who people are from the beginning, don't ignore red flags, don't magically assume that because he gets you wet he has all those qualities you hoped to find.

If your partner picking skills are this badly flawed, then you need to work on yourself. Why do you ignore the reality of who people are? Why are you delusional when it comes to relationships? Why do you settle for people who obviously aren't what you're looking for?

Remember, the only constant in all your relationships is you.

You know, I'm all for taking responsibility for one's choices, and looking within to figure out who one is, and why one chooses as one does... But I doubt any of us has the exact answer to this age old question of what motivates each individual. And once in a while, it might be just a little less unkind, bit more humane, to not slap someone who is hurting while telling them "it's clearly your fault you were abused, lied to, or beaten, assaulted, etc...

Are most of us here so perfect in judgement? Or do we protect ourselves by being too cynical to ever chance getting hurt, or by carefully treading water hoping the sky never falls on our heards? M

< Message edited by FullfigRIMAAM1 -- 11/22/2008 1:53:41 AM >

_____________________________

The place to improve the world is first in one's own heart and head and hands.-Robert M. Persig

Love is the only sane and satisfactory answer to the problem of human existence Erich Fromm

(in reply to DesFIP)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 1:24:29 AM

susie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

That is like asking someone why they attract alcoholics. Maybe because there are a lot of them out there? Perhaps it is worth examining why you find it necessary to "blame" the person who simply wishes to know why basic qualitites which I value are so lacking here. Period.

You may see them lacking here but I and many others do not. There are plenty of honest people on this site along with other internet sites. Of course there are also a huge pile of idiots, fakes and wannabes too. The trick is finding the one that suits you.
Blaming everyone because you came across someone that was not what you thought they should be is ridiculous.

When I started out I based my search solely on the internet and found a Master full of honour and integrity. I also found a large number of people that have remained online friends. All with the qualities you say are lacking here. So basically nothing happened to honour and integrity, it is alive and kicking in many people here, just not everybody sees it.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 2:15:47 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

in a Master. Maybe someone can explain that to me.

I've found plenty of people with both those qualities, some of them indentifying themselves as masters. There are plenty of losers too. We're all just people at the end of the day, and other than whatever brings us to this scene, you tend to get the same mix you would walking down any street.

I know how after a string of bad encounters one can get into the "they're all assholes" mindset, but judging a diverse group of people based on one commonality is rarely a good idea, and can lead to narrow-minded bigotry similar to that which spawns sexism, racism and the like.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 4:47:00 AM

Ryu

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Honor - 8 a: a keen sense of ethical conduct: integrity <wouldn't do it as a matter of honor> b: one's word given as a guarantee of performance <on my honor, I will be there>

Integrity- 1: firm adherence to a code of especially moral or artistic values

After reading this post I was interested as to the reasons behind what the poster was asking. As a Dom/Husband to my sub/wife we have our own set of rules for both aspects of our lives. I honor her as we have discussed and arranged within these parameters. Do I have my own set rules about honor and integrity, yes I do, as does she. Our standards are complimentary of each other. These standards may not be the same standards of living as yours or anyone else’s for that mater.

Basically each and every individual has a set of ethical standards they live by regardless of how others see them. Tomato - Tamoto. Life is about finding who is compatible with you. Everyone is different.

(in reply to WestBaySlave)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 5:29:25 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WestBaySlave
I've found plenty of people with both those qualities, some of them indentifying themselves as masters. There are plenty of losers too. We're all just people at the end of the day, and other than whatever brings us to this scene, you tend to get the same mix you would walking down any street.

I know how after a string of bad encounters one can get into the "they're all assholes" mindset, but judging a diverse group of people based on one commonality is rarely a good idea, and can lead to narrow-minded bigotry similar to that which spawns sexism, racism and the like.

_____________________________

Not with envy, not with a twisted heart, shall you feel superior, or go about boasting. Rather in goodness by action make true your song and your word. Thus you shall be highly regarded, and able to live in peace with all others.
- 15th century Aztec

(in reply to WestBaySlave)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 5:52:59 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Aszhrae

