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ORIGINAL: Icarys

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ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

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ORIGINAL: Icarys

No tolerance policies rarely work.

Again you see a meaning that's much more in depth than what I was going for. I simply meant give a little room to breathe as my own personal belief. I don't let someone I'm with get away with yelling at me but I also know that the majority of people get stressed and act out in ways that she had posted she would not allow.

Mark my words..there will be a time when He or even she gets to a point in their relationship that they become overstressed and it won't always work like it is now.
What will she do then? What I perceived in her way of thinking was that there is no room for mistakes.

What it sounds like to me is that both of them deal with things in a wonderful manner and I'm happy for them. Honestly, despite what she has said, I can understand how something at least very close to that is possible.

I've had relationships where there was essentially no arguing and absolutely no yelling. The reason for that is because the females were such docile people and that put me at extreme ease. I knock that one up to compatibility.  We simply worked well together.

"No tollerance policies rarely work."

I am going to have to call total bullshit on this. I also find it extremely humorous on a forum where many involved in M/s relationships post. My relationships are full of "no tollerance". Oddly enough they are relationships that rarely involve anything close to yelling or breaking of things. I actually find the opposite difficult to imagine.

All relationships are based upon certain expectations, whether communicated or not. If one person communicates their expectations, and stands firm, the other/s have a choice to either comply or walk away. It doesn't require any yelling or childish behaviour to communicate either point of view. It is just what many people come to expect or find as "normal" so they cannot imagine it to work any other way.

My grandparents never yelled, neither did my parents. Neither woman was compliant or docile. One relationship was a longterm, till death do us part, sucessful, relationship. The other was hideously fucked up. Yet, again, no abuse, of any sort, was ever visible. I grew up completely ignorant of the potential for nastiness, people that love one another, are capable of. Talking, communication, creating rules and boundaries and lots of love and affection, both verbal and physical, were my norm. Therefor that was how I expected others to behave. Anything else was immature and should be corrected. I have never EVER had any respect for an adult that cannot control their reactions to anger or other potentially destructive emotions and behaviours.

To say that it is impossible to live a life, as an adult, like that, is rediculous. I've seen too many beautiful human beings prove the opposite.

Notice the use of the word rarely as in it's not impossible but improbable to me.
Of course in your quest for the dramatic you passed right by that.

You can call bullshit all you want, it's not gonna change anything. I love these dramatic I'm gonna make a stand people.

I'm a very strict person but I like to think I'm balanced enough to realize that there's gonna be human error. You can tell someone that you had better not do this or else but I doubt that type of attitude works well in reality.

I'm sure if you look around our society a little you'll see examples of no tolerance working in all of it's glory. (tongue in cheek)

Some people like to talk tough with words like..No kids left behind...War on drugs and the No tolerance policy crap but in the end the actual people who have to live that crap suffer.

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Now you are just being silly.

I don't know what world you live in but in mine, I could make a very long list of "no tollerance" examples that work very well. Both personally and professionally.

Call me overly dramatic if it makes you feel better. It doesn't matter one way or another to me. All I see in your words are examples for making excuses for failure. Something most that abuse are very good at. All too often, the victims also.

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There is obviously some reason why some people AREN'T susceptible to that type of abuse and some reason ( whatever that may be, I don't know what it is) why some people are.

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ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

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There is obviously some reason why some people AREN'T susceptible to that type of abuse and some reason ( whatever that may be, I don't know what it is) why some people are.

For me, there was no other kind of behavior to compare. As far as I knew, yelling, hitting, throwing stuff, nasty names, and never seeming able to do anything right along with drug and alcohol abuse .. that was all normal. That's what 'everyone' did so when I jumped head first into an M/s relationship, the behavior patterns weren't all that different. There was still yelling, hitting, throwing stuff, nasty names and never being able to do anything right. Why walk away from something so normal? Why question something when you know that it's just a part of life and it's how everyone else lives, too?

A lot of times, until we get out and about, we don't realize how confined that space we call our world has been for us. The perspectives we bring into adult life can have a single lens and everything is seen through that single lens. If you add 2 + 2 and get 5, you're not going to erase it and work the problem again if you think you've already got the right answer. Everyone and their brother knows it supposed to be 4 .. but you weren't in school that day so didn't get the lesson that, hey, maybe something's a bit screwy here and I need to go back and check it out. You'll keep adding 2 + 2 and getting 5 until someone either points it out to you or you stop for a moment, let go of the old math you've always known and just count the damn numbers up on a couple of fingers. It seems so simple, but without the catalyst for that change, without something to trigger it.. you just keep walking the same route .. it's normal, it's comfortable and.. you get used to it.

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That is incorrect.  I find the entire thread heartbreaking.  I never stated at all that what 'you were saying is an example of abusive'.  I said I could also see abuse occuring during the thread, but that isn't specifically why the thread is heartbreaking.
 
the.dark.

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ORIGINAL: beargonewild

ETA: My only question is wanting to see how other's define "victim mentality."

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ORIGINAL: BitaTruble

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There is obviously some reason why some people AREN'T susceptible to that type of abuse and some reason ( whatever that may be, I don't know what it is) why some people are.

For me, there was no other kind of behavior to compare. As far as I knew, yelling, hitting, throwing stuff, nasty names, and never seeming able to do anything right along with drug and alcohol abuse .. that was all normal. That's what 'everyone' did so when I jumped head first into an M/s relationship, the behavior patterns weren't all that different. There was still yelling, hitting, throwing stuff, nasty names and never being able to do anything right. Why walk away from something so normal? Why question something when you know that it's just a part of life and it's how everyone else lives, too?

A lot of times, until we get out and about, we don't realize how confined that space we call our world has been for us. The perspectives we bring into adult life can have a single lens and everything is seen through that single lens. If you add 2 + 2 and get 5, you're not going to erase it and work the problem again if you think you've already got the right answer. Everyone and their brother knows it supposed to be 4 .. but you weren't in school that day so didn't get the lesson that, hey, maybe something's a bit screwy here and I need to go back and check it out. You'll keep adding 2 + 2 and getting 5 until someone either points it out to you or you stop for a moment, let go of the old math you've always known and just count the damn numbers up on a couple of fingers. It seems so simple, but without the catalyst for that change, without something to trigger it.. you just keep walking the same route .. it's normal, it's comfortable and.. you get used to it.

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ORIGINAL: IronBear

Victim Mentality is usually seen in "Professional Victims" often craving for sympathy and attention. Because much of the suffering they have is psychosomatic with no relationship to reality both past and present (generally) it is still jolly hard to separate this from genuine suffering which they have or had. In any case it really is a case by case line call as to weather you intend to buy into their issues or back off.

If the truth be known, nearly all of us have suffered some form of subtle abuse or perceived subtle abuse in the past but didn't know it or accepted it as part of life (children can be included her because they perceive things and process them differently so that a parent who "blows his or her lid" for regular misbehavior can be in effect abusive though not intentionally). Again, I doubt seriously if there are any of us who haven't been guilty of subtle abuse and not so subtle abuse at one time or another even if in defense of self or in retaliation for a perceived wrong. Most wouldn't recognize their actions as being abusive..

I know I can and do at times come across as a bad tempered abusive sod. Usually both my back and knees are giving me merry hell and morphine isn't helping much and is till have to complete some building project about the house. As Neets can testify, I rarely become abusive, physically or verbally, towards others but towards the problem (knees and/or back) or towards the project etc. I am terse with people even after until I have settled into my chair or after a hot shower and am lighting my pipe with the physical stress lifting. Because I am aware, I usually try to keep a space between me and the rest of my family so they don't inadvertently receive any flack.