Just a general reply to the thread concerning integrity: dom/ domme , or what ever the case may be, leads into the conversation about trust, about loyalty, about devotion. If you are sub or slave, such things are what we all want, what we all desire and yet betrayal is not something a sub or slave is expecting, then it comes, sure they are interested, but only as an object, property to be used at their convenience, discarded or even dismissed. The sub or slave's heart sinks, their spirit lessens, all that they are or what to become comes into question. Where do they go from where the individual put them, a future shattered, the sub or slave looks in the mirror, tears in their eyes. What now? Who do they trust now? seek the fiction or seek what is real. They think or they believed that something they most wanted was in fact only an illusion. Someone enjoyed themselves. The sub or slave is now standing in front of the mirror trying to pick up the pieces of their heart and spirit because they believed that the dom/domme wanted them. Integrity.....not! Honorable....hell no! worthy of a sub or slaves admiration and respect....never! Do they care...probably not. Pick up the pieces and start over. Has to be a dom/domme out there that sub or slave can believe in.
To have such values is an investment of self, of identity, for the dom/domme and for the sub/slave.
It's not an illusion, it's a lifestyle, a life choice.
Some would use and abuse, discard and dismiss and continue. Sell the illusion, when the illusion loses its glamour, move on.
Is not the values of this thread what should be emulated if not define the relaltionship between dom/domme and their sub/slave?
Or such values only written in novels, dreamed about, written in poetry and verse, reflected upon within music. Is having such values a falsehood?

No those values exist outside of fiction, otherwise where would the ideal for that fiction come from, no one would know of it.

What I think most of the respondents are saying some of us more harshly than others, is this. IF, you have a string of such, multiple assholes in your life, then you are making poor choices.

Too many people want the relationship so badly that they do not use good judgement in choosing the person they have their relationships with. They do not look at the person realistically in the first place. Instead they place their ideals and expections on that person then cry foul when the person does not meet their false expectations. Who's fault is that, the asshole's? NO!! Of course not, assholes are assholes. It is not their responsiblity to change. Anyone that expects them to be any different is fooling themself.

If you want a prince or knight then you set your filter to find a prince or knight. AND, you quit looking at assholes trying to figure out how you can, by some miracle, turn them into something they are not. It really is that simple.

Unfortunately there are many that are so desperate they settle. They are afraid to be alone and do the work on themselves that they need to do, to be worthy of the prince or knight.

In my short time here I have seen so much damned whining about "no one wants me" "there are no good subs/slaves/doms/dommes" blah blah blah blah.......Well guess what, there are quite a few of them! You name the gender and dynamic and I could give you a name on here that IF that person fit my dynamic, and I theirs, I would be chasing after like a starving dog after a fresh meaty bone. And that is just here in the forums!

No one, and I mean NO ONE, worthy of being with, is interested in the "oh woe is me, I've been soooo badly wronged" person. So, IF that is a person's mindset, my advice to them is to STOP LOOKING FOR A RELATIONSHIP and start working on themself. Get a good vibrator or tub of lube if you have to. Fix yourself. Take some classes and broaden your mind. Do some volunteer work. Get your finances in order. Do something that gets you out of your self pity mode and when you quit feeling desperate to have or belong to, someone, you just might be ready to try again.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to Aszhrae)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 6:04:02 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ryu

Basically each and every individual has a set of ethical standards they live by regardless of how others see them. Tomato - Tamoto. Life is about finding who is compatible with you. Everyone is different.

That, of course, is fundamentally reasonable; there is no objective truth on that which constitutes honour. As you quite righly point out, ethics is a matter of personal taste.

There are, however, one or two charcteristics that can be nailed down:

Is a person consistently good for his/her word? The principles behind the words are only relevant in the sense of two people finding common ground.
Do you live according to the letter of the law? Even this is open to interpretation, in terms of being 'ethical'.

This thread seems to be a discussion lacking the details from which to form an informed discussion. Until the OP lays out the specific code of honour that has been broken, then it's a case of going 'round in circles.

_____________________________

I have the courage to be a coward - but not beyond my limits.

Sooner or later, the man who wins is the man who thinks he can.

(in reply to Ryu)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 6:15:41 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tinyLaKajira

quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

yes that is it exactly. And what a flippin' challenge.

I understand, also, to those who have been into the scene long before the internet, this llife was very different and the term Master was not something one bestowed upon one's self, but was a title that one was given that actually meant a man was master of himself.

Hey sis,
Thats still true, and as I love to explain to the morons that write me. Only a slave calls a man Master, the fact that you use it in your title only tells a girl what you truly are.

Really? I wasn't aware of that. I know a lot of submissives who call their partner Master. What should they be calling him?

To the OP - there are Masters with honor and integrity, you just have to find them.

_____________________________

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This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi

(in reply to tinyLaKajira)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 7:39:44 AM

susie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

quote:

ORIGINAL: tinyLaKajira

quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

yes that is it exactly. And what a flippin' challenge.

I understand, also, to those who have been into the scene long before the internet, this llife was very different and the term Master was not something one bestowed upon one's self, but was a title that one was given that actually meant a man was master of himself.

Hey sis,
Thats still true, and as I love to explain to the morons that write me. Only a slave calls a man Master, the fact that you use it in your title only tells a girl what you truly are.

Really? I wasn't aware of that. I know a lot of submissives who call their partner Master. What should they be calling him?

I was surprised by that comment too. Guess there are lots of people out there getting it wrong then!!! So I better rush off and find something else to call mine. Hm so many options (and chances to get into trouble if I get it wrong)

(in reply to thishereboi)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 7:47:08 AM

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Haven't read the thread but woke up feeling reflective and vaguely surly, so am going to say that I am in agreement with the title of this thing: I, too, want to know what happened tohonor and integrity.
Oh, but just from the replies on this page, someone telling someone else the honorific to use toward their partner is rather presumptuous. That is a personal thing, not to be dictated by anyone but those with the titles.
Great day, all,
Davan

_____________________________

May you live as long as you wish & love as long as you live
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It's about the person & the bond,not the bondage
-Me

Waiting is

170NZ (Aka:Sex God Du Jour) pts

Jesus,I've ALWAYS been a deviant
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(in reply to susie)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 8:46:30 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullfigRIMAAM1

Are most of us here so perfect in judgement? Or do we protect ourselves by being too cynical to ever chance getting hurt, or by carefully treading water hoping the sky never falls on our heards? M

No, some of us really screw up in our judgments. I know I have. But what have I learned if I don't look back and review what I allowed into my life and why? How can I prevent such a misplaced judgment in the future if I don't make some decisions about how it is OK to be treated? Unless of course I want to continue my cycle of poor judgment. Either way, I have some accountability in who I let in my life and how they treat me.

_____________________________

Live Simply. Love Generously. Care Deeply. Speak Kindly.

(in reply to FullfigRIMAAM1)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 9:00:36 AM

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Wow... five pages and people are still looking for what happened to honor and integrity. Has anyone checked the lost and found dept.?

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Padriag

A stern discipline pervades all nature, which is a little cruel so that it may be very kind - Edmund Spencer

(in reply to NuevaVida)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 10:30:30 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: FullfigRIMAAM1

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesFIP
If you pick partners without integrity, that says that your judgment in picking partners is no good. You chose this guy. He was who he was from the beginning. Assuming that just because he calls himself a master meant that he would be a knight in shining armor was your fault. Next time see who people are from the beginning, don't ignore red flags, don't magically assume that because he gets you wet he has all those qualities you hoped to find.

If your partner picking skills are this badly flawed, then you need to work on yourself. Why do you ignore the reality of who people are? Why are you delusional when it comes to relationships? Why do you settle for people who obviously aren't what you're looking for?

Remember, the only constant in all your relationships is you.
You know, I'm all for taking responsibility for one's choices, and looking within to figure out who one is, and why one chooses as one does... But I doubt any of us has the exact answer to this age old question of what motivates each individual. And once in a while, it might be just a little less unkind, bit more humane, to not slap someone who is hurting while telling them "it's clearly your fault you were abused, lied to, or beaten, assaulted, etc...

Are most of us here so perfect in judgement? Or do we protect ourselves by being too cynical to ever chance getting hurt, or by carefully treading water hoping the sky never falls on our heards? M

Picking one bad guy is something anyone can do. But in your mid 50's like the op, unable to read people at all, having a string of only bad experiences? Sorry.

Saying "there, there it isn't your fault" is akin to giving her a bandaid to go over the infection. Telling her how to learn to pick healthier partners is taking a needle and getting the splinter out.

Which is more helpful in the long run?

_____________________________

Slave to laundry

Cynical and proud of it!

(in reply to FullfigRIMAAM1)

RE: I want to know what happened to honor and integrity - 11/22/2008 10:56:05 AM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

That is like asking someone why they attract alcoholics. Maybe because there are a lot of them out there? Perhaps it is worth examining why you find it necessary to "blame" the person who simply wishes to know why basic qualitites which I value are so lacking here. Period.

It isn't about blame. It is about the fact that the only common denominator in all of these people are you. You cannot control other people. You can only control you. What do you need to do different so that you meet the people here who do have honor and integrity? I know there are people here with those qualities, so the question isn't what happened to them. The question is why aren't you meeting them? Do you keep doing the same things and hoping for different results? Maybe you should try doing something different if you want different results.

You control you... What are you going to do so that you start meeting people with the characteristics that you want?

Knight's Kyra

_____________________________

"Passion... it lies in all of us. Sleeping, waiting, and though unbidden, it will stir, open its jaws, and howl. It speaks to us, guides us... passion rules us all. And we obey..." ~Angelus

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

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